Ratings

Spacc123

Newbie
Nov 28, 2017
22
55
Hi all,

So as an active user (in the sense of I download a lot of games), I notice myself that I do look at ratings when selecting a game. Even though I know that ratings should be taken with a shitload of salt. But in the end, because there are so many games, ratings do have an effect on my, and probably others, their selections.

I mean, there are plenty of 3 star games that are really great, but are ruined by some jackass who only rates 1 and 2 starts without any proper feedback, and I notice that sometimes I miss out on quality games because of this.

I know it is impossible to check and judge every rating but I would appreciate if some things in the ratings get changed:

1. People who only rate 1 or 2 stars, for me people who have permanent bad days, or play games which they know of that they are not going to like, should be removed. At least their ratings should be. Not every game is bad.

2. This is my main point actually: Old ratings.
Can there be a system where ratings that are 'x' versions old get either removed or that the rater gets a chance to re-rate and otherwise it gets removed.

I've been playing a lot of lower rated games recently, which apparently where terrible in the beginning, but are good now. But they have this low(er) rating because the their start was bad and players gave them, rightly so, 1 or 2 stars, but they don't get adjusted and now they get better ratings, but old ratings keep them down and me being me, look at it, think hmmm, only 3 stars, the game next to it 4 or 5, so.. Yeah let's take the other one, to find out later, that the ratings should have been the other way around (imo).

To be clear: I say this as a player, not a maker. As I said above, there are so many games, that you automatically filter on ratings (as well) and I think if the above gets adjusted, my game choices will become better and I will have a better experience playing games, and that is what it is all about, isn't it?
 
D

Deleted member 3145675

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Hi,
you omitted the fake 5 stars...

Anyway, as you yourself stated in your post: " Even though I know that ratings should be taken with a shitload of salt. "
you should jump to the next stage of this level of consciousness to reach true enlightenment which is: "online ratings should be ignored."

Why? (good question I thank you for asking it.) - simply because the only sensible way for one to make one's own opinion is to experience things from one's self point of view.

in layman's term - live your life dude, do things, experience shit, make discoveries, mistakes, you'll grow a better person.


(try not to break the Law while doing that)

(or don't get caught)

have fun.
GL
 

moskis22

Member
Nov 26, 2020
439
366
Every one have their own likes and dislikes, specially on porn, don't pay attention to ratings, better read some posts and try to figure what the game offers
 

Beatrix Kiddo

Member
Donor
Aug 25, 2016
402
1,048
Rating is just a vague indicator. The actual reviews are more useful though, some of them at least. If there's few ratings I ingore it completely, but if there's enough and I'm indecisive I might go to the reviews page and read a few, glance over a few more, all ranging from high to low ratings, and try to figure out if it's worth cheking or not.

Half the time it doesn't help too much, since there's people praising the same things others complain about, but knowing what I like and what not I can tell, to an extent, which reviews might be on the same page as I would. I might even discover valuable info that is otherwise buried somewhere in the hundreds of pages the thread has.
 

God3333

Member
Mar 9, 2019
418
400
You mention people who rate things lowly should have their reviews removed. This is stupid logic as we could then say everyone who rates highly should have their reviews removed. Some games are actually that bad to warrant 2 and 1 stars, I've played quite a few and it's important that people be allowed to rate things fairly. A 2 star game is a 2 star game at the end of the day, a mood change isn't going to take a 2 or a 1 to a 4/5.

Your other main point has some actual use, however, is semi redundant. Game reviews are sorted by recent meaning that (As long as people are reviewing) a review from the first version will be pushed back. Also, it's important to note that if someone says the renders are appalling in version 0.5 then it's likely that (Unless the dev remasters, which is rare) the same criticism would translate to 0.6 and 0.7.
Reviews should never be removed unless they are unfair and biased reviews. Let's say it's the year 2021 and the game was first released in 2019, let's say people in 2019 and early 2020 were rating 1-2 stars and then the average in late 2020 and 2021 was 4 stars. We can now clearly see how far the games progressed, and thus how the dev is able to adapt to issues in the game.
Devs are responsible for their game, if they release shit then they deserve the bad rating.

