VN Ren'Py A Wife and Mother [P2 v0.225 + P1 v0.152] [Lust & Passion]

[Talcum Powder]

I agree with you.
In real life such a convenient deal would be ridiculous, to the point that maybe Mafia should sue L&P for misrepresenting their category
Even if Don Morello can be considered a "high class" mobster, more business oriented then a violent one, it's difficult to think that a simple prison visit, no matter how far Sophia goes, is enough to free them from the debt or at least a big chunk of it.

dm "You see, before anything, and everything... I am a businessman. My interests are in solving problems strategically, and efficiently."
dm "So, finishing you off... That wouldn't benefit me at all! It's an antiquated, and stereotypical view of our business."
[...]
dm "The money isn't actually what's important to me here. It's the principle. A man reaps what he sows."
dm "But most of all, it hurts me that such a lovely woman has to suffer under the foolishness of her spouse."
dm "I therefore propose you a special deal... A way to redeem a big part of the debt, and keep your home intact."
[...]
dm "After that, we'll talk about your debts once more. I might even consider freeing you from all of them!"

The only thing that can actually make the story a bit more believable is the "Family" and the high value that it plays in the Mafia world. Since Morello seems not so greedy about money it can make sense that he values the well-being of his family so much to propose the deal (also to keep Larry calm and avoid any temptation in "singing"). Seen from this point of view it's not so out of the world, but still it is quite odd even for the Mafia world.

This is for what we know from the story and the small pieces of information from the dev. I'm not digging into other theories that we explored in the past for which the gambling was a set up or Liam was already in debt etc.

For what has to come, according to what the dev said (thanks KillJoys ) Larry's points (i.e. how far Sophia went) could matter for the help that she can receive from Morello.
Possibilities are endless and it's difficult to say. L&P seems to suggest that just visiting without giving too much to Larry is enough to get rid of the debt. Probably getting to the cumare status (i.e. without showing the breast and anything after that) will grant the "protection" and the favor to ask. There could be a finer grained set of outcomes based on Larry's point but that will make things more complicated (branches etc)

Again, I agree that it is unrealistic to have such a good deal + "protection" for just a prison visit. The only thing that can make it a more believable is, again, the Family and the particular "honor" system that rules the Mafia world. I think we are again the conditional realism realm or/and we can grant L&P an artistic licence.

As for the choices of asking Morello's help and who should "sleep with the fishes" I see the potential for Sophia to choose between the lesser of the two evils (Morello or deal with Aiden/Bennet alone), as the favor could come with some "strings attached" or at the very least accepting to be part of the "Family" is not a choice that someone (at least in real life) could make with a light heart, once you are in the Family you cannot quit...

I think the whole Morello as an out for either of Sophia's extortionists doesn't hold an ounce of water. This especially doesn't make sense until Sophia/Liam have completely satisfied their debt. This is business, right? Why would Sophia be allowed to open up additional credit lines before satisfying the first line of credit? Doesn't make sense.

If Aiden really is connected in some way, and the cops certainly think that he is, then it seems likely that either,

1. Morello intervening with Aiden would cause tension between two different syndicates - even if Morello is the larger and more powerful, he wouldn't want to engage in anything that provokes a competitor as that would upset the status quo. I cannot conceive of how or why Morello would risk tilting the applecart, let alone upending it, to "take care of" Aiden. This is dumb. Sorry gang, it's dumb.
2. Aiden's connections are actually a part of Morello's syndicate, in which case he has a lot of sway and ending Aiden's extortion is actually no big deal for him. This is dumb, too. This is a ridiculously contrived convenience and dumbs down the jeopardy of this and every other bit of tension in the entire game. The author will have shown that there is no jeopardy for Sophia, she's got plot armor and the author has no problems waving the deus ex machina wand and sprinkling pixie dust over everyone to make difficult writing situations disappear. That's not dumb, that's lazy.

With Bennet, would Morello really pull in outsiders into his orbit? Why on earth would he risk entanglement with someone working for a municipal board of education? The fuck that Morello is going to get heavy with someone who can get the government involved in any way, however remotely and however limited that government involvement might be. It just creates an extra bit of hassle and exposes him and his organization to an additional bit of risk.

To provide a service to a debtor who hasn't satisfied their debt and provide a service that, if not rendered, does not in anyway change the probability of the debt being satisfied? Sorry to say, folks, the whole Morello as an out is stupid. It's deus ex machina, it's contrived, it's lazy, and it doesn't even make any sense anyway.

