Avoiding Character and Plot Conflicts

[grtrader]

First, I probably should define what each of these types of thing are I am referring to so we are on the same page.

second, This is revised removing personal example and replacing it with statistical or comparative samples because "AON" took it personal and as if I was bragging.

Plot conflicts
This is when a primary portion of the stories explanation for what is about to unfold doesn't match up with what happens.

Character conflicts
This is when a characters actions don't match up with the persona the person has been given previously in the story and there is not a strong enough or reasonable explanation for the change. This is situation were even IFM(it's fucking magic) can not explain it away.

Some reasons it happens
Plots
Generally there are two primary reasons authors make this mistake.
The first is backwards thought.
Lets say I have a bunch of stuff I want to happen to a character and I want to explain it. So I want to create a situation for what would put her in the position for this to happen. However, I fail to consider what would really happen if that situation was to actually happen.
The second is lack of foresight.
In this case the author is usually only looking at what they are working on at the moment and not really looking ahead or even actually considering more realistic outcomes for what they come up with.

Characters
The biggest reason for this is the authors inability to see the situation from the characters perspective. This can be because of a number of reasons.
They aren't keeping track of the type of character they are writing about. Author attempting to write above their skill level. Author has no actual understanding of stuff like the fields the character works in. The biggest difference in IQ between the author and the character being written about. Lets say the author has a 110 to 120IQ it would be impossible for him/her to see from the perspective of someone with a 140 to 150 IQ. They don't see the world the same or problems the same.

Solutions
Know yourself. Know your limits.
If your IQ is below 110 it will take you to much time to research everything on your own your best option is ask someone who you know is actually knowledgeable about the subject. There in is a problem figuring out who knows something about a topic when you don't have a sufficient knowledge yourself. Kind of a catch 22. Even finding people who work in the field you can run into morons. Take Sheila Jackson Lee politician. I can't tell if she is actually as stupid as some of the answers and crap she has spewed in public or if she is doing it for attention and dramatization. Either way I would never ask her how shit works. This means you are going to have to understand the persons character and motives and what type of work they do or have done to judge what they actually know.
Comparative example: IQ off 110 vs 150 is like comparing a single core computer to a quad core computer. That's given you are not dealing with other mental issue like ADHD and both people have similar IQ ratings on both timed and untimed testing. Even that's example falls short. Most modern computers the cores have to shared bus that doesn't change in size. Well with IQ that data path and bus size also increases. So more accurately it would be a single core computer with a 64bit data path vs a quad core computer with 256bit data path. To be clear I am not actually saying a single core computer equals a 110IQ individual.

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That was six years ago.

Plots
One of the most common issues I see with VN stories is narrow focus. They don't look at the overall view just a very narrow view at what the author was looking or working on at the time. You can tell this because of the types of stuff and way things need to be revised. They are building their story scene by scene rather than having a general overview that ties everything together to start with. What type of world or economy they are in how money and other stuff tie in so on. Because they do this a lot of stuff doesn't make sense down the line and they then have to go back and revise it. The sad part this is an issue that can be fixed by simply spending 10 writing this things out.

First, consider the society you are portraying. Societies and People in general try to maximize gain. Think of it like water and electricity they take the path of least resistance.
While there are people who try to be the knights and hereos you almost never see that mentality expressed by mobs or large groups of people. Take a look at social justice warrior more times than not they are on the side that is anything but just. Their actions are more about what works best for them at the moment. Which is why so many bad laws and crap gets passed. Lots of people fail to think how stuff can be abused and what if the other side gets in office and can use that power.

This is especially true in politics. They are going to look at what action can best serve them. If they can help a company and get their help in the future such as monetary backing vs if they can't and what type of gain they will get in poles for taking whatever or whoever down. Politics is more about presentation/appearance than substance and what is right or wrong.

If you are going to use a political issue in your story as a means or cause to move a plot forward you either need to have a strong understanding of how stuff really works not the crap you read in books or college course I mean actual workings.

Politics is just one aspect. Then there is the matter of science and a lot more. You really need to do your research or consult people who know about the topic. Extreme example. Reactor scram what most people think it is vs what a Nuclear Reactor Operator and Nuclear Engineer know it is are vastly different. What you read on the internet or in most books doesn't cover 1% of what the experts need to know to do their job in dealing with the issue. It's blatantly obvious when someone who doesn't know about a field writes about it when it comes to science and tech for me and there are many more people like myself. To avoid this issue do some research. Don't make assumptions about issues you don't understand. In short don't apply your understanding to try and rationalize other crap based on it. Ask an expert before you make yourself look like an ass. Or only write what you know and have been given an explanation from a reputable source.

