Played it through. Things that could be changed for better, in my humble opinion:
1. As said before —"choiceless" choises: fight with bear, Evelyn scene.
Bear — that "fight" description wasn't even needed, because the choice in its core is "to end the game" and player only wastes time. You don't wan't players to waste their time, you want them to spend it with pleasure.
Suggestion: rock-paper-scissors fight system. You have description of bear's attack and choices with side to evade to. Make decreasing reaction time-line (like in QTE moments in the game "Wolf Among Us") so it feels more intense. Give character for example 3 or 2 HP, i.e. small room for error. And story wise, when after few evade-sequences, when the Principle arrives, it will make more sense that he feels / sees potential in MH — he survived encounter with a magic beast. I beg you not to make MH "The Chosen One" without him actually doing surprising things and earning and proving that status from THE GOD himself. Also you could do "Run" choice likewise, make player choose where to run, i.e. think fast and click fast, he shouuld feel intense, because the situation IS intentese.
Evelyn — two choices leading to the exacts same dialog, i.e. event sequence, when in a good written story different choices should matter and should create at least small and different story-branches or different ways to the main point (in global story or relations-between-characters-story).
Suggestion: think through your characters' personality first, then play the interaction in your head as MH and as the character. It might help you understand how they will interact irl, lol. And then build your dialog choices. Also, if you want RP here, give MH varying personality choices, decide, for example 3 routes "Cool kid", "Kind guy" or "Shut-in nerd" that will affect other characters as well. He was dissapointed with his high school life and university was his "new life starting" moment, make your story matter, you can play it out like this here, it's his new life, literally, he can be whatever he wants now and more players may bond stronger with him if they can choose what they like, don't decide for players, make them decide for themselves.
2. Useless descriptions
Why do you need to describe me a character's apperance if I can see her/his picture and see how she/he looks like. It may work in book, but not in the game, you have visual channel of perception here, consider this, please. Demoness' description was literally description of her art, which I can see with my own eyes. This is a problem, because player will think that the writer is bad or that the writer thinks, that the player is blind or stupid. If you want to describe a character, describe those parts that we can't see, actions or gestures (if you won't animatethem), small body movements ("her chest rapidly goes up and down from excitement" or smthng like this). Everything except what we can actually see on the screen, because it's needless.
3. Minigames
As Jesse Schell said in his book "The art of game design", game has 4 elements: story, style, technology and mechanics. And they must support and complete each other. First decide what mechanics, simply said minigames will be used for different routes (warrior, mage, priest), make them from paper and play test it, you will se how it works and if it's actually interesting. Second, decide how it will loook, i.e. style. Magic-shooting training with archer-targets look not so good, imho. Also don't forget about story, because throwing minigame at player immediately after he clicks "go to lecture" without any explanation (thanks to warrior classes for having at least key-pressing tutorial) and seeing how MH then says "I learned a lot about magic today" feels very incoherent. We need to understand as a player why are we doing those arrows or clicking those targets.
4. Another "The Chosen" guy
I mentioned it above and want to emphasize — please, don't make character just "The Chosen" and so that he then gain everything just because God said that he is "special". Youshould prove it to us readers/players through his story, character development and actions. Don't turn your story into another stereotyped isekai anime, please, I beg you (I can forgive you that truck in the beginning, ok, it's sort of a meme at this point). And I know it's demo and story didn't even started so to speak, but I am looking a few steps ahead.
5. Priest minigame where? XD
- - - - -
I mixed everything a little but that's it.
I'm not trying to offence you, guys. You did not bad for beginners (as I understood), but there is a lot to learn and improve. Don't be lazy about searching info and improve your skills. There are a lot of videos on writing stories, characters and gamedesing on Youtube, it's free, use it wisely.
Also remember: it is good when people critisize your work (except some woke bs), because complaining — is caring. The thing is dead when nobody cares.
And I hope you're not trying to make some cash from patreon and then leave with abandoned 0.0.3v game. Don't be like this, please.
