Artificial Intelligence that generate ren'py games?

Elton1997

Newbie
Oct 4, 2019
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Hey guys

am wondering is there such a thing? like an AI program that makes games (scripts. renders. animations etc.)? i mean it would be cool if we have it.

What u think?
 

Jofur

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May 22, 2018
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There are different programs around that do each thing separately(but not well). AI that writes stories, AI that generate characters, probably even a few that generate usable code, and so on. But creating something like that is an astronomical task. Like we are talking huge companies like Google or Microsoft could be working on it for 10 years and it would still be barely usable and pale in comparison to anything a human could make.

So I'm afraid there's nothing really like that. The closest you get to a fully AI generated game is probably AI Dungeon, and even that breaks and messes up like 80% of the time.
 
Jul 22, 2019
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Yeah as Jofur said. There are some clunky tools out there that might be able to do the individual things that go into making a game. But there is nothing even remotely close to what you're asking here. The task is IMMENSLY complex.
 
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shark_inna_hat

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Dec 25, 2018
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It could be done if one had a big enough data set. Take a generative adversarial network and feed it a million renpy vn and I bet it could generate something passable (but probably with a lot of deformed cat pictures in it).
 

yuyutsu

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Mar 31, 2019
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Won't be as easy as you make it sound unless you don't care what the outcome will be like. Just look at all the genres out there, one will have to decide a genre and then create a data set. If one adds random games to the mix, the output will also be a random mix which will be incomprehensible. We can't just throw in shit in a data set.

Next would be computing power. Games are big, even when compressed. Definitely require Quantum computing to process the dataset unless you are ready to wait weeks for it to complete.

These are just 2 problems I can think of. I am sure there are more. With the knowledge I have of current technology it just isn't viable to try and create a game with AI unless that is what you are trying to research on.

Though I am talking about big games with story and everything. If we are talking about casual games, current technology might be able to do it but outcome could still be questionable.
 

anne O'nymous

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So far what can be done is to create Ren'py games that would looks like AI generated ones.

Among what is needed, Ren'py can dynamically build the path to the image to display, therefore something like:
Code:
label bedRoom:
    scene expression "images/background/house/{}/bedroom.jpg".format( girlName )
    show expression "images/girls/{}/{}/{}.jpg".format( girlName, girlMood, girlClothes )
Would display one of the girl in her bedroom, this whatever the girl, her mood and the clothes she wear.
[Note: I voluntarily forgot about layered images to simplify]

Ren'py can also dynamically build the labels where it branch, therefore something like:
Code:
menu:
    "Say hello":
        jump expression "greeting_{}".format( renpy.random.randint( 1, 10 ) )
    "walk away":
        jump nextEncounter
Would choose between one of the 10 scripted greeting scenes. Scenes that would apply the images trick to be usable with all the girls.

And finally, but it need a little more works, Ren'py can dynamically build the text it will display, what permit to choose between some randomized dialog lines.


But, as said by others, the would be questionable if you give full liberty to the code to choose what will happen next.

So far, the best, in terms of deepness, that have been done is Super Powered, that follow more or less the principle presented above to make a heavily randomized sandbox game. But even with the limited narrative content it have, there's visible flaws time to time.
It's the actual limitation. You can't run a real AI behind, what mean that you need a lot of watchdog if you want to keep the story constancy and coherence. Therefore, as I said, it would "looks like AI generated", but not even fully be AI driven.


This being said, creativity come from the emotions of the creator, and (try to) talk to the emotions of the viewers. Therefore, whatever how computing power you can give it, so far the most one could get is a soulless copy of what already exist.
It's surely possible, with enough time, to make a machine paint like Picasso. Give it more time and the said machine can perhaps fool any Picasso expert, making them believe that "this painting" was made by Picasso. But while technically it would looks like a Picasso painting, it would be something flat. There will be no passion put in the making process, and no message carried by the painting, and this will be felt when looking at it.