Even IFM (It's fucking magic) has to have rules. Magic in all stories and games has rules. Other wise you could count on things happening the way you want them to happen. Each spell would end up creating some random effect or out come and thus would be come pointless and dangerous to use. You have to explain how things work to a minimal extent. You don't necessarily need to do anything like say magic is the effect of mental understanding taking advantage of quantum mechanics and multitude of a butterfly or cascading effects to create a result turning thought into reality. Basic guidelines lines like and a background are enough in most cases. Long lost art discovered by ancient race full understanding of how it works has been lost. Cast this spell and this happens. Can only be used this many times ... and so on pretty much it.

Characters
First, flesh out the character and their traits even list stuff like skills family... If you need an idea of what to keep tract of look at DND character sheets and you could probably stand to add quite a bit more to them. Things to describe personality and why they have that personality what core values they have and so on.
Then create a level scale to base how strong views they have and traits are and what can be done to raise and lower them and scale them out.

People always do stuff for a reason even crazy people. You may not understand the reason yourself to them it makes sense at the time in the metal state they are at that time.
Personality shifts are usually gradual. There are two primary times large personality shifts happen major incidents in their life and the straw that broke the camels back.
Chemical causes drug addiction and alcoholism. Behavioral modification. IFM
The straw that broke the camels back.
Example: Butler is belittled 20 years by wife of estate finally has enough and decides its time for her to pay for all her transgressions.
Major life incident
Victim of assault, War major loss, Victim of mob mentality, Kind napping, rape, home invasion, ... incidents where they were not in control and made to feel helpless
Chemical
It depends on the chemical and exposure as to how fast and long term and what effects can occur. Different cocktails can create different results. I seen stupid authors list cocktails that would simply kill the person because they didn't realize the strength of what they include and what the side effects of mixing them with other drugs or chemicals. Best to use fantasy names for them and avoid to much detail if you don't have a understanding of chemistry and pharmacology. Even using a Merck Manual isn't enough to get it all right.
Behavioral modification
The vast majority of people who write about this get it wrong. This is a topic that can result in an postgraduate degree.
There is long term and short term behavioral modification.
Example short term example: Person forced to act a certain way under duress or coercion. The behavioral modification will break down over time after getting away from the duress even if the long term mental scars persist. You can say they will change into other patterns of behavior to avoid becoming that type of victim again or even result in fighting back and attacking people to prevent victimization of others. It really depends on the individuals and help and support they have in their lives.
Example of long term: Long term behavior modification can be achieved a number of ways. The various approaches to modification have different degrees of result and time requirements and other issues.
Two examples probably the most used
Discussion or convincing someone a behavioral change can be beneficial is possible the degree of change may need to be done incrementally.
Carrot and Stick: Its a fairly good method in that it can produce results fairly fast. However, breaks down rather quick when not reinforced depending on personality it is applied to. This is used on animal training a lot. To achieve better long term effects with people should be used with convincing discussion as to why it is beneficial to them.
Incremental exposure: This is when you do stuff like getting them used to situations or behaviors by repeatedly exposing them to it and gradually getting them used to more and more over time. You are normalizing it for them and changing the bar level slowly.
There are a number of other methods.

IFM (It's Fucking Magic)
This can be any number of things, mental power, magic spells, magic items, potions and gases ... and more. You have to establish a set of rules that govern the magic system and explain it to the audience. Does the magic last long term or short term or do both types exist. How it works very basically. Going to complex can throw you into conflicts with known science. Example: We all know matter is comprised of atoms and how their structure and so on. What you can't do is redefine stuff like that to make magic work. It's perfectly ok though for magic to do stuff like turn lead to gold. Transformation, transmutation and transmogrify 3 terms to look up. You could even combine science technology and magic to create even more powerful spells tools and explanations or an entire society based around it. Instead of a society where electricity powers most things magic could. Magic could be used to gather elements from around transmute them and then teleport them and set them off. Think of it this way you could create a spell that equals a nuclear bomb using that combination.
If there is a society based on this type of magic there are also going to be defenses created shields, spell prevention or anti casting magic, ... how is magic powered, is it unlimited can some people do more than others what creates that difference...
Skill / knowledge level their understanding of spells and how magic works
Absorption speed - rate at which they can bring mana in if used in the system
Storage level - how much mana they can store
Dispersion rate - how much mana they can release at one time
Control level - their level of control of the spell and tuning it and the ability to fully utilize the dispersion rate
Accuracy - ability to hit a target with it
Just a few things for though. You don't have to have mana or anything like it in a magic system though

Situational Influence on Characters
Various situations have different effects on characters but the degree they modify the characters changes of change is various in nature.