Best regards.
Last edited:
- Sep 3, 2024
- 8
- 17
Thank you for the detailed suggestions, your opinions and areas of improvement. We will definitely be looking to improve the areas you mentioned. It seems to us like you want the game to have some rpg elements, the player deciding the personality of the MC. We also want the game to have rpg elements like you said that is why the choice with the bear was added as we felt like some people might have wanted to not run away. But as you said in the end it is a choiceless choice (there is basically only 1 correct choice). The problem for us now is there is not an overarching mechanic in which we can reward or punish or change depending on the players choices. The best we can for now is giving the player affection or attributes or small changes in the dialogue as you have expressed. These small dialogue changes can definitely be written better and longer as you said. We are also thinking of maybe integrating a personality system but it is pretty hard to set in stone a concrete system in this style of games. Before starting the game, we as in me and my partner had to choose between two choices. Will the game be route based where not everyone was romanceable at the exact same time or will it be more free and less route based. We ultimately choose the second option as we also wanted to integrate a map feature and the second choice was more suited for it. The problem with the second choice is as you said making the choices seem or be important. We will be looking to solve this issue. We honestly sidelined the priest side of things for the demo as you can feel. We will be working on improving the general feel of the game but it will definitely take some time. So thank you for your suggestions we value them deeply. We hope we can see more feedback like this in the future.
The pressing of keys in a porn game need to be way shorter I'm wanting to play a good game story not Rhythm I hate Rhythm games and being forced to play it is just plain bad. Also no explanation of why we are even doing this.. in a combat clicking on them for timing is one thing but just clicking for no reason is just bad.
I was also getting Disco Elysium vibes from the screen shots. That would be a cool mechanic to add to a porn game.
- Jun 13, 2021
- 4,063
- 2,351
AcardiaAfterdarkThronesOfDesire-0.11
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. Downloading issues? Look here.I went through all the content there is in the game so far. After reading Oturan767's post, one which I agree with, I thought I might as well share my thoughts on the game on top of what others had already wrote.
I'll start by saying that I don't mean to offend any of the developers by anything I might have written below. My aim is to just give my subjective feelings on the game.
---
1. Pre-Truck-kun
The stilted, wooden, unnatural nature of the script in the prologue gives a bad first impression.
I can see many people dropping the game before Will even gets the chance to get hit by the truck purely on the assumption that the rest of game's script is equally as bad.
To be clear, I'm aware the rigid dialogues and the fast pace of the prologue are most likely intentional to transport Will (and the reader) to the God's doorsteps pronto, but as it stands, it should either be rewritten or trimmed down significantly.
Suggestion:
The story and the reader will lose nothing if the prologue opens with Will thinking to himself about the confession (and thus informing the reader of what's to come) on his way to the park or even with him already waiting there for Anna with her arriving soon after.
You can use the opening scene of
The opening (of Katawa Shoujou) with Hisao being confessed to by Iwanako doesn't waste any time and serves to quickly establish one of the central aspects of the story, that being Hisao's arrhythmia, while efficiently capturing the reader's interest.
I'm not saying you should copy what Katawa Shoujou did to the letter, but a good prologue definitely shouldn't give the reader a bad first impression and preferably should hook them up as soon as possible (with overall pacing in mind, of course).
2. Unbelievable casualness in face of death and the surreal
This is hardly unique to this game and is pretty much the standard when it comes to isekai stories, but Will, a supposed university student who still sits in a Japanese highschool classroom, shakes off getting hit by a fucking truck with what amounts to a bored "Huh?".
He isn't even a bit shocked/scared by suddenly appearing in an errie room with a mysterious dark figure standing ominously on the opposite side of the room before it teleports right to him.
The only way that kind of character behaviour would even remotely makes sense is if Will has been in the state of shock the entire time.
Jokes aside, I'm not expecting him to have a trauma from the incident or for him to collapse. A story that wants itself to be taking at least somewhat seriously should have its characters showcase at least semi-believable reactions to events around them.
