- Nov 20, 2018
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So this is why vanilla fag being hate
- Thread starter Takomon
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I was just browsing some random mangas the other day and came across this rather cliche harem power fantasy. At least it's not isekai although it really reads like one lol.
This chapter illustrates what "vanilla fags" are all about. An adventurer party invades the MC's dungeon. MC (evil dude) captures them and mind breaks/tricks the 3 girls into becoming his sex toy. The only male in the party gets the "NTR reveal" in this chapter. It doesn't take him long to start cursing the girls and calling them whores despite the fact that none of this was their fault, and quite obviously so.
What's more, if you read the comments section, almost everyone is just fine and even proud of the MC. Don't get me wrong, I totally understand the difference in the appeal of netori and NTR. People who own up to it and have some introspective understanding of their fetishes are A-OK in my book. If it just comes down to "hey, I don't like when heroines get fucked by other dudes." that's fine. The "vanilla fag," on the other hand, will go through hoops to cover up their insecurities and incel mindset by blaming the victims. "She is a whore for falling for the asshole." "This cuck is a pussy, he should have just killed them all." This carries on all the way to death threats to the author and racist remarks against Asians and Blacks.
Not everyone who hates NTR is a vanilla fag, but the ones that are happens to be among the lowest filth you can find on the internet.
Vanilla or not sadly this permeates a great many manga too, or at least their English translations. Not victim blaming which could be understandable as an in-universe character trait of the male but as an objective truth in that fictional world. These girls ARE vapid sluts and commonly go from the "crying and bleeding virgin" schpiel to "RAPE ME HARDER MASTER! I'M CUMMING! NOOO!1!" within 5-10 pages. Without any drugs or supernatural powers involved. Basically more often than not the incels are right in-universe.
And if the MC corrupts the girls into such a state, are they not whores? I guess extending vanilafag to these types of hypocrites might not be the most accurate, but it's generally the same mindset at play. In the end, all of it is fucking moot because none of this shit is real.
sry if that sounded unnecessarily aggressive. I swear there was nothing personal against you lol
That's one way to look at it...
The other is that, on the topic of how to treat women, the protagonist was wrong and the antagonist was right. That women are not made of glass and as outlandish as it may sound... are for fucking.
The other is that, on the topic of how to treat women, the protagonist was wrong and the antagonist was right. That women are not made of glass and as outlandish as it may sound... are for fucking.
Well in my eyes they are, but then again I consider most "romance" protags molesters at best and serial rapists at worst. Presentation plays a huge part though, in most contexts where the MC gets the girl(s) there is no scene between them and other males(/futas/strap-ons) for contrast. And whether "natural" or "forced" or any other excuse most of the time the drivel pouring from the girl's mouth specifically references the person she's actively having sex with so it's easy to assume she's doing it only for him. But they all do it. Every. single. damn. time.
I can't stomach rape/NTR fests so I won't go through the full twelve chapters you linked to but that one might actually be one of the cases where the girls truly are innocent based on your description. I rarely see those stop at a point where you could call it "vanilla" though, most of the time it goes on to wanton exhibitionism, gangbangs, full-on slavery or worse. Might be selection bias though because I usually click away when "NTR/cheating" is the only non-vanilla tag.
Within the context of these fictional worlds the problem with your interpretation is that most of the time the women are made of glass until a man takes them by force. Innocent pure kind-hearted maidens who they continue to be (or pretend to at least) outside of the bedroom. Only once that "way too big" dick has has rammed into the bleeding gash between her legs with lots of "noooo!"'s and crying does it magically start to feel super good and she realises her true purpose was to get fucked all along.
(note: I absolutely hate that crap - just pops up waaay too often while looking for completely unrelated content)
- Aug 25, 2017
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The problem with the typical vanilla fag is that they're like the Karens of adult media. They're very vocal about what they don't like and will get upset that not everything that exists is tailored towards their preferences. They're the guys that go into NTR games/doujins/forums to complain about how they hate NTR, like they didn't just willingly ignore the title, tags, and preview image just to get to the page. They're the guys that go into m/m games and complain about how there's "too many gay games" or demand that m/f content be included to "appeal to a wider audience." They're the kind of guys that pretend the Emergence 'alternate ending' is canon because they missed the message ShindoL was going for.
