VN Ren'Py Game Development Process: Outlining a Ren'py VN Game Approach? (Long)

[FranceToast]

Hi, I have been thinking about making a Visual Novel using Ren'py, and was wondering if I could share my planned approach with more experienced Ren'py VN authors to see if my approach seems plausible.
Why:
1) I like the idea of putting my stories into a Visual Novel format (I have a couple stories)
2) Re-learning 3D graphics thru Daz3D ( I used to do 3D graphics back in the 90s-things have...changed)
3) Brushing up on basic programming through Python/Ren'Py (again, used to program years ago, was never good at it LOL)
4) I have decent hardware/software (1080Ti, Photoshop, etc.)
5) I have writing expertise, I have graphics expertise, I have a little programming expertise, I have some free time
6) I probably don't have anywhere near the free time necessary for something like this (LOL)
7) Making money is not my end goal-may use Patreon to centrally locate my game(s), but not even sure how that all works.

How:
1) Start Small: I began with a big story - started to outline it (as a script), and then started to put it into Twine, as a story boarding/flow chart process. But after reading a lot of good advice on this site about starting small, I decided to put the main story on hold, and took a small side story from it to develop first. It is pretty linear, but has some branching paths.

2) Define the Tasks Broadly:
a) Scripting: convert my Story into a Visual Novel type format, with branching dialogue and multiple paths (using Twine)
b) Graphics: Defining and collecting the characters, Locations, Props, and Poses needed for 3D rendering (using Daz3D)
c) Programming: familiarizing myself with Ren'py and the basic programming for a VN, trying tutorials and deconstructing some existing games for tips (using Ren'py)

3) Avoid Boredom/Frustration: I have started on all 3 of the above tasks at once, and just flit around randomly from one to another to avoid getting burnt out or frustrated by any one task.

Tasks a bit more in depth:
1) Scripting-I think I have a handle on this-Twine is pretty cool. I kind of wish Twine were more package-able, I could almost see this game working in it.

2) Graphics: Huge time sink, I know, LOL. My current plan is:
a) Create the main character faces to be a bit unique and fitting to my vision of what they look like, with multiple expressions
b) Find appropriate hair styles for each character (unique hairstyles seem like the biggest budget cost )
c) Create the main character bodies, and add all the adult bits, create some naked poses
d) Create at least one wardrobe set for each (would love multiple wardrobes but now realize why so many authors save those for secret galleries and patreon bonuses)
e) Create standard clothed poses for each character to start (based on some story ideas)
f) Create the various Locations I have planned, with basic lighting to start (will refine)
g) Create various props I need for story
h) Spend a lot of time playing with/refining lighting and setting up scenes (a lot of time)
h) Save all these sub-scenes with a great file naming system for later reference ( yeah, sure)

3) Programming: Probably my weak spot. I really have very few special needs, but I'm not sure if they are easy/hard. The basic Ren'py setup, with branching dialogue paths, graphics, integrated music, etc...seems pretty complete. I might want:
a) Basic Affection system (I have some script examples from the Ren'py site which seem to work)
b) Possibly an Instant Message system (on phone?) I have some script examples, but it seems complicated.
c) Notes screen-I am thinking of doing a simple Skyrim Quest type guide to serve instead of a walkthrough: Just a separate screen that shows a brief description of what you are doing ("I should go visit the FBI office next") and then change once you have accomplished it ("Met FBI Agent Mulder at the FBI office-he gave me a tip that UFOs were seen in the woods on the outskirts of town") These Notes could be on the phone as well?
d) Things I am not planning: Sandbox, Time of day, Inventory, Map, Mini-games, Animation, etc. I want to start small-even an Instant Message system/phone seems a bit much.

Anyways, this is my current thinking of how to approach my first game. I don't have a timetable, this is just for fun and my education (and I do have a couple of stories to tell).
There are also a ton of other issues I know-like do I do the overlaid sprite approach (like MOTH) to save space, or just render each character in-scene (like Depraved Awakenings) for more realism, etc. etc.
Any feedback, tips, warnings appreciated!