3. Alter Egos & Blank Will
While the Alter Egos play off of each other a few times, which I actually found a bit charming and they even got an unexpected chuckle out of me once, there are barely any interactions between them and Will outside of them giving him conflicting opinions/advice on how Will should react to any immediate situation.
Will simply lacks any agency and even personality.
That being the case, Will's lack of agency and personality isn't necessary a bad thing.
The reader can easily come up with a few reasons for Will's lack of agency. Him being a PC (player character) does neccesitates him being a blank automaton for the reader to inhabit while the Alter Egos serve as advisors not for Will, but for the reader.
Although, even if that was the case, I still believe Will should react, banter, and play off of the Alter Egos to some degree as well.
4. Leveling Alter Egos... what?
As it stands, the existence of the leveling system for the Alter Egos basically leads to two (arguably negative) outcomes.
4.1. Hidden content
The player is inevitably going to miss out on content (i.e. comments, insights, banter) of the Alter Egos they didn't spec into.
While that might be (debatebly) sensible for games like Disco Elysium and RPGs in general because they often offer better degree of replayability, the same system doesn't lend itself the same way for h-games like this one.
Very few people are going to replay whole parts of the story and try out all the combinations of sufficiently leveled up Alter Egos just to see all the bits they haven't seen the first time. So all the system does is rob the reader of the content by hiding large chunks of the unique comments/banter for no real benefit.
I even used the console to max out all the Alter Egos for one of my playthroughs and it was a definitive improvement over having parts of the dialogues hidden for no benefit.
Suggestion:
I'd suggest that no comments from the Alter Egos should be gated behind levels/points, but instead have the choice/ideas proposed by them locked behind level requirements.
That way the player isn't robbed of the content, the leveling system retains its value, and the writers will most likely have an easier time accounting for all the different combinations of choices and Alter Egos when writing the scripts.
Just as an example, when Will reaches the city academy for the first time, Aggression should get upset at the guard for ignoring Will and ask him to bring it up with the guy, but have the option to do so locked/greyed out if Will doesn't have the necessary level of Aggression.
4.2 Perfect route & ever-growing complexity
The leveling system inherently leads to there being an optimal/perfect point allocation and a route through the story, unless the player is be able to max out or reach the necessary points to reach the "optimal" series of choices no matter their points spread throughout the game.
However, if that's the case then the whole leveling system is pretty much pointless and serves only to create an illusion of choice while hiding content from the player and making development harder on top of it.
From what I've seen in the game so far, I believe there will be a perfect route because some of the choices already grant affection/rep with the girl(s).
The other issue is that the effort in keeping such a system meaningful, such as making different "builds" offer different approaches, is an ambitious undertaking. If you don't intent to make the system offer different approaches based on "builds", then all the leveling system amounts to is a pointless system them hurts players that haven't taken the optimal points allocation throughout the game.
5. The value of minigames
Once upon a time, game publishers and studios were cramming their games full of minigames for no other reason than minigames being a new thing in gaming. Think hacking, lockpicking, woodcutting, fishing and many other minigames. Most often then not, the players either hated the pointless busywork that only slowed them down or were at best ambivalent towards them.
A good minigame has to bring an adequate value to the player, can't be boring, grindy, monotonuos, pull the player out of the experience, and should preferably be optional. Otherwise the minigame only serves to iritate the player while making more work for the developers.
From my point of view, the minigames in the game are pretty much pointless.
I'm not saying that because of how trivial they are, but because it's really hard to justify a minigame's existence in a game, especially a hentai VN, while also making it fun. Very few (hentai) games actually pull that off.
Suggestion:
Reconsider cutting out the minigames if you can't justify their existence and rather focus on other aspects of the game.
It will not only make development easier/faster (assuming you wish to introduce more minigames down the line), but also lessen the chances of existing/new minigames not sitting well with the players or creating issues for you.
You can introduce minigames into the game at the later point once you have found a way to make them actually enhance the experience.
