game update times

[Naxos]

Is it just me or are a lot of games taking a lot longer with updates these days?

I really don't want to "shame" or call out any developers but it just seems that a lot of games have gone from monthly updates to updates every 2 or 3 months and the quantity of content in the updates have dropped as well.

By no means all, there are a lot that update regularly, just seems certain ones have slowed down significantly.

 

[SeventhVixen]

Being fair as far as I heard in many instances, many devs have been upping their quality, -and maybe too remaking old content- and that could be the cause for some.

Other than that...

Myself as a dev personally, beyond computer problems that makes one want to throw the computer sometimes thru the windows, reality is that having the kid all day around during the quarentine has been making work a bit slower generally for the past 3 months... and now holidays :S

I guess the same the quarentine has helped many devs have more time, in other cases other may had more difficulties (including job issues)

 

[polywog]

Be patient, you have to allow for differences in time zones.

 

[Adabelitoo]

Maybe you're just unlucky with the games you follow. Everything seems normal to me.

 

[Naxos]

Maybe you're just unlucky with the games you follow. Everything seems normal to me.

I think this.

And now I see one has been marked Abandoned.


Oh well, time to find new stuff.

 

[Hadley]

Its a problem with the Patreon Business-Model. Devs really get no motivation to actually try to finish their Games ASAP. I bet a bunch are trying to figure out how long they can go without updating before they lose a lot of Patreons.

 

[Adabelitoo]

Its a problem with the Patreon Business-Model. Devs really get no motivation to actually try to finish their Games ASAP. I bet a bunch are trying to figure out how long they can go without updating before they lose a lot of Patreons.

It seems like you met one or two bad apples and now you're assuming all devs do the same.

 

[AmazonessKing]

As I said in a different thread, you really don't know what can be going in a devs life or how is a dev personality when dealing with their audience. It's not a justification, though, communication is always key even if you take months to release an update, as long as you constantly interact with your followers so they know you are at least alive, the game is most probably still being worked on. Personal experience.

Its a problem with the Patreon Business-Model. Devs really get no motivation to actually try to finish their Games ASAP. I bet a bunch are trying to figure out how long they can go without updating before they lose a lot of Patreons.

I also agree with this. But as much as devs are to blame, I also blame consumers. I personally threat patreon as a tip jar more than anything, even back when I needed patreon money to live. A lot of people think that patreon money magically makes dev work faster or better, when that's simply not the case.

 

[polywog]

Reminder to all developers: you only have two months left to finish your game, if you want to get it on store shelves before Christmas. If not you'll have to wait a whole year.

 

[AmazonessKing]

Dunno if you are trying to be sarcastic, but deadlines are not a bad thing. Rushing a game to meet a deadline is pretty bad, but small goals with self-imposed deadlines should be a more common practice and just organized work in general.

 

[polywog]

Dunno if you are trying to be sarcastic, but deadlines are not a bad thing. Rushing a game to meet a deadline is pretty bad, but small goals with self-imposed deadlines should be a more common practice and just organized work in general.

I dunno why you would think that was sarcasm. We both agree that patreon is not a business model, it's just a tip jar with someone else's greedy hands in it. There are far better avenues through which to sell games, and make real money, for those looking to make a business out of their hobby. Goals and deadlines are not bad... we can't change when the Christmas shopping season occurs, we have to adjust our goals to meet the consumer demand.

 

[AmazonessKing]

Problem is that dealing with digital games is completely different than Christmas Sells used to be. You needed to rush because if you were releasing in physical format in time you had to have it done. Right now games come whenever. I think the best dates to release update of games is in the end or beginning of the month because of pay days.

 

[polywog]

Problem is that dealing with digital games is completely different than Christmas Sells used to be. You needed to rush because if you were releasing in physical format in time you had to have it done. Right now games come whenever. I think the best dates to release update of games is in the end or beginning of the month because of pay days.

You're not another one of "those people" trying to say that physical goods are a thing of the past
and how DVD and Blu Ray is obsolete, and nobody with glasses, a plaid shirt, and beard, would be caught dead buying physical game discs... are you?