 

[randomguy]

3) Programming: Probably my weak spot. I really have very few special needs, but I'm not sure if they are easy/hard. The basic Ren'py setup, with branching dialogue paths, graphics, integrated music, etc...seems pretty complete. I might want:
a) Basic Affection system (I have some script examples from the Ren'py site which seem to work)
b) Possibly an Instant Message system (on phone?) I have some script examples, but it seems complicated.
c) Notes screen-I am thinking of doing a simple Skyrim Quest type guide to serve instead of a walkthrough: Just a separate screen that shows a brief description of what you are doing ("I should go visit the FBI office next") and then change once you have accomplished it ("Met FBI Agent Mulder at the FBI office-he gave me a tip that UFOs were seen in the woods on the outskirts of town") These Notes could be on the phone as well?
d) Things I am not planning: Sandbox, Time of day, Inventory, Map, Mini-games, Animation, etc. I want to start small-even an Instant Message system/phone seems a bit much.

I personally haven't enjoyed a single one of the "Open-world" type visual novels here on F95 and I think that's mostly due to the navigation systems/interactive interfaces. It's always a chore to want to replay a game a few months down the line if I have to navigate from place to place or hunt quests and events or go to a place on a map and click on items.
The game summertime saga comes to mind as in my opinion that game used to be a complete shitshow in terms of how tedious the gameplay was, but it's been polished as hell recently.

Which brings me to my point, unless you think your game will benefit from having an interactive interface(which judging by point "d" you don't), then just make things more "linear", which would completely eliminate the need for a "note screen."
In my experience almost every game on this site would be better with a choice style system rather than having to go and manually interact with characters on the map.

This is just my opinion though, I'm sure other people have different opinions on this topic. My English is a bit rusty so if something is unclear feel free to ask away.

P.S. I think we're in mostly in agreement about this, I'm just sharing my thoughts and thought process on the whole thing.

 

[Hentai_Kishi]

You said something about using Twine for the flow chart process, may I recommend yEd Graph Editor instead? I don't know how Twine performs as a chart making program but I think that having a program focused on chart making is better, especially when yEd Graph is free.

 

[FranceToast]

It's always a chore to want to replay a game a few months down the line if I have to navigate from place to place or hunt quests and events or go to a place on a map and click on items.

Which brings me to my point, unless you think your game will benefit from having an interactive interface(which judging by point "d" you don't), then just make things more "linear", which would completely eliminate the need for a "note screen."
In my experience almost every game on this site would be better with a choice style system rather than having to go and manually interact with characters on the map.

P.S. I think we're in mostly in agreement about this, I'm just sharing my thoughts and thought process on the whole thing.

I agree! And interestingly, the only reason I was thinking about having the Notes feature was because of your first point, which is that I tend to start and stop games, and then when I play again, I forget what was going on, LOL. I was thinking the Notes would just be there to remind you (in a linear game) what you just did last, and where you are going next (and vaguely why).

 

[FranceToast]

You said something about using Twine for the flow chart process, may I recommend yEd Graph Editor instead? I don't know how Twine performs as a chart making program but I think that having a program focused on chart making is better, especially when yEd Graph is free.

I'll take a look at yEd, thanks! Twine is a Flow chart thing that uses (I think) hyperlinks to just go from one box to the next box. So I can start with a box called *Talk with Agent Mulder* and make a list of responses: "You are crazy" "I want to believe" "Is Scully single?" and each 'response' creates a new box, that takes the dialogue to either different or the same paths. The problem is it doesn't 'translate' to Ren'py (there are some old conversion scripts but they are pretty old), but as a quick way to visualize branching conversations, it seems to work ok. I could probably do this straight inside of Ren'py if I knew Ren'py better, but Twine is stupidly simple for me to understand so far.

