Theorist Battleground - Definition of RPG, Sand Box, Open World, Visual Novel in F95'Zone

[Benn Swagger]

Before posting/commenting :
1. Only take example from games that available in F95zone.
2. Definition should base on any Internet's Dictionary, but not your own self made definition.

The Question :
1. What is an RPG ?
2. What is a Sand Box ?
3. What is an Open World games ?
4. What is a Visual Novel ?
5. Are all Games in F95 (exclude the action genre), are Visual Novel ?
6. If no. 5, there RPG, Sand Box & Open World Games style, can you make 3 example ?

Answer do not need in order.

 

[DarthSeduction]

The Question :
1. What is an RPG ?

An RPG is a game that allows you to take on a role and play within it, in its most simple terms, there are RPGs that don't require the same exp and levelling experience that we typically associate with an RPG, however most use this method to track character growth. The Artifact, and Incest Adventure are both RPGs but approach them differently. The artifact is what's known as an action rpg, giving you the player an active role in the open combat, but also showing a progression from the beginning to the end. Incest Adventure is a Turn Based RPG, this is the more traditional format that we are used to in games like Pokemon, or Final Fantasy.​

2. What is a Sand Box ?

A Sandbox is technically just another word for an Open World game. However one could make the argument that the nature of a sandbox is that its a world in which you, the player, get to decide what to do and when to do it. Not all Open Worlds manage this well.​

3. What is an Open World games ?

An Open World game is a game that allows you, the player, to explore it's entirety at your own pace, letting you go back to where you came from, or forward to a place you're not really meant to be yet at any time. Some of these games do this while keeping you locked in to a linear story, others allow you to move through it's story at your own pace. Big Brother, Man of the House, View of Family, etc, are all examples of open worlds, in that you, the player have a choice in where to go at any point. Similarly most of the RPGM titles are the same, allowing the MC to go and do what they want at any given time. However I wouldn't really call any of them sandboxes, because they all have linear progression and there's not any real fun to be had outside those systems.​

4. What is a Visual Novel ?

Due to the fact that this place has a lot of games that fit this description it's hard to nail it down for certain. For instance, I would tell you that My Girlfriends Amnesia is a Visual Novel, however it uses the RPGM format. That said, it doesn't really use that format because it needs it, and could arguably be a better game if it was in Ren'Py. In essence a Visual Novel is a game wherin the interactions of the player are mostly limited to making choices, to do or not to do. It's a mostly linear storytelling medium, that, even with branches, can often be very much in a box designed to move to one definitive end.​

5. Are all Games in F95 (exclude the action genre), are Visual Novel ?

Absolutely not. Some may feel like it, other's may use an engine that was intended for them, but I wouldn't call all the games here Visual Novels.
​

6. If no. 5, there RPG, Sand Box & Open World Games style, can you make 3 example ?

RPG I already mentioned Incest Adventure and The Artifact, I could add Icstor to the list to make an even 3

Sand Box I don't think we are there yet, however if anyone is interested and owns or can pirate skyrim, the mods OSA engine, Osex, and Amorous Adventures turn the game into a pretty interesting open world sandbox sex game. Have fun. The mods OSA engine and Osex also work in Enderal.

Open World My favorite would be Coceter Chronicles, which allows you to travel the world at your own pace, interacting with plenty of side quests that have no bearing on the main story. This might be the closest we have to a Sandbox, but I still wouldn't put it up there. Then obviously you have the Life sims, like View of Family and Chloe 18 that allow you to go around and do things at your own pace. There's no requirement that you go to any one place, and while certain places are closed during certain hours, that's no different from the real world.​

 

[Benn Swagger]

1. What is an RPG ?

An RPG is a game that allows you to take on a role and play within it, in its most simple terms, there are RPGs that don't require the same exp and levelling experience that we typically associate with an RPG, however most use this method to track character growth. The Artifact, and Incest Adventure are both RPGs but approach them differently. The artifact is what's known as an action rpg, giving you the player an active role in the open combat, but also showing a progression from the beginning to the end. Incest Adventure is a Turn Based RPG, this is the more traditional format that we are used to in games like Pokemon, or Final Fantasy.​

Only playing The Artifact v.01 ... but I do play Incest Adventure. I don't think it's the right example of RPG. Role Playing Games is about simple to fully customize your main character. From Appearance, to Characteristic. Both game is on RPGM platform which offer combat system. But the combat itself had not anything to do with the story. It's just simple/forced mechanic of the game. In Incest Adventure, you can't have different set of mind/characteristic. You just follow what the story tell you. Probably have a few story selection, but it's not changing how the main character behave. Simple like VN with branching story.

There are many quest in Incest Story, which female to progress, but the outcome is pretty linear. Is this a VN with multiple quest ? Or it is a true RPG or just try to be one ? ... In my understanding Role Playing Games mean a freedom choice from character behavior, appearance and statistic build up, which I don't see it in many RPGMaker games. Leveling character combat stat are fixed, Appearance doesn't change looks but statistic, Combat didn't really matter and no class system, Changing appearance didn't change the scene event at all. In story you cannot became a pervert, neutral or rapist asshole (since it about porn game). The whole design pretty much fixed. The only freedom you can do are choosing which female you want to follow first.

