A better VNDB needed or not?

Do you think VNDB needs competition?


  • Total voters
    25

RedEye781

Member
Dec 15, 2019
103
144
Right I get the consensus here, even though

Welcoming new fans through a modern platform doesn’t take away from long-time users. If anything, it:
  • Brings in more funding and visibility for the medium.
  • Encourages more translations and localization efforts.
  • Makes it easier to find rare or underappreciated titles.
  • Larger communities mean more reviews, recommendations, and discussions.
You guys are happy with gatekeeping VNs. Well, now I know why there are no other websites, it's because no one wants it.
 
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desmosome

Conversation Conqueror
Sep 5, 2018
6,512
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Right I get the consensus here, even though

Welcoming new fans through a modern platform doesn’t take away from long-time users. If anything, it:
  • Brings in more funding and visibility for the medium.
  • Encourages more translations and localization efforts.
  • Makes it easier to find rare or underappreciated titles.
  • Larger communities mean more reviews, recommendations, and discussions.
You guys are happy with gatekeeping VNs. Well, now I know why there are no other websites, it's because no one wants it.
Literally no one is gatekeeping. People are saying vndb is fine. They don't see a need for some sleek modern website, but no one is stopping you from making it yourself or funding it. In general, the overwhelming majority of people just don't like changes to what they know, even if things are supposedly better. And whether it is actually better is objectionable in most cases. Better for ads, monetization, engagement, doom scrolling, etc, surely, but better for the end-user?
 

whowhawhy

Active Member
Jan 19, 2023
668
687
well, here's an excerpt about making the site more mobile-friendly:

and here's the latest 3rd party vndb app for android:
 

Catapo

Member
Jun 14, 2018
263
468
Right I get the consensus here, even though

Welcoming new fans through a modern platform doesn’t take away from long-time users. If anything, it:
  • Brings in more funding and visibility for the medium.
  • Encourages more translations and localization efforts.
  • Makes it easier to find rare or underappreciated titles.
  • Larger communities mean more reviews, recommendations, and discussions.
You guys are happy with gatekeeping VNs. Well, now I know why there are no other websites, it's because no one wants it.
Personally I am kind of on the same page as the others, VNDB is fine as it is and it does not NEED fixing but I also somewhat share your sentiment in that I wouldn't be upset by a modern interface for it.

There are a few points that I would like to bring up though

Brings in more funding and visibility for the medium.
Considering the site keeps information on vns that feature: non consensual acts, guro / vore, necrophilia, loli/shota and beastiality I don't think major visibility should be anywhere on their priority list.

Encourages more translations and localization efforts.
This is a bit of a double edged sword. Sure more proper translators can appear but also many more improper ones.
Using AI/MTL as an aid in the translation process done by a human is not necessarily an issue but this also opens the door for MTLs without any proper review which leads to poor quality translations and also discourage proper translators to pick up a title that already has a crap translation.

Makes it easier to find rare or underappreciated titles.
I really don't see how since rare titles are not magically going to appear on the front page of a new interface.

Larger communities mean more reviews, recommendations, and discussions
And taking F95Zone as an example it also means more user conflicts, more moderation work, bad actors pushing limits and childlike behaviour.

Also take into account that right now VNDB hides explicit thumbnails and screenshots and you have to agree to view them. They are most likely doing this to comply with some regulations meaning a UI with huge thumbnails for the vns might introduce some complications.
 

RedEye781

Member
Dec 15, 2019
103
144
Personally I am kind of on the same page as the others, VNDB is fine as it is and it does not NEED fixing but I also somewhat share your sentiment in that I wouldn't be upset by a modern interface for it.

There are a few points that I would like to bring up though


Considering the site keeps information on vns that feature: non consensual acts, guro / vore, necrophilia, loli/shota and beastiality I don't think major visibility should be anywhere on their priority list.


This is a bit of a double edged sword. Sure more proper translators can appear but also many more improper ones.
Using AI/MTL as an aid in the translation process done by a human is not necessarily an issue but this also opens the door for MTLs without any proper review which leads to poor quality translations and also discourage proper translators to pick up a title that already has a crap translation.