 

[khumak]

Have been thinking about this myself as well. I have zero experience with software development so I've been getting my feet wet just doing some modding so I can practice Daz, writing, python/etc.

I have definitely noticed after playing some of the more nonlinear games on this site that they have a tendency to leaving the player unsure of what they should be doing. Some type of note/hint system IMO is critical to making that type of game enjoyable without a walkthrough. Man of the House is a good example of a game that does that fairly well IMO. I'd be hopelessly lost in that game without it, but with the in game hint system I don't find any need to check a walkthrough either.

I'm also intrigued by the idea of using some sort of flow chart type app to map out the game first. I hadn't considered that but thinking back on some of the issues I've had writing my mod I can definitely see how that would help. Being able to visually map out different dependencies and progression paths would be a lot easier than trying to keep it straight in your head or having some text document detailing everything.

As far as storyline, I also think it's probably useful to map out at least a rough outline of how you want the entire storyline to play out (including what each character's motivations/goals are) before you start. I think games that don't do that can end up either getting bogged down in endless tangents that don't lead anywhere or progress too fast and then kind of fall flat trying to figure out how to continue without actually ending the game too soon. You can also end up in wierd situations where a character seems to have an abrupt personality change that makes no sense (like Alice suddenly switching from sub to dom in Big Brother).

 

[FranceToast]

As far as storyline, I also think it's probably useful to map out at least a rough outline of how you want the entire storyline to play out (including what each character's motivations/goals are) before you start. I think games that don't do that can end up either getting bogged down in endless tangents that don't lead anywhere or progress too fast and then kind of fall flat trying to figure out how to continue without actually ending the game too soon.

My original side story was just a straight shot beginning/middle/end, with just some variations on the theme for one main ending (for example, if you make certain dialogue choices/build up affection points you get a certain ending/epilogue/options, if you don't you get a similar ending but no epilogue/options, etc...) I realize after mapping it all out with my main story conclusion, that there was something intriguing about having an inflection point or two that would lead to a completely different ending that might still be...satisfying to some? But I can see how this can also become pretty complex, LOL.

One thing I do notice from this site-people are divided about what a VN should provide-a common refrain is "if your choices don't make a significant change in the experience, then don't give the choices", which I understand in theory-no one wants to feel like they made a hard choice that didn't seem to make any significant difference in the end, or if they replay the game the overall story remains the same.

But I do think there are some grey areas in that-you could be given choices that make subtle differences in how other characters treat you later on, that don't affect the overall story but do affect your future interactions with them. The plot might not change, but the character interactions might. Be a jerk to the waitress at the start, she won't be friendly next visit, and the people you are with also might think less of you, etc. That might make later conversations much more confrontational or unhelpful-it might not change the story, but it will change how other characters perceive of you for the rest of the game.
Maybe a lot of people aren't interested in that type of subtlety in an adult VN, I don't know. Or maybe VNs just aren't deep enough to make it worthwhile.

 

[khumak]

One thing I do notice from this site-people are divided about what a VN should provide-a common refrain is "if your choices don't make a significant change in the experience, then don't give the choices", which I understand in theory-no one wants to feel like they made a hard choice that didn't seem to make any significant difference in the end, or if they replay the game the overall story remains the same.

But I do think there are some grey areas in that-you could be given choices that make subtle differences in how other characters treat you later on, that don't affect the overall story but do affect your future interactions with them. The plot might not change, but the character interactions might.

I think there's room for different levels of impact for choices. As you mention, some choices could just have minor impact on character relationships or something. There are quite a few VN games on this site though where if you actually dig into the code of the game you'll see a large number of choices that literally have no effect, they all just point to the same thing with no difference in relationship/score/outcome at all. I think that's the type of choice people don't like because it's entirely pointless.