6. Knowing one's limits
From what I've seen in the game, it's trying to tackle branching choices, minigames, multiple love interests, map movement, and more.
Oturan767 already touched upon it a bit, but assuming this is your first project, I implore you to think about the scope of the game you wish to make.
Creating and finishing up even a simple (hentai) game is hard and takes a lot effort. Countless projects are stuck in an (un)intentional development hell for years as can be seen on this very site.
A short, yet finished game is worth more than an ambitious one that never completes what it set out to do and having finished a smaller project gives one more experience in tackling bigger projects down the road.
---
To clarify again, I'm not trying to be condescending or appear that I know better than the devs themselves. Some of my points might even be wrong or misinformed. These are just my personal thoughts I had after playing through the game.
I believe the devs should create the game they wish to make first and foremost, yet they should also listen to feedback whenever it doesn't go against their vision. I hope you'll remain motivated and passionate about the game, and that you make the game you wish to make!
I'll start by saying that I don't mean to offend any of the developers by anything I might have written below. My aim is to just give my subjective feelings on the game.
---
1. Pre-Truck-kun
The stilted, wooden, unnatural nature of the script in the prologue gives a bad first impression.
I can see many people dropping the game before Will even gets the chance to get hit by the truck purely on the assumption that the rest of game's script is equally as bad.
To be clear, I'm aware the rigid dialogues and the fast pace of the prologue are most likely intentional to transport Will (and the reader) to the God's doorsteps pronto, but as it stands, it should either be rewritten or trimmed down significantly.
Suggestion:
The story and the reader will lose nothing if the prologue opens with Will thinking to himself about the confession (and thus informing the reader of what's to come) on his way to the park or even with him already waiting there for Anna with her arriving soon after.
You can use the opening scene of
You must be registered to see the links
as a good example and a guideline for a decent prologue as they share similar aspects.The opening (of Katawa Shoujou) with Hisao being confessed to by Iwanako doesn't waste any time and serves to quickly establish one of the central aspects of the story, that being Hisao's arrhythmia, while efficiently capturing the reader's interest.
I'm not saying you should copy what Katawa Shoujou did to the letter, but a good prologue definitely shouldn't give the reader a bad first impression and preferably should hook them up as soon as possible (with overall pacing in mind, of course).
2. Unbelievable casualness in face of death and the surreal
This is hardly unique to this game and is pretty much the standard when it comes to isekai stories, but Will, a supposed university student who still sits in a Japanese highschool classroom, shakes off getting hit by a fucking truck with what amounts to a bored "Huh?".
He isn't even a bit shocked/scared by suddenly appearing in an errie room with a mysterious dark figure standing ominously on the opposite side of the room before it teleports right to him.
The only way that kind of character behaviour would even remotely makes sense is if Will has been in the state of shock the entire time.
Jokes aside, I'm not expecting him to have a trauma from the incident or for him to collapse. A story that wants itself to be taking at least somewhat seriously should have its characters showcase at least semi-believable reactions to events around them.
3. Alter Egos & Blank Will
While the Alter Egos play off of each other a few times, which I actually found a bit charming and they even got an unexpected chuckle out of me once, there are barely any interactions between them and Will outside of them giving him conflicting opinions/advice on how Will should react to any immediate situation.
Will simply lacks any agency and even personality.
That being the case, Will's lack of agency and personality isn't necessary a bad thing.
The reader can easily come up with a few reasons for Will's lack of agency. Him being a PC (player character) does neccesitates him being a blank automaton for the reader to inhabit while the Alter Egos serve as advisors not for Will, but for the reader.
Although, even if that was the case, I still believe Will should react, banter, and play off of the Alter Egos to some degree as well.
4. Leveling Alter Egos... what?
As it stands, the existence of the leveling system for the Alter Egos basically leads to two (arguably negative) outcomes.
4.1. Hidden content
The player is inevitably going to miss out on content (i.e. comments, insights, banter) of the Alter Egos they didn't spec into.