Well assign a scale to character types or resilience or 0 being a weak character type (spineless shit) 10 Strong Character type
A person with a 10 isn't going to give into you no matter what doesn't matter if you threaten them or their family or others.
A person with a 0 is going to basically give into you on everything only when they think they can get away with it will they not do so.
There are countless levels between them. Various threats will work better on some than other. In fact threats may just piss some off.

A person knowledge and skill set and support level in their life is going to also play a role in how much of an effect something has on them.

Lets look at a couple examples: You have photos of a person killing another person is a lot stronger than say naked pictures of the person. That depends though.
Maybe the person has a high degree of body shame and a week character strength. Or maybe the person who killed the person did so justifiably or they can prove the image isn't them and have proof the were in another location and that image is fabricated. Or maybe they have friends and family that will help them deal with you.

If you have a character that doesn't have an issue posing nude for photo shoots do you really think they are going to be blackmailed to do shit simply because someone has some nude pics of them bathing? Especially when that character knows who you are has friends and family nearby, is intelligent is a stronger character type... No Chance in hell that type of blackmail would work on that character.

Now lets look at another situation 19 year old girl moved away from home sharing an apartment with several friends none of them have any skill set or education between them to make note of they hold down whatever temporary jobs they can find and barely make rent between the group of them and have enough to pay for meals and in some cases rely on free meals from their work. Now put the girl in the spot of having a fine she needs paid by noon and if not a warrant will be issued. She has no real understanding of the legal system and how it works. She is rather plain looking shows up at an open casting for the prospect of getting paid $200 dollars if she is oked for the shoot. Now you have a situation that is rather easy to take advantage of or explain. Upon hearing she is being passed on becomes visibly upset upon questioning she mentions she really needs the money and why. Depending on how strong of character she was depicted as before this she should be rather easy to convince to do more than a plain photo shoot or maybe not even the shoot maybe just something else period.

The point is it isn't enough to say this situation is going to get this character to do xy or z. You have to take into account more than that. If you don't it looks like nothing more than fan gratification. And don't be butt hurt when people call you on it and down rate the game.

Most characters are going to look for the path that least conflicts with their values and or gives them the greatest benefit. So you sort of need to create a cost vs benefit table with a weight value system to make it accurate. The problem with that is value assigned for one thing or another is going to be different per the individual. Money may hold a higher value for Tom than Jack. Jack might assign a greater value to his self-esteem or love or property or whatever. So while 10K might get Tom do something it may take 100,000 or more to get Jack to do the same thing.

When a character is knocked out or unconscious the issues is more a situation of humiliation and loss of control verse a forced compliance. While it can be used to break down a person it doesn't help much in establishing a behavioral pattern itself.


The type of stuff I use when working on characters.
Name
Background - up bringing bonuses and penalties
family & friends - jobs, skills and values they can bring to the characters benefit
Education - including courses they took in school
IQ level
Fitness level
Appearance

Personality: Out going, social, introvert ...
Morality: covers a number of areas clothing and dress, swearing, stealing, treatment of others....
Sexuality: promiscuous level
fetishes: these can be gained and lost
constitution / strength of character - pretty much how hard it is to influence them against their will

Activities and Hobbies - running, martial arts, dance, ... whatever and how that can effect situations and knowledge levels.

Then create a list of all the activities you want done and figure out what that character might think is a higher level or lower level. You'll need to consider the character at the time their up bringing culture. Example: I know a lot of Catholic females who don't consider anal sex not to be breaking their virginity. I do see it a lot more with Hispanic females.
It doesn't mean that list can't get shuffled around with experience and life and the stuff they have happen to them through out the game or even just the situation they are in who they are with.

Anyway hope that provides some food for thought.

 

[Deleted member 1121028]

Characters
The biggest reason for this is the authors inability to see the situation from the characters perspective. This can be because of a number of reasons.
They aren't keeping track of the type of character they are writing about. Author attempting to write above their skill level. Author has no actual understanding of stuff like the fields the character works in. The biggest difference in IQ between the author and the character being written about. Lets say the author has a 110 to 120IQ it would be impossible for him/her to see from the perspective of someone with a 140 to 150 IQ. They don't see the world the same or problems the same.

Solutions
Know yourself. Know your limits.
If your IQ is below 110 it will take you to much time to research everything on your own your best option is ask someone who you know is actually knowledgeable about the subject. There in is a problem figuring out who knows something about a topic when you don't have a sufficient knowledge yourself. Kind of a catch 22. Even finding people who work in the field you can run into morons. Take Sheila Jackson Lee politician. I can't tell if she is actually as stupid as some of the answers and crap she has spewed in public or if she is doing it for attention and dramatization. Either way I would never ask her how shit works. This means you are going to have to understand the persons character and motives and what type of work they do or have done to judge what they actually know.
To give you an idea in the advantage IQ gives I have a friend who went to school the same time I did. His IQ is around 120 mine is a bit over 150. He learned CS in the time I learn Nuclear, Electrical Eng, Equipment eng and CS. Like I said above we perceive things differently you could say even though we live in the same physical world it isn't the same to each of us.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Too long and too confuse, didn't read past your bragging.

