Ren'Py Is it possible to live off making these games

[Morsin]

I dabbled in 3D for fun before. I've also written some short things that exes found pretty hot. I've had ideas for games that could work well I think. Recently I lost my job and it's been difficult to find something with the market the way it is. Is it actually possible to make a living making these games?

I was thinking I would do a ren'py game, with optional NTR. How would I even start? Lol

 

[Nadekai]

Is it possible? Certainly!
Is it probable? Not really...


If you want to start one, make a sketch, a general idea, a storyline, an MVP, and characters.
If you just do things on the fly, nothing good will come out, and the story will be inconsistent.


Count Morado made an excellent analysis of patreon earnings, so check them out if you want to know statistics.

 

[Morsin]

Is it possible? Certainly!
Is it probable? Not really...


If you want to start one, make a sketch, a general idea, a story synopsis, an MVP, characters, and an overall idea.
If you just do things on the fly, nothing good will come out, and the story will be inconsistent.


Count Morado made an excellent analysis of patreon earnings, so check them out if you want to know statistics.

can you give me a link?

i know it sounds arrogant, but i'm fairly certain if i was able to get the art out i can definitely make something people would like. and i absolutely do have a short outline worked out already, it wouldn't be a long project that gets extended past its life unnaturally, i have other ideas in mind for future projects which i already had written in short story form.

 

[Nadekai]

can you give me a link?

i know it sounds arrogant, but i'm fairly certain if i was able to get the art out i can definitely make something people would like. and i absolutely do have a short outline worked out already, it wouldn't be a long project that gets extended past its life unnaturally, i have other ideas in mind for future projects which i already had written in short story form.

UPDATED FOR 2024 DECEMBER
Data of the 8,685 adult game creators on Patreon used to create this analysis comes from:

You must be registered to see the links

Of the 8,685 creators, 6,650 have paid subscribers.
Of the 2,035 creators who do not have paid subscribers, 137 started in the past 365 days.
The 1,898 creators who do not have a paid subscriber and have had a Patreon creator account for longer than 365 are not included in this analysis.

This analysis is of the 6,787 creators who have paid subscribers or started in the previous 365 days.
Of those, 4,165 make their earning public (61.4%). Using their data, creators receive an average of $4.50 per paid subscriber each month (that's down 3-cents from last year).

Where monthly earnings are supplied, they are used. Where the earnings are not disclosed, the figure is determined by multiplying the number of paid memberships times the average monthly subscription as listed above (Monthly Earnings = # paid memberships X $4.50)

However, I am also including a figure that is half that. Again, if monthly earnings are supplied, they are used. However, based upon looking at various developers numbers prior to their decision to not disclose their earnings - it appears that the actual average is closer to $2-$3 per paid membership. This is comparable to paid memberships across the entire Patreon site.

$4.50 paid sub avg	$2.25 paid sub avg.
View attachment 4378154​	View attachment 4378156​
View attachment 4378163​	View attachment 4378158​

So, use this data with a grain of salt - this is for large data purposes - not to determine exact figures for any individual developer.

Spoiler: 2023 Post

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Spoiler: 2022 post

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So, yes, my original memory was slightly off on the upper end, but it still stands that "if you're doing this because you think this is going to be more lucrative than a traditional job in a brick-and-mortar business or a great way to earn extra money to supplement your current income or a rainmaker to get you to your first million" then a person is sadly mistaken.

If anyone is interested, attached is a CSV of the information I used (for 2022, 2023, and 2024).

 

[Morsin]

ok that's actually not bad. $500 to $1000 USD a month can top off my rent nicely, though obviously I still would need a stable job as my main income. it would also help me at the moment while i find a job, but it's probably not realistic to make something and make money before i find another job.

 

[DSSAlex]

The thing is that vanishingly few games actually make that money. If you want a creative hobby it's fine to make a porno game but there's tons of competition

 

[eaudecologne]

You got this bro hop on chatgpt and ask it to make a renpy game

 

[Morsin]

I honestly do not want to use AI. I find what it produces to be creepy and an instant turnoff. I know this massively increases the work I would have to put in, but maybe that goes into "quality"?