TLDR;
Your point about the removal of 1-2 star reviews is a stupid point and has no basis in reality.
Your second point, while good in sentiment, is not very practical and doesn't really help that much.
 
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Staimh

Active Member
Dec 12, 2020
895
3,417
If you are going to use ratings at all you need to first establish which members rate reliably.
So after you have decided what you think of a game see if anyone giving a sensible rating mirrors your thoughts.
Then if you see further ratings by that member they may be worth considering.
It's the same as film or music critics - they don't need to like the same as you; just describe things consistently.
 
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HopesGaming

The Godfather
Game Developer
Dec 21, 2017
1,705
15,350
It could be fun to see something like an average rating score under their name that only appears in the review section.
Whenever I check someone who left a bad review I can see that 99% of their reviews are 2 or under.
If someone reads someone's review and sees that the person has an average score of 1.7 in review - they would probably not take the review seriously.
 

RossoX

Active Member
Jun 3, 2021
765
999
you omitted the fake 5 stars...
Exactly.
During my long time lurking here I've seen this same topic of "hurr people who rate 1 or 2 stars aren't valid hurr" come up a lot of times, but EVERY SINGLE TIME they forget to mention the other side of the coin; the truck-load of 5 star ratings that just say "hehe game gud, because I say so"... double standards much?

Shouldn't those 5 stars reviews that clearly are only there to pad up the score be culled as well by OP's reasoning?

Anyways, as others have stated (because it should be obvious from the get go to any sensible person) is that review scores in general are a "pandora box" and no matter how complex or protected you make such a system, there will alwasy people who review poorly, people who rage-review, people who give 5 stars for games despite clear flaws, etc... in other words, people misusing the review either maliciously or just by being biased as all human are on different levels.

If it was easy to solve the problem, f95zone and other sites (steam, metacritc, etc) would already have implemented a solution but the truth is that it's too complex and subjective of a matter to be easily solved.

But I'll say it again; I find it highly suspicious that people always complain about the lower reviews "bringing down a good game" but never even mention the bloated and effortless 5 star reviews that overrate games more than they should.
 
D

Deleted member 3145675

Guest
Guest
It could be fun to see something like an average rating score under their name that only appears in the review section.
Whenever I check someone who left a bad review I can see that 99% of their reviews are 2 or under.
If someone reads someone's review and sees that the person has an average score of 1.7 in review - they would probably not take the review seriously.
Hi,
What about "troubled persons" who love and only blossom at reviewing shitty games?
What about "luckless persons" who only find and download atrociously bad games?
What about "persons with poor taste" who only download games that are "onhold" or that will never go further than 0.02a etc...?

I could add a few more but I think you get the vibe. ;)

A last one just for the fun of it - what about middle school teachers who love to give bad grades but cannot do it at work? (because of the PC woke police)
;)
 

HopesGaming

The Godfather
Game Developer
Dec 21, 2017
1,705
15,350
Hi,
What about "troubled persons" who love and only blossom at reviewing shitty games?
What about "luckless persons" who only find and download atrociously bad games?
What about "persons with poor taste" who only download games that are "onhold" or that will never go further than 0.02a etc...?

I could add a few more but I think you get the vibe. ;)

A last one just for the fun of it - what about middle school teachers who love to give bad grades but cannot do it at work? (because of the PC woke police)
;)
Why would anyone listen to someone that spends his time reviewing shitty games? If I read reviews of a game I want to find someone that is known to have a balanced opinion.
Luckless person. I don't believe such a person exists. I mean, let's be real. You know what you like pretty quickly. You're bound to play games that are known that fit your preferences. If someone only played games that they detested without seeking them - he would probably stopped playing these games a long time ago.
I dunno if there are enough people that only play onhold games. It is too much of a statistical anomaly to add in as a factor.

I'm not sure I understand the teacher one. He/she should just rate grades based on what the grade should be and not feelings.