Therefore, the day an AI is able to make an effectively interesting game, please remember me to kill myself. I'm not sure that teaching machines how to feel emotions, then how to be passionate, is such a good idea.
 

Carrera

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Jun 25, 2017
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I’m convinced that’s how all the hentai puzzle games are made. An AI generates/steals 20 hentai images, calculates new puzzle configurations, and then farts it onto steam.
I imagine that's completely doable, but that doesn't fall into AI, if a game only needs to follow a very specific formula, say for example a puzzle game where you just need to move pieces of a picture around to make it whole again it would be easy for an algorithm to cut up pieces of a picture and then apply code to the pieces to make them movable and scramble them.

On many of my sites we already use code thats literally drag and drop easy to update photos and videos and take down old ones. I've actually got webmasters who know less about HTML than I do .

Anyway, the computer scans images, reads the faces, hair color, basically watches the video or picture and uploads them to the correct areas of whichever site is being updated with a scary level of accuracy. It can tell the difference between gang bangs and just multiple people in the video for instance and example.

I mention this because, it's a very complicated and functional program, but for all the things it can do it's NOT an AI. AI is just a catchall term many people like to use that doesn't actually apply to what they're using it for. It's like how far to many people think all cheating is NTR when it's not.

We have NO true A.I., nor the capability to make one,,, yet. I was told long ago that if you have to use any kind of an "if" statement to write a program it will never be an A.I. because then you're taking the decision making out of it's hands. Or something to that effect.

AND, those robots that will shit talk each other and scare people by claiming they want to take over the world, those are NOT true AI. They're literally choosing from pre-programmed responses they're allowed to choose from based on outside stimuli. They're not forming their own decisions based on their own thoughts. (if that makes sense.) Even then it's NOT the robot "choosing" based on it's own thoughts, it's choosing based on a decision matrix based on a humans thought process. Meaning "it" isn't actually choosing.

I think I shit out a tangent.


To add more to this, there are already programs people claim to be "AI" that write music, it's fucking horrid but they exist. Also programs that will scan music/individual songs and then try to add to them,,, which also turns out horribly.
 
Jul 22, 2019
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I imagine that's completely doable, but that doesn't fall into AI, if a game only needs to follow a very specific formula, say for example a puzzle game where you just need to move pieces of a picture around to make it whole again it would be easy for an algorithm to cut up pieces of a picture and then apply code to the pieces to make them movable and scramble them.

On many of my sites we already use code thats literally drag and drop easy to update photos and videos and take down old ones. I've actually got webmasters who know less about HTML than I do .

Anyway, the computer scans images, reads the faces, hair color, basically watches the video or picture and uploads them to the correct areas of whichever site is being updated with a scary level of accuracy. It can tell the difference between gang bangs and just multiple people in the video for instance and example.

I mention this because, it's a very complicated and functional program, but for all the things it can do it's NOT an AI. AI is just a catchall term many people like to use that doesn't actually apply to what they're using it for. It's like how far to many people think all cheating is NTR when it's not.

We have NO true A.I., nor the capability to make one,,, yet. I was told long ago that if you have to use any kind of an "if" statement to write a program it will never be an A.I. because then you're taking the decision making out of it's hands. Or something to that effect.

AND, those robots that will shit talk each other and scare people by claiming they want to take over the world, those are NOT true AI. They're literally choosing from pre-programmed responses they're allowed to choose from based on outside stimuli. They're not forming their own decisions based on their own thoughts. (if that makes sense.) Even then it's NOT the robot "choosing" based on it's own thoughts, it's choosing based on a decision matrix based on a humans thought process. Meaning "it" isn't actually choosing.

I think I shit out a tangent.


To add more to this, there are already programs people claim to be "AI" that write music, it's fucking horrid but they exist. Also programs that will scan music/individual songs and then try to add to them,,, which also turns out horribly.
Though you're right on the broader points, just wanted to point out a few things. If the image classifier you're using is a conventional trained convolutional neural network (CNN) then technically that WOULD classify as an AI in the business. But definitely not "true" AI. But its still pretty impressive, (its not hardcoded, it learns).