Also, rather than learning how to do everything 3D, maybe I can get someone to do the environments and backgrounds and I can focus on just the models? Like I said, I've dabbled but never really went into it as a deep dive. But focusing on one aspect is probably the best way to learn, and well, the models in my opinion are what seems to make or break a game. Making the environments doesn't really seem like something I could be passionate about, but the story and the models yes.

As for the art style I'm looking for, I do like anime, but I don't think that would be my style. Honestly two of the hottest models I've seen on this site are the ones from "Stay True, Stay You", lol, maybe my tastes are weird but that's kind of what I would be aiming for.

 

[peterppp]

From what I’ve seen, around 90% of these games are clearly made to cash in fast. There’s an avalanche of low-effort titles made in some engine I haven’t identified yet — they all use the same awkward-looking "realistic" models that end up looking like creepy dolls. Personally, I don't like that style. I prefer anime/cartoon-style art. That’s just my taste, though. But if you scroll through Steam, you’ll see a flood of generic games using this engine. It's like an entire new subgenre trying to ride the wave of Being a DIK.

sounds like you're talking about Daz games (usually ren'py games), same as BaDIK. and calling 90% of them made to cash in fast sounds like you dont know what it takes to make a game like that.

newbie devs making daz games with the intention of cashing in fast soon realize you dont become a new badik from releasing a crappy v0.001 on f95, and you need more than a few renders to be accepted on steam.

if you want to cash in fast on patreon (relatively speaking), you use ai and make an ntr mobile game.

 

[Count Morado]

I did a deep research dive into the porn game market late last month using Gemini. Based on my observations and the results, it's a promising niche — the research projects that the market will hit $76.17 billion in 2024.

Are you high? I want whatever drugs you are on because they definitely are some strong shit.

The data does not support your "research" not at all. $76 billion would be about 1/6th of the entire video game market - that's not gonna happen. Even if you add Patreon, Subscribestar, Itch, Steam, etc .... no, it is nearly impossible to get to that $76 billion number.

There is no way that adult video games hits $1 billion annually any time soon. Also, "projects... will hit... in 2024"? Bruh, this is 2025.

 

[Count Morado]

There's a good chance the research is wrong. But from what I understand where it says adult content I think she means everything, including x.videos, only fans etc. I THINK so.

Here is the complete part, it breaks down the values a little, but I think that's it, this value is for the market as a whole, not just porn games.

Spoiler: Research

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You keep using "research" but it's not research when Gemini (or any other AI) responds to a prompt. Research actually requires time and effort - just like most things in the world.

For example, the "Adult Digital Content Market" information is directly ripped from this webpage:

You must be registered to see the links

Diving deeper into that page shows that, yes, it means much more than just adult video games, listing several types of areas. It's the entire adult digital industry, with videos taking in "over 70% of the user engagement" and video games being one of the other types mentioned.

Using the $6.98 billion that article sites - with a the bulk of that being videos and live cam shows, it's obvious that adult video gaming is not pulling in even $1 billion (in 2024).

Instead of taking what an AI says as being the answer - just like Wikipedia, it should only be the start of you, yourself, looking for the actual answer.

--------

But -- how much an industry is making doesn't tell a single developer what they should expect and strive for. That's like saying "look at how much hollywood brings in annually (about $40 billion or so in 2024)" - if you can make good quality low budget indie films, you can make a living. Uh, no, that's not the comparison.

Look at what others are making in the industry, individually. That's what my research has done the past 3 years by taking Patreon data from Graphtreon and qualifying and quantifying the data:

Numerically	Visually
​	​

As you can see in the data above, the median developer who has paid subscribers (about 20-25% do not have any subscribers) on Patreon brings in about $100 USD per month... even after 4 or more years on that platform. That's after Patreon's percentage (8%-12%) but before credit card fees, transaction fees, and currency conversion fees (for developers outside of the US).

