Advice for a young at heart (what suggestions would you give to a rookie dev?)

[SummmerP]

So, friends and family... (and to those of you who do not know me, nice to meet you)

I'm creating this thread 'cause I've only recently engaged into learning Daz Studio and Ren'py in order to make my own game - it ain't going to be anything fancy in terms of art or game mechanics, nothing exquisite, so the lessons and guides that I've been able to find, so far, are doing the job

But then, I see new games flooding the place, and tbh, that had me a little bit scared... everyday it's a new 3D graphic novel, version 0.1 or demo or intro or whatever, and it's been like that for a while
I'm aware though, that most of these games ain't gonna go any further, or much further... but why?
Mostly, I suppose, 'cause the dev is only fishing for some quick Patreon support
But without actually taking its time to build a good game, and a good release entry, it won't happen
I see games with great renders, and some fine models, but then... a 5 minutes gameplay, terrible ENG translations, awful premises, more bugs than bunnies, crappy dialogues, NPC characterization w/ little depth (or no characterization at all), characters or story arcs that make absolutely no sense
And I too find these things quite disappointing

But, back to the point... I don't wanna be one of those
I want my game to be good... actually good

I'm making a sandbox harem with some simple farm/dating simulation RPG elements
Kinda like a mix between Harvest Moon & Summertime Saga, but with 3D models
(that's... actually pretty much it)

And I was wondering, what exactly do you hope to see on a new game?
What qualities must a new game have for you to consider supporting it right away, or at least get interested enough to keep a close watch on how the dev is going to be handling it?

Anything that pops on your mind
The way his Patreon site is being handled?
How communicative the dev is?
The amount of renders the game has? The amount of sexual content it had on its early build?
A fancy GUI?
Some sort of gameplay beyond skidding dialogues until you see some boobs? (choices that do matter, options, places to go and people to meet, mini-games, etc)
Unique models? (does that even matter to you or girls have been looking all the same for so long that you just don't care anymore?)
A unique art style?

Anything... really

If you haven't skipped this yet, I would really appreciate if you could share your thoughts... no need to elaborate a full essay
Just an idea, a small suggestion, a quick opinion
Do this... or don't do that...

 

[Kinderalpha]

what exactly do you hope to see on a new game?

Not sure, and can't really suggest anything. Almost every fetish and genre has an audience so you're gonna get a lot of mixed opinions on this.

What qualities must a new game have for you to consider supporting it right away, or at least get interested enough to keep a close watch on how the dev is going to be handling it?

A feitsh or theme I personally like. A developer that shows consistency, confidence, and understanding of what they're working on.

How communicative the dev is?

For me to support them, I think this is important. Not communicative by spamming their feed with small updates and bugfixes. I want communication around the development process, who the developer is, and that connection. Otherwise, how do I know you won't just drop the game tomorrow?

The amount of renders the game has? The amount of sexual content it had on its early build?

if you personally don't think there is enough content, then don't release it until it has enough. Two images for ten minutes of gameplay? No thanks. Ten images for ten minutes of gameplay? Sure.

Some sort of gameplay beyond skidding dialogues until you see some boobs? (choices that do matter, options, places to go and people to meet, mini-games, etc)

Starting to get this feeling of, "I wanna make something that everybody loves" or "I'm not sure what my game is so I'm going to mash things together and hope it works.". These are all entirely up to the game, how it plays, how it functions. It's very opinionated. Some people like skidding through, others like minigames. I like both, just depends.

Unique models? (does that even matter to you or girls have been looking all the same for so long that you just don't care anymore?)

Don't just use the exact model. Apply some kind of morphs, variation, and your own style to it. No I don't want to play your game that has the same characters from Dating My Daughter. It would make me lose all immersion or relation to the characters in your game because I'll already have a preconceived idea of each characters personality based on their appearance in other games.

A unique art style?

That's a creative liberty at your own discretion. Can you? yes? Then absolutely. Not many people can answer yes to this question. It's not always an option, or easy one at that, so whatever creative or unique look you can give to your game. I'd suggest doing so. As long as it's within the bounds of your goals.

