Image or Animation?

[DeafPerv]

I'm no sucker for animated scenes.
While it's enjoyable to watch them, i don't think it's worth the time the devs put on them.
Some of the updates i have played the past few days have multiple animations and only 3-4 minutes worth of story. I would rather enjoy the story than animated scenes.
They should be putting on more effort on the storyline than the animated scenes that are well equal to massive amount of images.

What do you guys think?

 

[Eoin]

Myself, I prefer images. Drawn images, to be precise, for two simple reasons:

1. The size of the game reduces massively.
2. In my opinion, the artwork looks better (looks to have more effort put into it than, i.e. a DAZ model).

It definitely helps that w/ drawn images, there is more effort put into the story of the game.

Story over artwork every day of the week.

 

[N7]

I think ICSTOR does it the better story and renders and animation are flawless with enough content each update.

 

[Lorric17]

Tastes vary. Personally I want some context to the scenes and if the scenes are animated, then it's an added bonus. But it's not a requirement for me. But let each dev do what works for them.

 

[baneini]

Images are better by an infinite margin. I haven't seen any game where doing that repeating loop bullshit added any value. Usually it detracts value.

For example in Town of Passion the 2d animation requires comically sized cock to move tits and hand on it, and the poses are just awful. So we're robbed of decent character design and poses because dev thinks animation makes up for that.

Then in some rpgm titles like My gfs amnesia/Anna exciting affection the looped animation just keeps going without you being able to interrupt it and god help you if you accidentally click "repeat".

 

[Yoshiiki]

Time spent on animation could be used to make few images and give more scenes or extend current ones, that means more content, more fun. But, if it's a bigger studio that can afford it without degrading rest of the game - yeah, why not?
Unless it's one of those weird animations you see on all those hentai ads... It looks weird, like someone is just stretching stuff or cutting image into parts and trying to animate it, don't like that and don't want.

 

[DarthSeduction]

I think ICSTOR does it the better story and renders and animation are flawless with enough content each update.

Yeah, and money and a team can do that. Most devs don't have that.

 

[The-real-Vastitas]

Yeah, and money and a team can do that. Most devs don't have that.

You suggested ICSTORS new game to me in another thread and I finally got around testing it...incest isn't my personal favorite the story itself as well as the writing and repetitiveness put an end to the test but it wasn't a rage quiet mainly due to the animations being the biggest asset and the fact that his games are better off using Ren'py of course...while he somehow managed to hold onto parts of the grind regardless:coldsweat: but that's maybe just me I hate repetition with a passion by now too many games have certain time extending elements that are simply no fun...but back to animations...

While render limits may be the factor as to why most games use static images, effects on them or small time loops I can appreciate not only the effort and strive to go the extra mile...movement of all sorts ( facial expression within dialog...background...other interactive animations like gestures and so on) can add depth to the game and it's story if placed and timed correctly I believe.
A good story certainly can do without but it does not hurt to have them either...I get it time spend creating animations is in no way justified by the time the player spends looking at them especially in 3D projects but I would never say

Images are better by an infinite margin

as a matter of fact I expect animations in a well funded project like BB, DmD or DoD as a natural step of evolution...the question of Image or animation is in the end a matter of resources available.

 

[Göffel]

Oh, I like me these simple small loop animations with 2d images.
(Nekopara, Boob Wars 2, such stuff)

And I absolutely adored the funny + cute miniature animations for the sex scenes with minor enemies that happened right there on the RPGM map in Rune's Pharmacy.
imo. worth playing for that alone already, but to me the game is also good otherwise, made the impression to be created with "love" for making their game.

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[DarthSeduction]

.while he somehow managed to hold onto parts of the grind regardless:coldsweat:

Obviously if you aren't into incest, that's that... ofc I would hold out, if the paths with the girls at school are half as good as the ones at home it'll be worth it. That said, the only grind I noticed was money, and it was a simple Rock Paper Scissors game. Didn't feel at all like grind to me. I played until I could buy every item from both stores and then from then just had everything I needed. Don't get me wrong, the earning money mechanic is a grind, but compared to BB or My Summer with Mom and Sis, or countless other games, this grind was so tame that I barely noticed it.