 

[Dan5k74]

I think that will be something like this
View attachment 1308286

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I wonder what songs Sam is going to sing at the concert.

As nexer pointed out so well, I too think that the place where Sam will be performing will most likely be this one:

The presence of the logo (El Mocandos) immediately hints at the famous Toronto live music venue (

You must be registered to see the links

) where rock bands like U2, Ramones, Rolling Stones etc. have performed over the years so I think the stage will be laid out in this configuration. In addition to this, without disturbing such a sacred place for live music for the performance of a fledgling garage band, I think the presence of the palm tree in the bar's logo is perfect to justify what Sam anticipated during his first guitar lesson to Sophia (...Just one of those bars at the beach).
I also think that the stage layout will not deviate much from the one depicted in the image shown above. In fact, I think Sam's show will not be a group performance, but a solo electric guitar performance. This would greatly reduce L&P's involvement in developing the scene (fewer characters involved, fewer renders to produce, less time to waste on any aspect of his work) and would bring the characters presumably starring in it (Sam and Sophia) into focus more quickly.
It would also be more in line with the developer's tendency to lower expectations of this event. In fact, having placed Sam's performance, in temporary order, before Sophia and Liam's visit to Cathy and Andy's house, in my opinion, greatly limits the possible developments of this event.
Therefore, I think that Kevin (the guy in whose garage Sam usually plays) and the other members of Sam's band won't show up (perhaps due to too much stage fright) and that Sam will have to perform alone playing a single song in a nearly deserted venue (given the time of the appointment with Cathy and Andy his event will inevitably take place around 8/9pm). In this rather disappointing atmosphere, Sam should not miss the chance to turn his performance into a serenade to dedicate to the girl of his (wet) dreams that he would like to cum true. To achieve this, he should play a particularly evocative song whose notes evoke a clear and unequivocal message in the heart of his muse: Sophia.
I suggest this song:

Spoiler: Bloodhound Gang - The Bad Touch

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Joking aside, I don't know what are the limits not to be exceeded in order to avoid transgressing international copyright laws (even if in the game I already seemed to hear some more or less original songs), but if it were possible, since both Sophia and Sam are classic rock lovers, I would choose this famous power ballad as the song to dedicate to Sophia:

 

[Sabertooth__]

I think the whole Morello as an out for either of Sophia's extortionists doesn't hold an ounce of water. This especially doesn't make sense until Sophia/Liam have completely satisfied their debt. This is business, right? Why would Sophia be allowed to open up additional credit lines before satisfying the first line of credit? Doesn't make sense.

If Aiden really is connected in some way, and the cops certainly think that he is, then it seems likely that either,

1. Morello intervening with Aiden would cause tension between two different syndicates - even if Morello is the larger and more powerful, he wouldn't want to engage in anything that provokes a competitor as that would upset the status quo. I cannot conceive of how or why Morello would risk tilting the applecart, let alone upending it, to "take care of" Aiden. This is dumb. Sorry gang, it's dumb.
2. Aiden's connections are actually a part of Morello's syndicate, in which case he has a lot of sway and ending Aiden's extortion is actually no big deal for him. This is dumb, too. This is a ridiculously contrived convenience and dumbs down the jeopardy of this and every other bit of tension in the entire game. The author will have shown that there is no jeopardy for Sophia, she's got plot armor and the author has no problems waving the deus ex machina wand and sprinkling pixie dust over everyone to make difficult writing situations disappear. That's not dumb, that's lazy.

With Bennet, would Morello really pull in outsiders into his orbit? Why on earth would he risk entanglement with someone working for a municipal board of education? The fuck that Morello is going to get heavy with someone who can get the government involved in any way, however remotely and however limited that government involvement might be. It just creates an extra bit of hassle and exposes him and his organization to an additional bit of risk.

To provide a service to a debtor who hasn't satisfied their debt and provide a service that, if not rendered, does not in anyway change the probability of the debt being satisfied? Sorry to say, folks, the whole Morello as an out is stupid. It's deus ex machina, it's contrived, it's lazy, and it doesn't even make any sense anyway.

You are overhyping Aiden. Aiden is nowhere near a threat that big, it's a school gang with maybe a few connections with some rowdy adults. And in the other corner is a mafia boss. You really think morello with think twice before giving a school teenager a scare.