Edit: Like you ever notice how they always make people who like NTR out to be the bad guys, but there's almost never anyone complaining about the lack of NTR? Stay in your lane, Karen.
Edit: Like you ever notice how they always make people who like NTR out to be the bad guys, but there's almost never anyone complaining about the lack of NTR? Stay in your lane, Karen.
- Nov 20, 2018
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Most work of fiction always progress fast, like boxing movie for example, goes from total beginner to 80% chance win against a guy train since he was 8 less than 1 year, and in the case of sex in doujinshi it's really not far from reality, sex itself is addictive in similar way of drug:
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obviously its effect not as strong and progress to addiction never be as fast, but if the man know how to do it right, they can give their partner something similar to it to certain extent. When I have sex try to make 1 round last 40 minutes, the moment exhaustion start effect the girl is also the moment the real fun for her begin, when she seems to be a bit of trembling and breath a little heavier, that is the time to make the any boring or shy girl start the honest moan, I never have enough of that, sound much better than motivate moan to make man happy. If that not prove any woman can be addicted to sex, I don't know what is, all it take is do it right. And when it comes to fiction, fiction is exaggeration of reality, by that girl fiction experience sex much like they experience cocaine (without hallucination ofc) which boring nice guy in NTR can not provide her even he is not suffered any physical disability, call the girl whore make incel just sound like sore loser. And the one you mention from virgin to sex slave with 5-10 pages, can you give me the link, that sound like a bad writing NTR, like people who not know NTR try to do tell NTR story, it should be from boring relationship with nice guy-> blackmail->virgin blackmail sex -> boring nice guy sex->more black mail sex-> addicted, that's the most cliché
Sorry for my bad English, rarely write anything this long, the grammar error must be like crazy
If you throw together all kinks and fetishes it might be somewhat even actually. Lack of polygamy tends to be a pretty common complaint after all (of course only in the form of "I as the MC want to bang anything and everything with a vagina"). You can't count only one niche fetish unless you have reliable stats and correct for the baseline of actual prevalence.
Hey if the guy actually had any reason to justify it even just the sexual equivalent of a 1-episode training montage that'd be fine. But you see it all the time with "highschool virgins" (both the guy and the girl) regardless of the stereotypes those particular characters are cast as.
Just search for "female:virgin" and "female:mind_break" on e-hentai, you'll find hundreds. Usually not NTR although sometimes a boyfriend (who is never shown during the sex scene but stated to be really bad at sex and never make her cum) may be mentioned.
I have to admit to never having heard the term "vanilla fag" or at least considered that much, but you have to consider that things like "virgins" "incels" and even "NTR" are tropes.
The reality can be different and a well-written story should diverge from these tropes in order to give characters depth.
Real people may be virgin or incel for different reasons than you imagine.
Not being a manga fan, I have real difficulty understanding the Engrish in the plate in the OP, but it seems a bit shallow. On the other hand the premise, secretly liking a girl who you think is "out of your league" but not daring to ask her out, is I think understandable for many male adolescents. It's just one of the problems of adolescence where you have desires but no self-confidence or skill. But many girls have a similar problem: they want to have a boyfriend but not become a slut. The threat of NTR (ie. some other guy getting the girl the MC secretly desires) could motive the guy to act but IRL they still would likely be too shy.
But as I said, that is part of normal adolesence. It's unfair to call the guy an incel, even if it technically correct. It's also not correct to call it NTR because there is no established relationship outside the MC's head. On the other hand, you also need to give the girl some credit: IRL the chance of her going out with that other guy is also not that big and if they are, the MC simply needs to accept it was not meant to be. And there is no shame in that: if I walk on some beach in the summer, I see plenty of good looking girls but I have rights to none of them and the actual chance of fucking even one of them is pretty small, regardless of my looks, confidence, age or money.
The reality can be different and a well-written story should diverge from these tropes in order to give characters depth.
Real people may be virgin or incel for different reasons than you imagine.
Not being a manga fan, I have real difficulty understanding the Engrish in the plate in the OP, but it seems a bit shallow. On the other hand the premise, secretly liking a girl who you think is "out of your league" but not daring to ask her out, is I think understandable for many male adolescents. It's just one of the problems of adolescence where you have desires but no self-confidence or skill. But many girls have a similar problem: they want to have a boyfriend but not become a slut. The threat of NTR (ie. some other guy getting the girl the MC secretly desires) could motive the guy to act but IRL they still would likely be too shy.