I really don't see how since rare titles are not magically going to appear on the front page of a new interface.


And taking F95Zone as an example it also means more user conflicts, more moderation work, bad actors pushing limits and childlike behaviour.

Also take into account that right now VNDB hides explicit thumbnails and screenshots and you have to agree to view them. They are most likely doing this to comply with some regulations meaning a UI with huge thumbnails for the vns might introduce some complications.

Considering the site keeps information on vns that feature: non consensual acts, guro / vore, necrophilia, loli/shota and beastiality I don't think major visibility should be anywhere on their priority list.
I'm pretty sure the site isn't distributing this content and even if you wanna say they're bad, then please go look into porn sites and find everything you just mentioned in one form or another.


This is a bit of a double edged sword. Sure more proper translators can appear but also many more improper ones.
Using AI/MTL as an aid in the translation process done by a human is not necessarily an issue but this also opens the door for MTLs without any proper review which leads to poor quality translations and also discourage proper translators to pick up a title that already has a crap translation.
this already happens and VNDB treats at all as MTL making it sound like garbage, now have I seen garbage MTLs yes, have I seen good ones again yes. The day when an LLM made with a dataset about Japanese-to-English porn translation is coming, and what then?

Bad translations are a symptom of the demand for access. By stigmatizing MTLs across the board, the community risks alienating users who have no other way to engage with certain titles. Encouraging proper translations doesn’t mean ignoring MTL—it means managing it responsibly.

Using AI/MTL as an aid in the translation process done by a human is not necessarily an issue
VNDB disagrees with you here.

I really don't see how since rare titles are not magically going to appear on the front page of a new interface.
they already have a random VN feature on the site, I have no idea if it's truly random or if there's some sort of curation behind it, but right now it's just a damn text link in the left corner where new people could easily miss it, how about if it was a whole section or a page on the site? Wouldn't that encourage finding older titles that are good?

And taking F95Zone as an example it also means more user conflicts, more moderation work, bad actors pushing limits and childlike behaviour.

The Counterpoint:
  • Community Management Tools:A modern platform could implement features to reduce moderation burden:
    • Report systems for inappropriate behavior or content.
    • Community guidelines to establish norms early.
    • Tiered permissions for trusted users to assist with moderation.
  • Focus on Quality: Larger communities don’t inherently mean more chaos. Platforms like AniList and MyAnimeList have vibrant communities with relative stability, even with user-generated reviews and discussions.
  • Content Safety: VNDB already hides explicit thumbnails/screenshots. A modernized platform could retain or improve this system to meet regulatory standards.
The Bigger Picture:
Every community faces challenges as it grows. The key is proactive moderation and creating tools to manage conflicts effectively, rather than avoiding growth altogether.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Overall


You raise fair points, but most of your concerns reflect a fear of change or misunderstandings about what modernization would actually entail. Here’s the reality:

  1. Visibility Doesn’t Hurt the Medium: A modern platform would shine a light on all visual novels, not just controversial ones. With proper tools, the community could spotlight the best of the genre while managing sensitive content responsibly.
  2. MTL Is Here to Stay: Instead of rejecting it outright, the community should focus on improving transparency around MTL quality and supporting proper translations.
  3. Modernization Helps Everyone: Improved discovery tools, better filtering, and community-driven features wouldn’t just benefit casual users—they’d enhance the experience for hardcore fans, too.
Change is always uncomfortable, especially in niche communities. But the alternative—stagnation—poses a much greater risk to the long-term health of the VN genre. A modern platform isn’t a threat; it’s an opportunity.
 

RedEye781

Member
Dec 15, 2019
103
144
well, here's an excerpt about making the site more mobile-friendly:

and here's the latest 3rd party vndb app for android:
The guy literally says "I have very little patience for front-end web dev." You're just proving my point and highlighting the issue
 

whowhawhy

Active Member
Jan 19, 2023
668
687
The guy literally says "I have very little patience for front-end web dev." You're just proving my point and highlighting the issue
he's literally continously doing what he's good at (as the site's being improved in other ways than the specific one you want), he's not tricking you into buying a product with grand promises/false advertizing or intending to make the website his regular job, the users are provided with ways to customize their experience, those who want and can code more have tools for that too and are welcome to contribute to the site's code directly:
and better mobile support or lack of more sns features apparently is not a critical flaw that needs to be prioritized, lest the userbase deserts and the site implodes.

