Can you give me some character feedback

[warmax42]

Hey guys, I'm trying out some character design, and wanted to get some opinions on the characters.

I'm trying to imagine general character traits too, and hopefully these reflect in the image:
- The woman on the left is cheerful, has a positive outlook on life and isn't that street-smart
- The woman in the center has more life experience, is more prone to be angry and cynical.
- The woman on the right is a bit older and tends to get her way through sweet-talk more than force.

Some other notes: The characters aren't meant to be related, I'm thinking more of neighbours or flat-mates.

Edit: Feel free to critique the visual character design, character traits or just the image quality. I'm sorta new to most of these, so feedback is appreciated

 

[DarthSeduction]

The traits themselves are fine, but they're very surface and have no real depth. When creating my own characters I like to make a list of things they enjoy, things they don't, make some comments on their psyche.

For instance, my character Alexis:

Likes Animation
Plays Tabletop RPGs
Loves Fantasy
Loves Sci-Fi
Guilty Pleasure for Romantic Horror
Space Opera Fanatic
Prefers the Dark Side
Thinks Vampires are Sexy
Open to lots of music, loves musicals, keeps it modern while enjoying the classics
Self conscious about small breasts
Flaunts her ass
Hates chinese food
Has deep rooted fear of becoming a monster like her father​

In this way, as I'm writing her in the future I can use these traits. Most of these are positive, but that's because I don't need to list the opposite. If she likes these things she doesn't like others as much, and if she hates this then in relation she'll be pleased by something different.

 

[warmax42]

The traits themselves are fine, but they're very surface and have no real depth. When creating my own characters I like to make a list of things they enjoy, things they don't, make some comments on their psyche.

That's true, I've only written down the most basic descriptions of where the characters are heading. Thanks for sharing your character as well - it's good to have an example. It sounds like it also makes sense to think of a backstory along with coming up with character traits. I guess it makes sense to have this in mind and written down to try and write how a character would react to events in the ongoing story.

 

[DarthSeduction]

That's true, I've only written down the most basic descriptions of where the characters are heading. Thanks for sharing your character as well - it's good to have an example. It sounds like it also makes sense to think of a backstory along with coming up with character traits. I guess it makes sense to have this in mind and written down to try and write how a character would react to events in the ongoing story.

That's exactly what it's about. Judging by your descriptions I assume you're going for a more Dating Sim Style game than a VN, like I am writing, so it would be good to include more in regards to deciding what this character will respond positively to and negatively to.

for instance, taking alexis as an example again.

She'd react positively to someone mentioning her favorite space opera series
she'd react negatively to being taken out for chinese food
she'd probably, based on her character traits prefer nighttime dates
She'd probably react negatively to a jock
I didn't really need to include this in my list, because its related to the backstory, but she's very courageous and will likely enjoy daring activities, like skydiving, or repelling.

I probably won't get much use out of statements like that for my game, because its more of a story than a sim, but you should be thinking in terms like that.

 

[warmax42]

Anyone have any feedback on the look of the characters or the image quality? I'm curious if people like it, or if not why not.

 

[DarthSeduction]

Anyone have any feedback on the look of the characters or the image quality? I'm curious if people like it, or if not why not.

I don't want to discourage you, but the only one I find remotely attractive is the first girl. Are you using Honey Select? It kinda looks like it, but certain parts of it are way lower quality than I'm used to. I think all of their eyes need work, and I think there could be some sculpting done on the faces to make the center one more sharp and the last one more rounded. I could give more critiques if I knew what look you were going for but mostly I just think the last two look clunky

 

[warmax42]

I don't want to discourage you, but the only one I find remotely attractive is the first girl. Are you using Honey Select? It kinda looks like it, but certain parts of it are way lower quality than I'm used to. I think all of their eyes need work, and I think there could be some sculpting done on the faces to make the center one more sharp and the last one more rounded. I could give more critiques if I knew what look you were going for but mostly I just think the last two look clunky

Yes, honey select with a bunch of mods for better lighting. The last girl is definitely more sharp features on purpose. The middle one's softer face is not in purpose I think it has a lot to do with the face normal map I picked.

The other thing could be just the lighting. With different lighting maps it looks better at times but not much. This was meant to be a beach scene so a bit over exposure is slightly purposeful, but I also think that the lack of sharp features is a general problem with Honey Select in general.

To be honest, honey select seems to be the easiest package of freedom of face design plus clothes plus easy posing. Daz looks better but has very little in terms of make your own character with sliders...and everything seems very "buy our models" oriented.