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I support piracy...people who can't afford games, wouldn't buy them anyway, so it's no loss. Nothing against digital downloads at all, it's hip and trendy to buy vaporware and have nothing to show for it... but serious collector, people with serious money... they want a box on the shelf. Maybe it's the cover art? The bonus content? The potions guide? I dunno.

It's not just about how the game is delivered, it's about marketing your brand, building a fanbase. Each time the see your box on the shelf in their bedroom, the go to your website to look and see what you are working on now. When they are in their closet getting dressed and they see your t shirt, it reminds them that they haven't played in a few weeks.

 

[AmazonessKing]

You're not another one of "those people" trying to say that physical goods are a thing of the past

No. I'm just saying that physical releases and digital releases are inherently different and they need different strategies. So applying the whole "christmas sales" doesn't apply, at least not as it does with physical media for a lot of reasons I think it's not worth mentioning in detail, but basically, you wanted to get rid of your stock as soon as possible and people wanted to buy the game as soon as it was released. With digital media, it's always ready to be sold and there isn't an stock since digital media doesn't run out. And so on and so forth.

That's why I think deadlines are important, but they are not nearly the same as physical releases. And that's coming from a person who not only wish to release his games in physical format, but that would also collect video games if I wasn't starving. I'm not fond of Steam at all, I don't even use it.

 

[khumak]

Personally, I think it makes more sense to do releases based on the completion of a big event series or a pivotal plot development rather than sticking to an arbitrary release schedule. So you might have some updates ready every couple of weeks for awhile and then a big one that takes 3 months. So longer release schedules isn't necessarily bad but it depends on why the cycle is longer.

If the scenes feel like they were fully developed and left off at a point that makes sense I would rather see that than a game that sticks to a rigid release schedule and then has scenes with placeholders, empty locations, broken dialog options, etc. If the scene isn't ready yet, don't put it in yet. On the flip side, if we're waiting 3 months for a minor bug fix update then I could see people being annoyed about that.

My dev experience just involves modding so far but I've run into situations even just with modding where I'm making a scene that's big enough that I can't finish it in a month. Sometimes it takes 2 or 3 months and is complex enough that it can't really be broken up into smaller chunks. A smaller scene might only take a week or sometimes even less. Those sorts of smaller scenes could much more easily be grouped together in a more traditional month long release cycle.

 

[Vaman]

How many developers do you actually believe spend the same amount of time working as you do every week? They're trying to game the system, to put in minimal effort, for maximum reward. Why wouldn't they? There's no benefit for them actually putting in a lot of work. Their performance management is absolutely fucked.

EDIT: I'm specifically talking about full-time game developers, who have acquired substantial wealth. I'm not talking about ones who already have a job and are working on the game in their free time.

 

[AmazonessKing]

How many developers do you actually believe spend the same amount of time working as you do every week? They're trying to game the system, to put in minimal effort, for maximum reward. Why wouldn't they? There's no benefit for them actually putting in a lot of work. Their performance management is absolutely fucked.

Some months ago I was jobless so I spent around 5 hours every day working on the game, both because I had nothing else to do and it's something I enjoy doing. Now that I have a job, I don't have the same time to spend on the game except at night and my free day. I'm at my job right now, I just don't give a shit anymore because I hate it.

 

[Vaman]

Some months ago I was jobless so I spent around 5 hours every day working on the game, both because I had nothing else to do and it's something I enjoy doing. Now that I have a job, I don't have the same time to spend on the game except at night and my free day. I'm at my job right now, I just don't give a shit anymore because I hate it.

Perhaps I should've added more context to my reply. I am specifically talking about game developers who are supposedly working on their game full-time (according to themselves), not ones who have not been able to do so. Sometimes you notice how developers who have been working full-time on a game, and release updates consistently, like every month, suddenly start to release updates consistently every third month. They continue to do so for over a year, and are still doing it. Now I won't name any names, because I do not wish to call out anyone, but it has been noticed ,and I know I'm not the only one.

 

[Zippity]

Is it just me or are a lot of games taking a lot longer with updates these days?

I really don't want to "shame" or call out any developers but it just seems that a lot of games have gone from monthly updates to updates every 2 or 3 months and the quantity of content in the updates have dropped as well.