Also remember, there is still the game's overall rating to help. The persons review score is just an added help.
 
D

Deleted member 3145675

Guest
Guest
Why would anyone listen to someone that spends his time reviewing shitty games? If I read reviews of a game I want to find someone that is known to have a balanced opinion.
Luckless person. I don't believe such a person exists. I mean, let's be real. You know what you like pretty quickly. You're bound to play games that are known that fit your preferences. If someone only played games that they detested without seeking them - he would probably stopped playing these games a long time ago.
I dunno if there are enough people that only play onhold games. It is too much of a statistical anomaly to add in as a factor.

I'm not sure I understand the teacher one. He/she should just rate grades based on what the grade should be and not feelings.

Also remember, there is still the game's overall rating to help. The persons review score is just an added help.
Ah, sorry I should have looked your avatar to see that you are from a Nordic country - and as such may not be familiar with Humor and/or sarcasm even less with irony.
Sadly I considered that adding 2 ;) to my post would give a hint and be enough.
next time I'll add the /s
(you can give me a bad rating)
;)
 

Alcahest

Engaged Member
Donor
Game Developer
Jul 28, 2017
3,242
4,121
Exactly.
During my long time lurking here I've seen this same topic of "hurr people who rate 1 or 2 stars aren't valid hurr" come up a lot of times, but EVERY SINGLE TIME they forget to mention the other side of the coin; the truck-load of 5 star ratings that just say "hehe game gud, because I say so"... double standards much?

Shouldn't those 5 stars reviews that clearly are only there to pad up the score be culled as well by OP's reasoning?

Anyways, as others have stated (because it should be obvious from the get go to any sensible person) is that review scores in general are a "pandora box" and no matter how complex or protected you make such a system, there will alwasy people who review poorly, people who rage-review, people who give 5 stars for games despite clear flaws, etc... in other words, people misusing the review either maliciously or just by being biased as all human are on different levels.

If it was easy to solve the problem, f95zone and other sites (steam, metacritc, etc) would already have implemented a solution but the truth is that it's too complex and subjective of a matter to be easily solved.

But I'll say it again; I find it highly suspicious that people always complain about the lower reviews "bringing down a good game" but never even mention the bloated and effortless 5 star reviews that overrate games more than they should.
To be frank, I find the whining about bad reviews to be pretty tiresome. It's the same for everyone, so why complain? Sure, there can be instances where one or more people try to bring down (or bring up) the rating of a game by unfair means such as using several accounts, but generally that's not the case when people complain about reviews. All games will get bad reviews sooner or later. Everyone can't get only 5-star reviews. That would make ratings meaningless.

The reason that you hear people complaining about bad reviews more than good reviews (the latter does happen though), is that for a given game, obviously the dev won't complain about getting 5-star reviews and everyone who likes the game won't either, and these people generally make up the majority of the players who care about the game and thus the reviews it gets. If someone doesn't like a game and give it a 1 or 2 they generally drop the game and move on. So the potential number of people that would complain about a game getting undeserved 5-star reviews are generally lower. But that doesn't change the fact that you're being a hypocrite if you only complain about a game getting bad reviews when we all know there are loads of 5-star ratings which are just as low quality as they claim the 1 or 2-star ratings are.

In short, it all evens out and it's the same for everyone.
 
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HopesGaming

The Godfather
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Dec 21, 2017
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Ah, sorry I should have looked your avatar to see that you are from a Nordic country - and as such may not be familiar with Humor and/or sarcasm even less with irony.
Sadly I considered that adding 2 ;) to my post would give a hint and be enough.
next time I'll add the /s
(you can give me a bad rating)
;)
it's not that I didn't see your attempt at comedy. But it just didn't make sense to me so I asked.
Same as with your Scandinavian comment. It makes no sense as the Scandinavian countries are known for dark, sarcastic, irony kind of humor. (Probably another sarcastic humor that I didn't get)
My bad :p
 
