- Oct 13, 2016
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- Thread starter JohnDupont
- Start date
- Oct 28, 2017
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Hi John, thanks for you work, I appreciate it. I see that you are having some problems with the future of the mod. I have an idea that maybe can help you. I saw some creators than have a patreon but make his content for everyone, but patreons has priority. I make myself clear, for example, the patreons has the content earlier. I was thinking and maybe you can release the same mod, with unlock feature and all, but one update later. I mean, when the game is in v 0.23, you give the mod 0.23 to patreons but the mod 0.22 to public in general, when game is in 0.24 you give the 0.23 to non patreons. This way people who can be your patreons will be interested in that, cause people tend to be impacient, and people who can't be patreons for some reason will be happy anyway, and you avoid filtrations of contents.
I dunno, it's just an idea, maybe you can consider that. Anyway, this is your mod, the desicion is all yours. Greetings.
PD: I'm sorry for the bad English, I'm not a native talker
I dunno, it's just an idea, maybe you can consider that. Anyway, this is your mod, the desicion is all yours. Greetings.
PD: I'm sorry for the bad English, I'm not a native talker
- May 26, 2017
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- May 26, 2017
- 792
- 2,658
Things have moved a lot since I created the thread about the future of the JDMOD.
Anyway, that's what I had in mind from the beginning but it comes with 3 problems:
- How much delay would be appropriate? I think that one version (= ~1month) is fair for the GGGB JDMOD and 1 month would also be fair for games with a slower release rate, but I might be wrong.
- The biggest problem I encountered during the last days: Some people really don't like "content being hidden behind a paywall", even temporarily. I understand ; @Epaddder have some
You must be registered to see the linksto explain it. My personnal opinion is that it comes mostly from:
- An underestimation of the modder's work or, to be more precise, how much work is needed and how much added value the modder brings compared to the original developer: Basically, I'm using someone else's work. I don't know yet how much convincing it will take... but I'll try anyway. Getting some kind of approval from the original developer would be a good first step.
- An historical expectation that the modder works out of love and passion. In my case, the passion has faded over time and creating this Patreon was the way I found of bringing it back: tangible support from visible persons is much more motivating than intangible support from the undefined F95 community.
- About the "people tend to be impacient": I really don't want someone to support me out of frustation, it's not how you build a community. This is why, if a delay is chosen, it should be done very carefully.
I still think it's the right reward: updating the GGGB JDMOD takes a long time, patrons motivate me to make the efforts: it'd be fair if it was released to them first.
It's far from perfect at the moment ; I didn't have a lot to offer to thank the patrons and I had to remove some of what had been public for a long time. I'll be tweaking it over the next 3 months and I'm open to suggestions.
To be honest, I wasn't really following your mod updates(Edit: without any particular reason)after my post, until now. A friend made me aware of the patreon situation. So not having read about kofi in my mind you went from "I'm gonna set something up" to the current model.
That prompted my reaction.
I hope you accept my apology for that, I was wrong.
- May 26, 2017
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- Nov 19, 2017
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this whole "debate" reminds me of when bethesda tried to make people pay for skyrim mods and got a massive negative feedback that it got cancelled. Go to nexus and see how many great mods out there and for FREE!
I think you should ask for donations instead of "monthly payments".
When Wikipedia needed money to survive they asked for donations, they didn't lock it behind a pay wall.
It's a great mod that i mainly use to see scenes that i missed, nothing more, it saves me a lot of time.... however if that is no longer an option i rather waste time on a new walkthrough to get that particular scene than pay, just saying.
Thank you for your hard work and every patreon who shares with us, much appreciated.
I think you should ask for donations instead of "monthly payments".
When Wikipedia needed money to survive they asked for donations, they didn't lock it behind a pay wall.
It's a great mod that i mainly use to see scenes that i missed, nothing more, it saves me a lot of time.... however if that is no longer an option i rather waste time on a new walkthrough to get that particular scene than pay, just saying.
Thank you for your hard work and every patreon who shares with us, much appreciated.
- May 26, 2017
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Hello friends,
If you're wondering the gin bottle is Bombay Sapphire.
I'll make changes to the GGGB JDMOD patron rewards based on the 2 polls in early January
Changelog:
- Added 2 new scenes from 0.23 PREVIEW ;
- The gui should now better reflect the fact that selecting enhanced tits is required to access the bimbo outfit
- Fixed a bug with customization for anal experience and deepthroat experience ;
- Minor changes to all the scenes from the previous version
- May 26, 2017
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- I don't understand how a company's decision to monetize other people's work and a modder's decision to monetize his work have in common.
- You should read more about why it received massive backlash before talking about it: It was mostly out of fear of free mods disappearing ; how much the company takes from the modders was also an issue.
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- Although I didn't talk a lot about the Ko-fi page, it ran for almost 2 months, received over 500 visits but not a single donation ; I don't think donations work (and Ko-fi is probably not very popular).
- It being considered "monthly payment" is based on the assumption that mods should be free in their entirety, without ever considering the efforts required each month in updates and improvements from the modder and amount of free content he's providing. Most of my work is public and the patron rewards are based on what I add each month. I lost the passion but I still spent 3 hours this morning on the update for 0.23 PREVIEW because 45 persons have put their trust in me and I don't want to disappoint.
Again, I don't see what Wikipedia and mods have in common.
Fuck I didn't know Wikipedia spent over $38,000,000 in salaries and wages annually and over $13,000,000 in Awards and grants.
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If you ever decide to create a walkthrough for GGGB, I'll be the first one to use it.
If you meant "playthrough", have fun ; this game is one of the greatest.