 

[DarthSeduction]

Only playing The Artifact v.01 ... but I do play Incest Adventure. I don't think it's the right example of RPG. Role Playing Games is about simple to fully customize your main character. From Appearance, to Characteristic. Both game is on RPGM platform which offer combat system. But the combat itself had not anything to do with the story. It's just simple/forced mechanic of the game. In Incest Adventure, you can't have different set of mind/characteristic. You just follow what the story tell you. Probably have a few story selection, but it's not changing how the main character behave. Simple like VN with branching story.

There are many quest in Incest Story, which female to progress, but the outcome is pretty linear. Is this a VN with multiple quest ? Or it is a true RPG or just try to be one ? ... In my understanding Role Playing Games mean a freedom choice from character behavior, appearance and statistic build up, which I don't see it in many RPGMaker games. Leveling character combat stat are fixed, Appearance doesn't change looks but statistic, Combat didn't really matter and no class system, Changing appearance didn't change the scene event at all. In story you cannot became a pervert, neutral or rapist asshole (since it about porn game). The whole design pretty much fixed. The only freedom you can do are choosing which female you want to follow first.

have you never played Final Fantasy or Pokemon or Golden Sun or Earthbound or Kingdom Hearts or The Witcher? Character customization is a feature that can be included, but it doesn't have anything to do with roleplaying in general. A role playing game is a game where you play a role. The role that the game wants you to play. You might be spoiled by modern RPGs or a tabletop gamer so you've been able to experience freedom of choice, but that isn't the case in most RPGs. RPGs are not necessarily not Linear. All the games I mentioned above are by every definition RPGs All but one of them is completely linear, and even that one always advances to the ultimate end of dealing with the Wild Hunt.

 

[Ataios]

The main difference between sandbox and open world game in opinion is the extent, the player or players can influece the world.

If the player can go whereever he wants whenever he wants, that's basically enough for a game to be considered open world. Most open world games have some sort of linear story, but the player is not forced to play along that route, basically he can do what he wants.

For a sandbox the player or players must have some influence on the way the world looks and functions in addition to that. There must be housing and a complex economic system in addition to everything that makes an open world game. Some games are somewhere in between I have to admit, but not every open world game is a sandbox. Black Desert Online is a sandbox game e.g. while World of Warcraft isn't.

Will there ever be somethin remotely resembling an open world or sandbox porn game? I seriously doubt it. There is nothing even remotely in that direction right now and porn game developers don't have the ressources to create such a game at least in the near future. To closest thing to open world and sandbox porn games are mods for Fallout 4, Skyrim and Sims 4.

For a game to be considered RPG it needs character development, which RPG maker games and some other games here, like Lust and Power und Ladies Superleague of Lesbos technically have, at least as far as skills and stats go. Still, these features are not important enough and well developed enough to call these games RPGs (an average shooter has more RPG features than any game here). I'd rather call them visual novels with RPG elements.

 

[Benn Swagger]

Now I'm confuse the difference between RPG and an Adventure games. I read in the past, some said, game like the Witcher 3 & GTA are RPG, while Tomb Raider as Adventure. They look the same, different at detail. Hm... ? :frown:

 

[Ataios]

Now I'm confuse the difference between RPG and an Adventure games. I read in the past, some said, game like the Witcher 3 & GTA are RPG, while Tomb Raider as Adventure. They look the same, different at detail. Hm... ? :frown:

In the Witcher games you have stats, skills and levels. You get more powerful as you advance in the game. In Tomb Raider you don't, even though the games use a similar perspective and combat system.

So The Witcher 3 is certainly an RPG. Tomb Raider is not. I wouldn't call GTA an RPG either, although some may argue that, because you have levels. I don't think it fits the definition though, as you don't earn any new skills and the level is mostly for prestige reasons, not for actual character advancement.

 

[Egglock]

1. What is RPG?
Well, let's break this down a bit, so what is the definition of "Role-Playing"?
"Role-playing is the changing of one's behaviour to assume a role, either unconsciously to fill a social role, or consciously to act out an adopted role"
Source:

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Now if you add the word "game" to the end of that. Essential what we have is, a virtual world, where the player takes on the role of said character to act out a series of events. RPG doesn't necessary need skills, stats, levels to make them a RPG, the way I see it, these are here to help illustrate what the player can't physically sense.. I would go as far to say that VN's can be consider RPG.

2. What is a Sand Box?
Think of it like a "sand box" you know those boxes that have sand in them, that kids play in? Well, if you can imagine that, think of what happens when kids jump into those sand boxes? They play with their toys, their imagination, there is no story, there is nothing stopping them or directing them in a direction. It's an open space that one can do whatever they wish to do. So if you look at it in terms of video game, it's an open space with no rules, no story, no direction the player goes in. They are free to do what ever they please with whatever is offer to them to shape and direct that virtual space.