As for the talking robots, the recent GPT-3 comes as close to AI as possible and doesn't have any pre-programmed responses or decision matrices (I don't think any chatbot has those these days unless its archaic lol). As for whether it has "its own thoughts", that is a very deep and philosophical question lol, the answer to which we might never know. But other than that you're right. Tasks as complex as creating entire videos games, and the creative thought processes it requires, is yet to be done.
 

MrSilverLust

MSL Games
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May 22, 2021
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Tasks as complex as creating entire videos games, and the creative thought processes it requires, is yet to be done.
I was already quite impressed by watching GPT-3 make some out of thin air.

I don't know how long it will take, but it's just a matter of (a lot of) time until our new AI overlords start making (porn) games for us.
 

anne O'nymous

I'm not grumpy, I'm just coded that way.
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AI is just a catchall term many people like to use that doesn't actually apply to what they're using it for.
Yeah, nowadays there's supposedly AI everywhere, but it's not AI. Most of the time it's just advanced weighted choices ; something like "should I show him/her this recommendation or not ? Oh, he looked 15 videos in a row that share the same main tag, I definitively should do it."
It's the same for the said AI that drive cars. They don't think, they recognize forms and take a decision according to a weight table and/or a decision tree. They can do basic reasoning, like "this is a car, it's in front of me, it's the same car that 1 second ago, but it's now nearer, I need to decrease the speed", but globally that's all.
Would they be real AI, therefore really able to think, their development wouldn't pass by the long trial and error that we actually witness. It would suffice to teach the Highway Code to the machine.


We have NO true A.I., nor the capability to make one,,, yet.
There's some, but actually they are, almost, just learning machines. By itself it's already marvelous, but they can't do much because they still don't know how to apply the knowledge they learned. Or, more precisely, they don't know how to apply this knowledge outside of the way they are coded for.

Take facial recognition software by example. They can be trained to go further than simple facial recognition, and by example learn to recognize signs of suffering. They are small signs, sometimes almost perceptible, they vary depending of the suffering, and they are altered by the geometry of the face. But we have the knowledge to make "AI" that could learn to recognize them whatever the person.
It would be a nice addition, with all the security cameras we have, it could surely save life if each one could throw a big "WARNING, heart attack detected" and other, "WARNING, high risk of epileptic crisis", on the screen. But it's all those "AI" could do. If everyone in the center is busy, by example because there's a major crisis at the exact same time, the machine will just throw its warning in the void. Simply because it's how it is coded and not being a real AI, it can't do more that what it's coded for.
This will a real AI would have been able to recognize the lack of reaction, look at the context and either call 911, use the nearest speaker to send a "Your attention, is there a medic around here ? The person with a blue shirt is having a heart attack and no one else is available at the moment", or whatever feel to be the best solution at this moment.


I was told long ago that if you have to use any kind of an "if" statement to write a program it will never be an A.I. because then you're taking the decision making out of it's hands. Or something to that effect.
It's a little more complicated than that. Basically speaking, AI are a software running inside a software.
Ideally, humans wrote a software that simulate how our brain physically works, and there we will need to have if and other conditional branching structures. After all, our organism already works like that. Our immune system works accordingly to a decision tree that is updated during all our life. What in terms of code is expressed by IF infection looks like this THEN produce those antibody ELSE continue with the next entry in the immunity dictionary.
And it's the same for our brain. It's over simplification, but it's also a big decision tree. The reaction we will have to an impulse will depend of the route it took through our neurons. This with each neuron being a, possibly multi state, if.
Then, inside this simulation of a physical brain, would run a second software, that would be the AI itself. And there, yes, any conditional branching would be use imposing our will. But, as I said, when proceeded into our brain, this software massively rely on if...