Ultimately, just make something and move forward. A lot of these questions are extremely subjective so you're going to get varying opinions. I don't see how that could be constructive, but maybe some people will elaborate on the why's and you might be able to extrapolate ideas from them. Anyways, good luck friend!

 

[Stompai]

My advice, for what it can be worth, would be to leave the graphics aside for last.
Of course it's good to get experiences with daz3d, learn how to create/edit models, play around with morph, texture, shaders, etc.
But starting with the graphical part can actually lock you in 1 direction for the rest of the development.
Creating characters can take days, creating props too, let's not mention putting them together in a scene and rendering several CGs of said scene.

So I'd advice to start with the engine and coding part first.
Create the template of your game, ui, gameplay, etc first with placeholders. Making sure everything works and that it fit what you want for your game.
Then you can start the art part to make it fit your game.
I think it's better that way instead of fitting your game to your art, only to find that it doesn't work and you'll have to remove features you planned, for example.

Wish you a good luck

 

[Domiek]

At this point, the novelty of adult games have more or less worn off. There are hundreds of devs who know the basics of Daz and how to make a clean render. The next step in quality to achieve visuals like Phillygames or story/writing like BADIK takes a lot more effort and time to reach than simply posing some Daz assets. It's still possible to make a financially successful first game like WVM but it's an unrealistic goal.

For anyone interested in making a game, my only advice is to not get attached to your first project. Try not to care for your Patreon numbers or number of comments in your thread. Use the first project as a way to dip your toes in the water to see if making games is something you're actually interested in for the long term. If so, you will go down a rabbit hole of nonstop learning. Figuring out what Daz has to offer and what other software compliments Daz as a workaround to it's soft limitations. If financial success (as well as positive feedback) is the primary goal, it's really easy to lose motivation once you realize 6 months in that you could have made 30x more income by flipping burgers part-time.

Good luck with whatever you decide!

 

[Paz]

And I was wondering, what exactly do you hope to see on a new game?
What qualities must a new game have for you to consider supporting it right away, or at least get interested enough to keep a close watch on how the dev is going to be handling it?

Anything that pops on your mind
The way his Patreon site is being handled?
How communicative the dev is?
The amount of renders the game has? The amount of sexual content it had on its early build?
A fancy GUI?
Some sort of gameplay beyond skidding dialogues until you see some boobs? (choices that do matter, options, places to go and people to meet, mini-games, etc)
Unique models? (does that even matter to you or girls have been looking all the same for so long that you just don't care anymore?)
A unique art style?

Anything... really

If you haven't skipped this yet, I would really appreciate if you could share your thoughts... no need to elaborate a full essay
Just an idea, a small suggestion, a quick opinion
Do this... or don't do that...

Frankly, there's not a universal truth to any of these questions, there is no magical recipe (else everyone would have the cheat sheet at hand and go for it). A stroll through a random thread will readily show you contradictory preference posts in quick succession.
True, some themes and game forms have more success than others, but even different games sharing many of the characteristics you listed end up having quite varied success, purely by stroke of luck or coincidence.

You reading 200 different opinions here for one's idea of a "good game" might really easily lead you in opposite directions from one another, and some answers might not even be that enlightening.

• Patreon? At this point I firmly believe that initially creators copied tiers from one another and it ended up being some form of "norm" that the majority goes with. Why is the 10$ tier the most usual "get the game now" tier. Does every creator happen to value his time invested the same? Nah, it just is.
• GUI? Sure, some form of GUI love conveys a sense of extra polish to the game.
• Gameplay? Too little and it will feel a kinetic novel for some, too much and it will frustrate others.
• Unique models, that's hard unless you sculpt your own or be the first to incorporate a newly-released one.
• Amount of renders? I bet you won't find anyone saying "Gee, I wish this game version had less renders".

My crudely conveyed point is, trying to please a lot of people will probably end up really pleasing very few. Thankfully, the potential pool of supporters is nowadays large enough that it's slightly easier to get at least some form of initial traction (depending on whether you deal with stuff that will lessen that pool or not).

