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VN A Idea for a Game

iVeGa123

New Member
Aug 23, 2020
6
3
I've always enjoyed visual novels where choices truly impact the story, so I've been crafting this idea for some time now... but I don't know if it's good or not. I've written quite a lot and generally the idea is something like that: there is some dark things in the past of the protagonist (player). Through the player's choices, the protagonist would either redeem or succumb to his past ways.
The heroine is a talented musician exploited by her adoptive family (something like an "chained" innocent girl) . So any mistake was treated as an offense by her adoptive parents, who saw her more as a servant to their ambitions than as a family member.
Later she discovers that the adoptive family is signing her compositions as if they were theirs. So she created something like an alter-ego for herself to experience freedom (you know). The game will revolve around how the player will relate and try to help or take advantage of the heroine's situation, something similar to an honor system. Which could lead to different narrative paths. Seems like a good start to me... What do you think? Thank you.
 
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Kamishirov

Member
Sep 22, 2023
164
1,279
It's an interesting concept and I'm sure dependent on the game's quality a lot of people would like to play a visual novel such as this.

For me however I definitely wouldn't play it due to my personality and the "extreme" situations surrounding the in game characters.

I hate all delinquents with a passion and believe that they aren't deserving of any kind of redemption whatsoever, I can't stand watching any sort of media involving delinquents as I don't find them and their actions cute, I just want them all to die.

I also don't subscribe to the Battle Royale-esque idea of "The poor downtrodden youth Vs the mean old adults". Boomers are selfish and largely oblivious assholes but who isn't these days?

As for the adopted girls situation, I couldn't stand watching someone bust their balls for someone else to take the credit and then to top it all off be at the mercy of some delinquent's whims, out of the frying pan and into the fire, that exploitative scenario just wouldn't mesh with me personally at all, I wouldn't want to play as an adoptive member of some high pressure Asian family who just takes it and woe-is-me boo hoo.



I only like hot and sexy exploitative situations, now if she was perhaps a ballet prodigy and the not fat, ugly or disgusting ex-ballerino father got a bit too handsy during private ballet recitals making the also ex-ballerina mother jealous then that's another thing.

I'd rather the freedom arc "boyfriend" was some sort of, I don't know, rugby player for the elite high school she goes to.
A 6"4' 260 lbs jacked gigachad lock who could rip a car door off, flip cars and tear what's between an ex-ballerino's legs clean off.

1722731295959.png
 
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ps5029

Newbie
May 6, 2024
32
15
I don't know much about tools for making visual novels.
Still, here are a few ideas:

If possible, I would like to be able to determine the branching of actions and endings by including indicators such as reason, violence, and expressiveness (I can't think of the right word for this item).
The harsh environment and excessive stress caused her to develop multiple personality disorder, and various incidents and abusive decisions strengthened those personalities.
Her multiple personalities react to each choice in the setting of taking over her body, and in the end, the most developed personality determines the ending.

Reason determines the extremity of action.
Violence determines whether an action causes physical harm to the target.
Expressiveness determines whether the direction of action is directed toward oneself or toward another target.

well..
This is just what I thought of right away, so I think you just need to swallow the sweet and spit out the bitter.
 
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balitz Method

Active Member
Jan 30, 2018
906
1,472
The schema you're describing, a pure route/corruption route, works for plenty of games. Before you get too much further into it, make sure that you like your ideas for each route roughly the same amount. You don't want to end up in a situation where you're mostly working on one route over the other and upsetting half of your players.
 
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lfgals1

Newbie
Sep 7, 2022
86
98
I honestly feel like the vast majority of pure/corruption route games don't work that well. Too many devs end up making 2 different games or one game that is totally nonsensical. I generally think a dev should decide which side they like more and just make different routes on that side.
 
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Cartman-Brah

Member
Jul 8, 2024
146
231
I think it's a good idea if you can do character development well. there are characters who stay the same throughout the game but change their character completely with a choice at the end of the game, nobody likes this kind of thing. it should be handled slowly from the beginning to the end of the game.
 
