NTR fetishes, tropes and ideologies. Any help?

[gargamel44]

So, I'm in the process of creating a VN and I feel like, while I do have some inspirations and a decent picture of how a Corruption/NTR game should work, I'm severely lacking in many aspects in terms of the player enjoyment/narratives and underlying ideologies.

What I mean by this?

1. Player's enjoyment: what kind of fetishes/tropes do people like in Ntr/Corruption (all of them) games? This can involve specific situations or the way in which the degradation occurs. What I'm asking here is if you can share any preferences you might have and your expectations for future games. Is there any type of corruption you would like to see?
Different TROPES that occurred to me
a) A student is pissed off at one of their classmates and feels like seducing their boyfriend/girlfriend to break them up.
b) A pretty naive person is groomed into performing certain acts, which end up seriously harming their future.
c) A second party helps out a loser friend and seduces someone to later share them with their friend.
d) In a fantasy setting, you need to endure a curse that makes you permanently aroused and that jeopardizes every relevant encounter and progress you might be making.
e) Your friend is in danger, and you will try to save them by agreeing to have sex with their aggressor so they leave them alone. It turns out they were both being used at the same time, and they fall for the aggressor.
And many others. About fetishes, is there anything I can use outside of cuckold, fem dom, mind control... Can you give some nuances, in case you have a more specific taste?
I feel like expanding my library so I can choose a more optimum approach. If you can, you can share some readings or games too!

2. Underlying ideologies: there's a lot to consider here. Fetishes tend to bloom from certain experiences or situations. I'll give some examples
a) Nowadays cuckolding is often linked to "race play" that comes from immigration discourses, such as ghettoization, criminality, and great replacement theory.
b) Bdsm tends to be practiced by people who have been abused. People who were mistreated in the past, sometimes can manifest a kink for rough play or are so unsure of themselves they'll degrade themselves in order to partner up with someone. We could talk too about how a person might take advantage of another with manipulation, abuse, grooming...
c) We could talk about what discourses we might need in order to corrupt someone's psyche. Degrade their morals. For example, from helping the poor to despising them, from being committed to being promiscuous, from acknowledging good values such as kindness, resilience, and intelligence, to acknowledging more "materialistic" traits such as beauty, money and power.
Can we tie those to certain philosophies?

The corruption of NTR games, whether you like it or not, is based in realistic issues, so I'm trying to get some insight in order to make the corruption more effective. Examples of games who have managed to analyze those issues and apply them are "Hero party must fall" with race play and great replacement theory, and Star Knightess Aura which slowly changes the values of the heroine from humanist to consumerist to capitalist to fascist.

I'm not asking for you to make my game, but simply helping me out to have more insight on this genre would be appreciated. You could share your takes on what ideologies might be involved in the genre or specific discourses that might be relevant. Ideas to add to my narrative would be EXTREMELY helpful too!!!

I understand if you feel like I'm asking too much, but I needed to ask! I believe this is the best site to learn more about this, hehe.

Thank you!

 

[Pretentious Goblin]

"Hero party must fall" with race play and great replacement theory

Are you sure you've got the right game? It's just a jacked NTRman cucking an entitled brat.

Star Knightess Aura which slowly changes the values of the heroine from humanist to consumerist to capitalist to fascist.

Admittedly I haven't played the latest updates, but I haven't seen "Added scene Rounding up the Jews 1" in the changelog.

 

[DawnCry]

Overall simplified the post I was making since it was gonna be too long.

Related to the type of NTR I play it is the avoidable one, I mean a game in which the MC can achieve a perfectly happy ending but has many obstacles and struggles along the way.

On the topic of ideology I don't recommend you focus on it, however perhaps fantasy races could be more useful:

-Cowgirls typically worship strength so her being taken away if you were defeated in a duel would make sense.

-Goblins and succubi are lustful creatures that if not properly fed they will tend to get it from other people.

-Dark elves are very devious for a partner.

Rather than trying to have ideologies perhaps going more with fantasy culture could work better.


Now talking about how would be an avoidable NTR I would play then...

-SRPG game in which defeated party girls can be captured and then raped/corrupted/transformed... finding them as enemies later on. Bonus points if you can recover/rescue them and capture enemies.

-RPG games in which you are an adventurer accepting guild quests however some monster races will try to capture girls while doing said quests.

-Games in which the antagonist isn't a piece of shit but a lustful person.


