H GOTY

[Imisx]

Yes, this is a suggestion for F95. I think there is no one better suited than F95 to choose the H GOTY.

How? Personally I would make the whole F95 community choose the candidates with votes, and then I would make a restricted group of unbiased and impartial people choose the goty.
This of course with more than one category like for example: GOTY, Best FMC game, Best MMC game, Best RPG, Best Art ecc. Since it would be a tough job to play all the candidate games, maybe it's a good idea to limit their numer per category to three or four max.

To avoid people voting the candidates they want using bots I would make a rule that prevents new and inactive accounts to vote.

What do you people think about it?

 

[NeonSelf]

Games already have ratings, tags and reviews.

I dont trust some small group of people to choose the best movie (hello oscars), the same way I wouldnt trust someone to choose GOTY. But good luck with that.

It starts as just a recomendation and then these reviews are bought and used to get more publicity or to make a statement. Look what happens on rotten tomatoes or how steam deletes unwanted waves of downvotes.

 

[Imisx]

Games already have ratings, tags and reviews.

I dont trust some small group of people to choose the best movie (hello oscars), the same way I wouldnt trust someone to choose GOTY. But good luck with that.

It starts as just a recomendation and then these reviews are bought and used to get more publicity or to make a statement. Look what happens on rotten tomatoes or how steam deletes unwanted waves of downvotes.

You are right, personally even The Game Awards are a bit biased and limited. But still, I think it would be a very fun and interesting thing to have. It's up to people then to take them more or less seriously.

And more important, it would help people discovering good games.

 

[Sphere42]

And more important, it would help people discovering good games.

Porn tastes are far too subjective for that. You could categorise the gameplay and narrative genres but even that is imperfect, and for porn "intensity-rated" tag clouds and authentic previews are much more useful. And in a direct vote the winners would be likely to be mediocre with wide exposure rather than the best in their specific niche, basically the same as you get when ordering the threads by number of likes.

For a personal example, the "better" a "corruption" game is the less interested I am. I HATE the basic premise of "corruption", but sex-positive female leads are so rare that speedrunning a corruption path with decent production value but utterly atrocious progression often is the closest substitute I can get. Blitz past the shit that's supposed to be the core of the game and enjoy what's left.

 

[Imisx]

Porn tastes are far too subjective for that. You could categorise the gameplay and narrative genres but even that is imperfect, and for porn "intensity-rated" tag clouds and authentic previews are much more useful. And in a direct vote the winners would be likely to be mediocre with wide exposure rather than the best in their specific niche, basically the same as you get when ordering the threads by number of likes.

For a personal example, the "better" a "corruption" game is the less interested I am. I HATE the basic premise of "corruption", but sex-positive female leads are so rare that speedrunning a corruption path with decent production value but utterly atrocious progression often is the closest substitute I can get. Blitz past the shit that's supposed to be the core of the game and enjoy what's left.

Porn tastes might be subjective, yes, but gameplay, narrative, art ecc. aren't. If games have a wide esposure, maybe it's because they are good.

 

[Sphere42]

Porn tastes might be subjective, yes, but gameplay, narrative, art ecc. aren't. If games have a wide esposure, maybe it's because they are good.

No, even if we're being generous mass appeal beats quality. Imagine for the sake of argument that the uncontested best game from a given year in terms of gameplay, narrative, art quality etc. was a gay NTR game with a fat black protagonist. I am sure that the relevant sub-communities would absolutely LOVE the representation, but the popular vote would still go to some generic hourglass bimbo incest shovelware instead of the objectively "better" game because one appeals to the basic preferences of the majority audience while the other doesn't in the slightest. If you have a panel of judges you'll most likely get a similar result just averaged out over their individual tastes instead.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Oh, it's this time of the year already?

 

[Imisx]

No, even if we're being generous mass appeal beats quality. Imagine for the sake of argument that the uncontested best game from a given year in terms of gameplay, narrative, art quality etc. was a gay NTR game with a fat black protagonist. I am sure that the relevant sub-communities would absolutely LOVE the representation, but the popular vote would still go to some generic hourglass bimbo incest shovelware instead of the objectively "better" game because one appeals to the basic preferences of the majority audience while the other doesn't in the slightest. If you have a panel of judges you'll most likely get a similar result just averaged out over their individual tastes instead.

That's why there's different categories and an unbiased and impartial group of people choosing the winners. Like this, these people will play all the candidate games from every category and then they will chose the bests.

And yeah, even like this of course this can't be 100% accurate, but still, it's fun and it's a good way to make people discover new good games.

Oh, it's this time of the year already?

Yes! Oscars, Golden Ball, Goty... we are only missing H GOTY at this point.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Yes! Oscars, Golden Ball, Goty... we are only missing H GOTY at this point.