I also have Klub 17 and while I got that looking pretty good too, I have to make character poses seperately from the combined/lighting/environment step and that makes it insanely harder for having 2 characters interact. Might give that a shot again though...

I'll do a few more lighting setups later today and post here, maybe I can get something better.

 

[DarthSeduction]

Yes, honey select with a bunch of mods for better lighting. The last girl is definitely more sharp features on purpose. The middle one's softer face is not in purpose I think it has a lot to do with the face normal map I picked.

The other thing could be just the lighting. With different lighting maps it looks better at times but not much. This was meant to be a beach scene so a bit over exposure is slightly purposeful, but I also think that the lack of sharp features is a general problem with Honey Select in general.

To be honest, honey select seems to be the easiest package of freedom of face design plus clothes plus easy posing. Daz looks better but has very little in terms of make your own character with sliders...and everything seems very "buy our models" oriented.

I also have Klub 17 and while I got that looking pretty good too, I have to make character poses seperately from the combined/lighting/environment step and that makes it insanely harder for having 2 characters interact. Might give that a shot again though...

I'll do a few more lighting setups later today and post here, maybe I can get something better.

The best advice I can give you then is to join the developers hub. They're mostly Daz artists, but there are some really skilled modellers on there. I'm the furthest from an expert, I just know art. Who knows, after talking to them you might even learn how maleable Daz really is.

This one guy is working on recreating the Ladies of Witcher with Daz, he's had to adjust a lot to get them there. He does run into problems where certain aspects aren't as customizable as he'd like but over the last couple of days with community input he's really cleaned up his Yennifer Model.

 

[warmax42]

The best advice I can give you then is to join the developers hub. They're mostly Daz artists,

I'm curious, as an honest question, do you think that, for your standards, we can't achieve acceptable quality of 3D rendered models from programs other than Daz? I'm not against using it but there are advantages to other programs as well, at least from ease of development/asset availability, which is why I'm trying the alternatives first.

Maybe I can post some better quality lighting later today (when I get home). I already have some ideas.

Either way, thanks for the feedback! Appreciate it

 

[DarthSeduction]

I'm curious, as an honest question, do you think that, for your standards, we can't achieve acceptable quality of 3D rendered models from programs other than Daz? I'm not against using it but there are advantages to other programs as well, at least from ease of development/asset availability, which is why I'm trying the alternatives first.

Maybe I can post some better quality lighting later today (when I get home). I already have some ideas.

Either way, thanks for the feedback! Appreciate it

The only honey select game I like the models in is A Perverted Family. Its not that I prefer Daz, its that most Honey Select games look weird to me. If I'm being honest, the models in A Perverted Family would rank among my top 5 at least. I also really like the clothing options I've seen in Honey Select. So no, I don't think Daz is naturally superior. I just think it takes a lot of skill to do something great with Honey Select.

 

[Egglock]

As far as character design goes, start broad and trickle down to the little things that relates to the game play. Below are some things I consider when designing my characters.

• Age
  • Younger and older mentality
    • How they'll react to player responses
    • How they dress
      • This can be time consuming, and possibly limited (if one is limited to the tools, or no skills in making their own) but can bring more life and personality to the character if done correctly. This can be tied to different events.
• Hobby
  • This is more tied to the game mechanics
    • Places the player may find them located at
    • Things player can buy to influence the character
• Activities
  • Gymnast, body builder, singer, comedian, ect.
• Emotional State
  • Angry, sad, happy, horny, confused, ect
  • How often it happens

This is just a brief overview, as it can get very detailed if broken down further.

With the information darthseduction mention along with this should give you a good starting point to further improve the personality and design of your characters.

I'm curious, as an honest question, do you think that, for your standards, we can't achieve acceptable quality of 3D rendered models from programs other than Daz?

Couple things to note here, I have very little to no knowledge of Daz / Honey Select. I've learn how to model/texture my own assets/used third-party tools to assist in making models.

As far as I know, If your looking for ease of use than yes Daz is probably the only one I know of that offers that. From the quick look at Daz it seems that right out of the box, you get a good amount of ready to render assets.

As far as achieving acceptable quality and ease of development, you're not going to find any other software that offers that, you will have to put some time into learning, if your thinking outside of Daz. One software, (not user friendly, or easy to use, does have assets, very few model assets) is Blender. Do a "Blender Render" search and you can see what you can achieve in terms of rendering with the software.

