You need to tell me HOW CRAPPY this is....

[MoolahMilk]

Ok guys! I've finally finished my first game ever version 0.1! Gosh this is way harder than I thought it would be. (The quarantine gave me the time and kick I needed to finally start on a game hehe.)

So here's the thing. I'm making a HS game (I prefer the artstyle vs DAZ) but problem is HS games look dated with really crappy background scenes. Obviously Daz is a much more powerful engine.
So I spent a lot of time trying to make the HS renders look as close to DAZ level as possible because I still like the HS vibe.

Everytime I feel like I've done a good job, my brother will walk in the room and tell me how crappy it looks. And I would gain a new perspective and realise "Yes, he's right, this is shit."
I think it's because I'm desensitized to my own work to make any objective criticism. (Because I look at the same thing over and over again.)

So thanks to my stupid brother, I spent ages remaking entire scenes. But also thanks to him, my skills inproved greatly. To make matters worse, HS2 was released while I'm halfway through my game! ARGGGH. I should have used that instead, the renders are much better! But oh well, I've put in so much effort its too late.


Anyway, now I think I'm confident enough to finally release my game, but I need some more feedback on the art.

Here are some renders.




And here's the improvement process every time I remake a scene.
I swear to god I will disown my brother if he says it's crap again because I have remade the whole game 3 times.

DRAFT1 (Brother walks in... "this sucks")



DRAFT2 (Brother walks in..."Never do art again")


FINAL (After remaking the entire character and massive rework of scenes, lighting, assets etc. Brother walks in... "This is not too bad")


I'm sure you can all agree there is significant improvement.

So yes, here are the final renders and now I need more public feedback. Someone who is not my brother.

What's good about it and what's bad about it?
What can be improved?
Are the characters designed well? (Do they look attractive, am I able to convey their personality from the art alone? Dress, expressions poses etc.)
How is the scenery, backdrop, lighting etc.

And finally, would you play this game? Is the artwork of enough quality to be released? Or does much more work need to be done.


Please leave feedback and cheers! I hope to release the game soon.
Peace and stay safe. Wear a damn mask and don't go out. Just play porn games at home!

 

[bboybarry]

No worries dude it looks good.
In fact it looks better than a lot of the other hs(that's honey select right?) games.

 

[DelinquentProductions]

Your brother is a very valuable man to have around. Like you said we can make something and try to be objective about it but looking at it for hours and hours can make that almost impossible.

Your finals look great for the engine, above most games using it imho. They have visual character, and as long as you have the writing and themes down it should be fine.

It's great to push yourself and get past those limits, but it's also important to remember not to get caught up in second guessing yourself.

It's all about consistency. Moving to a better program is probably a good call, as it's always good to be upping your game. But doing it between projects is the best way, for that consistency, and just to give yourself time to learn.

 

[Mimir's Lab]

First one looks okay, though I think the only way to improve it would be changing the scene or pose or lighting.

Second one looks good compositionally, though I think maybe you can apply some depth of field blur or back lighting so it separates the character from the background a bit more.

I think third one is by far your best work.

Between the first and second draft (4th and 5th images), I have mixed feelings. I like the colors of the character of the first draft more because it feels more vibrant while the character in the second draft looks washed out. However, the environment in the second draft feels much more 3 dimensional than the first. So it boils down to 1st draft = environment washed out + character vibrant, while 2nd draft = environment vibrant + character washed out. Additionally the double shadows in 2nd draft don't look too appealing. For the backdrop in these two scenes, I feel like it looks like a super intense white backdrop with chromatic aberration applied, though on second inspection I can see the tiny hills that sorta blend into the curvature in the fencing. Maybe increase the size of the hills or reduce the size of the fencing so they're more easily differentiated.

As far as character design goes, they seem like they fit into the archetypes that we've seen before, which is neither good or bad in my opinion. They're familiar and that helps people get into your story without them having to figure out how these characters should behave. The execution of the archetypes will be the most important part that helps sell your characters to your audience.

The artwork is far above acceptable for me to play, considering that I'd play most HoneySelect games with just the standard untouched graphics. If you're trying to convince the die-hard DAZ crowd to come play your game, don't.

Finally one tip I have for you that I think would really help you out is Perfectionism is not a gift, it's a curse. If you spend all your time making everything perfect, you'll have a perfect idea, not a finished game. Besides, the people who can spot all the tiny mistakes you make are few and far between, it's not worth wasting your time to please them.

 

[MoolahMilk]

Thanks for the encouraging comments. Yes, I just want to get the artstyle right for the demo because once launched, I will be using similiar style for the rest of the game. As you mentioned consistency is key so I won't be doing any drastic changes as the game progresses. I'll probably be working on this game for the whole of next year so it would be great to get the base right.

 

[MoolahMilk]

First one looks okay, though I think the only way to improve it would be changing the scene or pose or lighting.

Second one looks good compositionally, though I think maybe you can apply some depth of field blur or back lighting so it separates the character from the background a bit more.

I think third one is by far your best work.

Between the first and second draft (4th and 5th images), I have mixed feelings. I like the colors of the character of the first draft more because it feels more vibrant while the character in the second draft looks washed out. However, the environment in the second draft feels much more 3 dimensional than the first. So it boils down to 1st draft = environment washed out + character vibrant, while 2nd draft = environment vibrant + character washed out. Additionally the double shadows in 2nd draft don't look too appealing. For the backdrop in these two scenes, I feel like it looks like a super intense white backdrop with chromatic aberration applied, though on second inspection I can see the tiny hills that sorta blend into the curvature in the fencing. Maybe increase the size of the hills or reduce the size of the fencing so they're more easily differentiated.