It's not what I meant...
I was talking about this, and that, and all the threads that followed, but less easily findable because having a less obvious names, or because created where they should all have been.

Each year it's the same thing.
Each year the same arguments in favor of that H GOTY or whatever OP will name it that particular year.
Each year the same explanation why it's something that wouldn't works due to the nature of the adult gaming scene.
And each year there's someone (will be me this year) to remember that anyway F95Zone already do something similar through its annual Christmas contest where donors votes for their favorites games (that must follow some conditions), the three first getting a money donation from F95.

 

[Geigi]

I HATE the basic premise of "corruption", but sex-positive female leads are so rare

Me too, it's ridiculous how many FMC games are on my ignore list. Sex-positive games are rare but so are women writers.

 

[Imisx]

It's not what I meant...
I was talking about this, and that, and all the threads that followed, but less easily findable because having a less obvious names, or because created where they should all have been.

Each year it's the same thing.
Each year the same arguments in favor of that H GOTY or whatever OP will name it that particular year.
Each year the same explanation why it's something that wouldn't works due to the nature of the adult gaming scene.
And each year there's someone (will be me this year) to remember that anyway F95Zone already do something similar through its annual Christmas contest where donors votes for their favorites games (that must follow some conditions), the three first getting a money donation from F95.

Yeah, I know. Didn't know about the christmas contest, but I know that's a recurring question. I even noticed the rejected threads on the "Features Request" subforum, which is why I'm talking about it here instaed of making a request. I still wanted to talk about it because the more I think about it and the more it doesn't look like something that hard to do, if you find an affordable way to do it.

 

[anne O'nymous]

[...] the more I think about it and the more it doesn't look like something that hard to do, if you find an affordable way to do it.

It's not a question of difficulties, it's a question of accuracy.

When you see that there's people who genuinely believe that Milf City have the best renders, that A Wife and Mother have a marvelous writing, or that WVM still deserve 5 stars, what can someone expect form a GOTY-like contest? The last example being the worse because, whatever the quality that one can see in the game, if there's literally a black box to hide MC's face, it cannot be a 5 stars game; 4 perhaps, but not 5.
And I insist on the fact that they genuinely think what they are saying. It's not a question of good taste versus taste, it's mostly a question of ignorance, but not a purely intellectual one. It's more that, among the game than one played, Milf City is the one with the less worse renders, or A Wife and Mother the one with the less worse writing; what they say is right, in regard of the really small portion of games they played.
Whatever one can think about the GOTY award, Oscars, and those kind of annual awards, there's a filter applied by the presence of professionals that will judge the game/movie/music/whatever in regard of their practical and technical qualities instead of doing it in regard of the enjoyment it procured them. Something that can't be done here.

And, of course, there's also the fact that it would need selection criteria. What games can be part of the nominees?

Is a version 0.1, that would be perfect in all points, really as worthy than a version 0.9 that lack on some points? It's a good promise, but we don't know how long the dev have passed on that first release, nor do we know if he can stay at this level of quality in a long run.
And, of course, if we starts to discriminate depending on the version or the number of release, how should this be done? Most devs aren't there and, even among those who've an account here, most don't even know how many updates they'll need. In those condition how can we know when a game have reach the threshold and is, by example, half finished?

Should a 10yo finished game really be part of the nominees? After all, despite its age, Sakura Dungeon is still one of the best game. But is it fair to compare it with a game started last year?
And this raise another question. Should the few professional games compete with purely amateur games? There isn't enough professional games for a dedicated category, but it would be unfair to make them compete with hobbyist creations; like it would be unfair to simply ignore them.

And finally, who would be the voters? Does someone with a one month old account have played enough games to judge, as impartially as a lambda player can, the quality of a game? Not in regard of someone that played a hundred games each year since the creation of the forum. But in the same time, who are we to decide that this new member haven't played adult games since the early 90's and therefore know more than the majority?

 

[Imisx]

It's not a question of difficulties, it's a question of accuracy.

When you see that there's people who genuinely believe that Milf City have the best renders, that A Wife and Mother have a marvelous writing, or that WVM still deserve 5 stars, what can someone expect form a GOTY-like contest? The last example being the worse because, whatever the quality that one can see in the game, if there's literally a black box to hide MC's face, it cannot be a 5 stars game; 4 perhaps, but not 5.
And I insist on the fact that they genuinely think what they are saying. It's not a question of good taste versus taste, it's mostly a question of ignorance, but not a purely intellectual one. It's more that, among the game than one played, Milf City is the one with the less worse renders, or A Wife and Mother the one with the less worse writing; what they say is right, in regard of the really small portion of games they played.
Whatever one can think about the GOTY award, Oscars, and those kind of annual awards, there's a filter applied by the presence of professionals that will judge the game/movie/music/whatever in regard of their practical and technical qualities instead of doing it in regard of the enjoyment it procured them. Something that can't be done here.