I'm pretty sure the site isn't distributing this content and even if you wanna say they're bad, then please go look into porn sites and find everything you just mentioned in one form or another.
at the least you can find extreme lolicon threre, both images and links to official distribution, including pirate sites western devs post on (or in cases of abandonware, even a download link to google drive or somesuch). providing examples would be against f95 rules, though.
he's saying normies would get grossed out enough to grab pitchforks or vandalize the database. (i'm indifferent on that topic)
they already have a random VN feature on the site, I have no idea if it's truly random or if there's some sort of curation behind it, but right now it's just a damn text link in the left corner where new people could easily miss it, how about if it was a whole section or a page on the site? Wouldn't that encourage finding older titles that are good?
you're not using front page screnshots for discovery?
besides, the site is intended for, and the users encouraged to, use the robust search system to find stuff they want or they're not sure if they want. if they feel adventurous (some literally do go there to find obscure or indie titles to play), adding a few search filters that would show obscure stuff and clicking on a random title is not something that needs handholding (and once you've played the obscure thing, if your ocd guides you to it, you can fill in missing info in the game's entry to make it easier to find for others).
 
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anne O'nymous

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The guy literally says
"The Guy" like you say is VNDB creator and admin.


"I have very little patience for front-end web dev." [...]
I agree with what is implied behind this.
If CSS for mobile (since it's to what he replied) all lead to really similar visual, it's because people know that "this" works, looks good, and is practical enough. And really few have the patience to pass weeks experimenting to find new approach that would be valid, and consistent, for all browsers as well as for the different screen resolutions, while working on both screen orientation.
The fact that CSS conditionals make it easier than it was in the past, doesn't mean that it became a piece of cake.
And the same apply to the design of front-end apps, minus the "all browsers" part.

In top of that, for a site like VNDB the quantity of information that have to be provided do not help.
 
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Steuan

Super Straight
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May 3, 2024
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I think it's fine. No need to change anything. But there's one thing. Unfortunately the informations for the games is not up to date. More people need to contribute. :HideThePain:
 

Death Panda

Member
May 8, 2023
252
491
Welcoming new fans through a modern platform doesn’t take away from long-time users. If anything, it:
  • Brings in more funding and visibility for the medium.
  • Encourages more translations and localization efforts.
  • Makes it easier to find rare or underappreciated titles.
  • Larger communities mean more reviews, recommendations, and discussions.
All of that will mean less than nothing when people like you who are just in it for the money come in and change everything to appeal to the lowest common denominator.

Literally no one is gatekeeping.
I AM gatekeeping. Gatekeeping is not a dirty word, if you love something then you must keep it far away from people who just want to exploit it. It's called the tragedy of the commons.
 
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RedEye781

Member
Dec 15, 2019
103
144
"The Guy" like you say is VNDB creator and admin.




I agree with what is implied behind this.
If CSS for mobile (since it's to what he replied) all lead to really similar visual, it's because people know that "this" works, looks good, and is practical enough. And really few have the patience to pass weeks experimenting to find new approach that would be valid, and consistent, for all browsers as well as for the different screen resolutions, while working on both screen orientation.
The fact that CSS conditionals make it easier than it was in the past, doesn't mean that it became a piece of cake.
And the same apply to the design of front-end apps, minus the "all browsers" part.

In top of that, for a site like VNDB the quantity of information that have to be provided do not help.
You know just to give an example I'm old enough to remember the old, old look of forums, you know the days where it was nothing but static text, now if I just mouse over your name I can see a small bit of your profile here on F95zone is that a useless feature?

how about your name, it's red and sparkles, which used to be nothing more than a color change. Now yes it's purely cosmetic but I bet deep down you like it, or at least feel that it's nice that you have a sparkling name vs a regular one.

Are these needed? No, you don't need them, but they're nice to have.