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balitz Method

Active Member
Jan 30, 2018
906
1,472
I honestly feel like the vast majority of pure/corruption route games don't work that well. Too many devs end up making 2 different games or one game that is totally nonsensical. I generally think a dev should decide which side they like more and just make different routes on that side.
It's definitely more coherent to do variations on a single theme than trying to work the dichotomy, but it does cast a wider net if it can be pulled off.
 
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iVeGa123

New Member
Aug 23, 2020
6
3
Wow, thanks for your attention, guys!

I was very excited by the feedback and I think I can try to explain a little more about the idea.

The script is not interested in showing the protagonist as a victim, the idea is that the whole thing is a little gray, it is not exactly about who is right or wrong with each character in the work, the idea is that they are driven by a philosophy to deal with with their own problems.

Regarding the more mechanical part of the game, the idea is that the protagonist's choices little by little shape his personality, which varies within a quadrant of X and Y.

Basically where the extremes of X can be classified as selfishness and altruism and the extreme of Y can be classified as regret and anger.

The idea is to fill this quadrant based on the choices the player makes and the way he chooses to deal with other characters and situations.

So that when the protagonist reflects on his own past he can observe his past actions as mistakes and regret them or as necessary actions to survive and hold grudges against others.

It is worth highlighting that the idea is that he has to deal with the questions of others and the distrust of society. The idea is to try to create a world hostile to the player in an attempt to make this possible recovery more palpable and even difficult to be totally nice.

Regarding the heroine, the idea is that she goes through these metamorphoses together with the protagonist and the actions and the way he relates to her can be both positive and negative, respecting a slightly different quadrant.

For quadrant X we can put something like the intimacy between the two and Y the level of corruption of the heroine.
 
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ps5029

Newbie
May 6, 2024
32
15
So is this your final game concept?

Now you need to decide on the x and y axes and come up with various situational ideas, right?
=
 
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iVeGa123

New Member
Aug 23, 2020
6
3
So is this your final game concept?

Now you need to decide on the x and y axes and come up with various situational ideas, right?
=
Exacly... I was worried about the quality of the idea in general but I already have some flowchart drafts, the biggest problem is that although I can imagine well what I want to do, my writing isn't very good... English isn't mine first language and I am more focused on the software development part
 
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ps5029

Newbie
May 6, 2024
32
15
As long as you are good at writing itself, not having English as your first language is not a big problem.
You can use a translator, and it's not hard to find someone to review your game here.
Be confident in yourself.
 
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someyoungguy

Member
May 10, 2023
260
372
I have some criticisms of the concept as presented so far. It sounds interesting, and I'm not trying to discourage you developing it. These are just some things that I think could help make the project easier to develop and increase verisimilitude and overall appeal.

I don't think regret/anger is a helpful axis for determining much. There's too much overlap between the two for their juxtaposition to play well narratively. It's a common trope in fiction and irl to see people whose regret has made them bitter, angry, and/or cynical. I think replacing one end of the axis with something that better opposes the remaining end would make the narrative more satisfying. Maybe something like regret/acceptance or hope/anger would work better, depending on what you're going for.

I think you may be using too many axes/variables. There seems to be an assumption that each one would have two possible outcomes on the story, but I've seen devs provide story consequences for three sets of variable value ranges: low, middle, and high. Even if you only do low and high paths for each variable that you're considering working with right now, you're looking at having to develop 16 separate paths if you want to really make each choice matter narratively. (It'd be 81 if you were doing three paths per axis.) One way to reduce the number of paths, would be to treat the heroine's corruption/intimacy variables as an axis. This could be done by either using high and low numbers of a single variable to represent them, or you could still have two variables and the higher value determines which path the player is on. Maybe consider if similarly condensing the protagonist's paths would be possible/desirable. (Perhaps a kindness/anger axis would be sufficient?) Personally, I think that giving up some complexity in favour of more nuance (as in having fewer axes with more paths per axis) would make the story more narratively fulfilling to play. For instance, having two axes with three choices each would require nine paths, but three axes with two choices each would still only be eight paths. There may be fewer choices in the former option, but the choices seem like they matter more since there are more possible outcomes.