Bennett once again is not on the board. He is also a teacher just like Sophia. He might have hidden connections but nothing to do with government on his side. Morello is constantly doing things against the government, does it matter to him to give a phone call. He can give a direct threat to minister and be unscaved, let alone this sleazy bastard. Do you think Bennett is so hell bent on fucking sophia that even after getting a call from a Mafia boss he will fight against him and his entire gang just to "maybe" have a chance that Sophia will agree to have sex.

Helping Sophia is no big deal for Morello, henceforth even Calling it a favour is over exaggerating it. Morello would have done that for Sophia even if she mentioned it to him on the Casino night, Morello was interested in Sophia and helping a woman get rid of a harasser doesn't need to be called a favour to her.

 

[Old Dog]

Since Morello/Larry are loosely based on "The Godfather" film here is a quote
“I’m Gonna Make Him An Offer He Can’t Refuse.”

 

[xxxorro]

I think the whole Morello as an out for either of Sophia's extortionists doesn't hold an ounce of water. This especially doesn't make sense until Sophia/Liam have completely satisfied their debt. This is business, right? Why would Sophia be allowed to open up additional credit lines before satisfying the first line of credit? Doesn't make sense.

From the dialogues Don makes clear that it's not a matter of money but principle. And he is not interested in getting back the money as he knows they can't afford it at the moment.
Once again we have to look at it in the perspective of the "Family", the honor system and the willing to make his brother happy (and not singing, above all). So for him the visit is enough to pay the debt, and maybe listening how far went Sophia to make Larry happy will make Don appreciate the effort and, given her status of cumare, provide for her safety as she's now part of the family.
Again, it's a very stretched explanation that I found myself very unlikely to happen in real life, but at least it could make a bit more of sense in the game once you consider the premises and the "Family" context.
And don't get me wrong, I can see myself grasping at straws, it's just an attempt to find a bit more realistic interpretation.

As nexer pointed out so well, I too think that the place where Sam will be performing will most likely be this one:
View attachment 1318402
The presence of the logo (El Mocandos) immediately hints at the famous Toronto live music venue (

You must be registered to see the links

) where rock bands like U2, Ramones, Rolling Stones etc. have performed over the years so I think the stage will be laid out in this configuration. In addition to this, without disturbing such a sacred place for live music for the performance of a fledgling garage band, I think the presence of the palm tree in the bar's logo is perfect to justify what Sam anticipated during his first guitar lesson to Sophia (...Just one of those bars at the beach).
I also think that the stage layout will not deviate much from the one depicted in the image shown above. In fact, I think Sam's show will not be a group performance, but a solo electric guitar performance. This would greatly reduce L&P's involvement in developing the scene (fewer characters involved, fewer renders to produce, less time to waste on any aspect of his work) and would bring the characters presumably starring in it (Sam and Sophia) into focus more quickly.
It would also be more in line with the developer's tendency to lower expectations of this event. In fact, having placed Sam's performance, in temporary order, before Sophia and Liam's visit to Cathy and Andy's house, in my opinion, greatly limits the possible developments of this event.
Therefore, I think that Kevin (the guy in whose garage Sam usually plays) and the other members of Sam's band won't show up (perhaps due to too much stage fright) and that Sam will have to perform alone playing a single song in a nearly deserted venue (given the time of the appointment with Cathy and Andy his event will inevitably take place around 8/9pm). In this rather disappointing atmosphere, Sam should not miss the chance to turn his performance into a serenade to dedicate to the girl of his (wet) dreams that he would like to cum true. To achieve this, he should play a particularly evocative song whose notes evoke a clear and unequivocal message in the heart of his muse: Sophia.
I suggest this song:

Spoiler: Bloodhound Gang - The Bad Touch

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Joking aside, I don't know what are the limits not to be exceeded in order to avoid transgressing international copyright laws (even if in the game I already seemed to hear some more or less original songs), but if it were possible, since both Sophia and Sam are classic rock lovers, I would choose this famous power ballad as the song to dedicate to Sophia:

If it is really a beach bar I would expect to be an outdoorsy settings rather than a enclosed space.
But kudos for finding out this interesting location with a reference to a famous place, it's the kind of thing that we could expect to be in the game given L&P sense for details!