If your IQ is below 110 it will take you to much time to research everything on your own your best option is ask someone who you know is actually knowledgeable about the subject.

The key to good teaching is to never say things like, "you can't do it by yourself", but to accompany the student in his task.

 

[grtrader]

Too long and too confuse, didn't read past your bragging.

The key to good teaching is to never say things like, "you can't do it by yourself", but to accompany the student in his task.

I can revise it so people like yourself don't take it personally and just fill in those areas with performance data. There are countless studies on the topic. It won't change the facts. I don't see it as bragging. There are people who are smarter and out perform me such as the one you can read about at the bottom of this. He makes me look like I am sitting still in comparison. He's 15+ IQ points above me and has an eidetic memory.

The key to good teaching is teaching a student the best use of tools available to them to solve problems. It isn't a person can't do the research but it is the amount of time they want to dedicate to that aspect vs producing content. If they can find a reliable source (person) and get their feed back it will save them a large amount of time. Instead of spending hours even weeks trying to put together what they are reading and understand it.

The person goes and looks up something technical they never worked with in their life. But it isn't just that they may need to understand it can be all the supporting fields around it also the math, science, and so on.
Example: This is an over exaggeration to make a point.
Closed loop primary and secondary water system on a nuclear reactor the plant scrams. Show me the heat and power curves and explain why they are the way they are? You need to know Nuclear physics, reactor control systems and principles, Chemistry, Math and a good bit more to even come close to answering those. If you aren't up to that level on any one of the underlying topics you can't answer correctly. The US Navy effectively crams 4 years of college down their nuclear reactor operators in less than 18 months. You are talking a bunch of guys that are similar to me pushing a lot higher IQ than the 110. consider the amount of time it's going to take that 110 IQ to get up to speed to answer that one question. Is it worth that kind of time or would he be better off asking an expert in the field.

There is another aspect. There are jobs people with lower IQs are never ever going to do. They don't have the mental capacity to see all the variables in the problems that can happen and react appropriately in a timely manor. Doesn't matter how hard they apply themselves unless someone invents a means to boost their intelligence they will never ever be able to do them.

To be clear it doesn't make those people any less valuable in my eyes. They have a different purpose in life.

Also it creates problems to when people are mislead in believing they can do more than they can.
One of the guys I went through nuclear power with had an eidetic memory. From what I understand he missed 2 problems on one exam the entire time. The reason he was out of school that day it was discussed do to burns on his hands were he rescued a woman from a burning car. I got an 87 on my final. Which was good compared to a lot of the people 300+ started that class approx 10 graduate. Our class was reduce so much we had to be combined with another class to graduate. I may be smart but his level of ability to grasp information walks all over my ability. I put 10 20 some times 40 extra hours of study in a week. The most I seen him after hours when he stood watch duty. If he put an hour in it was a long day for him.

 

[obsessionau]

I fail to see how Aon thought you were directing criticism at them from their comment? The fact that they thought you were bragging has nothing to do with "Aon taking it as a personal attack against them self".

In my humble opinion your advice needs to be made more clear and concise.

It appears as though you try to use examples to support your message by discussing intellectual quotients, electricity fluidity and processor cores etc etc not realising that you are constantly straying off the topic and it is actually muddying up the communication.

Do something like pick the 7 most important things to remember when writing plots and then write 1 paragraph on each as to why it should be considered. I could probably sum up half of what you wrote with: "Do some study on your subject matter".

 

[RiffRaff0682]

Wow...

This advice rambles on so so much, I am with obseesionau, needs a tidy up and reducing.

And of course you can write about subjects you have little experience of, or about a character more intelligent than you are.
Otherwise we wouldn't have such great characters such as Q from Star Trek, and well, lots of others.

The important thing is you maintain willing suspension of disbelief throughout your work and stay within consistent rules laid out in your world. Biggest thing I think that would help a lot of people would be to jump over to tvtropes just as a source for inspiration and information.

Also, you come off as incredibly patronising.

 

[aphrodisia]

Lets say the author has a 110 to 120IQ it would be impossible for him/her to see from the perspective of someone with a 140 to 150 IQ. They don't see the world the same or problems the same.

...

Know yourself. Know your limits.
If your IQ is below 110...