It's a pure contradiction. To develop an effective independent AI, we need to do something that is at the opposite of the behavior we try to simulate. Reason why an AI have to be a software another software. We need to differentiate the mechanical part, that rely on conditions, and the behavior, where any condition is to avoid at all cost. Basically speaking, the AI receive the impulse, send it to its host software, then the interpretation and reaction will depend where the impulse return back to the AI.
To keep my car driving example, the impulse would be "I see something", and the host process would pass through "is it a car ?", "is it in front of us ?", "is it the same than the one we seen 1 second ago ?", "is it nearer now ?". The impulse will come back at a place that the AI would have learned to recognize as meaning "hey, fuck, we go too fast". Then what will happen depend. If it's a depressive AI, it will perhaps accelerate to kill itself. If it's a sane AI, it should decide to reduce the speed. Perhaps that a parallel processing have told it that the second lane is free, and the AI will decide to keep this speed and just pass to the said second lane. It can also happen that the AI recognized a danger and keep this speed, for the other car to hit it, and be stopped in its wild descent because the brakes broke.
This being to oppose to what actual car driving machines do. They don't know that they go too fast, they don't care about the reason why the other car is now nearer, and they possibly don't understand that there's a second lane. What they know is that "if the value of X is equal to Y, the action to do is to reduce the speed", and it's what they'll do. They don't think, they follow orders.

Be noted that here "host software" is to take in the most vast possible meaning of "software". It can be a language interpreter, it can be a simulator, it can be a decision tree algorithm. It can also be "not a software at all", and be a pure physical circuit or a dedicated microchip. Whatever can be able to proceed the software of the AI itself.


To add more to this, there are already programs people claim to be "AI" that write music, it's fucking horrid but they exist.
Yeah, they are just the learning machines I talk about above. They looks at tons of successful songs, recognize what they have in common, then apply this knowledge. But as I said, they lack of emotions, and therefore they are missing the most important part.
Take the opening of Beethoven's 5th symphony by example. It's the most known piece of classical music all around the world. Even if you don't know what it is, almost everyone will go, "hey, I know that, I don't dislike that". But while a learning machine would recognize the scheme behind it, any attempt to reproduce this success would be a failure. From their point of view of machines, the success would be due to the fact that each motif is repeated twice, while being a little more complex than the previous one.
But from our point of view of humans, it's the heroic feeling, followed by a melancholic one, carried by the music that make its success. While a machine would try to mimic the scheme, a human would try to mimic the feelings.
 
Apr 19, 2019
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AI is finally taking off, but we're just scratching the surface at this point. Probably one day.

One exciting possibility is "programming" with just natural language. Imagine you have a game idea. Right now you have to code it. You have to make the art and audio. You have to put it all together in such a way that makes it a game. Imagine just describing your game to an AI, and the AI builds as best it can based off your description, you can then go in and make revisions, again just by describing them.
 

Smithinator

New Member
Feb 8, 2022
4
1
I think this is a wrong direction to make canned games using AI. What if the AI can generate the game in real time, open-ended manner?
 

Meaning Less

Engaged Member
Sep 13, 2016
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Imagine just describing your game to an AI, and the AI builds as best it can based off your description
Well you would learn that this is literally just programming...
Because when you start getting to the nitty and gritty of your "description" you will see that you will have to be just as specific as code if you want something to work to your specifications.

Think of a developer talking to his AI like this:
"Here listen, IF the user does that THEN you show him this image, OTHERWISE don't."
"STOP, I said to move this image only 20 pixels to the left and not 20 centimenters, are you dumb?"
"What have you done!?"

It's like asking AI to draw something very specific to you, you would have to be so descriptive that at that point it would be easier to just draw it yourself.
 

Deleted member 440241

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Feb 14, 2018
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I was already quite impressed by watching GPT-3 make some out of thin air.

I don't know how long it will take, but it's just a matter of (a lot of) time until our new AI overlords start making (porn) games for us.
You joke, but bread and (erotic) circuses are very useful for pacifying the general public.