While that might be (debatebly) sensible for games like Disco Elysium and RPGs in general because they often offer better degree of replayability, the same system doesn't lend itself the same way for h-games like this one.
Very few people are going to replay whole parts of the story and try out all the combinations of sufficiently leveled up Alter Egos just to see all the bits they haven't seen the first time. So all the system does is rob the reader of the content by hiding large chunks of the unique comments/banter for no real benefit.
I even used the console to max out all the Alter Egos for one of my playthroughs and it was a definitive improvement over having parts of the dialogues hidden for no benefit.
Suggestion:
I'd suggest that no comments from the Alter Egos should be gated behind levels/points, but instead have the choice/ideas proposed by them locked behind level requirements.
That way the player isn't robbed of the content, the leveling system retains its value, and the writers will most likely have an easier time accounting for all the different combinations of choices and Alter Egos when writing the scripts.
Just as an example, when Will reaches the city academy for the first time, Aggression should get upset at the guard for ignoring Will and ask him to bring it up with the guy, but have the option to do so locked/greyed out if Will doesn't have the necessary level of Aggression.
4.2 Perfect route & ever-growing complexity
The leveling system inherently leads to there being an optimal/perfect point allocation and a route through the story, unless the player is be able to max out or reach the necessary points to reach the "optimal" series of choices no matter their points spread throughout the game.
However, if that's the case then the whole leveling system is pretty much pointless and serves only to create an illusion of choice while hiding content from the player and making development harder on top of it.
From what I've seen in the game so far, I believe there will be a perfect route because some of the choices already grant affection/rep with the girl(s).
The other issue is that the effort in keeping such a system meaningful, such as making different "builds" offer different approaches, is an ambitious undertaking. If you don't intent to make the system offer different approaches based on "builds", then all the leveling system amounts to is a pointless system them hurts players that haven't taken the optimal points allocation throughout the game.
5. The value of minigames
Once upon a time, game publishers and studios were cramming their games full of minigames for no other reason than minigames being a new thing in gaming. Think hacking, lockpicking, woodcutting, fishing and many other minigames. Most often then not, the players either hated the pointless busywork that only slowed them down or were at best ambivalent towards them.
A good minigame has to bring an adequate value to the player, can't be boring, grindy, monotonuos, pull the player out of the experience, and should preferably be optional. Otherwise the minigame only serves to iritate the player while making more work for the developers.
From my point of view, the minigames in the game are pretty much pointless.
I'm not saying that because of how trivial they are, but because it's really hard to justify a minigame's existence in a game, especially a hentai VN, while also making it fun. Very few (hentai) games actually pull that off.
Suggestion:
Reconsider cutting out the minigames if you can't justify their existence and rather focus on other aspects of the game.
It will not only make development easier/faster (assuming you wish to introduce more minigames down the line), but also lessen the chances of existing/new minigames not sitting well with the players or creating issues for you.
You can introduce minigames into the game at the later point once you have found a way to make them actually enhance the experience.
6. Knowing one's limits
From what I've seen in the game, it's trying to tackle branching choices, minigames, multiple love interests, map movement, and more.
Oturan767 already touched upon it a bit, but assuming this is your first project, I implore you to think about the scope of the game you wish to make.
Creating and finishing up even a simple (hentai) game is hard and takes a lot effort. Countless projects are stuck in an (un)intentional development hell for years as can be seen on this very site.
A short, yet finished game is worth more than an ambitious one that never completes what it set out to do and having finished a smaller project gives one more experience in tackling bigger projects down the road.
---
To clarify again, I'm not trying to be condescending or appear that I know better than the devs themselves. Some of my points might even be wrong or misinformed. These are just my personal thoughts I had after playing through the game.
I believe the devs should create the game they wish to make first and foremost, yet they should also listen to feedback whenever it doesn't go against their vision. I hope you'll remain motivated and passionate about the game, and that you make the game you wish to make!