I can tell your intention here is to provide good advice. You have some great points scattered in through this post! But here's the thing. This weird focus you have on IQ comes off as arrogant and is also patently inaccurate. IQ doesn't mean what you think it does~

 

[BigBaboon]

About character design - writers already invented magic pill. They call it "Character sheet"
So basic one -https://www.writerswrite.com/characters/character-profile/
super-duper-mega-huge variant -

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And something more useful -

You must be registered to see the links

 

[lancelotdulak]

Too long and too confuse, didn't read past your bragging.



The key to good teaching is to never say things like, "you can't do it by yourself", but to accompany the student in his task.

A better thing is not to come here just to criticise people when you have nothing to add

 

[lancelotdulak]

I fail to see how Aon thought you were directing criticism at them from their comment? The fact that they thought you were bragging has nothing to do with "Aon taking it as a personal attack against them self".

In my humble opinion your advice needs to be made more clear and concise.

It appears as though you try to use examples to support your message by discussing intellectual quotients, electricity fluidity and processor cores etc etc not realising that you are constantly straying off the topic and it is actually muddying up the communication.

Do something like pick the 7 most important things to remember when writing plots and then write 1 paragraph on each as to why it should be considered. I could probably sum up half of what you wrote with: "Do some study on your subject matter".

so you came here to criticise.. and used nonsensical sentences to do so. Great job at being useless and negative

 

[lancelotdulak]

It's not suprising NOONE wants to give you people advice.. because this is the response people who know what theyre talking about always get. I for example have been programming since the early 80s. in addition i ran my own programming business and an adult business for over a decade. Those skillsets sound useful folks? Zero chance ill help you folks with things like oh.. programming, SEO work, serverside programming, etc. Keep it up geniuses

 

[obsessionau]

so you came here to criticise..

You do realise you are dragging up a 6 month old comment just to criticise and say nothing helpful yourself?

It's not suprising NOONE wants to give you people advice.

This makes no sence as you are saying that to people giving Grtrader advice?

I find what you are saying ironic but funny as you are being negative and criticising me for giving him advice on how to make it easier to read...
...so should I be more like you and be negative and criticise instead of give advice... I am confused?

I am sorry that you found my sentences nonsensical I can explain it further for you if you require in PM?
Other people appear to understand what writing more clear and concise means and how it needs to be applied to what Grtrader had written.

Great job at being useless and negative

I invite you to quote anything that I said that was "negative"?

Excuse my ignorance, after all you ran a programming business. I only wish I had my firstborn to give to you.

 

[recreation]

It's not suprising NOONE wants to give you people advice.. because this is the response people who know what theyre talking about always get...

That's actually not true, it has to do with how you give advice.
You can't tell people that they're stupid and expect them to respect and listen to you afterwards. That's something grtrader never understood.
He always had one big problem: he thought he was better then others, and showed it everytime he was giving advice, or when ever he had the chance to...
He was always right, others - of course - always wrong. Best example is the IQ part, which is proven to be utter bullshit...

Other people here on the forum, me included, give a lot of advice when we can, the difference is that we don't act like we are "better" and know everything. Respect others, and others will respect you.
Most of the time people are thankfull, listen, ask questions. Of course there are exceptions, but you know how it is, there will always be that one idiot.

 

[anne O'nymous]

A better thing is not to come here just to criticise people when you have nothing to add

Then, why are you doing it, exhuming a 6 months old thread, forgotten by everyone and wrote by someone who've rage quit the forum few months ago ?

As for the "come here just to", before writing it, you should have took a look at the two threads in my signature and/or at my posts history. It would have been better to not assume that everyone is like you, and to verify if it's effectively the case before talking.

Yes, time to time I criticize what I read, because it's what freedom mean ; and I don't talk about "freedom of speech", just the liberty to have a different opinion. It's how people progress, by being pointed out their errors, and here there where many in the form of the message.
But it's far to be the only thing I do, way far. By themselves, the comments I wrote yesterday do more than compensate this small, yet justified, critic.

It's not suprising NOONE wants to give you people advice..

Well, it don't happen often, but the few times I asked for help/advice, I had answer. And as far as my memory is right, it's the same for obsessionau , that you put on the same boat.
Therefore, once again you are just assuming, talking without knowing. Isn't that at the opposite of what you are asking us to do ?

I for example have been programming since the early 80s. in addition i ran my own programming business and an adult business for over a decade.

And so ?
Do you really think that you are the only one to be, more or less, in those shoes ? Saying this don't give you mandatory authority, nor make you an expert of the subject. Especially if it's just a claim.

Those skillsets sound useful folks? Zero chance ill help you folks with things like oh.. programming, SEO work, serverside programming, etc. Keep it up geniuses

Well, like probably many people who'll read your comment, I'll just assume that you're a nothing more than a 18yo virgin coming here to feel better each time he cry in his dorm room after being bullied in his art college.
But don't worry, we'll not miss your skills. Like I said, you are far to be the only one in those shoes, except that the others don't brag and complain, they act and prove.