 

[warmax42]

As far as character design goes, start broad and trickle down to the little things that relates to the game play. Below are some things I consider when designing my characters.

• Age
  • Younger and older mentality
    • How they'll react to player responses
    • How they dress
      • This can be time consuming, and possibly limited (if one is limited to the tools, or no skills in making their own) but can bring more life and personality to the character if done correctly. This can be tied to different events.
• Hobby
  • This is more tied to the game mechanics
    • Places the player may find them located at
    • Things player can buy to influence the character
• Activities
  • Gymnast, body builder, singer, comedian, ect.
• Emotional State
  • Angry, sad, happy, horny, confused, ect
  • How often it happens

This is just a brief overview, as it can get very detailed if broken down further.

With the information darthseduction mention along with this should give you a good starting point to further improve the personality and design of your characters.



Couple things to note here, I have very little to no knowledge of Daz / Honey Select. I've learn how to model/texture my own assets/used third-party tools to assist in making models.

As far as I know, If your looking for ease of use than yes Daz is probably the only one I know of that offers that. From the quick look at Daz it seems that right out of the box, you get a good amount of ready to render assets.

As far as achieving acceptable quality and ease of development, you're not going to find any other software that offers that, you will have to put some time into learning, if your thinking outside of Daz. One software, (not user friendly, or easy to use, does have assets, very few model assets) is Blender. Do a "Blender Render" search and you can see what you can achieve in terms of rendering with the software.

Interesting, from my experience using Honey Select was significantly more straight forward to setup. It probably helps they have 2 separate programs for character morphing and for posing.

I have tried Blender, I've actually done work with it before for other work. I tried it with Make Human models rendered I Blender. I'm no pro, but it looked good, close to Daz quality (blender also uses Ray tracing). The problem with that is the limitation of clothing/accessory items available for make human or blender in general.

I'm not saying that I want to avoid all work, but I do want to avoid having to manually design clothes at least.

Like I said, despite these screenshots not being the best I will try again for a bit with HS. Ultimately l.. I don't know. Daz seems like the only plhrest alternative... maybe iClone but I literally only found out about it yesterday

 

[Egglock]

I honestly wouldn't know, I'm the wrong person to get any tangible information regarding the use of Daz or Honey select. Spending nearly less than 10 minutes on Daz hardly counts as me knowing anything about that software.
I was merely saying Daz seems like an easy software to use right out of the box.

The image quality looks fine? Is there a problem with rendering in Honey Select? Or did I say something that seemed misleading?

 

[fauxplayer]

Hey guys, I'm trying out some character design, and wanted to get some opinions on the characters.

I'm trying to imagine general character traits too, and hopefully these reflect in the image:
- The woman on the left is cheerful, has a positive outlook on life and isn't that street-smart
- The woman in the center has more life experience, is more prone to be angry and cynical.
- The woman on the right is a bit older and tends to get her way through sweet-talk more than force.

Some other notes: The characters aren't meant to be related, I'm thinking more of neighbours or flat-mates.

Edit: Feel free to critique the visual character design, character traits or just the image quality. I'm sorta new to most of these, so feedback is appreciated

View attachment 62341 View attachment 62342 View attachment 62343 View attachment 62344

To answer your direct question:

The girl on the left is meant to be cheerful, so she should be smiling. Maybe have her head cocked a little with a sweet smile that convey a look of "Hey, what's up? I'm happy, and I'm waiting for you to interact with me in a positive way!" Her body is ideal IMO.

The girl in the middle: her face conveys someone prone to be angry or cynical, so you've succeeded there, but she's not very attractive. She's a butterface: Her body is hot, but her face. She looks a lot older than it seems you want her to be. If she was in a game I was playing, I wouldn't feel motivated to break through that negative persona... I'd just leave her be because "meh, not worth the aggravation."

The girl on the right: She looks older and more mature in a healthy way. She could be wearing a slight smirk or subtle smile to convey what you mentioned about sweet talk. Her breasts are a bit big for my taste, but in a game with these three that's not a problem because the first girl's tits are perfect. I can see myself enjoying the sweet-talk path with this model in a game.

If you haven't, be sure to play several games with honey select models. I recommend both SolValley School and House Arrest by TK8000, Research into Corruption by Boomatica, and Max's Life by Kuggazer. Doesn't matter whether you enjoy those games... just download them and rip the images if you want. I chose them because I normally wasn't a fan of Honey Select models until these games changed my mind

 

[fauxplayer]

The only honey select game I like the models in is A Perverted Family. Its not that I prefer Daz, its that most Honey Select games look weird to me. If I'm being honest, the models in A Perverted Family would rank among my top 5 at least. I also really like the clothing options I've seen in Honey Select. So no, I don't think Daz is naturally superior. I just think it takes a lot of skill to do something great with Honey Select.