You can still have the storyline converge even in situations where a choice causes a significant diversion though. For instance in Babysitter there is a choice you make that determines whether Christine ends up working for Silver (one of the "bad guys" in the game) or whether she works with her best friend instead. This leads to a full day's worth of events that are completely exclusive to each path (you go to entirely different locations based on that choice for the entire day). But then the story converges back to the same path again after that single day divergence.

So your choice matters even though you still converge back into the same plotline later (but with outcomes that are affected by events exclusive to what happened when the story diverged) and a full day's worth of completely different renders. So while some choices could be a point of no return where the story completely diverges, it doesn't have to be. Most of these games the choices really just come down to choice a means +1 or -1 relationship with character a/b/c rather than an actual plot change and that's fine although I don't like it if there's no context provided that lets you know which is the better choice. Random guessing holds no appeal to me. A few random choices doesn't bother me that much but if I have to save and reload before each choice it becomes annoying.

Minigames are even worse IMO, I really dislike minigames being included unless it really does fit in with the story. A lock picking minigame for example when trying to open a locked door would at least make sense (even though I still wouldn't like it). Clicking on spinning disks or something to advance the story based on your sense of timing or how fast you can click or something is just annoying and pointless though.

 

[FranceToast]

So your choice matters even though you still converge back into the same plotline later (but with outcomes that are affected by events exclusive to what happened when the story diverged) and a full day's worth of completely different renders. So while some choices could be a point of no return where the story completely diverges, it doesn't have to be.

Hey, this is great to know, thanks! I actually have played the first couple versions of that game (hope to continue at some point), and wondered how deep those choices went.

 

[khumak]

Hey, this is great to know, thanks! I actually have played the first couple versions of that game (hope to continue at some point), and wondered how deep those choices went.

Some of them are like that in Babysitter. Unfortunately Babysitter also has a number of pointless choices as well that don't matter. Most of the choices do have at least some impact though, whether it's a difference of a few different renders that otherwise lead to the same outcome or a difference in relationship status of a point or 2 depending on your choice, or both. A lot of the early game choices led to game over bad ending scenarios which people didn't like so they don't do as much of that later.

My mod is for Babysitter so I'm a lot more familiar with exactly what each choice does in that game than I am for most games.

 

[Epadder]

I think there's room for different levels of impact for choices. As you mention, some choices could just have minor impact on character relationships or something. There are quite a few VN games on this site though where if you actually dig into the code of the game you'll see a large number of choices that literally have no effect, they all just point to the same thing with no difference in relationship/score/outcome at all. I think that's the type of choice people don't like because it's entirely pointless.

I agree mostly with @khumak's opinion on what kinda of choices a lot of people complain about. Choices that have a lasting effect even if minor are okay, Choices that change the next few lines of dialogue and nothing else aren't appreciated (Unless your asking questions and the dialogue is 'extra' information).

The type not mentioned that I think a decent number of us get frustrated with if they are constantly used, are when you're staring at screen with a single choice that you have to select to proceed. If your 'choice' is one thing and it can never be anything else, don't make me have to click it.


For me to get ready to produce a solo project I took a HTML game that I like, but wanted to change things around in, and decided to recreate it in Ren'py.

I started with a game that didn't have unique artwork so I could focus more on the coming to grips with the tool and practice my creative writing. I've had game ideas in general for years that I've kicked around and sometimes mapped out general mechanics and world overviews, but I never really went into the dialogue/script writing aspect for those ideas.

My next step on the journey is to build my own small game with 3D graphics and have some of the basic structure I would want in the much larger project I have in mind.

I would also prefer the larger project to be done in 2D or 3D that is highly stylized, so hopefully I could at least generate enough funding or a good enough small project to interest someone in working with me.

 

[FranceToast]

The type not mentioned that I think a decent number of us get frustrated with if they are constantly used, are when you're staring at screen with a single choice that you have to select to proceed. If your 'choice' is one thing and it can never be anything else, don't make me have to click it.