Lastly, I want to talk about the multiple personality thing. Its diagnostic name is dissociative identity disorder (DID). Narratively it would only make sense for the heroine's dissociations into alternate personalities to match up with the presence of or changes in the protagonist if he was the source of the trauma that led to the development of the disorder or presented a similar type of perceived threat as the trauma that led to its development. It might work narratively if they were supernaturally linked somehow, in which case it would probably be better to have her personality shifts also explained as part of whatever happened to them to cause their connction. It could be that you intended the protagonist to be a source of trauma, but it seemed implied that the parents were the source of the trauma and that they were still abusing her. Typically, the type of trauma that leads to the formation of DID is extreme. Having a character with the disorder still under the influence of their abusers should make the story very dark. It would also make the player character taking advantage of her seem outright evil. It would probably be difficult, if not impossible, to portray a character taking advantage of an abuse victim as sympathetic. I think you should be careful in how you portray DID because it's famously typically portrayed in very unrealistic ways in film and TV. Anyone who is interested in your game due to having a LI with DID is going to be at least familiar enough with the disorder to catch on pretty quick if you're not portraying it realistically. If you have any other ideas for portraying what's going on with the heroine, it might be a good idea to at least think about how easy they'd be to incorporate into the story compared to the DID, which you should probably do a lot of research on if you're intent on incorporating it into the story.

Good luck with your story
 
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iVeGa123

New Member
Aug 23, 2020
6
3
Thank you for the encoragment I really apreciate!
As long as you are good at writing itself, not having English as your first language is not a big problem.
You can use a translator, and it's not hard to find someone to review your game here.
Be confident in yourself.
 

iVeGa123

New Member
Aug 23, 2020
6
3
Wow, thanks for the tip, what you said really makes a lot of sense considering that it's my first project so I decided to remodel the idea a little, I thought of a single quadrant divided into X and Y.

X would have Karma and Y would have Heroine affinity, which would be less complex to develop into an MVP and a first project.

Regarding DID, I think that maybe I'm not prepared to deal with issues like this in a first project, what I had in mind for the Heroine was something closer to an attempt to escape from all this social pressure that she had, not necessarily trying to get into on the merit of a psychic illness, you know.

Now about the plot, I'm going to try to bring some more information to try to show what I'm really looking for in the narrative.

The heroine has these family problems that I talked about and to try to escape this problem a little she kind of goes into hiding, puts on makeup, dyes her hair and becomes a keyboard player in a band, she disconnects from her life full of rules and tries to enjoy taking some of the tension away with drinks and drugs.

The heroine is afraid of confronting her own abusers, she is afraid of showing who she really is, deep down she prefers to wear the mask rather than confront, she is afraid of confrontation.

Now the protagonist gets into this situation somewhat unintentionally, she was one of the intelligent and popular girls and he was a guy considered dangerous, many rumors circulated around the school about him and depending on how the player acted, the rumors could increase or decrease.

Basically he meets her in one of these bars and recognizes her and kind of accidentally discovers her secret.

Depending on how the Player relates to the heroine and how he will try to help solve the problem, he can influence her positively or negatively.

I have some criticisms of the concept as presented so far. It sounds interesting, and I'm not trying to discourage you developing it. These are just some things that I think could help make the project easier to develop and increase verisimilitude and overall appeal.

I don't think regret/anger is a helpful axis for determining much. There's too much overlap between the two for their juxtaposition to play well narratively. It's a common trope in fiction and irl to see people whose regret has made them bitter, angry, and/or cynical. I think replacing one end of the axis with something that better opposes the remaining end would make the narrative more satisfying. Maybe something like regret/acceptance or hope/anger would work better, depending on what you're going for.