Oh yea, haha, I didn't even think of this one as an example because I actually forget those are Honey Select models it's so well done

 

[JDgamer]

The traits themselves are fine, but they're very surface and have no real depth. When creating my own characters I like to make a list of things they enjoy, things they don't, make some comments on their psyche.

For instance, my character Alexis:

Likes Animation
Plays Tabletop RPGs
Loves Fantasy
Loves Sci-Fi
Guilty Pleasure for Romantic Horror
Space Opera Fanatic
Prefers the Dark Side
Thinks Vampires are Sexy
Open to lots of music, loves musicals, keeps it modern while enjoying the classics
Self conscious about small breasts
Flaunts her ass
Hates chinese food
Has deep rooted fear of becoming a monster like her father​

In this way, as I'm writing her in the future I can use these traits. Most of these are positive, but that's because I don't need to list the opposite. If she likes these things she doesn't like others as much, and if she hates this then in relation she'll be pleased by something different.

hehe I like you darthseduction. There are people who scribble on a piece of paper and call it art "ME! " And then there's you, Picasso.

 

[warmax42]

To answer your direct question:

The girl on the left is meant to be cheerful, so she should be smiling. Maybe have her head cocked a little with a sweet smile that convey a look of "Hey, what's up? I'm happy, and I'm waiting for you to interact with me in a positive way!" Her body is ideal IMO.

The girl in the middle: her face conveys someone prone to be angry or cynical, so you've succeeded there, but she's not very attractive. She's a butterface: Her body is hot, but her face. She looks a lot older than it seems you want her to be. If she was in a game I was playing, I wouldn't feel motivated to break through that negative persona... I'd just leave her be because "meh, not worth the aggravation."

The girl on the right: She looks older and more mature in a healthy way. She could be wearing a slight smirk or subtle smile to convey what you mentioned about sweet talk. Her breasts are a bit big for my taste, but in a game with these three that's not a problem because the first girl's tits are perfect. I can see myself enjoying the sweet-talk path with this model in a game.

If you haven't, be sure to play several games with honey select models. I recommend both SolValley School and House Arrest by TK8000, Research into Corruption by Boomatica, and Max's Life by Kuggazer. Doesn't matter whether you enjoy those games... just download them and rip the images if you want. I chose them because I normally wasn't a fan of Honey Select models until these games changed my mind

Hey, thanks for the feedback. That's some good pointers on the girls. I've tried to change it up a bit. For the girl in the middle, yea, a but-her-face is a bit of the way i was going for it, but maybe not so that it was 'meh'.

I actually went back and changed some of the skin textures and reflection properties. The Honey Select games I've seen all have very strange reflection, so I specifically got the linear light and image-based lighting plugins. I'm still new though, so gotta keep trying to learn more about them.

I edited the faces, expressions, and facial features a bit. These actually come out as 3840x2160 images, and i'm uploading them as such, but I don't think you can really see that :/ I did do a tiny bit of touchup on the final images (increase contrast) too, since I'm still learning the in-game exposure and eye-adaption.

 

[fauxplayer]

Hey, thanks for the feedback. That's some good pointers on the girls. I've tried to change it up a bit. For the girl in the middle, yea, a but-her-face is a bit of the way i was going for it, but maybe not so that it was 'meh'.

I actually went back and changed some of the skin textures and reflection properties. The Honey Select games I've seen all have very strange reflection, so I specifically got the linear light and image-based lighting plugins. I'm still new though, so gotta keep trying to learn more about them.

I edited the faces, expressions, and facial features a bit. These actually come out as 3840x2160 images, and i'm uploading them as such, but I don't think you can really see that :/ I did do a tiny bit of touchup on the final images (increase contrast) too, since I'm still learning the in-game exposure and eye-adaption.

View attachment 62755 View attachment 62757 View attachment 62752 View attachment 62753 View attachment 62754

Hey, I'm glad you found my feedback helpful. I really like the first girl. She seems innocent but confident, wholesome while sexy, which makes for all kinds of variables in a game (corrupt her? romance her? seduce her? YES PLEASE! )

The third girl has a look that better captures your initial description, at least in my opinion. Haha I definitely feel my feedback was helpful here (for me!) because that slight smirk you gave her was exactly what I was imagining to make her more approachable for playful banter and "sweet talk."