Related to the antagonist I prefer that she is a futanari or female, since it also opens the way for MC x antagonist stuff which can be quite interesting. The fetishes that you add depend on your game and how you are gonna manage it.

 

[desmosome]

Your post was a bit scatterbrained to address broadly, so I'll just write something in general terms when it comes to NTR stories.

First of all, you need to decide if you want to go for the fetish, or go for a more grounded story that incorporates NTR branches or subplots. The former means the story exists to support the fetish, while the latter means the fetish isn't the true focus of your writing.

When it comes to the latter, it's pretty meaningless to really get into specifics about NTR this and NTR that. Not all stories need to be classified into some neat categories. Just write what you think makes sense for the story developments, themes, and characters without worrying about what tags will be applied.

Now when it comes to a more standard fetish based story that is focused on NTR, you should take note that there are broadly 2 groups of people who would be your target audience.

• Fans of Japanese style NTR that generally focus on female protagonist's corruption, cheating, and moral degeneration due to the antagonist subjecting her to a corruption arc. The male protagonist shouldn't find out about the cheating too early in the story because that puts stress on the corruption arc continuing smoothly or keeping character motivations logical.
• Fans of western style NTR which is more about cuckoldry, sharing, hotwifing, swinging, etc. It can be more wholesome with a sharing focus, or it could be less wholesome with bullying and blatant cucking of the male protagonist who knows what's happening but hates it. The cuck can be sad or horny about it. This type of story involves the male MC knowing quite early in the story about the NTR. The focus of the narrative tends to be about the male protagonist's thoughts, reactions, and cucky nature moreso than the female protagonist's corruption.

There can be some overlap in styles and incorporation of other kinks like interracial and what not, but as far as NTR's impact on the narrative, it generally follows those two types.

I'm of the opinion that Netori has stronger appeal to a subset of harem fans than NTR fans, just because of the way these stories are usually written with a relatable protagonist that steals women for the greater good (she has a shitty husband or whatever), but we could say Netori is a third group.

Of course, it would be the best if there are many routes that can give everyone their preferred style of NTR, but that is not always feasible or it could even spoil each other's branches just because the common thread narrative between the branches need to account for each eventuality. But focusing on only one style coul also lead to complaints about kinetic novel bla bla if there are no meaning decision points or elements the player can influence. It's just something you gotta iron out.

Asking for specific scenarios and NTR mometns can be helpful I guess, but the most important thing is to notice the difference between the appeal of NTR as a story about female corruption vs a story about a male cuck. Once you have the idea of the main theme, the individual story beats in between should be to smoothly iron out the escalating nature of the NTR.

 

[gargamel44]

Are you sure you've got the right game? It's just a jacked NTRman cucking an entitled brat.




Admittedly I haven't played the latest updates, but I haven't seen "Added scene Rounding up the Jews 1" in the changelog.

I don't think you got what I tried to express.

I'm not saying ideologies are the purpose for those games, but that they lay the foundation in order to intensify the experience.

In Hero party must fall's case race is mentioned with every character, I'm going to give you examples:

Cecille is hellbent on killing demons, yet she secretly has fantasies about them—an archetype of a racist woman who is actually attracted to those she hates on. In one of the earlier scenes, she explicitly says that Mars would be her type if he were white. Now this doesn't mean Cecille is being explicitly racist, but looking at the context, the themes, how Mars is viewed in the village, etc., we can see how everything spins in that direction.

As to his "shady" look, that's exactly how Elena reacts the first time she sees him. The woman who is said to be a perfect saint and who loves everyone, is betrayed by one of her first thoughts in the game. We actually buy her act throughout the game until she finally snaps, and the first thing she does? Insulting Mars for his body color. Btw we can also see here a bit of what I mentioned in the BDSM section: that traumas can become kink. We can see how Mars feels "blessed" to be "reunited" with his mother. Later, mother Elena is used as a fuckhole to cheer on the whole demon race and encourage human women to have sex with them. She then joins a cult that pretends to replace human men with demons, turning the men into cucks. This is basic race play. He's making use of typical conspiracy theories that spread hate towards immigrants and women. This doesn't mean he supports it, but that he uses it to fuel the NTR component. The wrongness is what we're here for, and it's extremely effective.

We can see other instances of sexism, when almost all females feel good when Mars abuses them (Erin too questions how it's possible that women find someone like Mars attractive). It's the classic "girls always go for bad guys" and that is an insanely good line to create NTR (and the most common trope).