I meant to write something about Sam's event as I have the impression that the concert itself won't take much space in the game because, e.g., contrary to the art modelling there is not much build up in the concert itself.
The only "interesting" thing that can happen is what you mention, Sam dedicating a love song to an anonymous lady in the public that has stolen his heart. That would warm Sophia up for later. And good choice for the kind of song the he would play!

But that's it, I don't think we will see much of the concert itself, the big event I think will be after. I guess it will also make L&P life easier to skim through the concert part as it can be a mess to model, light and render.

It's just a feeling that I have, then maybe he will take up the challenge and make a crazy amount of awesome renders covering the whole live performance

 

[nexer]

To be realistic, what Don Morello did is like showing a child a lollipop and then hiding it. Larry can't help but keep asking for it, I think it's more than human. So either we have L&P's words that it can all stop there, or Larry's route is longer.

 

[nexer]

As nexer pointed out so well, I too think that the place where Sam will be performing will most likely be this one:
View attachment 1318402
The presence of the logo (El Mocandos) immediately hints at the famous Toronto live music venue (

You must be registered to see the links

) where rock bands like U2, Ramones, Rolling Stones etc. have performed over the years so I think the stage will be laid out in this configuration. In addition to this, without disturbing such a sacred place for live music for the performance of a fledgling garage band, I think the presence of the palm tree in the bar's logo is perfect to justify what Sam anticipated during his first guitar lesson to Sophia (...Just one of those bars at the beach).

I think L&P can remove a wall if necessary.
As far as I know, Sam doesn't sing vocals, so just a guitar solo.

 

[Old Dog]

I think L&P can remove a wall if necessary.
As far as I know, Sam doesn't sing vocals, so just a guitar solo.

Sam is a rhythm guitarists, as for vocals who knows, but Andy Summers also sang as well.

 

[mulerider]

As nexer pointed out so well, I too think that the place where Sam will be performing will most likely be this one:
View attachment 1318402
The presence of the logo (El Mocandos) immediately hints at the famous Toronto live music venue (

You must be registered to see the links

) where rock bands like U2, Ramones, Rolling Stones etc. have performed over the years so I think the stage will be laid out in this configuration. In addition to this, without disturbing such a sacred place for live music for the performance of a fledgling garage band, I think the presence of the palm tree in the bar's logo is perfect to justify what Sam anticipated during his first guitar lesson to Sophia (...Just one of those bars at the beach).
I also think that the stage layout will not deviate much from the one depicted in the image shown above. In fact, I think Sam's show will not be a group performance, but a solo electric guitar performance. This would greatly reduce L&P's involvement in developing the scene (fewer characters involved, fewer renders to produce, less time to waste on any aspect of his work) and would bring the characters presumably starring in it (Sam and Sophia) into focus more quickly.
It would also be more in line with the developer's tendency to lower expectations of this event. In fact, having placed Sam's performance, in temporary order, before Sophia and Liam's visit to Cathy and Andy's house, in my opinion, greatly limits the possible developments of this event.
Therefore, I think that Kevin (the guy in whose garage Sam usually plays) and the other members of Sam's band won't show up (perhaps due to too much stage fright) and that Sam will have to perform alone playing a single song in a nearly deserted venue (given the time of the appointment with Cathy and Andy his event will inevitably take place around 8/9pm). In this rather disappointing atmosphere, Sam should not miss the chance to turn his performance into a serenade to dedicate to the girl of his (wet) dreams that he would like to cum true. To achieve this, he should play a particularly evocative song whose notes evoke a clear and unequivocal message in the heart of his muse: Sophia.
I suggest this song:

Spoiler: Bloodhound Gang - The Bad Touch

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Joking aside, I don't know what are the limits not to be exceeded in order to avoid transgressing international copyright laws (even if in the game I already seemed to hear some more or less original songs), but if it were possible, since both Sophia and Sam are classic rock lovers, I would choose this famous power ballad as the song to dedicate to Sophia:

Great song

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

There's been an issue with Bennett ever since it was announced that he was being curtailed. We've referenced &/or used this knowledge ever since, for a number of years in real time. At first I couldn't quite understand how there wasn't a bigger outcry about his upcoming departure, until I realised that there's hardly any blackmail followers/fans on this thread, or apparently amongst the paying patrons, at least as far as Bennett is concerned. So, a major storyline with huge potential was to be axed & the reaction was minimal & in some cases, apparently, a cause for celebration.

