VN Ren'Py Blurring the Walls [v0.5.2] [Torimiata]

4.60 star(s) 47 Votes

Torimiata

Member
Game Developer
Sep 24, 2023
117
1,225
I was unsure about posting, but I wanted to share a few thoughts before diving back into development. This is gonna be a long one.

I post bi-weekly updates and communicate regularly on Discord. Some are asking for answers I don't have or that could cause confusion.

I shared this on Discord:

In hindsight, the countdown post may have set unrealistic expectations. Reviewing a single complex scene can take 10+ work hours to finalize (expressions, poses, consistency, re-dos, etc.). This is true for both old content and new content. The hours add up quickly and my time is limited.

Some here understand the development process. The last stretch feels slow, there's a reason this quote exists: "The first 90 percent of the work accounts for 90 percent of the development time. The remaining 10 percent accounts for the other 90 percent."

======

Thanks to those who pointed out this. The countdown post was accurate but these last 10 percent obviously feel very long and I miscommunicated the expectations. That's on me. I messed up the comms given the complexity of the update.

Predicting doom over the remaster is quite an assumption though. With new mature tooling and story/character changes, a remaster was inevitable. Best to do it now rather than when the game is twice as large. (I don't know of any games still using the older models due to their limitations)

I've always understood if someone cancels their support, even during 0.3.x release. Attacks on this front are misguided. I can't speed up release or change direction this late, and I have no interest in annoying supporters. This is the only solace I can offer. I will not rush out the release like I did for 0.5.0. I will release when I feel it's ready.

Support when you can, and know that your feedback is valued whether you're currently subscribing or not.

I don't like to talk about earnings but you brought it up. Patreon earnings can fluctuate month-to-month and are not guaranteed. You are looking at peak Patreon support to draw misguided conclusions.

People's financial situations and living costs vary widely. What seems like "a lot" to one person could be modest or even tight for another. There are other projects that I could take that are way more lucrative, but this project is about something I wanted to do. Don't get me wrong though. The money is a great support that helps me keep grinding but I made it clear it's not the main motivation by now. Never was.

I know some may not see the value in my decisions, but it feels right for the project and I'm happy with how it's coming out. My focus now is completing the update. For those staying, your patience is appreciated and I'm truly grateful.

As a final note - until 1.0, changes are part of the creative process. This rework aligns aesthetics and fills narrative gaps. Dramatically changed scenes weren't bad previously, they just needed to fit in. It's a one-time process that will actually speed up future development.
 

Pr0GamerJohnny

Conversation Conqueror
Sep 7, 2022
6,142
9,043
I was unsure about posting, but I wanted to share a few thoughts before diving back into development. This is gonna be a long one.

I post bi-weekly updates and communicate regularly on Discord. Some are asking for answers I don't have or that could cause confusion.

I shared this on Discord:

In hindsight, the countdown post may have set unrealistic expectations. Reviewing a single complex scene can take 10+ work hours to finalize (expressions, poses, consistency, re-dos, etc.). This is true for both old content and new content. The hours add up quickly and my time is limited.

Some here understand the development process. The last stretch feels slow, there's a reason this quote exists: "The first 90 percent of the work accounts for 90 percent of the development time. The remaining 10 percent accounts for the other 90 percent."

======

Thanks to those who pointed out this. The countdown post was accurate but these last 10 percent obviously feel very long and I miscommunicated the expectations. That's on me. I messed up the comms given the complexity of the update.

Predicting doom over the remaster is quite an assumption though. With new mature tooling and story/character changes, a remaster was inevitable. Best to do it now rather than when the game is twice as large. (I don't know of any games still using the older models due to their limitations)

I've always understood if someone cancels their support, even during 0.3.x release. Attacks on this front are misguided. I can't speed up release or change direction this late, and I have no interest in annoying supporters. This is the only solace I can offer. I will not rush out the release like I did for 0.5.0. I will release when I feel it's ready.

Support when you can, and know that your feedback is valued whether you're currently subscribing or not.

I don't like to talk about earnings but you brought it up. Patreon earnings can fluctuate month-to-month and are not guaranteed. You are looking at peak Patreon support to draw misguided conclusions.

People's financial situations and living costs vary widely. What seems like "a lot" to one person could be modest or even tight for another. There are other projects that I could take that are way more lucrative, but this project is about something I wanted to do. Don't get me wrong though. The money is a great support that helps me keep grinding but I made it clear it's not the main motivation by now. Never was.