Even with Sera the race play is mentioned. I don't think any character is an exception, maybe the crazy one who believed she was the saint. Game mostly ridicules women for falling in love with a scumbag like Mars (and sarcasm is used multiple times to show how pathetic the whole situation is). The game is built around that. And again, it doesn't mean it supports it, just that it's extremely useful for this kind of genre.

With Aura it's not about her becoming a capitalist (person who owns capital) or a fascist (as Mussolini defined it) but about acquiring attitudes that align with them. One of the first lines, before Aura is corrupted, is where she mentions fashion magazines are bad because they create a necessity and then make you feel bad for not buying them (this is basic to understand consumerism). She loses value by becoming kind of "stupid" or simply becoming extremely cynical. She then begins to see capitalists as attractive because of the power they hold and starts to blame people rather than their circumstances (blame the exploited before the exploiter). This sets an idealist philosophy that ignores the causes of some events and puts all the blame on the person's choices. "If you're poor, it's your fault. Go and flirt with some rich dude". If you're a dude she will simply call you pathetic. She quickly develops an habit to control what people should do in their lives, basically turned into what she criticized at the beginning of the game. Later, this will become Aura basically not giving a fuck about people's lives, and she will hate anyone who isn't up to her standards.

Like I said, these games have a pretty good foundation that intensifies the themes of their stories. You can't ignore it, you're basically diminishing the effort the authors put into them.

 

[gargamel44]

Overall simplified the post I was making since it was gonna be too long.

Related to the type of NTR I play it is the avoidable one, I mean a game in which the MC can achieve a perfectly happy ending but has many obstacles and struggles along the way.

On the topic of ideology I don't recommend you focus on it, however perhaps fantasy races could be more useful:

-Cowgirls typically worship strength so her being taken away if you were defeated in a duel would make sense.

-Goblins and succubi are lustful creatures that if not properly fed they will tend to get it from other people.

-Dark elves are very devious for a partner.

Rather than trying to have ideologies perhaps going more with fantasy culture could work better.


Now talking about how would be an avoidable NTR I would play then...

-SRPG game in which defeated party girls can be captured and then raped/corrupted/transformed... finding them as enemies later on. Bonus points if you can recover/rescue them and capture enemies.

-RPG games in which you are an adventurer accepting guild quests however some monster races will try to capture girls while doing said quests.

-Games in which the antagonist isn't a piece of shit but a lustful person.


Related to the antagonist I prefer that she is a futanari or female, since it also opens the way for MC x antagonist stuff which can be quite interesting. The fetishes that you add depend on your game and how you are gonna manage it.

Hey! Thanks for answering.
I didn't mean ideology like I'm about to spread propaganda in my game, but rather how having a better understanding of how reality can be intertwined with the NTR genre. Ofc most of the games tend do have the minimum and most common social connotations, but there are some who put in a lot of effort and that means polishing the reality of your setting and which philosophies will the characters adopt in reaction to it.

I was aware about how you could use fantasy races to make them more lustful in certain circumstances. It's certainly a very good resource.

About the girls being kidnapped and then coming back as enemies... it's an extremely good concept. I think I can benefit from it for my game, thanks!

Btw, my game will have a female protagonist which in certain situations will be futanari and there's some sort of deuteragonist who is male and will have a lot of action. You'll see, it's a neat concept, and it's based on mind control/corruption themes. Maybe you don't like netori, but I feel like the corruption here will be nice. You actually have to put in a lot of effort in order to achieve your goals, and you aren't particularly bad in the end; corruption is a pretty relative thing in my universe. You still become mean and messed up, though. lol

 

[gargamel44]

Your post was a bit scatterbrained to address broadly, so I'll just write something in general terms when it comes to NTR stories.

First of all, you need to decide if you want to go for the fetish, or go for a more grounded story that incorporates NTR branches or subplots. The former means the story exists to support the fetish, while the latter means the fetish isn't the true focus of your writing.

When it comes to the latter, it's pretty meaningless to really get into specifics about NTR this and NTR that. Not all stories need to be classified into some neat categories. Just write what you think makes sense for the story developments, themes, and characters without worrying about what tags will be applied.

Now when it comes to a more standard fetish based story that is focused on NTR, you should take note that there are broadly 2 groups of people who would be your target audience.