But as I said, that is part of normal adolesence. It's unfair to call the guy an incel, even if it technically correct. It's also not correct to call it NTR because there is no established relationship outside the MC's head. On the other hand, you also need to give the girl some credit: IRL the chance of her going out with that other guy is also not that big and if they are, the MC simply needs to accept it was not meant to be. And there is no shame in that: if I walk on some beach in the summer, I see plenty of good looking girls but I have rights to none of them and the actual chance of fucking even one of them is pretty small, regardless of my looks, confidence, age or money.
Yea, almost all porn fetishes are tropes, but that is by design.
- Extreme extrapolation of events can be exciting. Why is this woman being blackmailed into a cum dump by threat of one nude photo? I don't know but corruption baby!
- Realistic depiction of relationships could be considered boring. A coming of age story of love and loss can be some compelling drama, but how many people look to porn to fill that niche? Of course, I like some realistic plots and characters as much as the next guy, but sometimes (most of the time lol) I just want to fap to mind break hentai.
- A realistic take on a lot of these fetishes could become very bleak. Most of incest content should be about grooming some kids if we're being realistic. There would be no "happy rape." Brothel games would be about sex trafficking. Harem games would be about some middle east misogynistic society. If you want to be depressed, try to read Metamorphosis by ShindoL. There are certainly worse hentai out there in terms of shock value, but this story hits so fucking close to home because it can, and does, happen in real life.
I mean some of these feelings could part of growing up, but some people just never grow up from this juvenile world view, and it begins to taint their whole being to the core.
- Nov 20, 2018
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I feel like we have difference view on incel here, like who should be being call incel and who shouldn't, in your example above, I would never call guy like that an incel, real incel on the other hand, by default they want the girl they secretly like attention all for themselves, childish but understandable, until they call that girl a whore/slut when they learn she had sex friends, or even she just interest in many guys, they find some excuse like "she'll cheat on me if we are in a relationship anyway" when they back away, but if the incel see another guy still chase that "slut" girl after he learns about her "nature", the incel will call him a simp.
And this is the most common thing about incel I have seen so far both online and irl, they want girl they like to accept who they really are physically, mentally and financially, therefore they never go to gym or do anything to improve their image in the opposite sex eyes but the idea of having a girl approach them are their ultimate fantasy lol, even I back in middle school, I was still a fat ass I have girl ask me out, it's just the incel horrible personality and their shitty view on women make them stay virgin, being virgin is not a bad thing obviously, I know many people have anxiety due to their lack of inexperience with the opposite sex, I never slander someone because they are virgin, but if they are virgin and talking shit about how women should be and slander them when they act against that idea, then I will make exception.
When it comes to fiction, I wouldn't expect everyone are able to enjoy NTR, I myself once scare of reading and NTR, checking tag to make sure before reading even it mean to spoil the story, but I never go out of my way to insult people who enjoy it or make it, artist have total creativity over their work and I'm sure people with common sense can understand this, vanilla fag on the other hand always feel the need to shit on anything remotely relate to the idea of heroine once have interest in anyone before they and the mc are in a relationship leave alone NTR, vanilla fag can't stomach anything beside the idea heroine love them for who they are and for some reason want to jump on their dick and have their baby, sound familiar?
In my opinion a pure trope is pretty boring. Of course absolute reality is also boring.
I guess what I'm looking for is "believable" or "plausible" scenario's.
But in my opinion in a VN the story should be good, as that increases the eroticism.
Just seeing two other people fuck also gets boring after a while.
We are in agreement then. I'm not a native English speaker so maybe I did get the wrong idea somehow.
Still, a lot of MC's in these games are 18, several I suppose would be a couple of years younger if that were legal. A lot of them are not quite men yet.
- Aug 25, 2017
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I don't understand why you brought up the lack of polygamy when the quote you chose specifically talks about NTR. The forum mods might be more vigilant now, but for years there is at least one person complaining about NTR in a game that's clearly about being cucked. Even at the start of the year, Vanilla fags would often come into NTR threads to bemoan the very existence of the fetish. They would say things like "I hope you get cucked in real life" when people called them out for their stupidity.