So my suggestion is, have a clear vision and go for it. It's better to have something you like working on, so if the initial support is not there to fully justify your effort you won't lose motivation. Try to do what feels best for you at first, because all of your game's aspects will be subject to improvement.

 

[I'm Not Thea Lundgren!]

First off; good luck with your project

I always look for a good story first.
Then good writing, preferably with realism and humour.
Good artwork is always a bonus.

 

[gunderson]

First: STOP.
Second: don't publish anything, don't make a Patreon, just fucking practice. For at least five months. Make test games, bug test, talk with people on development boards, fail, get better, etc.
Third: Finish a small test game. (Y'know, if you're still working on it. If you got tired of it in the middle and just quit that's fine too, because you didn't take peoples' money and nobody's depending on your release schedule). Now (assuming you actually made a game), release it. For free! See what people think.
Fourth: Congratulations! You now know how to make a game! Now you can start a Patreon, get a team together, and make a game with a reasonable set of expectations about what it takes to make a successful adult game and with an audience who knows at least something about what you can do.

 

[SummmerP]

I'm just fishing for tips, nothing specific... no magic trick, no miraculous hint
I'm 100% on board w/ most of the things you pointed out (if not w/ everything), but it all came from my personal gaming experience and I suppose it's always good to put your own thoughts to the test

Here's the thing... I already know what I want to do
I had this BIG idea for a BIG game, I even wrote down dialogues and character arcs and events and all... but... as I know shit about coding, I decided to go for something easier first, so that I could learn both Daz and Ren'py as I navigate through this challenging "wanna be a part job", and not fail miserably

So... I thought about it
And decided to start small
But I don't wanna make any game... and the more I got into it, the more I realized that if I take my time, I might actually end up with something pretty cool
It's porn, right? But porn can be cool, right? (...) You know?

So... I'm taking my time
I started with Daz a month ago, and I haven't yet touched Ren'py (though I'm seeing tutorials in a spree, as if they were Honest Trailer videos or any other casual thing)
(without practice it doesn't help much, I know... but at least I'm getting just a little bit familiar w/ what I can and cannot do, w/ its interface, etc)
(I'll get to it soon enough)

As I find awful to work without a deadline, I gave myself 6 months - in 6 months, shit should get real
By then, I hope to have built enough experience to actually start doing some lifting
Until then, try outs (lots of try outs, just for the sake of learning) and ground work (I'm writing down dialogues, characters, structuring the basics of in-game mechanics, trying to connect all dots, cover as much as possible before actually meeting the challenge, collecting assets, stuff like that)

I wanna make a good first game, though I had zero experience with Daz Studio or Ren'py
That's... doable, right?

And I know I mentioned Patreon a couple times, but that's 'cause it'll take time and effort and commitment (and tbh, making some money is part of the reason why I chose to do this, naturally... I got bills to pay and three cats to feed)
But I'm not looking for a hit, nor I'm hoping to make a game that's going to please everyone (of course)
I only want it to be a good game, a very good game
Guess I wanted to hear things like "then don't rush it" or "lower your expectations" or a straight foward "good luck to you"

The way I see it, being porn or not, you need to tell a good story... a good lewd story
I've seen people defending that cause, and now you (and to me, that's great)
Of course that a good story, and relatable characters, when it comes to adult games is not the same as in literature... duh
(it even changes quite a bit from genre to genre)
But hearing, again, that that's something important, makes me happy... 'cause I believe that's the one thing I can really nail... and I wanna believe that those things - characters, story, pace, the world you're creating - are the things that really separate good and ordinary games

But, that's it...
There's a lot that you guys said that I can add to my "keep that in mind" list, and there's plently that'll I'll just hit a check

That's what I wanted from this thread... having you spitting opinions, straight to my face, and feeling like I'm on track
(that sounded a bit harsh)

Thank you

Keep 'em coming

Now thinking about it, I might use this thread to ask for opinions on more specific matters as they appear