LOL, I hate that as well. The funny thing is, the last time I saw that was in a demo of a AAA game-you were in a car, and the one choice was "open door"...I mean, I guess you could just sit there and not click?

On a related note to this-I am definitely taking to heart another common criticism I've seen here-people feeling 'forced' into or doing things they don't feel they should have to do just to progress in the game-the chief one being feeling 'forced' into having sex with certain characters they don't really want to (I know, even in a sex game). I can see how authors might want it to happen for plot reasons, or possibly to justify the long hours and hard work I'm sure it takes to make half decent sex scenes/animations ("I spent six weeks rendering this threesome so you will sit here and enjoy it dammit!")
I kind of liked Dr Pinkcake's approach with the two college girls you meet at the bar-take one, take both, or take neither, but feel free to save, check out the sex anyways, then reload with your actual plot choice (I took neither up on their offer and didn't see the scenes at all, but I'm not a completionist)

 

[HiEv]

Hey, this is great to know, thanks! I actually have played the first couple versions of that game (hope to continue at some point), and wondered how deep those choices went.

If you're interested,

You must be registered to see the links

gives a pretty good rundown of the different ways you can handle choices in your games.

 

[FranceToast]

If you're interested,

You must be registered to see the links

gives a pretty good rundown of the different ways you can handle choices in your games.

Thank you for the link! That also led me to Dan Fabulich's Choice of Games blog, which has some great game advice too.

 

[79flavors]

I know others have already pointed out the weakness of non-linear play... I thought I'd add to that the weaknesses of an affection system.

With any scoring system in a game... you'll invariably end up with an "if tina_affection >= 6" type check.

Except most developers will set that as the maximum the player could have scored by that point in the gameplay.
You're essentially gating off content behind that score because it usually makes sense that you only get a blowjob if you've gained some points since you met the requirement to get that handjob earlier.
In some ways, point type systems are best suited to open world games... where you'll still get to see the content, but maybe it'll be on day 15 rather than day 9.

Except... this generally ends up with things such that the player NEEDS to follow a very linear path through your game to maintain the score/affection/love requirements of that next scene. Plus if you picked the "wrong" choice, there's rarely a thought given to how a player can "catch up" their score in future scenes/scenarios without breaking the system completely.

You then end up with a game that must be played a certain way to see all the "good" scenes - but as a developer, you need to code and render all those other scenes that hardly anyone will ever see. It's at least twice the amount of work for barely any gain.
You also tend to end up overly reliant on walkthroughs.

The other weakness is that there is no actually benefit to having 8 points out of 10 (or 11 points out of 18... or whatever).
If your player chooses NOT to spy on your roommate in the shower... what is the UPSIDE to not doing that? And if there's no upside, why give the player the choice?
You could set up some mutually exclusive scenarios where you can either earn enough points with Helen OR Daisy... but not both. But then how do you balance things when you've not got enough points in either to have fun.

Going back to the linear gameplay for a moment... I would also highlight that the "double the effort for barely any gain" applies there too if you end up with separate scenes for different choices. You can keep your development efforts/costs to a minimum if instead, you "mostly" try to stick to a single scene, but with minor dialogue changes (to reflect past events) rather than two separate paths (or more).

 

[khumak]

I know others have already pointed out the weakness of non-linear play... I thought I'd add to that the weaknesses of an affection system.

With any scoring system in a game... you'll invariably end up with an "if tina_affection >= 6" type check.

Except most developers will set that as the maximum the player could have scored by that point in the gameplay.
You're essentially gating off content behind that score because it usually makes sense that you only get a blowjob if you've gained some points since you met the requirement to get that handjob earlier.
In some ways, point type systems are best suited to open world games... where you'll still get to see the content, but maybe it'll be on day 15 rather than day 9.

