Daz Best render settings for game?

[coffeeaddicted]

"Iray cam" is a camera mounted with 5 section planes (top, bottom, left, right, rear) that hide everything that is not on camera sight. You don't have to shot with it, neither you have to use all planes all togethers. You will need some practice and how to light respectively tho, some situation will be tricky. But it's imho by a large marging the best tool for chain rendering efficiently (without destructive behavior) once you got the ropes.

To go further with optimization, surfaces are more tricky as it really depends how it's done. UberIray is quite a fat shader and most artists don't really care about optimization/redundancy. "Shiny stacking" (Gloss+Dual Lobe+Metallic Flakes+Top Coat...), translucency/SSS use (that tree with thousand leafs may not need it), and most of the time weighted base mix should be redflags (optimiztion wise/noise trap). It's especially critical when those surfaces are large (walls/floor/ceiling).

Sometimes it's worth reviewing an asset, say a living room you gonna use plenty of time, that don't perform very well, for less fatty shader use in some areas when possible. Iray presets and vMaterials (

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, then

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) can come handy and generally way more cheap to render.

For lights rules of thumb should be, more a light geometry (sphere, plane, disc) is small and the more intensivly it emit light, the more noise you generate. A ping pong ball emitting thousand suns is a bad idea, it need to be scaled accordingly.

For render setting nothing comes really to mind except keeping crush blacks and burn highlights to 0 (or nearly 0, like 0.01) if you render with 8bit color depth (default setting/not rendering 32bit exr beauty canvas), it will help to keep details in with underlighted and overlighted areas (and postwork later).

Well...

Here is what i tried to accomplish.
I had a scene setup with an HDRI. For background because it looks soo nice.
Now using that section plane camera, that scene looked shit because the lights were too bright.
So i was building planes around until i realized that this is actually useless. Just by logic. haha...

Ok, so now i have to rethink the scene to get rid of the HDRI and instead make a plane that emits some picture.
But, what is that? The spotlights i had emitted too much light. Worst, they made the render slow. My problem is this. I want the scene to have the right lightning. Lights should not flush the room out but enhance the scene.
Ceiling will be gone, so there has to be some other form of light. Best i can think off is a plane.

I think changing to scene only in the environment setting seems to yield the best results. No other light source except what you setup. If you don't, everything is flushed like you are standing next to an atomic blast.

So this will be a learning process to get the optimal scene.
So that is what i will do today. Sitting there and playing around and to get the best possible outcome.

Your tip about the light geometry made me thinking. I use spheres quite a lot as a sun. This seems to be true as it renders quite slow. So i have to work on the light sources and get the right mix.

But i like challenges.

Thanks for the links. I wasn't even aware of these "free" utilities.
But it's like with poses. I use just some standard assets and adjust them to my needs. So this will come in very handy.

p.s. Not sure how to measure time when rendering.
This render took about 20 minutes in 2K.
The cam sliced everything nicely away and i changed the environment to just a plane with a small sphere to give some sun light.
Not too much light and the scene is set to dark.
Personally, i am good with it. I think it has a good contrast and some shadow effects. Kind of what i was aiming for.

 

[Deleted member 1121028]

Well...
Here is what i tried to accomplish.
I had a scene setup with an HDRI. For background because it looks soo nice.
Now using that section plane camera, that scene looked shit because the lights were too bright.
So i was building planes around until i realized that this is actually useless. Just by logic. haha...

Oh ok, your main error is right there.
You never ever use an HDRI for it's background image but for its lightning quality.
It's such an old trap I completely forgot I fell for it too.

Forget about your background window for a sec. It doesn't matter, you will deal with it later.
Focus should be 100% on the figure and rest of the room.
Maybe more clear to (try to) explain step by step with a concrete exemple.
Gonna be a bit ridiculous but anyway lol.

Here my scene, lady in a bedroom with a window on the back. Starting from scratch with zero lights/no hdri:



Placing my Iray cam and choosing a HDRI, it's basically a single front source of light. It will be my main source of light but it doesn't have to, it's out of convenience (could be as well be second or third or no hdri at all). Rotate it to create a bit of shadows, contrast and depth.

:

As it's still a bit bland and a bit underlighted, gonna add few more lights, one in the back to simulate lightning coming from the window, and one more highlighting the head without removing its shadow.