• Fans of Japanese style NTR that generally focus on female protagonist's corruption, cheating, and moral degeneration due to the antagonist subjecting her to a corruption arc. The male protagonist shouldn't find out about the cheating too early in the story because that puts stress on the corruption arc continuing smoothly or keeping character motivations logical.
• Fans of western style NTR which is more about cuckoldry, sharing, hotwifing, swinging, etc. It can be more wholesome with a sharing focus, or it could be less wholesome with bullying and blatant cucking of the male protagonist who knows what's happening but hates it. The cuck can be sad or horny about it. This type of story involves the male MC knowing quite early in the story about the NTR. The focus of the narrative tends to be about the male protagonist's thoughts, reactions, and cucky nature moreso than the female protagonist's corruption.

There can be some overlap in styles and incorporation of other kinks like interracial and what not, but as far as NTR's impact on the narrative, it generally follows those two types.

I'm of the opinion that Netori has stronger appeal to a subset of harem fans than NTR fans, just because of the way these stories are usually written with a relatable protagonist that steals women for the greater good (she has a shitty husband or whatever), but we could say Netori is a third group.

Of course, it would be the best if there are many routes that can give everyone their preferred style of NTR, but that is not always feasible or it could even spoil each other's branches just because the common thread narrative between the branches need to account for each eventuality. But focusing on only one style coul also lead to complaints about kinetic novel bla bla if there are no meaning decision points or elements the player can influence. It's just something you gotta iron out.

Asking for specific scenarios and NTR mometns can be helpful I guess, but the most important thing is to notice the difference between the appeal of NTR as a story about female corruption vs a story about a male cuck. Once you have the idea of the main theme, the individual story beats in between should be to smoothly iron out the escalating nature of the NTR.

Wow, that's a long answer, thank you.

My game, by nature, will need to select a lot of NTR routes because my goal is to generate "disorder" and my means of doing that is to basically mess with everyone in my game. I don't want to make it focused on a few characters because it would beat the purpose in the sense that I want to encourage a feeling of defeatism on human values and then extrapolate it to a whole society (because we become more and more powerful, and in the road we will mess shit up). Basically, I was trying to come up with some ideas in order to increase creativity. I don't want to be redundant or unoriginal; I want to bring an experience that feels refreshing. Also, I'm appealing to a "harem" audience, so that is relevant to everything I've said.

About the type of NTR style, I could say it's a bit of both, focusing more on the Japanese style but I still want to be pretty flexible. The point of my game is about ruining everything and losing yourself along the way. Everyone gets affected in all kinds of ways, so, like you say, it's more like an overlap of styles. Do you think I should make it optional?

I can see what the overall meaning of your message is. I'll try to conceptualize it better before making any big decisions. Although I still need to think about scenarios, I'm kind of blank.

 

[desmosome]

Wow, that's a long answer, thank you.

My game, by nature, will need to select a lot of NTR routes because my goal is to generate "disorder" and my means of doing that is to basically mess with everyone in my game. I don't want to make it focused on a few characters because it would beat the purpose in the sense that I want to encourage a feeling of defeatism on human values and then extrapolate it to a whole society (because we become more and more powerful, and in the road we will mess shit up). Basically, I was trying to come up with some ideas in order to increase creativity. I don't want to be redundant or unoriginal; I want to bring an experience that feels refreshing. Also, I'm appealing to a "harem" audience, so that is relevant to everything I've said.

About the type of NTR style, I could say it's a bit of both, focusing more on the Japanese style but I still want to be pretty flexible. The point of my game is about ruining everything and losing yourself along the way. Everyone gets affected in all kinds of ways, so, like you say, it's more like an overlap of styles. Do you think I should make it optional?

I can see what the overall meaning of your message is. I'll try to conceptualize it better before making any big decisions. Although I still need to think about scenarios, I'm kind of blank.

I think from the beginning, you want sort of a corruption of a society story more than a classical NTR plot.

What I'm talking about when I say classic NTR is like this.
On Japanese side, you have the oblivious and naive male MC whose wife/girlfriend/mother/childhood friend/whatever gets corrupted behind his back by some asshole. The focus is on the heroine's descent into corruption. The male MC almost always didn't really do anything bad to deserve getting screwed over like that (other than maybe sucking in bed). As expected, misogyny being the norm in Japan is more recent than the west, so the girl, despite being a good woman, falls to the better cock.