- Nov 11, 2016
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In my opinion people just view this as parasitizing on someone else's work. I don't think that anyone would view it as a parasitic relationship if there was no paywall. If you simply got sponsored by fans of the game, it would probably be a different tune. I know it's not easy to create modifications, I have done some myself and sometimes did well (though not as well as you) and sometimes failed. I think your mod is really good and because it's good, people like it, and now they are obviously displeased when you took it from them (or at least important parts of it). That's probably the main reason you got so much criticism.
I don't really like getting paid for modifying someone else's work. It should be done for fun, not for money, but if people offer you money, who am I to tell you not to take it. My opinion about this is, that if there wasn't the paywall, there would probably be no backlash (or maybe one or two disagreeing posts which you could just ignore). I don't really know 100% if others think of this the same way as I do, but I hope this might help.
btw, by people I don't mean people in general, but people who voiced their dislike of the paywall
I don't really like getting paid for modifying someone else's work. It should be done for fun, not for money, but if people offer you money, who am I to tell you not to take it. My opinion about this is, that if there wasn't the paywall, there would probably be no backlash (or maybe one or two disagreeing posts which you could just ignore). I don't really know 100% if others think of this the same way as I do, but I hope this might help.
btw, by people I don't mean people in general, but people who voiced their dislike of the paywall
- Jan 28, 2018
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People don't see that this extremely useful mod takes a hell of work. Simply most of them have just no idea what it takes. So this is for me in no way parasitizing! -> huge workload, skills needed by the dev others obiously don't have or don't want to "share", much time invested and extremely useful -> dev should earn something for it! I wanna see those critics (communists ) if they spend their time for work and say, hey, I do work for others, I do it for free, I am a
) if they spend their time for work and say, hey, I do work for others, I do it for free, I am a
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. They demand things of others, I bet, they would never do by themselves.
- May 26, 2017
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I agree: if there were no patrons only content, less people (aka still some) would have been displeased but it wouldn't solve the problem. It only deals with the third of @Epaddder'sIn my opinion people just view this as parasitizing on someone else's work. I don't think that anyone would view it as a parasitic relationship if there was no paywall. If you simply got sponsored by fans of the game, it would probably be a different tune. I know it's not easy to create modifications, I have done some myself and sometimes did well (though not as well as you) and sometimes failed. I think your mod is really good and because it's good, people like it, and now they are obviously displeased when you took it from them (or at least important parts of it). That's probably the main reason you got so much criticism.
I don't really like getting paid for modifying someone else's work. It should be done for fun, not for money, but if people offer you money, who am I to tell you not to take it. My opinion about this is, that if there wasn't the paywall, there would probably be no backlash (or maybe one or two disagreeing posts which you could just ignore). I don't really know 100% if others think of this the same way as I do, but I hope this might help.
btw, by people I don't mean people in general, but people who voiced their dislike of the paywall
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: "You gave me free candy and now your charging for it". I think he's right if what he meant was "the people against monetizing modding agree with at least one of those 3 points".
I don't agree with any of them:
- I see the first one as a
You must be registered to see the links(I'm not sure it's exactly this one. What I mean is: We tend to think a certain way of doing things is the right way, only because it has always been down this way) ;
- The second point implies a mod doesn't have value because it relies on the original games value (Basically what you said, unless I didn't understand correctly, no matter of much value the mod adds it will always be "parasitizing on someone else's work") ;
- The third one is resistance to change.
The only part I took out was the Unlock Feature and
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.I don't see patrons having an early access to the latest content as being behind a paywall. I expressed my opinion on this subject in multiples posts like
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and made
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to gather everyone's view.
- Nov 19, 2017
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Interesting someone shared a mega link to the patreon version of your mod a few days ago but now it's down.
you shouldn't be complaining when someone shares your mod 9 minutes or even 2 minutes after release, they paid for it so it is theirs to do with as they please including sharing it with others, it is their right just as it is your right to charge money for your mod.
by the way shouldn't EvaKiss get a percentage of income from your mod since you're using her game to make money?! it's only fair
- Nov 11, 2016
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I think mods do have value, but not a monetary value. For me, mods are very important part of PC gaming, be it individual experience or a sense of a community (PC Master Race and all that shit, hehe). I don't really have an uncompromising stance on this issue myself, because it has it's shady parts, but also some good parts. I, for example, am not against rewarding a modder... for motivation and compensation for their time (yes, it takes a lot of time to make), but I don't think, that a modder should restrict certain parts of their mod to people who didn't pay them money.
And what's kinda crazy, is, that you can get the full game for free on this website (and very early at that), but not the full mod. To me it just doesn't seem fair. There is a big difference between the developer and the modder. I mean, you do it for fun, as a hobby, right? Not as a job. Or am I wrong? I know it all sounds like a moral appeal, but I just can't help myself in this instance. Also, I can manage without the mod and I am not angry about it, because GGGB isn't even in my top 10 on this site, but again, I just can't help it, but to join the conversation, because the topic is somehow very interesting to me.
BTW, after reading the patreon posts, I understand some of your points better now, but it's still too bad, that the main part I was using the mod for, the unlock feature, is still restricted ... because you can always save before the scenes and just load the save to play the already viewed "unlocked" scene again. The game has rollback feature, so you can save whenever you want and try different outcomes. If you can manage your saves, you have no problem with revisiting the scenes whenever you want, anyway.
Unlock option used to be a great time saving feature thanks to which I didn't have to play the game multiple times trying every different outcome and sometimes load repeatedly, because I missed something earlier, or I could even skip content I wasn't interested in... locking that feature makes the mod pretty much useless to me, contrary what you would probably think at first glance. Because I can do almost the same thing regardless. Or did I get something wrong about availability of the feature?
- May 26, 2017
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- May 26, 2017
- 792
- 2,658