I know some may not see the value in my decisions, but it feels right for the project and I'm happy with how it's coming out. My focus now is completing the update. For those staying, your patience is appreciated and I'm truly grateful.

As a final note - until 1.0, changes are part of the creative process. This rework aligns aesthetics and fills narrative gaps. Dramatically changed scenes weren't bad previously, they just needed to fit in. It's a one-time process that will actually speed up future development.
I'm not a patron, so you owe me nothing. However, this is a game I certainly could see myself being a patron of if this style didn't seem the norm.

Don't spend 5 paragraphs saying blah blah in corporate speak, just tell people what they want to know. You're behind on a release, fine, no biggy, it happens. What drives me up a wall (and I'm sure I'm not the only one) is when devs obfuscate and put out these mealy-mouthed communiques.

Just speak plainly. Report things like "I've completely 8/10 script days for the update, I have renders/artwork done for 7, need to write 2 more script days and make the art for 3." Simple.

If that's the style you use when speaking directly to your patrons, then I sincerely apologize for this criticism, but usually f95 posts mirror what's said there to a partial degree.
 

Orthenos

Newbie
Aug 1, 2017
89
113
I was unsure about posting, but I wanted to share a few thoughts before diving back into development. This is gonna be a long one.

I post bi-weekly updates and communicate regularly on Discord. Some are asking for answers I don't have or that could cause confusion.

I shared this on Discord:

In hindsight, the countdown post may have set unrealistic expectations. Reviewing a single complex scene can take 10+ work hours to finalize (expressions, poses, consistency, re-dos, etc.). This is true for both old content and new content. The hours add up quickly and my time is limited.

Some here understand the development process. The last stretch feels slow, there's a reason this quote exists: "The first 90 percent of the work accounts for 90 percent of the development time. The remaining 10 percent accounts for the other 90 percent."

======

Thanks to those who pointed out this. The countdown post was accurate but these last 10 percent obviously feel very long and I miscommunicated the expectations. That's on me. I messed up the comms given the complexity of the update.

Predicting doom over the remaster is quite an assumption though. With new mature tooling and story/character changes, a remaster was inevitable. Best to do it now rather than when the game is twice as large. (I don't know of any games still using the older models due to their limitations)

I've always understood if someone cancels their support, even during 0.3.x release. Attacks on this front are misguided. I can't speed up release or change direction this late, and I have no interest in annoying supporters. This is the only solace I can offer. I will not rush out the release like I did for 0.5.0. I will release when I feel it's ready.

Support when you can, and know that your feedback is valued whether you're currently subscribing or not.

I don't like to talk about earnings but you brought it up. Patreon earnings can fluctuate month-to-month and are not guaranteed. You are looking at peak Patreon support to draw misguided conclusions.

People's financial situations and living costs vary widely. What seems like "a lot" to one person could be modest or even tight for another. There are other projects that I could take that are way more lucrative, but this project is about something I wanted to do. Don't get me wrong though. The money is a great support that helps me keep grinding but I made it clear it's not the main motivation by now. Never was.

I know some may not see the value in my decisions, but it feels right for the project and I'm happy with how it's coming out. My focus now is completing the update. For those staying, your patience is appreciated and I'm truly grateful.

As a final note - until 1.0, changes are part of the creative process. This rework aligns aesthetics and fills narrative gaps. Dramatically changed scenes weren't bad previously, they just needed to fit in. It's a one-time process that will actually speed up future development.
Remasters and extending delays will be seen as the beginning of the end by some people no matter what you tell them. It's not really your fault, it's just that people have seen that pattern play out countless times on this site. Shitty devs who really do just milk patrons as long as possible ruin it for everyone else, unfortunately.
 

jclosed

Active Member
Dec 3, 2019
510
998
i think you accidentally mistyped.
"the first 90% takes 10% of the time and the last 10% takes 90% of the time"
And do not forget Murphy's law, that predicts that a catastrophic game (or software) breaking bug occurs a few minutes before the intended launch time, and will take hours, day's or even weeks to resolve. Yeah - Been there too... :p
 

kogahaya

Newbie
May 9, 2018
52
29
People talking a lot about the remaster, i don't see the comparison, but i don't think he will do a remaster if the art become worst instead of better aniway.
 

SDaddy666

Active Member
May 5, 2017
967
762
I was unsure about posting, but I wanted to share a few thoughts before diving back into development. This is gonna be a long one.