By no means all, there are a lot that update regularly, just seems certain ones have slowed down significantly.

It's that way primarily because this is a amateur/hobbyist developer based market... Usually consisting of just one person, at most maybe 2-3 people... Larger teams are not that common... Mix in some real life with all that, and you get slower development... It's just the innate nature of this niche market... Been like this for years...

But we are even seeing it happen in the normal game market as well... The market is just absolutely saturated with Early Access Games these days, with hundreds of small time developers making all sorts of non-sense... Many of which are throwbacks to older games, or they take years to develop if they ever even stop developing... It blows my mind, how many games on Steam in the last 2 years are now Early Access while being slowly developed...

So it's not just this niche market...

As to the quality issues with many erotic/adult VN/Games, that has been going on for years as well... It's a craps shoot... Will it be good, will it be bad, will it be so-so, will I want to rip my eyes out after looking at and/or reading this crap... The list goes on and on...

I would not expect it to be any different even years from now... Because with such a high volume of new developers constantly popping into existence, you are going to get the bad with the good... But all we can do is hope that the developers, who decide to stick with it for the long haul, grow and learn and get better at what they are doing... And perhaps one day surprise us, going from mediocre to being a rising star... Until then, we just have to put up with how the market is, or go find some entertainment somewhere else... It's the nature of the beast...

No. I'm just saying that physical releases and digital releases are inherently different and they need different strategies. So applying the whole "christmas sales" doesn't apply, at least not as it does with physical media for a lot of reasons I think it's not worth mentioning in detail, but basically, you wanted to get rid of your stock as soon as possible and people wanted to buy the game as soon as it was released. With digital media, it's always ready to be sold and there isn't an stock since digital media doesn't run out. And so on and so forth.

That's why I think deadlines are important, but they are not nearly the same as physical releases. And that's coming from a person who not only wish to release his games in physical format, but that would also collect video games if I wasn't starving. I'm not fond of Steam at all, I don't even use it.

Read a few replies regarding the whole setting goals and release dates and so on...

I do believe that one of the tools in a developers toolbox is the use of Soft Goals for updates... What that means is, setting a date for releasing an update and/or finished product as a goal to work towards, but allowing flexibility to push out that date for whatever reasons, if absolutely needed... It's always important to set goals, but developers in this niche industry are not huge corporate game developers... They don't have shareholders breathing down their necks to get a product to market on time so they can start reaping in the profits from sales... Etc etc etc... In this industry meeting an update goal, or even getting it done early, is just something to be happy about and admired... But it should NEVER be used to push out updates and/or finished products before they are ready... Rushing to meet a hard goal deadline, will almost always result in the quality somehow suffering... And I'm a big proponent of quality over quantity...

If some fans are too impatient to deal with slow development, then they should go look somewhere else... But when I say that, I also want the fans to pay attention for misbehavior such as dishonest milking of donations... But don't pile milkers into the same bucket as slower developers that put out high quality updates/products but at a slow pace... I know it's sometimes hard to tell everyone apart, but be aware, there are some predatory developers out there... But that doesn't mean every time development slows down, that it's some form of miscreant activity, with every developer...

The absolute key element I can not stress enough, is good communications between the developer/s and their entire fan base (donators or not)... When crap happens, it happens, nothing you can do about it, but as long as your are 100% honest and upfront with your fans, most are going to understand and probably be o.k. with your reasons for delaying development when you need to... Just be honest, consistent, communicative, learn, grow, and make a quality product...

Zip

 

[AmazonessKing]

They don't have shareholders breathing down their necks to get a product to market on time so they can start reaping in the profits from sales

I consider my patrons and fans in general my shareholders. I depend on them, after all. I don;t want to let them down, and I want them to keep enjoying my products. Otherwise you get very lazy developers or even milkers. I acknowledge that not all devs are like that, but I also acknowledge that some are.

This is specially true for someone like me with only 6 patrons. Imagine only having 6 fans willing to give you money and letting them down, without mentioning the fans that don't pledge as well.

I think it's a matter of trust and morality.