He was always right, others - of course - always wrong. Best example is the IQ part, which is proven to be utter bullshit...

Anyway, someone with an IQ as high as he claimed to have, know that it mean nothing and that there's no reason to brag about it.

 

[namiv]

First, I probably should define what each of these types of thing are I am referring to so we are on the same page.

second, This is revised removing personal example and replacing it with statistical or comparative samples because "AON" took it personal and as if I was bragging.

Plot conflicts
This is when a primary portion of the stories explanation for what is about to unfold doesn't match up with what happens.

Character conflicts
This is when a characters actions don't match up with the persona the person has been given previously in the story and there is not a strong enough or reasonable explanation for the change. This is situation were even IFM(it's fucking magic) can not explain it away.

Some reasons it happens
Plots
Generally there are two primary reasons authors make this mistake.
The first is backwards thought.
Lets say I have a bunch of stuff I want to happen to a character and I want to explain it. So I want to create a situation for what would put her in the position for this to happen. However, I fail to consider what would really happen if that situation was to actually happen.
The second is lack of foresight.
In this case the author is usually only looking at what they are working on at the moment and not really looking ahead or even actually considering more realistic outcomes for what they come up with.

Characters
The biggest reason for this is the authors inability to see the situation from the characters perspective. This can be because of a number of reasons.
They aren't keeping track of the type of character they are writing about. Author attempting to write above their skill level. Author has no actual understanding of stuff like the fields the character works in. The biggest difference in IQ between the author and the character being written about. Lets say the author has a 110 to 120IQ it would be impossible for him/her to see from the perspective of someone with a 140 to 150 IQ. They don't see the world the same or problems the same.

Solutions
Know yourself. Know your limits.
If your IQ is below 110 it will take you to much time to research everything on your own your best option is ask someone who you know is actually knowledgeable about the subject. There in is a problem figuring out who knows something about a topic when you don't have a sufficient knowledge yourself. Kind of a catch 22. Even finding people who work in the field you can run into morons. Take Sheila Jackson Lee politician. I can't tell if she is actually as stupid as some of the answers and crap she has spewed in public or if she is doing it for attention and dramatization. Either way I would never ask her how shit works. This means you are going to have to understand the persons character and motives and what type of work they do or have done to judge what they actually know.
Comparative example: IQ off 110 vs 150 is like comparing a single core computer to a quad core computer. That's given you are not dealing with other mental issue like ADHD and both people have similar IQ ratings on both timed and untimed testing. Even that's example falls short. Most modern computers the cores have to shared bus that doesn't change in size. Well with IQ that data path and bus size also increases. So more accurately it would be a single core computer with a 64bit data path vs a quad core computer with 256bit data path. To be clear I am not actually saying a single core computer equals a 110IQ individual.

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That was six years ago.

Plots
One of the most common issues I see with VN stories is narrow focus. They don't look at the overall view just a very narrow view at what the author was looking or working on at the time. You can tell this because of the types of stuff and way things need to be revised. They are building their story scene by scene rather than having a general overview that ties everything together to start with. What type of world or economy they are in how money and other stuff tie in so on. Because they do this a lot of stuff doesn't make sense down the line and they then have to go back and revise it. The sad part this is an issue that can be fixed by simply spending 10 writing this things out.

First, consider the society you are portraying. Societies and People in general try to maximize gain. Think of it like water and electricity they take the path of least resistance.
While there are people who try to be the knights and hereos you almost never see that mentality expressed by mobs or large groups of people. Take a look at social justice warrior more times than not they are on the side that is anything but just. Their actions are more about what works best for them at the moment. Which is why so many bad laws and crap gets passed. Lots of people fail to think how stuff can be abused and what if the other side gets in office and can use that power.

This is especially true in politics. They are going to look at what action can best serve them. If they can help a company and get their help in the future such as monetary backing vs if they can't and what type of gain they will get in poles for taking whatever or whoever down. Politics is more about presentation/appearance than substance and what is right or wrong.

If you are going to use a political issue in your story as a means or cause to move a plot forward you either need to have a strong understanding of how stuff really works not the crap you read in books or college course I mean actual workings.

Politics is just one aspect. Then there is the matter of science and a lot more. You really need to do your research or consult people who know about the topic. Extreme example. Reactor scram what most people think it is vs what a Nuclear Reactor Operator and Nuclear Engineer know it is are vastly different. What you read on the internet or in most books doesn't cover 1% of what the experts need to know to do their job in dealing with the issue. It's blatantly obvious when someone who doesn't know about a field writes about it when it comes to science and tech for me and there are many more people like myself. To avoid this issue do some research. Don't make assumptions about issues you don't understand. In short don't apply your understanding to try and rationalize other crap based on it. Ask an expert before you make yourself look like an ass. Or only write what you know and have been given an explanation from a reputable source.