 

[The-real-Vastitas]

but compared to BB

nothing like that for sure but a few variables to give different answers each days wouldn't hurt for one...it's early stage and the story is not meant to be taken too seriously I get it but that's another one of these titles in which family members are crazy about one another without any explanation as to why that would be a thing...choices given had zero impact as well in the end...if you ain't kissing the mother for example that is not even slowing her down...all female family members have zero problem with any of it from start to finish really the progression feels like watching an old VHS on 16x forward motion skipping the plot looking for the "good scenes". Alternate titles for this one would be: The irresistible cock or Coming of age: gotta fuck them all. It's not so much the incest theme itself ( I can look passed that pixels ain't related in my book ) but the unexplained acceptance and willingness to go for it with which I have a problem with. To be fair though that problem is shared with pretty much any other incest themed title out in the field.

 

[DarthSeduction]

nothing like that for sure but a few variables to give different answers each days wouldn't hurt for one...it's early stage and the story is not meant to be taken too seriously I get it but that's another one of these titles in which family members are crazy about one another without any explanation as to why that would be a thing...choices given had zero impact as well in the end...if you ain't kissing the mother for example that is not even slowing her down...all female family members have zero problem with any of it from start to finish really the progression feels like watching an old VHS on 16x forward motion skipping the plot looking for the "good scenes". Alternate titles for this one would be: The irresistible cock or Coming of age: gotta fuck them all. It's not so much the incest theme itself ( I can look passed that pixels ain't related in my book ) but the unexplained acceptance and willingness to go for it with which I have a problem with. To be fair though that problem is shared with pretty much any other incest themed title out in the field.

And see, actually enjoying the incest genre I'd disagree with you that, while Milfy City seems to have made it more accepted, it does a good job of laying the groundwork for why. Caroline, for instance, isn't having any of it at first... its only as she realizes it was turning her on that she goes forward. Sara's makes perfect sense as the story goes along, to her, incest with you isn't a new thought... its an old one. She's got a crush on her older brother who she looks up to and who pays attention to her, something the guys at school don't do. As for mom, seeing her being the one who is going after the MC is a huge improvement. So often the mom is desexualised and treated like someone who has to be tricked into sex. The fact that she goes for you instead is a nice change.

Now, if you wanna say that the kind of wish fulfillment you're getting here in a Harem game is not your thing, then sure, that's a valid complaint, no one person is as lucky as the MC. But I'm willing to suspend my disbelief on that note as the game is in fact a Harem game. So it is only natural that the Harem would be possible. In terms of character development and whatnot, I find the fact that the female characters are motivated for their own reasons to be with the MC is preferable. I don't know about you but never in my life have I ever been able to convince a woman who wasn't interested in me to be interested in me. Thats what makes games like MotH and BB so unplayable to me. I'm tired of playing games where I'm a sexual predator. It's about time a writer wrote women who are interested in the MC.

 

[The-real-Vastitas]

It's about time a writer wrote women who are interested in the MC.

Absolutely which is what I do in my own game for the most part as well...too many games ignore a woman's sexuality.
I agree also that the Mom's interested is a nice change within the genre...however with the MC looking too young for comfort coupled with her aggressive persuade it does feel a bit forced especially since there is no branch to avoid any of it. My take on Caroline's plot is a little different to yours...practically sitting around butt naked at home from the get go teasing the shit out of her brother ( very first scene after intro -butt alert - :closedeyesmile it needed little more than a bit of help in her store and a few naughty pics to make her realize that she wants more out of it after all.
A "Harem game" might be the keyword to realize that the plot is not to be taken too seriously which is fine as most folk prefers a fun ride...it may not be my cup of tea but knowing other games of his this one is by all means a huge step up.

 

[DarthSeduction]

especially since there is no branch to avoid any of it.

The way the game is written you don't have to do any of it. If you don't want to follow the mom route, ignore her. She doesn't exist as a gate to allowing you to follow other routes. You don't have to interact with her at all.

practically sitting around butt naked at home from the get go teasing the shit out of her brother ( very first scene after intro -butt alert - :closedeyesmile it needed little more than a bit of help in her store and a few naughty pics to make her realize that she wants more out of it after all.

It's pretty clear to me that she's simply comfortable with her body in a way that she doesn't see it as sexual in and of itself. I get your point, but I also agree with her view.

however with the MC looking too young for comfort

I understand enough about human sexuality to know that there's really nothing inherently wrong with ephebophilia, which is a sexual attraction to those aged 12-15. Acting on it can be wrong, and in fact the younger they are, the more likely that is. But in a society where sex isn't treated as a taboo and a 14 year old understands what sex is, why we have it, and what we get out of it, there's no reason that they can't consent. The problem of consent actually comes from our societal taboo and sheltered attitude.