Let's go rendering with 95% convergence (still doesn't care about that window background) :



2022-12-18 06:41:32.094 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: 95.07% of image converged
2022-12-18 06:41:32.134 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Convergence threshold reached.
2022-12-18 06:41:45.880 [INFO] :: Total Rendering Time: 16 minutes 49.73 seconds

It's still ~5min too much for that type of render but hey, it's a rapid exemple.



Now let's deal with our windows background. I will use image from a HDRI, but any spherical image should do the trick (you can also make your own with a spherical camera). That one should do it, hide everything & render it (should take few seconds):



Assemble both images (open as layer) in GIMP or whatever :



A rapid postwork in your favorite software :



And you're done :



Ok it's a crappy render but that should do it as proof of concept lol.

It's still too much rendering time for that kind of scene. You generally don't shot with your Iray cam, most of the time I mount it on a fake 35mm one and adjust section planes and/or Z translate it. It's the most basic scene ever, you can do way more funny thing once you got the ropes (and still kept those rendering time to the bare minimum).

 

[coffeeaddicted]

Oh ok, your main error is right there.
You never ever use an HDRI for it's background image but for its lightning quality.
It's such an old trap I completely forgot I fell for it too.

Forget about your background window for a sec. It doesn't matter, you will deal with it later.
Focus should be 100% on the figure and rest of the room.
Maybe more clear to (try to) explain step by step with a concrete exemple.
Gonna be a bit ridiculous but anyway lol.

Here my scene, lady in a bedroom with a window on the back. Starting from scratch with zero lights/no hdri:

View attachment 2244163

Placing my Iray cam and choosing a HDRI, it's basically a single front source of light. It will be my main source of light but it doesn't have to, it's out of convenience (could be as well be second or third or no hdri at all). Rotate it to create a bit of shadows, contrast and depth.

View attachment 2244177 :

As it's still a bit bland and a bit underlighted, gonna add few more lights, one in the back to simulate lightning coming from the window, and one more highlighting the head without removing its shadow.

View attachment 2244202

Let's go rendering with 95% convergence (still doesn't care about that window background) :

View attachment 2244209

2022-12-18 06:41:32.094 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: 95.07% of image converged
2022-12-18 06:41:32.134 Iray [INFO] - IRAY:RENDER :: 1.0 IRAY rend progr: Convergence threshold reached.
2022-12-18 06:41:45.880 [INFO] :: Total Rendering Time: 16 minutes 49.73 seconds

It's still ~5min too much for that type of render but hey, it's a rapid exemple.

View attachment 2244215

Now let's deal with our windows background. I will use image from a HDRI, but any spherical image should do the trick (you can also make your own with a spherical camera). That one should do it, hide everything & render it (should take few seconds):

View attachment 2244225 View attachment 2244240

Assemble both images (open as layer) in GIMP or whatever :

View attachment 2244246

A rapid postwork in your favorite software :

View attachment 2244252

And you're done :

View attachment 2244255

Ok it's a crappy render but that should do it as proof of concept lol.

It's still too much rendering time for that kind of scene. You generally don't shot with your Iray cam, most of the time I mount it on a fake 35mm one and adjust section planes and/or Z translate it. It's the most basic scene ever, you can do way more funny thing once you got the ropes (and still kept those rendering time to the bare minimum).

There is one thing i don't get.

When i am using an iray plane cam and i leave it to dome and scene, it will flush my scene with light.
So there seems to be a challenge for me to understand how to deal with it.

Otherwise this makes all sense and i think i do not need really an HDRI.
Most important seems to me to understand where light would be and to light the room accordingly.

I think to use a section plane to slice behind walls seems a good approach. I don't care too much about the time for rendering as i leave it running over night.

The Avil room set seems to come with an HDRI right when you load it. I did not even notice that until i checked. At least with the Avil guestroom which i am using.

I have to try to recreate that in my scene.

The other point for me is the post work. Something i hadn't done because i am lazy. So i will look into that as well.

Thanks for explaining.

I start from scratch. Lumens and stuff... So that will take me a while.
Lights are really complicated.

 

[Deleted member 1121028]

There is one thing i don't get.

When i am using an iray plane cam and i leave it to dome and scene, it will flush my scene with light.
So there seems to be a challenge for me to understand how to deal with it.