On the western side, you have the pathetic cuck boy MC whose girl and the bull humiliates in front of his face if it's going for unwilling cuckold. If it's willing cuckold, you have the adventurous couple stuff where it's more wholesome. In both instances, the cuckold nature of the male protagonist is much more of a focal point of the narrative than the typical Japanese NTR stories.

There are Japanese stuff that focus on cuckoldry and western stuff that are doing the Japanese style, but I'm naming the subtype by what we generally see from either region.

It's quite generalized, but the story beat and themes that people look for as fans of whatever subtype of NTR are indeed pretty cliche like that. But there are also a decent number of non-standard NTR fans that want stuff like option for male MC to take revenge, some type of good ending, or for the male MC to not be such a pathetic wimp, the danger of NTR present but able to defeat the antagonists and "win," etc etc. Some want the cucked MC to deserve it so they don't feel so bad about an innocent guy getting screwed. Some want the male MC to have his own options to cheat, etc etc. And these various non-standard NTR can still be quite interesting and stimulating, just not in the same way or hitting the same spot as the standard cliche fetish people flock to the tag for.

So if I'm understanding your vision correctly, you want to have a corruptive force that is shaking up the whole town or whatever. Everyone is getting more depraved and degenerate. That's fine, but depending on how you write the thing, the NTR aspect can be very weak. And if that's the intention, that's absolutely fine.

For example, let's say the "disorder" hits the male MC and his girl. What exactly is the effect? Does the MC also turn into a lustful and hedonistic asshole? Would he even care if his girl started slutting it around then? And does he go around banging chicks as well? Is it really so bad for him if he is getting pussy around town as well? Maybe he was a boring vanilla dude before, but after corruption, he is some gigachad corrupting other women. But with a situation like this, the NTR just doesn't feel as hardcore and fucked up, you know?

That's why I said there are cliche NTR storybeats that fans of the genre generally enjoy. But it also means it's harder to innovate and come up with novel scenarios that still manages to follow this NTR set up and progression arc. What you decide to do with the story should be done with deliberate intention. If you break from the mold, you can expect some people to lose interest, but there will always be others that like precisely the freshness of whatever scenario you come up with (if it's well written at least). Good luck.

 

[gargamel44]

I think from the beginning, you want sort of a corruption of a society story more than a classical NTR plot.

What I'm talking about when I say classic NTR is like this.
On Japanese side, you have the oblivious and naive male MC whose wife/girlfriend/mother/childhood friend/whatever gets corrupted behind his back by some asshole. The focus is on the heroine's descent into corruption. The male MC almost always didn't really do anything bad to deserve getting screwed over like that (other than maybe sucking in bed). As expected, misogyny being the norm in Japan is more recent than the west, so the girl, despite being a good woman, falls to the better cock.

On the western side, you have the pathetic cuck boy MC whose girl and the bull humiliates in front of his face if it's going for unwilling cuckold. If it's willing cuckold, you have the adventurous couple stuff where it's more wholesome. In both instances, the cuckold nature of the male protagonist is much more of a focal point of the narrative than the typical Japanese NTR stories.

There are Japanese stuff that focus on cuckoldry and western stuff that are doing the Japanese style, but I'm naming the subtype by what we generally see from either region.

It's quite generalized, but the story beat and themes that people look for as fans of whatever subtype of NTR are indeed pretty cliche like that. But there are also a decent number of non-standard NTR fans that want stuff like option for male MC to take revenge, some type of good ending, or for the male MC to not be such a pathetic wimp, the danger of NTR present but able to defeat the antagonists and "win," etc etc. Some want the cucked MC to deserve it so they don't feel so bad about an innocent guy getting screwed. Some want the male MC to have his own options to cheat, etc etc. And these various non-standard NTR can still be quite interesting and stimulating, just not in the same way or hitting the same spot as the standard cliche fetish people flock to the tag for.

So if I'm understanding your vision correctly, you want to have a corruptive force that is shaking up the whole town or whatever. Everyone is getting more depraved and degenerate. That's fine, but depending on how you write the thing, the NTR aspect can be very weak. And if that's the intention, that's absolutely fine.

For example, let's say the "disorder" hits the male MC and his girl. What exactly is the effect? Does the MC also turn into a lustful and hedonistic asshole? Would he even care if his girl started slutting it around then? And does he go around banging chicks as well? Is it really so bad for him if he is getting pussy around town as well? Maybe he was a boring vanilla dude before, but after corruption, he is some gigachad corrupting other women. But with a situation like this, the NTR just doesn't feel as hardcore and fucked up, you know?