Even IFM (It's fucking magic) has to have rules. Magic in all stories and games has rules. Other wise you could count on things happening the way you want them to happen. Each spell would end up creating some random effect or out come and thus would be come pointless and dangerous to use. You have to explain how things work to a minimal extent. You don't necessarily need to do anything like say magic is the effect of mental understanding taking advantage of quantum mechanics and multitude of a butterfly or cascading effects to create a result turning thought into reality. Basic guidelines lines like and a background are enough in most cases. Long lost art discovered by ancient race full understanding of how it works has been lost. Cast this spell and this happens. Can only be used this many times ... and so on pretty much it.

Characters
First, flesh out the character and their traits even list stuff like skills family... If you need an idea of what to keep tract of look at DND character sheets and you could probably stand to add quite a bit more to them. Things to describe personality and why they have that personality what core values they have and so on.
Then create a level scale to base how strong views they have and traits are and what can be done to raise and lower them and scale them out.

People always do stuff for a reason even crazy people. You may not understand the reason yourself to them it makes sense at the time in the metal state they are at that time.
Personality shifts are usually gradual. There are two primary times large personality shifts happen major incidents in their life and the straw that broke the camels back.
Chemical causes drug addiction and alcoholism. Behavioral modification. IFM
The straw that broke the camels back.
Example: Butler is belittled 20 years by wife of estate finally has enough and decides its time for her to pay for all her transgressions.
Major life incident
Victim of assault, War major loss, Victim of mob mentality, Kind napping, rape, home invasion, ... incidents where they were not in control and made to feel helpless
Chemical
It depends on the chemical and exposure as to how fast and long term and what effects can occur. Different cocktails can create different results. I seen stupid authors list cocktails that would simply kill the person because they didn't realize the strength of what they include and what the side effects of mixing them with other drugs or chemicals. Best to use fantasy names for them and avoid to much detail if you don't have a understanding of chemistry and pharmacology. Even using a Merck Manual isn't enough to get it all right.
Behavioral modification
The vast majority of people who write about this get it wrong. This is a topic that can result in an postgraduate degree.
There is long term and short term behavioral modification.
Example short term example: Person forced to act a certain way under duress or coercion. The behavioral modification will break down over time after getting away from the duress even if the long term mental scars persist. You can say they will change into other patterns of behavior to avoid becoming that type of victim again or even result in fighting back and attacking people to prevent victimization of others. It really depends on the individuals and help and support they have in their lives.
Example of long term: Long term behavior modification can be achieved a number of ways. The various approaches to modification have different degrees of result and time requirements and other issues.
Two examples probably the most used
Discussion or convincing someone a behavioral change can be beneficial is possible the degree of change may need to be done incrementally.
Carrot and Stick: Its a fairly good method in that it can produce results fairly fast. However, breaks down rather quick when not reinforced depending on personality it is applied to. This is used on animal training a lot. To achieve better long term effects with people should be used with convincing discussion as to why it is beneficial to them.
Incremental exposure: This is when you do stuff like getting them used to situations or behaviors by repeatedly exposing them to it and gradually getting them used to more and more over time. You are normalizing it for them and changing the bar level slowly.
There are a number of other methods.

IFM (It's Fucking Magic)
This can be any number of things, mental power, magic spells, magic items, potions and gases ... and more. You have to establish a set of rules that govern the magic system and explain it to the audience. Does the magic last long term or short term or do both types exist. How it works very basically. Going to complex can throw you into conflicts with known science. Example: We all know matter is comprised of atoms and how their structure and so on. What you can't do is redefine stuff like that to make magic work. It's perfectly ok though for magic to do stuff like turn lead to gold. Transformation, transmutation and transmogrify 3 terms to look up. You could even combine science technology and magic to create even more powerful spells tools and explanations or an entire society based around it. Instead of a society where electricity powers most things magic could. Magic could be used to gather elements from around transmute them and then teleport them and set them off. Think of it this way you could create a spell that equals a nuclear bomb using that combination.
If there is a society based on this type of magic there are also going to be defenses created shields, spell prevention or anti casting magic, ... how is magic powered, is it unlimited can some people do more than others what creates that difference...
Skill / knowledge level their understanding of spells and how magic works
Absorption speed - rate at which they can bring mana in if used in the system
Storage level - how much mana they can store
Dispersion rate - how much mana they can release at one time
Control level - their level of control of the spell and tuning it and the ability to fully utilize the dispersion rate
Accuracy - ability to hit a target with it
Just a few things for though. You don't have to have mana or anything like it in a magic system though

Situational Influence on Characters
Various situations have different effects on characters but the degree they modify the characters changes of change is various in nature.