That's what people who are interested in developing an adult video game need to know: That it will be thousands of hours of painstaking work on a project with the likelihood of little monetary reward... unless they get lucky. Some of the best adult games with stand-out graphics and/or stories don't get a viable following to get a developer over the hump of earning a few bucks an hour.\

If a person lives somewhere that $1000 USD per month (before fees and income taxes) can give them a lifestyle they can afford while working on their project 80-160 hours per month, minimum - 5% of first year developers on Patreon make that cut and about 22% after 4 years do. If a person lives somewhere that needs much more (such as in the USA or a western European country) - then the chances are even more slim that a person won't be able to reap jack.

Or, a person can get a "regular" full-time job --- In the USA or western Europe --- starting at $13 USD per hour, 40 hours per week (which is shit wages, I admit) and bring in over $2000 per month before income taxes. They also know as long as they work 40 hours per week, they get paid. Plus other benefits a "regular" job provides.

---------

In the end, making an adult video game should be considered a hobby, a side-gig, -- a passion project -- that, if they get lucky, they might be able to support themselves at least as good as a "regular" job, if not a dream job.

 

[AlterxArt]

You keep using "research" but it's not research when Gemini (or any other AI) responds to a prompt. Research actually requires time and effort - just like most things in the world.

For example, the "Adult Digital Content Market" information is directly ripped from this webpage:

You must be registered to see the links

Diving deeper into that page shows that, yes, it means much more than just adult video games, listing several types of areas. It's the entire adult digital industry, with videos taking in "over 70% of the user engagement" and video games being one of the other types mentioned.

Using the $6.98 billion that article sites - with a the bulk of that being videos and live cam shows, it's obvious that adult video gaming is not pulling in even $1 billion (in 2024).

Instead of taking what an AI says as being the answer - just like Wikipedia, it should only be the start of you, yourself, looking for the actual answer.

--------

But -- how much an industry is making doesn't tell a single developer what they should expect and strive for. That's like saying "look at how much hollywood brings in annually (about $40 billion or so in 2024)" - if you can make good quality low budget indie films, you can make a living. Uh, no, that's not the comparison.

Look at what others are making in the industry, individually. That's what my research has done the past 3 years by taking Patreon data from Graphtreon and qualifying and quantifying the data:

Numerically	Visually
View attachment 5001509​	View attachment 5001510​

As you can see in the data above, the median developer who has paid subscribers (about 20-25% do not have any subscribers) on Patreon brings in about $100 USD per month... even after 4 or more years on that platform. That's after Patreon's percentage (8%-12%) but before credit card fees, transaction fees, and currency conversion fees (for developers outside of the US).

That's what people who are interested in developing an adult video game need to know: That it will be thousands of hours of painstaking work on a project with the likelihood of little monetary reward... unless they get lucky. Some of the best adult games with stand-out graphics and/or stories don't get a viable following to get a developer over the hump of earning a few bucks an hour.\

If a person lives somewhere that $1000 USD per month (before fees and income taxes) can give them a lifestyle they can afford while working on their project 80-160 hours per month, minimum - 5% of first year developers on Patreon make that cut and about 22% after 4 years do. If a person lives somewhere that needs much more (such as in the USA or a western European country) - then the chances are even more slim that a person won't be able to reap jack.

Or, a person can get a "regular" full-time job --- In the USA or western Europe --- starting at $13 USD per hour, 40 hours per week (which is shit wages, I admit) and bring in over $2000 per month before income taxes. They also know as long as they work 40 hours per week, they get paid. Plus other benefits a "regular" job provides.

---------

In the end, making an adult video game should be considered a hobby, a side-gig, -- a passion project -- that, if they get lucky, they might be able to support themselves at least as good as a "regular" job, if not a dream job.