3. What is an Open World Game?
This can be seen as what the real world is like. We have places, things, a sense of direction, and purpose or goal to achieve. How one goes about to do these is entirely up to ones discretion.

4. What is a Visual Novel?
It's a fancy way of saying picture book. It's basically what a VN is. It's words with images added to them.

5. Are all games in F95, VN?
No, but the majority seen on F95 are. There are a few selection that aren't VN. Look at the tags outside of Ren'py, and you'll most likely step outside the realm of VN.

6. If no, give examples.
As I mention above. Some off the top of my head are, Mahou Arm (hack and slash game) RPG, Third Crisis (Grid/turn base battle system) RPG, Insexsity (semi-sim exploration) Semi-RPG/Open world. These games are still rough around the edges, but with what little you get out of it, they all have elements of RPG, and aren't presented as a VN. They're interacting with the environment.

In my understanding Role Playing Games mean a freedom choice from character behavior, appearance and statistic build up, which I don't see it in many RPGMaker games.

To a degree yes, as mention by darthseduction, those are features, to allow some freedom to the player, but ultimately the player is still playing the role that the game is design for. Another example is Tomb Raider. You have no control as to how she looks or wears, but you take on the role or Lara Croft, and steer (most of the time in a linear direction) until you hit the ending.

Will there ever be somethin remotely resembling an open world or sandbox porn game? I seriously doubt it. There is nothing even remotely in that direction right now and porn game developers don't have the ressources to create such a game at least in the near future. To closest thing to open world and sandbox porn games are mods for Fallout 4, Skyrim and Sims 4.

If you're strictly speaking of indie dev's than yes, it's still a long road before anything comes close to FO4 or Skyrim. As far as sand box goes, I don't think it'll be that entertaining. If we were to think of it like the "sand box" I mention above, it's pretty much just throwing a character on screen, pose them, dress them up, and perform sex positions on them. Outside of Indie dev's there's plenty of games, majority being from Illusion. From the top of my head, there's Sexy Beach Premium Resort, Artificial Girl 3, (@)HomeMate

It's not the lack of resources, there's plenty out there for the picking. What I believe is, new or on going dev's don't want to spend years making such game. These types of game require a great deal of time invested into them. Even then it could probably turn out to be shit. No dev's wants to take that risk, after all, porn games don't sell well on digital distributor unless that platform allows adult content, even then devs would have to jump through hoops to get their game on these platforms.

Now I'm confuse the difference between RPG and an Adventure games. I read in the past, some said, game like the Witcher 3 & GTA are RPG, while Tomb Raider as Adventure. They look the same, different at detail. Hm... ?

So The Witcher 3 is certainly an RPG. Tomb Raider is not. I wouldn't call GTA an RPG either

I disagree, all three games have elements of RPG. You don't necessary need skills, stats, or levels. Any combination of these or progression is what makes it feel like a RPG. These are just representation to what we can't physically sense. As far as RPG and Adventure goes, these are categories that help gives the player an overview of what the game is about without going into a TLR scenario. It's no different than saying action, horror, open world, RPG. One might argue that the old school Tomb Raider games aren't RPG, but I beg to differ. At it's core it's essential a RPG. You take on the role of Lara Croft, who seeks out treasures and the thrilling adventure that comes along with it. Just because you're not getting stats, or leveling in the process, it doesn't make it any less of a RPG. Same goes to GTA, at least the more recent ones. Those are more open world, but still has a touch of RPG to them.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Now I'm confuse the difference between RPG and an Adventure games. I read in the past, some said, game like the Witcher 3 & GTA are RPG, while Tomb Raider as Adventure. They look the same, different at detail. Hm... ? :frown:

In a RPG you define the main character yourself, while in an Adventure game you play with a character already fully defined. So the Fallout series are RPG, the Tomb Raider one are Adventure games, and The Witcher one are stuck between them since you play a character defined by the game, but you decide how it will evolve.

As for the difference between sandbox and open world, it's tricky. Initially both were games where you decide how you play and what you do, while letting you the possibility to perform quests or don't care a single time about them. To keep the Fallout series as example, you can have thousand hours of play, and still haven't completed a single quest except the tutorial ones ; in Fallout 3, I played something like 50 hours before finding, by hazard, my father and remembering that it was why everything started. The main difference were about the (relative) size of the world. A whole county for the Fallout series (open world), against a single town for the Saints Row series (sandbox).
But nowadays the definition tend to completely change, and a game like minecraft is defined as "sandbox" simply because there isn't a single goal. It's like a sandbox in real time, you come without a single clue about what to do and what you'll do, and just pass your time doing something. In the same time, games like The Witcher series are seen as open world because you can come back to a place a do what you want ; this while you can't really play outside of the quests.
To this you must add a third definition of "sandbox", which can apply to porn games. Take any average corruption game as example. You start the game by corrupting each character, going further at each step. Then come a time when they are all corrupted and the only thing you can do is bang them. That's the moment when the game switch to "sandbox mode". There's no game, just you deciding who you'll fuck and how you'll do it.