Otherwise this makes all sense and i think i do not need really an HDRI.
Most important seems to me to understand where light would be and to light the room accordingly.

I think to use a section plane to slice behind walls seems a good approach. I don't care too much about the time for rendering as i leave it running over night.

The Avil room set seems to come with an HDRI right when you load it. I did not even notice that until i checked. At least with the Avil guestroom which i am using.

I have to try to recreate that in my scene.

The other point for me is the post work. Something i hadn't done because i am lazy. So i will look into that as well.

Thanks for explaining.

You want HDRI light to flush you scene, it's a feature not a bug, but :
If you want to render interior with an Iray cam with a HDRI, you have to remember you simulate a confined space - and avoid any HDRI made to simulate outdoor. Putting the sun in you living room ain't gonna work well, most of the time they ain't made for that (it's ultimately possible but a waste of time ihmo) :



Instead you want to use those HDRI who simulate studio/indoor/confined space, more likely used either for portraiture or vignette shot. Then you need balance light intensity and rotation (like you would do for any source of lights), and again you don't have to use camera Iray's section planes all together (lot of time you prefer to keep that ceiling intact and/or need that left/right/rear wall). It's a bit of practice in the end, but worth it imho if the goal is rendering time.

For postwork, I tried various things, but in the end never found something that goes as fast as Lightroom. Batch import with automatic preset, folder management, really easy (and fast) to use & good plugins pool. Huge downside is it doesn't manage alpha/transparency (but doesn't destroy it) but I don't care that much. Just grab a pirated version and start clicking everywhere o/

 

[coffeeaddicted]

You want HDRI light to flush you scene, it's a feature not a bug, but :
If you want to render interior with an Iray cam with a HDRI, you have to remember you simulate a confined space - and avoid any HDRI made to simulate outdoor. Putting the sun in you living room ain't gonna work well, most of the time they ain't made for that (it's ultimately possible but a waste of time ihmo) :

View attachment 2248003

Instead you want to use those HDRI who simulate studio/indoor/confined space, more likely used either for portraiture or vignette shot. Then you need balance light intensity and rotation (like you would do for any source of lights), and again you don't have to use camera Iray's section planes all together (lot of time you prefer to keep that ceiling intact and/or need that left/right/rear wall). It's a bit of practice in the end, but worth it imho if the goal is rendering time.

For postwork, I tried various things, but in the end never found something that goes as fast as Lightroom. Batch import with automatic preset, folder management, really easy (and fast) to use & good plugins pool. Huge downside is it doesn't manage alpha/transparency (but doesn't destroy it) but I don't care that much. Just grab a pirated version and start clicking everywhere o/

Yes, that's it.

I separate the HDRI now so i don't mix them up.

Today i took a little time to use a different asset (old) and done everything with spot light, distant light, point light and some planes.
It's quite hard to simulate something where i would say, yeah that's how it looks in real.
There is a lot of testing that goes with it.

So i made this scene but it does still take about 20 minutes to render. Probably because i accessorized it. Lot's of shaders, other garbage.

So this is what my scene looks at the moment. It ain't done yet. I still have to try the indoor or portrait HDRI.
But oh well, that's how it looks.
I still need grease and other things.
This supposed to be a night scene. No background yet.
Render isn't even finished. I am inpatient but for the sake of showing. \O/




p.s. i consider this as solved.
The rest is mainly learning and trial and error now. And it teaches me to be more mindful with lightning in general. To me lightning is really essential and i like to get it right to the point where i can say, this looks actually good.
In the beginning i tended to overflash everything. So i had several tries but i think i am getting closer to something that looks actually like real.

Thanks, @no__name for your explanations. This really helped me and i am sure it's useful for everyone else.

 

[Deleted member 1121028]

p.s. i consider this as solved.
The rest is mainly learning and trial and error now. And it teaches me to be more mindful with lightning in general. To me lightning is really essential and i like to get it right to the point where i can say, this looks actually good.
In the beginning i tended to overflash everything. So i had several tries but i think i am getting closer to something that looks actually like real.

Thanks, @@no__name for your explanations. This really helped me and i am sure it's useful for everyone else.

You're welcome. It take some practice to get your own balance on doing things. I go hard on rendering time because I got quite limited time and I cut corners wherever I can. But it may not be the best approach for every renders - just a good working workfow.