Thanks for taking the time to do these analisys.
Does f95 have an API of the games posted?
It would be interesting to check the correlation of Stars ↔ Patreon Income.

Say for example:
Luna In the Tavern is one of the worst rated games ever, period. Arguably, because of its predatory system and paywalls.
That didn't stop it from hitting +7k USD on Patreon.
The art is good, and the writting doesn't need to be that amazing because the setting itself isn't that deep.

Luna is in X place -> Multiple choice -> Luna fucks everyone in various ways.

One could think that, no matter what you do if your art clicks with the audience you get to stand out.

 

[polkaStudio]

Hello there!
i thought this is quite a interesting topic so I wanna hop in this conversation.
I have been making NSFW games for the last 7 months.
Sold a few thousand. (still not enough to make a decent living... )
I want to give you a different perspective.

I would say that it is possible make a living out of NSFW games. But only if you are "good".

People don't care what tool you are using or what 3d software or AI you took advantage of.
If you have "good" quality, people will buy your game.

I would say research on the market is valid.
But the top 1% sellers have crazy quality and dedication.
Unless you want to be a scam dev that never finishes the game and only markets it.

On the other hand, if you have crazy quality,
People will beg you, (literally beg you) to release it.

The main question I want to ask OP is that
1. What skills do you have?
2. How high quality of skill are you at that domain?

 

[Insomnimaniac Games]

The main question I want to ask OP is that
1. What skills do you have?
2. How high quality of skill are you at that domain?

There's a third question to ask that's equally as important. Time. How much time do you have to devote to development. How much time are you willing to devote? You know as well as I do that two-three hours a day isn't enough. Even most "low effort" games have hundreds if not thousands of hours behind them. (Can you tell I don't like the phrase "low effort" )

 

[X|Mortis]

I don't like the phrase "low effort"

 

[Insomnimaniac Games]

View attachment 5004964

The username change confused me at first.

 

[X|Mortis]

username change confused me at first

Who knows? Is it me or someone else entirely?...

Spoiler

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[Insomnimaniac Games]

Who knows? Is it me or someone else entirely?...

Spoiler

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I may have put in a reference to the Headpats cow in my new game, just for you.

 

[X|Mortis]

I may have put in a reference to the Headpats cow in my new game, just for you.

 

[osanaiko]

Thanks for taking the time to do these analisys.
Does f95 have an API of the games posted?
It would be interesting to check the correlation of Stars ↔ Patreon Income.

Say for example:
Luna In the Tavern is one of the worst rated games ever, period. Arguably, because of its predatory system and paywalls.
That didn't stop it from hitting +7k USD on Patreon.
The art is good, and the writting doesn't need to be that amazing because the setting itself isn't that deep.

Luna is in X place -> Multiple choice -> Luna fucks everyone in various ways.

One could think that, no matter what you do if your art clicks with the audience you get to stand out.

No official API exists. Exploitation of non-browser clients is against forum rules and has resulted in bans in the past.

Having said that: There are several attempts by rando devs to create "F95 Client" programs, where they have reverse engineered the data feed used for the new releases page. At low request rate, using a specific login, it's unlikely to be an issue.

Leaving that technical question aside:

I think the expectations and rating decisions of the PIRATE USERS of f95 is not well aligned to the number of PATRONs a project gets.

Regarding "Luna" - pirates hate the fact that some content is paywalled, because they want everything to be free for their taking. The game itself is apparently quite average to poor compared to other titles. But somehow the developer of that game has tapped into a channel to gain patrons which is completely independent of the f95 userbase.

Patron popularity seems to be connected to a few different drivers:
- longevity: statistically the earliest projects are likely to be the biggest
- kink: furry, transformation themed (and to a lesser extent gay themed) games get a boost due to those sub-cultures' habit of paying for content that they enjoy (mainly because it is too weird to be found in mainstream porn)
- frequency of update: no explanation needed
- quality of production: this is subjective, but is probably the factor that most aligns with the F95 rating