I've noticed a lot of this in games on this site as well. I wonder how much of it is intentional and how much of it is just the dev not really paying attention to the fact that the player, unlike himself does not have perfect knowledge about the scoring system in the game? I know I have run into this problem in my mod where I'll set a trigger at a level that's easy for me, the developer to reach (with several points to spare), but that players might consider almost impossible to reach without a walkthrough.

What I've started doing lately is setting my scenes up so that they are not all or nothing and start off with the first part of a scene being trivially easy (or even guaranteed) to be available and progressing to where you need to have some reasonable score (but never a perfect score) to get the hottest scene(s). It's hard to guage whether the difficulty is right unless you get a decent amount of feedback.

Except... this generally ends up with things such that the player NEEDS to follow a very linear path through your game to maintain the score/affection/love requirements of that next scene. Plus if you picked the "wrong" choice, there's rarely a thought given to how a player can "catch up" their score in future scenes/scenarios without breaking the system completely.

You then end up with a game that must be played a certain way to see all the "good" scenes - but as a developer, you need to code and render all those other scenes that hardly anyone will ever see. It's at least twice the amount of work for barely any gain.
You also tend to end up overly reliant on walkthroughs.

I agree that this is a major problem with most games that use a scoring system and I've struggled to try and find ways around it myself for my mod. The biggest problem I run into is that most scenes where the player is making "good" decisions means he's increasing his score as well. So mistakes tend to snowball. If I don't have a high enough score for some event then not only am I already behind but I miss out on whatever points I would have gotten for that event I'm missing.

My solution has been to try to make most of my events not be an all or nothing scene. The first part of any scene is basically guaranteed to be available even if your score is zero and will give you points. Then it gets increasingly hot if your scores are reasonable yielding further points. So you can get a satisfying scene even with a low score but you'll get a better one with a better score. I also like to track status for events like that where to get credit for the event you don't have to reach the best scene. (Your reward for the best scene is the renders for that scene plus maybe a small score increase). Your reward for getting "far enough" in the scene is kind of a "bypass the score" card for some future scene.

A catchup mechanism is harder to do and I've been struggling to find ways to do that. The best method I've found so far is to set up triggers that give the player ways to bypass the score. So instead of a trigger that says you get the best scene if relationship > x, maybe it says something like relationship > x OR Suzie gave you a blowjob on day 5. So I have a general score that gives players access to scenes regardless which events they've succeeded at, but I also trigger on specific events so that if the player succeeded there, they're guaranteed to be able to get that scene even with a low score. That requires more work though because it means tracking the status of a bunch of specific events.

The other weakness is that there is no actually benefit to having 8 points out of 10 (or 11 points out of 18... or whatever).
If your player chooses NOT to spy on your roommate in the shower... what is the UPSIDE to not doing that? And if there's no upside, why give the player the choice?
You could set up some mutually exclusive scenarios where you can either earn enough points with Helen OR Daisy... but not both. But then how do you balance things when you've not got enough points in either to have fun.

Going back to the linear gameplay for a moment... I would also highlight that the "double the effort for barely any gain" applies there too if you end up with separate scenes for different choices. You can keep your development efforts/costs to a minimum if instead, you "mostly" try to stick to a single scene, but with minor dialogue changes (to reflect past events) rather than two separate paths (or more).

I think a scoring system where you need perfect, or close to perfect scores to get the best scenes probably works the best in a game where there is some type of looping/grinding going on so that if your score isn't good enough on the first pass, you can circle back and try again after you've boosted stats/relationship points/etc. For a more linear game a lot of times it leads to the player kind of wasting his time playing for a guaranteed bad ending if he's missed a certain number of points. Most games don't seem to include a way to "catch up" to fix bad choices earlier in the game other than save/reload.

I think a scoring system works better as a means of tracking something like relationship status on a general level rather than having to individually track every specific event. So if your score is greater than some reasonable number then that character likes you. That's a lot easier to trigger on than event a = 1 and event b = 0 and event c = 2, etc. So in general I think a general score is fine as long as you're leaving the player with plenty of wiggle room below the "perfect" score to get the best scenes.