As for the MC, I see him as between 15 and 18. Same with Sara, I have no problem with them being depicted in the game in this way, so long as they are consenting. And it's pretty clear that, while he's confused, he is consenting. You do have the option to turn her down, or at least it appeared you do, later. I simply didn't because she's been the first mom I was attracted to.

 

[The-real-Vastitas]

You don't have to interact with her at all.

Oh look who is that sitting in my house...ah...it's my mother but I can't talk to her unless I do her to...okerFace:
I know first hand branches are a lot of work hell I got 10 in my game by now and it slows down the update progress but I wouldn't wanna miss them enabling the player to say...nah...I want that story to unfold in a different direction it is part of the charm playing a game instead of reading a book for me...

The youngish look does not really bother me as long as it is no shota ( another widely popular fetish that's even lower on my wish list than incest is) it really is just the combination but for those who do enjoy a mom&son plot that obviously is no issue how could it be...

 

[grgrgr5]

I hate animations. They are so pointless. Some developers spend all their time rendering a 5 second looped animation that they know half of their audience is going to skip over anyway (so they force you to watch it a few times before letting you continue with the game) when they could be working on the game itself. Who the hell likes these looped animations? I can only imagine it's people who have little experience with sex and don't realize how fake it looks. All animations serve to do is make me lose immersion completely in the most jarring way and make me click like mad to try and skip them as soon as possible.

 

[GuyFreely]

I can appreciate a well done animation. Meaning smooth, realistic motion, expressiveness, etc. When it's clunky and awkward, it might as well have been static. While I have yet to try to render an animation in Daz, I would imagine it's like rendering however many frames are needed for the animation. If they are using an animation plugin, a lot of the work should be done for them. If they are custom crafting an animation, that can take a ton of time to do right. So if a particular creator can get in a solid animation without spending all their time on it, great. If it's taking away from the story development or other aspects, then it could probably be cut. Unskippable ones are annoying. It should last from when it starts to when I click to move on.

If it came down to one short animation versus several varied poses, I'd probably like the poses more I think.

 

[Vanaduke]

If you can pull off and afford the time consumption of animation, then you can assure a dedicated fan-base. However, if your animations are lackluster loops like Dreams of Desire, then you have to compensate for images. So far the only games I played with a dedicated balance between animation and images is Summertime Saga and ICSTOR games.

Animation is pointless however if you have a poor build-up, execution and story.

 

[uradamus]

I feel a big part of the problem is that Daz and Illusion's Studio programs are geared towards simple static posing and are meant to be intuitive for unskilled users to work with. They really didn't give any serious thought to user created animations. You have to get away from those programs if you really want to get serious about 3D animation. Animating a scene with the proper tools can be a lot faster than creating a series of static poses with poor tools once you gain a little experience.

Though that obviously means overcoming a lot of hurdles, mainly with designing or purchasing rigged models and background scenes to work with in your 3D animation program of choice (which also needs to be learned). Blender's really nice for animation if you've got a model with appropriate helpers integrated - ik/fk switches where appropriate, control bones for drivers and simplifying things like foot roll and hand closing, shape keys to save deformations for correcting mesh problems or doing facial expressions, and the graph animation editor for adjusting the transitions between key frames using curves.

One thing that can possibly make things easier for those coming from Daz who'd like to leverage the power of Blender would be this exporter/importer:

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. I haven't used it myself, but it looks rather promising.

On the 2D side of things Toonz was open-sourced as

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which is used by some pretty big animation studios. Also

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has some pretty nice animation tools built-in now. If you want to do 2D animation using skeletal rigs and mesh deforms,

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has nice coverage for those features now. Though you may have to build it yourself to get the new deform features until the next update comes out as they were only recently added.

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[Pretentious Goblin]

Depends on the artstyle and writing. My favorite game and most anticipated game have minimal animation. But if I'm just gonna look at a still image, your writing had better carry it. Translated Japanese RPGM games are the worst, I don't need to read an entire paragraph's worth of ''aaaahhhh'' and ''nnnnggggg'' and cringeworthy, awkward Japanese writing.