Now IMO, this goes to show what a great villain had been created, albeit one that didn't suit the young fanbase, (cue Aiden), many of whom possibly recognise aspects of their own current teachers in the sleazy individual. Aiden is 17/18, so whatever people think, it's not realistic to believe that he could be as imaginative as Bennett, with their relative experiences & education. It's just one of several reasons that I wish Bennett could be restored to full participation. Many folks don't like him now but if well-written events could be conjured from the pen of L&P, it's possible that more fans of coerced corruption could be added to the fanbase. He gets results & is a genuine 'love to hate' personality.

As for Don Morello & Larry, I referred from the moment they appeared to the potential solutions to the blackmail problem(s). This was because, a) it was obvious in the context of this type of game/VN & b) it seemed an easy get-out for the writer, which could be activated at any time. I suggest, however, that this wouldn't be especially likely in real life. Sophia visited the prison & did 'whatever' & this was the deal at the time. Morello has the Parkers on his books as debtors. Liam owes him & the Don doesn't owe the Parkers anything except to stick to his word. It wouldn't take much to make the blackmail go away but remember this is business & where's the profit in such action? Sophia is compliant, Liam is up to his neck in debt. They're in no position to request any favours & please don't tell me that the Morellos would do something out of the goodness of their hearts & their appreciation of Sophia....please.

Larry might have a moment of 'charity' with another visit, I suppose but like Bennett, he's on the "not wanted on voyage" list of poll absentees. Where does this leave all the loose ends? So I say, roll on the concert & "Bring Back the Full Bennett."

The game has too many storylines and some just need to be cut. Sometimes you have to make hard choices and I think Bennett was one of them

 

[Deleted member 2183629]

.

 

[Dan5k74]

Since Morello/Larry are loosely based on "The Godfather" film here is a quote
“I’m Gonna Make Him An Offer He Can’t Refuse.”

So far the only offer he can't refuse that I've found in this game is without a doubt this one:

 

[Tennyson@]

The game has too many storylines and some just need to be cut. Sometimes you have to make hard choices and I think Bennett was one of them

So aiden's storyline should also get cut out
Being blackmailed by a teen just because Dylan gets to stay home not in boarding school seems a bad writing for a bully character if task are getting this much extreme as 3rd task then the reason why she is accepting all this should be more serious than that which is not Aiden is just there to give Sophia more filthy points not an interesting storyline
Same goes for don morello introducing crime lord in your game for small events seems wastage of time if he is there just for few events L&P seems more focused on incest storyline and lesbian storyline than others

 

[Old Dog]

So aiden's storyline should also get cut out
Being blackmailed by a teen just because Dylan gets to stay home not in boarding school seems a bad writing for a bully character if task are getting this much extreme as 3rd task then the reason why she is accepting all this should be more serious than that which is not Aiden is just there to give Sophia more filthy points not an interesting storyline
Same goes for don morello introducing crime lord in your game for small events seems wastage of time if he is there just for few events L&P seems more focused on incest storyline and lesbian storyline than others

Aiden is the 4th highest person in the poll so I doubt that he will get cut from the game.

 

[Old Dog]

Hi Dr.
may you tell me if the little bonus event with Sophia is still relevant plz ?

(Afternoon) Just after Dylan/Ellie :
A little bonus storyline with Sophia (with interesting options for later)

Are you sure that you don't mean the next day?
As there is a bonus scene during Aiden's 4th task

 

[Dr.SigmundFap]

Hi Dr.
may you tell me if the little bonus event with Sophia is still relevant plz ?

(Afternoon) Just after Dylan/Ellie :
A little bonus storyline with Sophia (with interesting options for later)

It should be, but I don't know how big it's going to be.

 

[Deleted member 2183629]

.

 

[Dr.SigmundFap]

Are you sure that you don't mean the next day?
As there is a bonus event during Aiden's 4th task

I'll have to double-check but I think L&P said there was a little bonus event in this upcoming update.

 

[Old Dog]

I'll have to double-check but I think L&P said there was a little bonus event in this upcoming update.

It must be very small then if L&P has not even posted it and he has said himself that this update will have 4 events but lets wait and see what Dr.Fapalot can find out.

 

[Tennyson@]

Aiden is the 4th highest person in the poll so I doubt that he will get cut from the game.

Nah I didn't mean he will get cut out
I was just presenting a view that these popular storylines in the game does not have that much strong reasons to be continued as reasons behind all that corruption is weak
Ofcourse he will continue the storylines which are most voted by his members