And, of course, there's also the fact that it would need selection criteria. What games can be part of the nominees?

Is a version 0.1, that would be perfect in all points, really as worthy than a version 0.9 that lack on some points? It's a good promise, but we don't know how long the dev have passed on that first release, nor do we know if he can stay at this level of quality in a long run.
And, of course, if we starts to discriminate depending on the version or the number of release, how should this be done? Most devs aren't there and, even among those who've an account here, most don't even know how many updates they'll need. In those condition how can we know when a game have reach the threshold and is, by example, half finished?

Should a 10yo finished game really be part of the nominees? After all, despite its age, Sakura Dungeon is still one of the best game. But is it fair to compare it with a game started last year?
And this raise another question. Should the few professional games compete with purely amateur games? There isn't enough professional games for a dedicated category, but it would be unfair to make them compete with hobbyist creations; like it would be unfair to simply ignore them.

And finally, who would be the voters? Does someone with a one month old account have played enough games to judge, as impartially as a lambda player can, the quality of a game? Not in regard of someone that played a hundred games each year since the creation of the forum. But in the same time, who are we to decide that this new member haven't played adult games since the early 90's and therefore know more than the majority?

Not even Oscars and The Game Awards are 100% accurated, so why would an H Goty need to be 100% accurated?

Selection criteria? The most loved games chosen by people with votes.

What games should be part of the nominees? Only completed games, since being unfinished is a huge defect for a game.

Should a 10yo finished game really be part of the nominees? Sorry but that's a stupid question. Of course not. It should count only games completed during that year. GOTY stand for Game of The YEAR for a reason.

Should the few professional games compete with purely amateur games? Of course. An indie lately won the normal GOTY, for a porn game it's only easier lol.

And finally, who would be the voters? Already wrote about that. It's not that I have something against new people, but some developers could use bots to candidate their own game. Maybe there's other solutions for this, but for now that's the best idea I can get.

The thing is that you are all taking this too seriously while it would only be something fun to do. No one ever did anything perfect in this kind of things, but they are still fun to have (look at the Golden Ball for example...).

 

[anne O'nymous]

Not even Oscars and The Game Awards are 100% accurated, so why would an H Goty need to be 100% accurated?

There's a difference between ninetish percent accurate and tenish percent accurate.

Selection criteria? The most loved games chosen by people with votes.

What games should be part of the nominees? Only completed games, since being unfinished is a huge defect for a game.

Be coherent. Either there's nominees, and therefore there's selection criteria, or there's no selection criteria, and therefore there's no nominees.

But okay, so completed games it is. Not a bad selection criteria, we progress...

Sorry but that's a stupid question.

I adapt to the topic...

It should count only games completed during that year. GOTY stand for Game of The YEAR for a reason.

So, for 2024, ~2000 games. Good, at least its not a short selection.

Oh, wait, since I said "short", should we count the one shoot games that have less than one hour of content? Is it fair to compare them to games that have days of content?
And, while I'm at this, is it fair to compare the many one shoots, to games that have years of development behind them? The first ones are relatively unknown, while the seconds have grown a solid fan base over all their years of development.

Karryn's Prison, 441 reviews, near to 3,000 reactions and more than 52,000 posts in the thread, for 5 years of development. Against 14 reviews, 100 reactions and and less than 150 posts for Dusk Pub, published, already finished, few days apart from Karryn's Prison. I have no doubt who would win between those two, whatever can be their qualities.
At equivalent rating, you can also compare Karryn's Prison with Buka Ore x Onna Joushi/Kashidashi Play, published already finished, or Interview with the Horny Ghost, one year of development. Two games that would have near to no votes, because totally hidden.
And this is just randomly picked examples from a randomly picked page of the Latest Updates, when filtering by completed games.

And the top five for the H GOTY 2024 is: City of Broken Dreamers, Karryn's Prison, Sunshine Love, Freeloading Family, The Genesis Order.
Oh, wait, sorry, Freeloading Family shouldn't be here. It's part of the few games that have updates for one year or two after being finished. It's cheating. Such games shouldn't be authorized to be part of the nominees for years just because the dev/team released the endings one by one, in order to get more money.

By the way, can games that have been played over their years of development really be qualified of "Game of The Year"?
I mean, Chloe 18 New have had one release that year, in January, after two years of development. It's not really a game of that year...

Should the few professional games compete with purely amateur games? Of course. An indie lately won the normal GOTY, for a porn game it's only easier lol.

When it come to regular games, "indie" mean small studio of professionals not owned by, or affiliated to, a publisher. Not really the same definition than the hobbyist who works on its adult games after his daily job, using for this the knowledge he have gathered by himself.
There's semi-professional writers, professionals graphic designers, professionals game designers, professionals coders, and so on, among the adult games creators. But there's none that are all of this, not even if counting teams. You can't compare them to the few professional studios, like Winged Cloud by example, that rely on teams where everyone graduated on their own field.