I don't want to throw VNDB in the garbage bin, I just would like another modern version to exist. You can keep using VNDB until your dying day for all I care, just don't tell me that competition isn't needed.
 

anne O'nymous

I'm not grumpy, I'm just coded that way.
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You know just to give an example I'm old enough to remember the old, old look of forums, you know the days where it was nothing but static text,
Wow o_O you're so...
Hmm, excuse-me, but I don't know what to say after those words, because I totally fail to understand why you felt the need to say the, totally irrelevant, "old enough" part.

I mean, I'm older than microprocessors, and I come from a part of the world that had a whole public networks that don't needed to own more than a dedicated terminal. A time where forums were displayed on a 40x25 lines screens, designed with 8 colors. A time where there were nothing more than the 128 ASCII characters to handle everything you'll see on the screen, even if for the few home computers that existed, and obviously also no mouses.
It also mean that I'm older that HTTP protocol, old enough to have known the time where "forums", when applied to internet, were a colorless plain text thing that needed a dedicated software to be accessed.

And you know what? This change absolutely nothing to what I said, nor does it mean that I'm nostalgic from those times and want forums to still looks, and acts, like one or the other forms I knew. This simply because being "this old" also mean that I'm not stupid to the point to not acknowledge that different technologies imply different possibilities and behaviors. Like it also mean that I know the difference between "useless" and "none mandatory"...


now if I just mouse over your name I can see a small bit of your profile here on F95zone is that a useless feature?
Useless, no, because it ease one's use of the forum, at least the really few times where (s)he need to access the information revealed when doing this.
Yet, this doesn't change the fact that it's, totally, absolutely, without a single doubt, and at 100%, a none mandatory feature.


how about your name, it's red and sparkles, which used to be nothing more than a color change. Now yes it's purely cosmetic but I bet deep down you like it, or at least feel that it's nice that you have a sparkling name vs a regular one.
Please, don't assume what I like and want. You're as bad at this, than you are at assuming what VNDB users all like and want.

I'm not responsible for the red sparkling way my username is represented. It came one day, and I have no fucking clue when, nor why; I just assume that it happened when I had one of my badges, but don't even noticed it before, months fater I got the last one, someone asked for a way to not see those kind of effects on usernames, and pointed that mine was among those effects that he dislike.

I'll not say that I dislike it, but this don't imply that I like it. It just mean that I'm totally indifferent to this purely meaningless and useless feature that artificially draw the attention on something relatively irrelevant, one's username. The badges being already enough to highlight the possible "qualities" (quoted because relative) of one member, and at least they don't do it artificially.


I don't want to throw VNDB in the garbage bin, I just would like another modern version to exist.
Because, as old as you want to present yourself, you care more about the form than about the substance; this whatever because you're still really young, or just easily fascinated.

And, you see, the reason why people like VNDB the way it is, is because they are at the opposite of you. They care about the substance more than about the form. And it happen that VNDB's sober design is perfectly adapted to this, deprived of artificial effects that would distract your attention from the information that matters to you on the page you've in front of your eyes.


You can keep using VNDB until your dying day for all I care, just don't tell me that competition isn't needed.
As I said, competition exist, and it's the other thing that you missed so far in what people told you; the first one being why people like VNDB the way it is.

Yes, the other VN database I listed aren't as complete as VNDB. But it's not by mean, it's by necessity. Would one of them have at least 10% of VNDB traffic, they would grow to keep that traffic growing and increase their relevance on the VN community.
But they don't have 10% of VNDB traffic, they are anecdotal not by choice, but by fact. And it would be the exact same with the competitor you wish for. It would be almost totally deprived of traffic for months, then needs years before starting to be actually known. Then, and only then, if you are right and people actually want a more modern VNDB, and only if your are right, it would starts to become a competitor for VNDB.