Well assign a scale to character types or resilience or 0 being a weak character type (spineless shit) 10 Strong Character type
A person with a 10 isn't going to give into you no matter what doesn't matter if you threaten them or their family or others.
A person with a 0 is going to basically give into you on everything only when they think they can get away with it will they not do so.
There are countless levels between them. Various threats will work better on some than other. In fact threats may just piss some off.

A person knowledge and skill set and support level in their life is going to also play a role in how much of an effect something has on them.

Lets look at a couple examples: You have photos of a person killing another person is a lot stronger than say naked pictures of the person. That depends though.
Maybe the person has a high degree of body shame and a week character strength. Or maybe the person who killed the person did so justifiably or they can prove the image isn't them and have proof the were in another location and that image is fabricated. Or maybe they have friends and family that will help them deal with you.

If you have a character that doesn't have an issue posing nude for photo shoots do you really think they are going to be blackmailed to do shit simply because someone has some nude pics of them bathing? Especially when that character knows who you are has friends and family nearby, is intelligent is a stronger character type... No Chance in hell that type of blackmail would work on that character.

Now lets look at another situation 19 year old girl moved away from home sharing an apartment with several friends none of them have any skill set or education between them to make note of they hold down whatever temporary jobs they can find and barely make rent between the group of them and have enough to pay for meals and in some cases rely on free meals from their work. Now put the girl in the spot of having a fine she needs paid by noon and if not a warrant will be issued. She has no real understanding of the legal system and how it works. She is rather plain looking shows up at an open casting for the prospect of getting paid $200 dollars if she is oked for the shoot. Now you have a situation that is rather easy to take advantage of or explain. Upon hearing she is being passed on becomes visibly upset upon questioning she mentions she really needs the money and why. Depending on how strong of character she was depicted as before this she should be rather easy to convince to do more than a plain photo shoot or maybe not even the shoot maybe just something else period.

The point is it isn't enough to say this situation is going to get this character to do xy or z. You have to take into account more than that. If you don't it looks like nothing more than fan gratification. And don't be butt hurt when people call you on it and down rate the game.

Most characters are going to look for the path that least conflicts with their values and or gives them the greatest benefit. So you sort of need to create a cost vs benefit table with a weight value system to make it accurate. The problem with that is value assigned for one thing or another is going to be different per the individual. Money may hold a higher value for Tom than Jack. Jack might assign a greater value to his self-esteem or love or property or whatever. So while 10K might get Tom do something it may take 100,000 or more to get Jack to do the same thing.

When a character is knocked out or unconscious the issues is more a situation of humiliation and loss of control verse a forced compliance. While it can be used to break down a person it doesn't help much in establishing a behavioral pattern itself.


The type of stuff I use when working on characters.
Name
Background - up bringing bonuses and penalties
family & friends - jobs, skills and values they can bring to the characters benefit
Education - including courses they took in school
IQ level
Fitness level
Appearance

Personality: Out going, social, introvert ...
Morality: covers a number of areas clothing and dress, swearing, stealing, treatment of others....
Sexuality: promiscuous level
fetishes: these can be gained and lost
constitution / strength of character - pretty much how hard it is to influence them against their will

Activities and Hobbies - running, martial arts, dance, ... whatever and how that can effect situations and knowledge levels.

Then create a list of all the activities you want done and figure out what that character might think is a higher level or lower level. You'll need to consider the character at the time their up bringing culture. Example: I know a lot of Catholic females who don't consider anal sex not to be breaking their virginity. I do see it a lot more with Hispanic females.
It doesn't mean that list can't get shuffled around with experience and life and the stuff they have happen to them through out the game or even just the situation they are in who they are with.

Anyway hope that provides some food for thought.

I liked it, Many writers do consider these automatically and their work will ended up being good. I myself didnt need to memorize them because as a writer its my fetish to go inside every aspect of my characters. Hell some readers criticized me for extra detail of side characters that didnt matter much in the plots.
Anyway, Thanks

 

[lancelotdulak]

Then, why are you doing it, exhuming a 6 months old thread, forgotten by everyone and wrote by someone who've rage quit the forum few months ago ?

As for the "come here just to", before writing it, you should have took a look at the two threads in my signature and/or at my posts history. It would have been better to not assume that everyone is like you, and to verify if it's effectively the case before talking.

Your critique seems to be "how dare you comment on something old and my butt is hurt"... um have a nice day now