That's why I said there are cliche NTR storybeats that fans of the genre generally enjoy. But it also means it's harder to innovate and come up with novel scenarios that still manages to follow this NTR set up and progression arc. What you decide to do with the story should be done with deliberate intention. If you break from the mold, you can expect some people to lose interest, but there will always be others that like precisely the freshness of whatever scenario you come up with (if it's well written at least). Good luck.

I probably should have explained myself better. I tried to be original with my initial concept, and I used a lot of "fantasy" to achieve it. It's actually an agglomeration of already existent plots but pushed together in order to convey the whole NTR experience. The distinction between styles is harder to tell here; it's still super focused on the girl, but... I want to create a lot of fronts.

I don't actually want to reveal it because I prefer to keep things unspoiled, but I can give a hint... it's based on "Star Knightess Aura", where the FMC needs to fight against the personality that has infiltrated her mind, slowly poisoning it. My heroine will be corrupted similarly, but I'll go beyond that concept. I'll send you a link if you're interested and don't mind Koikatsu and games with a school setting lol. It will have the good old VN format, with two or three images to show expressions and the occasional CG (I'm lazy like that).

About the corruptive force you mentioned, we could say that at times it will be the reason for the decay, but that's not what I want because I strongly want the heroine to stop believing in humanity by herself. Go against the orders that built our societies and embrace hedonism. It's a long road, and I will need to attack her mind from different angles, which is the reason I was so interested in ideologies/philosophies within the NTR genre... and also create different subplots with different characters so they can give a bit more perspective into that mentality (sometimes it's the same NTR/Corruption tropes but with entire different characters, which would support the "nothing matters" feeling and close up all possible paths that could lead to a better ending).

In the end, I'm basing the game on the typical sandbox which gets you to seduce a lot of women/men and form your harem, but I want to create a stronger connection between them and their transformative forces inside their world. Here, seduction matters in four main levels:
1. The player's satisfaction: bring him an expanded harem/netori experience.
2. Build the pavement of the story. Here, seduction will tend to help the characters achieve their goals. It's a necessary step towards the ending.
3. They will deeply influence the heroine's mind in a lot of ways. Maybe they will try to corrupt her themselves, or they will fall victim to the MC's shenanigans, and that will affect how our heroine views them. Maybe she will take action by herself, pushed by the pressure the MC puts on her, so she sees herself how easily things are done when you "stop giving a fuck about morals".
4. I want to slowly write a narrative that lays the foundation for the decay of this world. Most of the NTR subplots will affect completely different matters (Examples: from a personal level: amorality, dishonesty, promiscuity, hatred, viciousness, narcissism, apathy, dehumanization, etc., and from an external level: nihilism, gentrification, exploitation, precariousness, war, propaganda, etc.), and this will build the overall philosophy this game is going for.

I hope that cleared things up a bit. Sorry I can't give you more specifics. I'm basically trying to embrace the common VN experience while bringing more influences to the sauce in order to not become stagnant/hollow and to innovate with my own ideas.

Thanks for the luck!

 

[MarshmallowCasserole]

(all of them)

There's no such thing. Look, the problem with your question is that NTR is an umbrella term, and in reality netorare and netori & corruption are completely different beasts from emotional perspective. Netorare is masochistic. For example, the overwhelming majority of black-on-white porn consumers are white males, so you can infer with confidence what emotions they seek.

On the other hand, a netori game is not going to elicit that because you are taking away, not being robbed, so I don't agree with you lumping Hero Party with typical racial porn. The emotional core is aimed literally in the opposite direction.

Start with the emotion you want to explore, not with external circumstance. Tropes are tools, not the foundation.

d) In a fantasy setting, you need to endure a curse that makes you permanently aroused and that jeopardizes every relevant encounter and progress you might be making.

Not my favourite way to do corruption, to put it mildly, as one cnoice has all the positives, and the other all the negatives. In a VN what is the reason for me to pick "give in to pleasure" route? This is the VN equivalent of giving sex scenes only in defeat. Or narratively, "raped repeatedly until she comes to enjoy it." Blegh.

No, there has to be a tradeoff. If you give in, you'll have such and such consequences, but your arousal goes down. If you resist, arousal goes up and that should be detrimental by itself, somehow. That's why corruption happens, otherwise everyone would remain moral.