But the truth here is that you don't care what people tell you. You opened your thread asking a question, but your intent was just to have your opinion confirmed. And this make you discard all divergent opinion without even taking the time to think about it.
Look at your posts in that thread. Nothing that have been said to you is valid, all of your posts can be summarized with just one word, "no!".
In your eyes, whoever do not agree with you is either someone who don't know what he talk about, or someone younger than you, and therefore not smart enough, not as well aware of the reality than you are... Someone who need to know how old you are, because it's important, that age and experience of yours is the only authority argument you have in your sleeve, what you expect as having a "shut the fuck up and let adults do the talk" effect. Too bad for you, you used it with a grumpy asshole grandpa like me...
 

RedEye781

Member
Dec 15, 2019
103
144
Wow o_O you're so...
Hmm, excuse-me, but I don't know what to say after those words, because I totally fail to understand why you felt the need to say the, totally irrelevant, "old enough" part.

I mean, I'm older than microprocessors, and I come from a part of the world that had a whole public networks that don't needed to own more than a dedicated terminal. A time where forums were displayed on a 40x25 lines screens, designed with 8 colors. A time where there were nothing more than the 128 ASCII characters to handle everything you'll see on the screen, even if for the few home computers that existed, and obviously also no mouses.
It also mean that I'm older that HTTP protocol, old enough to have known the time where "forums", when applied to internet, were a colorless plain text thing that needed a dedicated software to be accessed.

And you know what? This change absolutely nothing to what I said, nor does it mean that I'm nostalgic from those times and want forums to still looks, and acts, like one or the other forms I knew. This simply because being "this old" also mean that I'm not stupid to the point to not acknowledge that different technologies imply different possibilities and behaviors. Like it also mean that I know the difference between "useless" and "none mandatory"...




Useless, no, because it ease one's use of the forum, at least the really few times where (s)he need to access the information revealed when doing this.
Yet, this doesn't change the fact that it's, totally, absolutely, without a single doubt, and at 100%, a none mandatory feature.




Please, don't assume what I like and want. You're as bad at this, than you are at assuming what VNDB users all like and want.

I'm not responsible for the red sparkling way my username is represented. It came one day, and I have no fucking clue when, nor why; I just assume that it happened when I had one of my badges, but don't even noticed it before, months fater I got the last one, someone asked for a way to not see those kind of effects on usernames, and pointed that mine was among those effects that he dislike.

I'll not say that I dislike it, but this don't imply that I like it. It just mean that I'm totally indifferent to this purely meaningless and useless feature that artificially draw the attention on something relatively irrelevant, one's username. The badges being already enough to highlight the possible "qualities" (quoted because relative) of one member, and at least they don't do it artificially.




Because, as old as you want to present yourself, you care more about the form than about the substance; this whatever because you're still really young, or just easily fascinated.

And, you see, the reason why people like VNDB the way it is, is because they are at the opposite of you. They care about the substance more than about the form. And it happen that VNDB's sober design is perfectly adapted to this, deprived of artificial effects that would distract your attention from the information that matters to you on the page you've in front of your eyes.




As I said, competition exist, and it's the other thing that you missed so far in what people told you; the first one being why people like VNDB the way it is.

Yes, the other VN database I listed aren't as complete as VNDB. But it's not by mean, it's by necessity. Would one of them have at least 10% of VNDB traffic, they would grow to keep that traffic growing and increase their relevance on the VN community.
But they don't have 10% of VNDB traffic, they are anecdotal not by choice, but by fact. And it would be the exact same with the competitor you wish for. It would be almost totally deprived of traffic for months, then needs years before starting to be actually known. Then, and only then, if you are right and people actually want a more modern VNDB, and only if your are right, it would starts to become a competitor for VNDB.


But the truth here is that you don't care what people tell you. You opened your thread asking a question, but your intent was just to have your opinion confirmed. And this make you discard all divergent opinion without even taking the time to think about it.
Look at your posts in that thread. Nothing that have been said to you is valid, all of your posts can be summarized with just one word, "no!".
In your eyes, whoever do not agree with you is either someone who don't know what he talk about, or someone younger than you, and therefore not smart enough, not as well aware of the reality than you are... Someone who need to know how old you are, because it's important, that age and experience of yours is the only authority argument you have in your sleeve, what you expect as having a "shut the fuck up and let adults do the talk" effect. Too bad for you, you used it with a grumpy asshole grandpa like me...
Holy hell lmao, I throw one word about my age to say I lived with old forums for years as an example and you turn it into some sort of proof that I'm mentally a toddler and therefore don't understand.