 

[FranceToast]

I know others have already pointed out the weakness of non-linear play... I thought I'd add to that the weaknesses of an affection system.

With any scoring system in a game... you'll invariably end up with an "if tina_affection >= 6" type check.

The other weakness is that there is no actually benefit to having 8 points out of 10 (or 11 points out of 18... or whatever).
If your player chooses NOT to spy on your roommate in the shower... what is the UPSIDE to not doing that? And if there's no upside, why give the player the choice?

I totally see this as an issue-in fact one thing that bothers me playing games that *show* you the scores as you play is it just makes you wonder wtf it means, and you end up watching the counter more than just playing the game itself (Although maybe people play for the high scores, and 'maximizing' the point total is a game unto itself for them).

My idea of tracking an 'affection score' is probably stupid-I was just thinking of using it to reflect mostly dialogue/emotional responses (as opposed to huge plot shifts). So for example-you chat with your sister early on, and you can be playful and affectionate , sarcastic, or rude and dismissive in your responses. Does it change the overall path? No, but it does change how she responds to you, and allows the player to define how they want to define themselves and their relationships. So maybe more of a role-play aid than anything else. Still working on it though.

I think a scoring system works better as a means of tracking something like relationship status on a general level rather than having to individually track every specific event. So if your score is greater than some reasonable number then that character likes you.

Yeah, that is what I am trying to do. But it might be so subtle that people will just get stressed over what the points mean or be angry they aren't more significant, LOL.

 

[thecardinal]

In my personal opinion, I don't like the points tracking that some games have. 100% agree that it just makes you read the walkthrough or look at the scores instead of the content.

Stick with the 'role-play aid,' it's a good idea to switch up dialogue a bit, especially for people who play multiple times to get different content.

Way too many games give a choice and penalize creepy behavior or lock out content (or give a game over screen) because you don't have enough 'points.'

If you are on the fence about it, not having a point system makes your game way easier to code.

 

[FranceToast]

In my personal opinion, I don't like the points tracking that some games have. 100% agree that it just makes you read the walkthrough or look at the scores instead of the content.

Stick with the 'role-play aid,' it's a good idea to switch up dialogue a bit, especially for people who play multiple times to get different content.

Way too many games give a choice and penalize creepy behavior or lock out content (or give a game over screen) because you don't have enough 'points.'

If you are on the fence about it, not having a point system makes your game way easier to code.

LOL, well given my flailing around in Python lately, this is probably great advice, thanks. I am also still interested in doing a simple wiki like you described a while back for your game-I think that is a cool idea to keep players up to date on who they meet, especially if they put the game aside for a while and then want to pick it back up without restarting.

 

[khumak]

In my personal opinion, I don't like the points tracking that some games have. 100% agree that it just makes you read the walkthrough or look at the scores instead of the content.

Stick with the 'role-play aid,' it's a good idea to switch up dialogue a bit, especially for people who play multiple times to get different content.

Way too many games give a choice and penalize creepy behavior or lock out content (or give a game over screen) because you don't have enough 'points.'

If you are on the fence about it, not having a point system makes your game way easier to code.

There's a flip side to that as well though. If your game does not have a point system then the player might not have enough context to know whether their decision was good or bad. I've found it disturbingly common when playing a game with no visible score to just kind of flail along blindly and end up with the bad ending with no clue how I got there and no idea which choices were good vs bad. With a scoring system you can at least save/reload and see that ok random choices suck but at least I know now that random choice A increased my score and random choice B reduced it...

It would be better if it was clear based on the text and renders whether you made a good or bad decision but that's frequently not the case in some games. You could also sort of have it both ways by making the score available to the player behind a phone interface or something so it was available if they needed/wanted it but otherwise invisible. So maybe you play most of the game not needing it but get stuck somewhere and save/reload paying attention to the score to try and figure out why you're stuck.