 

[gargamel44]

There's no such thing. Look, the problem with your question is that NTR is an umbrella term, and in reality netorare and netori & corruption are completely different beasts from emotional perspective. Netorare is masochistic. For example, the overwhelming majority of black-on-white porn consumers are white males, so you can infer with confidence what emotions they seek.

That's the thing, it has a lot of perspectives and lots of characters with different stories. The FMC will suffer a corruption that will turn into both netori and netorare. In one hand, she will see manipulation aka corruption as a tool to get what she wants, and at the same time, as she becomes less attached to her "past life", she will betray the one who loved her. This would still fall into corruption because of perspective, BUT that's the thing, we will have multiple perspectives and they will strongly act together.

On the other hand, a netori game is not going to elicit that because you are taking away, not being robbed, so I don't agree with you lumping Hero Party with typical racial porn. The emotional core is aimed literally in the opposite direction.

I wouldn't say it's typical racial porn. My opinion is more nuanced. Like I said, I believe the race games are too relevant to be ignored and entire subplots rely on them. Hell, every main heroine does this: betray your kind, join the other side. (Sera: doesn't care if her kind disappears, her loyalty can't waver. Cecille: she's so dependant on Mars she throws her hate aside to be with him. She will potentially place that hate on humans, just like she started to despise Erin for being "inferior" to Mars. Elena: she basically relies on what we call "White guilt". She's basically taking advantage of the bad situation the demons are in (and this is mentioned in her conversations with Mars, she thrives Mars' suffering so she can feel better about herself) so the women and men will have the necessity to repay them in some way, so they get mistrated in a different way to how the demons were mistreated. It's a reverse card). Ofc Nitrolith is a good author, we see the story with Mars' perspective and he does not agree with these methods but he NEEDS to because that's the way he was taught. Adapt, become the person they need. In this case, for example, streamcasting Elena to show her corruption as a "win" for their war between races is not because he actually wants her to endure that (although his sadistic side is always there) but because he knows that's what the demons want, and he would benefit from that. About it being a netori game, absolutely, but don't forget we are shown Erin's side multiple times. The Netorare is present and relevant. It's already a thing from past updates, though. I feel like all will be corruption from now on, since there's no one to steal anymore.

Not my favourite way to do corruption, to put it mildly, as one cnoice has all the positives, and the other all the negatives. In a VN what is the reason for me to pick "give in to pleasure" route? This is the VN equivalent of giving sex scenes only in defeat. Or narratively, "raped repeatedly until she comes to enjoy it." Blegh.

No, there has to be a tradeoff. If you give in, you'll have such and such consequences, but your arousal goes down. If you resist, arousal goes up and that should be detrimental by itself, somehow. That's why corruption happens, otherwise everyone would remain moral.

I get what you mean. My game will be sandboxish so normally the choices are basically going forth with the story development. I think both, FMC and MC, will lose a bit of themselves as time passes, being intoxicated by their minds mutually. But it's still an easy road, because MC is aware of that and simply embraces his destiny (in fact, he pursues it, can't say why). So the obstacles here will be: FMC will be blocked in some road and she will have to give something in order to advance, losing a bit of herself. As this happens, the MC will gain something from the experience that will make the corruption narrative process slower in some fronts, because he's slowly acquiring the FMC's personality. I can't tell you properly without spoiling, so you'll have to see hehe.

But, most important, the obstacles the PLAYER will have. Because all of what I said is simple narrative, there's actually no effort put in those decisions. What the player will need to do is to understand in which order the corruption might happen (we will have for example BODY corruption, LUST corruption, MORALITY corruption, etc.). Some changes might jeopardize the early game (and unnaturally improving your power and skills, too) and that will result in a bad ending.

For example, the FMC prematurely noticing there's something wrong happening within her, therefore focusing solely on eliminating the bad influence in her mind, since she is aware of the danger it poses.

Or changing your body, then in the sandbox choosing to go see a character before gaining enough friendship stats with them, that will make them become suspicious of the unnatural change instead of supporting it or brushing it off, and since they are "mages", they will notice something is wrong within her and purge the threat. This, for example, won't happen if the first meeting happens with the new body, since the character won't have anything to compare it with.

There's more things apart from this but I can't say without spoiling so you'll have to wait.

Basically, the player needs to be intelligent in the way he acts, try to close as much loose ends as he can before advancing and carefully choose what's the order of corruption. Foundation will be key in my game.