As far as character design goes, they seem like they fit into the archetypes that we've seen before, which is neither good or bad in my opinion. They're familiar and that helps people get into your story without them having to figure out how these characters should behave. The execution of the archetypes will be the most important part that helps sell your characters to your audience.

The artwork is far above acceptable for me to play, considering that I'd play most HoneySelect games with just the standard untouched graphics. If you're trying to convince the die-hard DAZ crowd to come play your game, don't.

Finally one tip I have for you that I think would really help you out is Perfectionism is not a gift, it's a curse. If you spend all your time making everything perfect, you'll have a perfect idea, not a finished game. Besides, the people who can spot all the tiny mistakes you make are few and far between, it's not worth wasting your time to please them.

Hey, thank you for taking the time to give detailed feedback. I've taken your suggestions to heart and it was very helpful.

You have a point regarding convincing the DAZ crowd. I guess I've been reading a lot of comments from many users who skip HS games completely. And I understand their point of view because it does look very dated in comparison.

I guess I wanted to stand out from other HS games to secure the HS fanbase and at the same time catch a few eyeballs from the DAZ crowd. I play a lot of DAZ games as well and after awhile, the models look the same. I wanted to offer something refreshing with the HS artstyle but still look decent.


You're right regarding your last point thought. I really enjoyed the process of making this demo and I'll be working on this project for the whole of next year. Hopefully the demo takes off and I can pursue this further. There's just so much more to explore and it's exciting!

Anyway, for those interested I've designed the banner already (my sig) and I'll be launching the game in a couple of days after I finish tweaking.

 

[Fliptoynk]

'would be stupid to argue with someone while holding a (hot) cup of coffee. put it down the table. and I dunno if that's the right facial expression... what are they arguing? how heavy is the issue? what's her personality? I mean, for example:
is she, a cheerful extrovert? she'd rather give you an angry but a bit sad face
is she, a an introvert? she'll either give you a cold glare, or look away irritated

for arm/hand gestures... you'll find upset/unconvinced people with hands to the hips, crossed-arms if disappointed or irritated, streched down clenched fist if they're about to throw a fit, hand in back if hiding something, streched down hands together if she's fond of you or giggling inside.

oh, she has a tattoo... she could be a wild and free type. they are usually sarcastic and cynical in mild-to-mid arguments. you'll often see her crossed arms with a cringe expression.

whenever you wanna make a render... imagine yourself in her place, look yourself in the mirror, and say the dialogue with feelings... over and over until you get the idea of what's the right expression/gesture

 

[Markéllisson]

I really liked you renders, keep doing it, i hope i can play your game soon.

 

[MoolahMilk]

'would be stupid to argue with someone while holding a (hot) cup of coffee. put it down the table. and I dunno if that's the right facial expression... what are they arguing? how heavy is the issue? what's her personality? I mean, for example:
is she, a cheerful extrovert? she'd rather give you an angry but a bit sad face
is she, a an introvert? she'll either give you a cold glare, or look away irritated

for arm/hand gestures... you'll find upset/unconvinced people with hands to the hips, crossed-arms if disappointed or irritated, streched down clenched fist if they're about to throw a fit, hand in back if hiding something, streched down hands together if she's fond of you or giggling inside.

oh, she has a tattoo... she could be a wild and free type. they are usually sarcastic and cynical in mild-to-mid arguments. you'll often see her crossed arms with a cringe expression.

whenever you wanna make a render... imagine yourself in her place, look yourself in the mirror, and say the dialogue with feelings... over and over until you get the idea of what's the right expression/gesture

Yes very valid points. Trying to come up with the right feel of poses and expressions is immensely difficult. Dont even get me started on writing dialogue. But I'm sure that will improve over time.

The context of the scene is that she's complaining to the waitress about the coffee thats too cold.

 

[MoolahMilk]

I really liked you renders, keep doing it, i hope i can play your game soon.

Hey fellow HS lover. Thanks for the encouragement. I'll be posting it real soon. Just getting final touchups ready. Hope its up your alley.

 

[Goodfella]

Buddy I have to tell you, i never thought one could achieve so much with HS. The Volumetric lighting looks amazing on your 3rd image.
the advice from Mimir's lab is all solid, but if anything, the only limitation I can see here that you would have a hard time getting over is the quality of hair and textures. With the better Daz Hair (like that released by OOT) or particle hair (if you go to blender), you could get better quality. You can also see the limitation of the textures on the jeans for example. But honestly I think you should embrace your current engine, as excelling in whatever you do is truly the key to success. With this being your starting point, I can't wait to see your tenth patch, and your second game ^^

 

[MoolahMilk]

Buddy I have to tell you, i never thought one could achieve so much with HS. The Volumetric lighting looks amazing on your 3rd image.
the advice from Mimir's lab is all solid, but if anything, the only limitation I can see here that you would have a hard time getting over is the quality of hair and textures. With the better Daz Hair (like that released by OOT) or particle hair (if you go to blender), you could get better quality. You can also see the limitation of the textures on the jeans for example. But honestly I think you should embrace your current engine, as excelling in whatever you do is truly the key to success. With this being your starting point, I can't wait to see your tenth patch, and your second game ^^

Thank you for your kind words. Yes, you are right. I simply do not have the time or expertise required to develop my own textures and I'm limited to what many great modders put out. Anyway, I guess renders aren't everything. I'm still trying to grapple with the writing and other aspects too so by the time I'm done with this game, no doubt I'll be better.

I just hope to stand out among the HS crowd and turn some heads from others who ignore HS games. Look forward to seeing you around.