I post bi-weekly updates and communicate regularly on Discord. Some are asking for answers I don't have or that could cause confusion.

I shared this on Discord:

In hindsight, the countdown post may have set unrealistic expectations. Reviewing a single complex scene can take 10+ work hours to finalize (expressions, poses, consistency, re-dos, etc.). This is true for both old content and new content. The hours add up quickly and my time is limited.

Some here understand the development process. The last stretch feels slow, there's a reason this quote exists: "The first 90 percent of the work accounts for 90 percent of the development time. The remaining 10 percent accounts for the other 90 percent."

======

Thanks to those who pointed out this. The countdown post was accurate but these last 10 percent obviously feel very long and I miscommunicated the expectations. That's on me. I messed up the comms given the complexity of the update.

Predicting doom over the remaster is quite an assumption though. With new mature tooling and story/character changes, a remaster was inevitable. Best to do it now rather than when the game is twice as large. (I don't know of any games still using the older models due to their limitations)

I've always understood if someone cancels their support, even during 0.3.x release. Attacks on this front are misguided. I can't speed up release or change direction this late, and I have no interest in annoying supporters. This is the only solace I can offer. I will not rush out the release like I did for 0.5.0. I will release when I feel it's ready.

Support when you can, and know that your feedback is valued whether you're currently subscribing or not.

I don't like to talk about earnings but you brought it up. Patreon earnings can fluctuate month-to-month and are not guaranteed. You are looking at peak Patreon support to draw misguided conclusions.

People's financial situations and living costs vary widely. What seems like "a lot" to one person could be modest or even tight for another. There are other projects that I could take that are way more lucrative, but this project is about something I wanted to do. Don't get me wrong though. The money is a great support that helps me keep grinding but I made it clear it's not the main motivation by now. Never was.

I know some may not see the value in my decisions, but it feels right for the project and I'm happy with how it's coming out. My focus now is completing the update. For those staying, your patience is appreciated and I'm truly grateful.

As a final note - until 1.0, changes are part of the creative process. This rework aligns aesthetics and fills narrative gaps. Dramatically changed scenes weren't bad previously, they just needed to fit in. It's a one-time process that will actually speed up future development.
thanks for clarifying.
One thing i didn't realize is that I have zero clue how AI CG works but I know tools are evolving quite fast atm. I know understand the remaster problematic better
 

mok135

Member
Feb 27, 2018
109
248
As someone had predicted in ancient times, still using the word maybe, this update will be released in October, and still the Dev makes promises upon promises, without any facts.
Do you never get tired of this, Alyss? Do something else with your life. Plant a tree or something. Touch grass. Anything else but this brainrot. I understand that you are a veteran hater of Tori at this point, but you can always find some other occupation, like actual work maybe. Then you will be finally able to get out of your mother's basement. Best wishes to you.
 

DrThundercock

New Member
Dec 15, 2022
5
18
Looks like Tori has chosen the tease queen path. Is life imitating art too much?

Release shenanigans aside I'm suprised we don't have much/any fan art yet, unless I've missed it. A lot of other AI/AI assisted game threads have some heroic coomer who can't resist figuring out how to replicate the styles.
 

JezzaBoi

New Member
Aug 5, 2019
2
0
Looks like Tori has chosen the tease queen path. Is life imitating art too much?

Release shenanigans aside I'm suprised we don't have much/any fan art yet, unless I've missed it. A lot of other AI/AI assisted game threads have some heroic coomer who can't resist figuring out how to replicate the styles.
Funny you say that! There's a channel dedicated to fan art in the Discord, unfortunately it's not as active as I'd wish but I can't say much considering I'm not contributing lol.
 

WhiteFireDaemon

Active Member
Mar 14, 2017
753
1,033
a remaster of a half finished game? wtf.. just finish the damn thing in the same style and THEN do remasters and DLCs. People are hungry for new content, not the same content in different pictures/words.
Not really possible. The AI tools that Tori uses updated their methods and so any new pics will come out a bit different from now on. "Remastering" the old pics just maintains consistency between the way the new and old pics since the new ones are unavoidably going to change.
 
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slackster

Active Member
Feb 1, 2017
855
2,020
Not really possible. The AI tools that Tori uses updated their methods and so any new pics will come out a bit different from now on. "Remastering" the old pics just maintains consistency between the way the new and old pics since the new ones are unavoidably going to change.
So what happens when the AI tools updates again- another rework lol
 
4.60 star(s) 47 Votes