D

Deleted member 3145675

Guest
Guest
it's not that I didn't see your attempt at comedy. But it just didn't make sense to me so I asked.
Same as with your Scandinavian comment. It makes no sense as the Scandinavian countries are known for dark, sarcastic, irony kind of humor. (Probably another sarcastic humor that I didn't get)
My bad :p
it's the all too common problem of written humor without making quotes or references. (and without vocal inflections or facial queues)
(in France we consider - often wrongly - that "nordic" people lack a "proper sense" of humor (due to the cold, they have frozen lips and can't smile :p) - but considering that french people don't understand "english humor" either - the problem is maybe within them (the french)
(they are known to mock everything that is not french - and then to mock all that is french.)
(just because mocking things is hilarious)
(when you like mocking)


Regarding ratings, witnessing the evolution of online ratings in general over the last few years (i.e. IMDB), I would repeat my claim to "just ignore them", between "fanboys", illiterates,*, people who give a 10 to a "thing" that deserves a 4 at best just because it's part of a Licence, IP, or belongs to a "Universe" they like, "ratings" are a joke. (and not a funny one)
;)
*Edit: I forgot the "bots".
Edit2: I also forgot the fake accounts - and it's "facial cues" not "queues" - but since we all wear masks due to Covid I guess facial cues are useless atm.

Legal Disclaimer: (most of this post is intended as a mix of serious facts, opinion, humor, and a bit of sarcasm)
 
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RossoX

Active Member
Jun 3, 2021
765
999
Is there a post minimum before submitting a rating or a review?
Building on the implication that you made for the sake of argument, that is, say having a minimum of 50 posts in order to be eligible to write a review, I think it wouldn't solve anything really.

It would go back to that old argument, where there's two different scores: one that aggregates the reviews made by """professional critics""", and another that averages the reviews made by the average users, so called the "audience score".

It leads to stuff like Dave Chappelle's "Stick & Stones", where a handful of soy critics hated it and lambasted the score, meanwhile the public loved it and so the scores stand at 30% to to 99%. Sure it may not be a near perfect show as the audience says, but it's also definitely NOT a 30% like the critics say.

My point being that having an arbitrary limit to who can write a review does not exactly correlate to proper reviews being made, sure it may discourage a few trolls and review-bombers (also bots), but other than that people with high post count are as biased as new accounts.

Others like GRasputin and Chelielz have made good points already and it sums up to this: the problem of having biased reviews in general is virtually unsolvable, given the insane amount of variables in human behavior, preferences and biases that you would have to account for.

The most healthy thing to do is take the reviews with a grain of salt; sure I have played games that I've enjoyed that had a low score, and alternatively have played games that had high scores which I found way overrated... but overall, the reviews as of now (as biased and messy as they are) at least give a decent baseline for you to make a personal decision based on your own tastes... after that it's up to each individual to interpret and filter the low effort reviews to judge the ones that are properly written.
 

desmosome

Conversation Conqueror
Sep 5, 2018
6,131
14,145
The actual rating stars are meaningless. Some people think 5 star means perfect, flawless game. I take 5 stars to mean "excellent." Others don't even think about it and default to "1 star bad 5 star gud."

The only meaningful information you can get from reviews is if you actually read the things people are saying and filter out the retards.
 

fitgirlbestgirl

Well-Known Member
Jul 27, 2017
1,141
4,285
If it was easy to solve the problem, f95zone and other sites (steam, metacritc, etc) would already have implemented a solution but the truth is that it's too complex and subjective of a matter to be easily solved.
Steam actually has a few features that improve the review system. One of them is sorting reviews by how many people found them helpful, the other is having two separate ratings for a game, one for the last 30 days and one for all time. I don't think the separate ratings would make sense for F95 based on the comparatively tiny amount of reviews that are written on the site, it would make the score fluctuate too wildly based on who happened to review the game most recently. The helpful review thing would be a good idea though.
 
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Droid Productions

[Love of Magic]
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Dec 30, 2017
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Steam also does only thumbs up/down votes, which I think would probably be better to adopt here as well.
 
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