Well since you're a mod lock the post for all I care I was just trying to see people's opinions about VNDB, clearly there's no constructive discussion to be had here. Even though my argument about growth and modernization are valid and are implemented throughout the whole damn World Wide Web.
 

Catapo

Member
Jun 14, 2018
263
468
Holy hell lmao, I throw one word about my age to say I lived with old forums for years as an example and you turn it into some sort of proof that I'm mentally a toddler and therefore don't understand.

Well since you're a mod lock the post for all I care I was just trying to see people's opinions about VNDB, clearly there's no constructive discussion to be had here. Even though my argument about growth and modernization are valid and are implemented throughout the whole damn World Wide Web.
I don't normally engage in pointless discussions but what the hell it's a new year after all:

1. According to his badges anne is a modder not a mod. For one who knows so much about the internet one would think you understand the difference.

2. Based on all your answers you never wanted an open discussion, you just wanted your opinion validated and the disturbing part is you yourself might not even be aware of it.
All of your answers to the others are written as if your opinion is the universal truth and any other opinion is invalid because of reasons that you come up with.
I mean just the first reply I gave and your response can be boiled to:
- VNDB needs to change
- I don't think it needs to change, it would be kind of nice but there might also be some complications.
- You don't see that change is better for the whole world and you are just afraid of that change.
There is no constructive discussion here. The same can be done to the other replies as well.
Also it is very funny you got upset when anne did the same to you.

3. The original answer I was going to give on my first reply before deciding to humour you with an actual honest and serious opinion is:

Ok, let's pretend that every single other response here agrees with you and VNDB needs a UI change or a competitor (for whatever reason) and you are absolutely right.
Congratulations, your opinion is validated ... Now what ?
What other purpose this thread was meant to serve besides making you feel good about yourself ?
 

RedEye781

Member
Dec 15, 2019
103
144
I don't normally engage in pointless discussions but what the hell it's a new year after all:

1. According to his badges anne is a modder not a mod. For one who knows so much about the internet one would think you understand the difference.

2. Based on all your answers you never wanted an open discussion, you just wanted your opinion validated and the disturbing part is you yourself might not even be aware of it.
All of your answers to the others are written as if your opinion is the universal truth and any other opinion is invalid because of reasons that you come up with.
I mean just the first reply I gave and your response can be boiled to:
- VNDB needs to change
- I don't think it needs to change, it would be kind of nice but there might also be some complications.
- You don't see that change is better for the whole world and you are just afraid of that change.
There is no constructive discussion here. The same can be done to the other replies as well.
Also it is very funny you got upset when anne did the same to you.

3. The original answer I was going to give on my first reply before deciding to humour you with an actual honest and serious opinion is:

Ok, let's pretend that every single other response here agrees with you and VNDB needs a UI change or a competitor (for whatever reason) and you are absolutely right.
Congratulations, your opinion is validated ... Now what ?
What other purpose this thread was meant to serve besides making you feel good about yourself ?
Okay, so you sir are attacking me personally for making the simple mistake of not looking too hard at his name and conflating the word modder with moderator, k cool.

Next, you claim I'm just looking to validate my opinion when the only thing that made me open this topic was my bafflement that VNDB still looks like this in 2025. So sorry I ever bothered the good folks at F95Zone by starting a discussion about a general topic in the general discussion section of the forum.

I urge everyone to stop replying and to let this topic die since apparently my opinion is not welcomed.
 

Jaike

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2020
1,690
6,813
I mean, personally I wouldn't want to scroll through a data base on a phone and I don't know why anybody would unless they only have a phone, but I'm no masochist. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ But if you think you can make a good phone alternative for it with a theme you like better, or build a team for it, go for it.

Okay, so you sir are attacking me personally for making the simple mistake of not looking too hard at his name and conflating the word modder with moderator, k cool.
I don't think that counts as attacking personally. If you want a personal attack, you can request a personalised example from me.