I think you may be using too many axes/variables. There seems to be an assumption that each one would have two possible outcomes on the story, but I've seen devs provide story consequences for three sets of variable value ranges: low, middle, and high. Even if you only do low and high paths for each variable that you're considering working with right now, you're looking at having to develop 16 separate paths if you want to really make each choice matter narratively. (It'd be 81 if you were doing three paths per axis.) One way to reduce the number of paths, would be to treat the heroine's corruption/intimacy variables as an axis. This could be done by either using high and low numbers of a single variable to represent them, or you could still have two variables and the higher value determines which path the player is on. Maybe consider if similarly condensing the protagonist's paths would be possible/desirable. (Perhaps a kindness/anger axis would be sufficient?) Personally, I think that giving up some complexity in favour of more nuance (as in having fewer axes with more paths per axis) would make the story more narratively fulfilling to play. For instance, having two axes with three choices each would require nine paths, but three axes with two choices each would still only be eight paths. There may be fewer choices in the former option, but the choices seem like they matter more since there are more possible outcomes.

Lastly, I want to talk about the multiple personality thing. Its diagnostic name is dissociative identity disorder (DID). Narratively it would only make sense for the heroine's dissociations into alternate personalities to match up with the presence of or changes in the protagonist if he was the source of the trauma that led to the development of the disorder or presented a similar type of perceived threat as the trauma that led to its development. It might work narratively if they were supernaturally linked somehow, in which case it would probably be better to have her personality shifts also explained as part of whatever happened to them to cause their connction. It could be that you intended the protagonist to be a source of trauma, but it seemed implied that the parents were the source of the trauma and that they were still abusing her. Typically, the type of trauma that leads to the formation of DID is extreme. Having a character with the disorder still under the influence of their abusers should make the story very dark. It would also make the player character taking advantage of her seem outright evil. It would probably be difficult, if not impossible, to portray a character taking advantage of an abuse victim as sympathetic. I think you should be careful in how you portray DID because it's famously typically portrayed in very unrealistic ways in film and TV. Anyone who is interested in your game due to having a LI with DID is going to be at least familiar enough with the disorder to catch on pretty quick if you're not portraying it realistically. If you have any other ideas for portraying what's going on with the heroine, it might be a good idea to at least think about how easy they'd be to incorporate into the story compared to the DID, which you should probably do a lot of research on if you're intent on incorporating it into the story.

Good luck with your story
 

ps5029

Newbie
May 6, 2024
32
15
Certainly, if we go in this direction, it will be much less complicated and easier to develop.

So, in this direction, is the relationship with the female protagonist main or one-and-only?

The direction of this plot would be for the player to be able to influence the heroine's behavior and psychology, either by gaslighting her or by being a purely positive influence.

Depending on the player's choice, there can be a sadistic route that uses her unstable mind to subordinate her to the player and manipulate her to do what he wants, or there can be an enterprising and pure goodman route that helps her overcome the pain of her past.

However, the affinity indicator with the heroine is essential to your relationship with her, which is ultimately the main content of the game, and if it decreases, your influence on her will literally decrease, which will interfere with the sense of accomplishment or enjoyment when enjoying the main content.
 

iVeGa123

New Member
Aug 23, 2020
6
3
Yeah Pretty much
Certainly, if we go in this direction, it will be much less complicated and easier to develop.

So, in this direction, is the relationship with the female protagonist main or one-and-only?

The direction of this plot would be for the player to be able to influence the heroine's behavior and psychology, either by gaslighting her or by being a purely positive influence.

Depending on the player's choice, there can be a sadistic route that uses her unstable mind to subordinate her to the player and manipulate her to do what he wants, or there can be an enterprising and pure goodman route that helps her overcome the pain of her past.

However, the affinity indicator with the heroine is essential to your relationship with her, which is ultimately the main content of the game, and if it decreases, your influence on her will literally decrease, which will interfere with the sense of accomplishment or enjoyment when enjoying the main content.