After reading your comments on the middle girl, I get it. I've known some girls with incredible bodies but... let's say "less fortunate" faces, and it makes sense this would make them dour and aloof and cynical. Hey, shoot your own shot and make the game you want to make. If that middle girl has a cynical facade masking an inner sex drive because she is frustrated with her looks, that makes sense. She works out like crazy to get that body but is prone to anger because "cute girls" get all the breaks that she doesn't. If you are successful in crafting a character, it will be believable and hot to play. My only advice would be to play around with expressions and facial responses you want to use in future when the player has "broken through" (if that's your angle). What does her face look like when she's being forced to accept a genuine compliment? Or for when she's finally allowing her inner sexuality to express itself? Haha or when the MC is giving her an orgasm? If you feel confident that she won't be "meh" given her character traits and how you'll design her look at certain levels along the way, go for it!

 

[warmax42]

Hey, I'm glad you found my feedback helpful. I really like the first girl. She seems innocent but confident, wholesome while sexy, which makes for all kinds of variables in a game (corrupt her? romance her? seduce her? YES PLEASE! )

The third girl has a look that better captures your initial description, at least in my opinion. Haha I definitely feel my feedback was helpful here (for me!) because that slight smirk you gave her was exactly what I was imagining to make her more approachable for playful banter and "sweet talk."

After reading your comments on the middle girl, I get it. I've known some girls with incredible bodies but... let's say "less fortunate" faces, and it makes sense this would make them dour and aloof and cynical. Hey, shoot your own shot and make the game you want to make. If that middle girl has a cynical facade masking an inner sex drive because she is frustrated with her looks, that makes sense. She works out like crazy to get that body but is prone to anger because "cute girls" get all the breaks that she doesn't. If you are successful in crafting a character, it will be believable and hot to play. My only advice would be to play around with expressions and facial responses you want to use in future when the player has "broken through" (if that's your angle). What does her face look like when she's being forced to accept a genuine compliment? Or for when she's finally allowing her inner sexuality to express itself? Haha or when the MC is giving her an orgasm? If you feel confident that she won't be "meh" given her character traits and how you'll design her look at certain levels along the way, go for it!

That is some EXCELLENT description. So good, I'm gonna pretend i came up with it myself

I did have a bit of a break and looked at the 2nd girl again, and i can see why she looks a bit older. The gray-ish hair and slightly lower square-ish jaw. I'll probably mess around with character creation more until I get the story settled to some degree. Thanks man!

 

[DarthSeduction]

Hey, thanks for the feedback. That's some good pointers on the girls. I've tried to change it up a bit. For the girl in the middle, yea, a but-her-face is a bit of the way i was going for it, but maybe not so that it was 'meh'.

I actually went back and changed some of the skin textures and reflection properties. The Honey Select games I've seen all have very strange reflection, so I specifically got the linear light and image-based lighting plugins. I'm still new though, so gotta keep trying to learn more about them.

I edited the faces, expressions, and facial features a bit. These actually come out as 3840x2160 images, and i'm uploading them as such, but I don't think you can really see that :/ I did do a tiny bit of touchup on the final images (increase contrast) too, since I'm still learning the in-game exposure and eye-adaption.

View attachment 62755 View attachment 62757 View attachment 62752 View attachment 62753 View attachment 62754

I think my biggest problem with the middle girl isn't even her look. She'd not wholly unattractive. Her head looks tiny with comparison to her body. I can't tell if you've Morphed it to make it smaller or if it's an illusion cause by your choice of hair for her. As a result she simply looks weird. I'd love to see what you could do with a similar but not so wide hairstyle. With her character it makes sense that she'd have something plain and straight, not what's going on here looks very unnatural.

I do like the last girl more in these new pics, the only caution I have is that their eyes seem weird to me. The eyes are usually the biggest problem designers seem to have with honey select, they either get too Asian and look like they're swollen closed, or they look like yours, which kinda look like 2d drawn eyes pasted into a 3d character.

I do think the changes in expression were a nice thing, though I was able to see their character through the way you posed and dressed them, it is a good idea to have expressions used to fit the model.

Again, I don't want to discourage you from continuing to create. If you're comfortable with what you've made, go for it, it's your project. But if you have the time to fine tune your art and make it something very approachable, I'd suggest you do, as it will only help your game of the art is superb.