Also, I don't know if you're joking or not, but if you've actually found a pie chart or whatever to prove such statistics exist, go ahead, post it and rip me a new one.
The term "incel" is usually self-given. When people call others an incels, they're saying that the other person is acting like an incel. These are just some of the things incels believe, as ridiculous as it sounds:
- Women are shallow and are only attractive to alpha males that have strong chins, thick necks, thick wrists, muscular bodies, 6 feet tall minimum.
- All alpha males are assholes.
- Women are unfaithful and sleep with multiple alpha males.
- The ideal woman has never had sex before and doesn't know how good alpha males are at it.
- Women who regularly have sex have sagging, dark colored labia.
- Women only marry unattractive or normal looking guys for money or financial stability, but cheat on them.
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- Apr 30, 2017
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Are they not? Then I played all the wrong incest games.
Uh, did you read my reply? That was the entire point. There are people complaining about scat in scat games, incest in incest games and all the other stuff as well. There also are people asking for incest, watersports, NTR, polygamy/harem and many other things to be added to games regardless of how little sense it makes. You always get random people vocally hating on niche content, NTR is not special in that regard. If anything the one niche which does suffer actual persecution is loli/shota because lawmakers believe the "video games cause violence" bullshit or simply don't care about personal freedom of expression.
Also openly calling others "vanilla fags" or "incels" is not particularly productive, you're needlessly feeding their victim complex.
Just for fun:
Actually I would consider being a bit of an asshole part of the definition of a proper alpha male. You can't really maintain leadership and control of your territory without it.
Maybe you as a mod can pull some proper statistics but a lot of them seem to involve the "kid" molesting all female family members.
- Aug 25, 2017
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I feel like we have a disconnect between what's considered a vanilla fag, and that's fine. But for the record, I'm talking about people who complain about fetishes they don't like, in places that feature them, or demand the catering to a very general crowd that's not interested in said fetish, which I highlighted in my original post.
Yes, but you can't deny that there's a significant number of people that hate "NTR" and anything that resembles it. Games that don't contain NTR get accused of having it by very insecure people who can't stand the presence of another attractive male character. There are literally "No NTR" mods for most major game titles on here stretching back years. There are mods that remove the NTR paths from games and rewrite their scenes to remove any hint of it. I've never seen any fetish get so thoroughly scrubbed and repainted to cater to people who absolutely abhor it.
I also feel the need to point out that I haven't used the term vanilla fag on anyone ever, and I've only used it here for the sake of discussion. And as far as I remember, I've also never called anyone an incel, and my usage here was restricted to explaining the term. I find it odd that out of everyone else that has used either words, you've singled my comment out to say this.
- Nov 20, 2018
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This but it needs to add the part where vanilla fag go around saying shit like "You enjoy reading this you have shit taste" even to those stories not involve fetish like scat, gore, NTR, they feel the need to act they are "the better person" in the comment section for not able enjoy tragic erotic story, classic virgin "nice guy". But having these idiots around barking "this is disgusting, nasty" is part of the fun anyway, it shows their insecurity, can't have much fun cucking an unbothered cuckold.
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- Nov 20, 2018
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That's urban dictionary is always knows for lacking, but consider it's been 2 years it's not too bad, vanilla fag do have fetish and it all trace back to vanilla trope, the more incel among vanilla fag also enjoy mind break, slave, rape, but still most commonly know for their most common trait, butt hurt attitude against NTR or anything remotely resemble it because they are very secure about themselves, these very secure "nice guy" hate NTR with their entire being but still for some reason you can find them bark them same thing in nhentai NTR comment section, how do I know they are vanilla fag ? Because these vanilla fag always feel the need to tell anyone stumble on their profile know how much they love vanilla, normally people would step away from fetish that make them feel uncomfortable, but not vanilla fag, they have kpop stan tantrum against NTR, or maybe they don't know what blacklist is, anyway I feel bad for them, imagine being so deeply hurt by fiction
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- Mar 9, 2019
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The fact that people are like that blows my mind. Like these beta cuck males and simps. Incels are just a joke. I'm telling you, so funny. Like realistically speaking unless you push everyone away or have a shit personality then you can get laid in your life. We live in a world where people who are virgins at 40 have shows made about them. Doesn't matter when you lose you virginity, but the more incel you are, the more nice guys finish last you are, the higher chances there are of you staring in the 78 year old virgin.