The thing is that you are all taking this too seriously while it would only be something fun to do.

The thing is that I'm taking this seriously because most devs, and even more players, would take it seriously. The game that would win the GOTY would see its number of patrons significant raise and, as usual, get ~100 time more players. A gain in popularity that would hide even more the thousands of worthy games that are cursed and always released in the same time than an artificially popular game.

And I don't even talk about the hundreds threads that would pop up because, "WTF! this game is shit, it don't deserve its GOTY". Nor about the fan raiding the GOTY thread to trash it because it's totally unfair that their dear favorite game didn't get the award.

 

[Imisx]

There's a difference between ninetish percent accurate and tenish percent accurate.

That's just your numbers.

Oh, wait, since I said "short", should we count the one shoot games that have less than one hour of content? Is it fair to compare them to games that have days of content?
And, while I'm at this, is it fair to compare the many one shoots, to games that have years of development behind them? The first ones are relatively unknown, while the seconds have grown a solid fan base over all their years of development.

You can apply this to every single GOTY thing, Ballon D'or, Oscars ecc. Yes, it's fair. Doesn't matter if the game has 5 years development or if the game was just released. If people played them both I'm sure they know what they like more.

More important, you're talking like games like Karryn's Prison are shit and would win only because they have a solid fan base... well, my friend, if such games have a solid fan base it's because they are good as fuck. Since we would have like three or four nominees I'm pretty sure we can have the best games to actually win the GOTY, or at least to be nominated. Maybe it would still not be 100% accurated but I'm sure it would be more than 10%, as you said before. It's not like we have a million completed games every year on F95. I think people can find the best 4 out of 1000-2000.

And the top five for the H GOTY 2024 is: City of Broken Dreamers, Karryn's Prison, Sunshine Love, Freeloading Family, The Genesis Order.
Oh, wait, sorry, Freeloading Family shouldn't be here. It's part of the few games that have updates for one year or two after being finished. It's cheating. Such games shouldn't be authorized to be part of the nominees for years just because the dev/team released the endings one by one, in order to get more money.

That's a good point. No, games receiving updates and DLCs after they were completed during another year should not be counted. About people who release endings with time, can't say a game is completed if it only has 3 endings out of 10 for example, expecially if we talk about a VN. I would not count them.

By the way, can games that have been played over their years of development really be qualified of "Game of The Year"?
I mean, Chloe 18 New have had one release that year, in January, after two years of development. It's not really a game of that year...

I don't know about this particular case, but if we are talking about a remake, yes, it should be counted.

When it come to regular games, "indie" mean small studio of professionals not owned by, or affiliated to, a publisher. Not really the same definition than the hobbyist who works on its adult games after his daily job, using for this the knowledge he have gathered by himself.
There's semi-professional writers, professionals graphic designers, professionals game designers, professionals coders, and so on, among the adult games creators. But there's none that are all of this, not even if counting teams. You can't compare them to the few professional studios, like Winged Cloud by example, that rely on teams where everyone graduated on their own field.

Nope, and time wikipedia comes to aid me. Here's the definition of indie game: "An indie video game or indie game, short for independent video game, is a

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created by individuals or smaller development teams without the financial and technical support of a large

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, in contrast to most

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."
So yeah, it includes individuals too. And no, they are not always professionals. Considering that normal games are often done by huge teams with even 500 developers, I think that inside the porn games industry is a lot easier for individuals to win the GOTY since the largest team you'll find has no more than 10 developers.

But again, everything you say can be applied to every other award... if you have a problem with every single award of this kind then we are talking for nothing.

The thing is that I'm taking this seriously because most devs, and even more players, would take it seriously. The game that would win the GOTY would see its number of patrons significant raise and, as usual, get ~100 time more players. A gain in popularity that would hide even more the thousands of worthy games that are cursed and always released in the same time than an artificially popular game.

Only the winner and the nominees will get a popularity boost (three or four games), no one will be ruined for something this small.

And I don't even talk about the hundreds threads that would pop up because, "WTF! this game is shit, it don't deserve its GOTY". Nor about the fan raiding the GOTY thread to trash it because it's totally unfair that their dear favorite game didn't get the award.

That's the best part! This whole thing would create a huge discussion with people talking about porn games, and hoping for their favourite game to win... I think it's beautiful. Of course there will be some people being a pain in the ass, but if they don't break the rules, then I don't think it's a problem. And if they do, well, just get em banned lol. There's people breaking the rules everyday even without the GOTY.

Realistically, the only reason I see for not doing this is that it's a lot of work. And that's why they officially refused to do it in the past, but personally I think that something simple could be done without having to stop sleeping. Solutions to make things easier exists and the discussions on this thread have the purpose to find them.