[R>Artist 2D] [R>Programmer] [R>Writer] Unpaid Having Failed To Assemble Team, Here I Am Again

May 18, 2019
97
144
Hey, everyone. It’s been a while since I posted on this site. Over a year, actually, and almost two years since the very first request I posted. I’m talking about [this] request and the one I put a link to previously.

So, uh, it’s been rough. A big thank you to everyone who contacted me in the past (except that one person who ghosted me after promising to send the files, which I presume was due to them having done virtually nothing over the span of several months – yes, I’m still salty after all this time), and tried working on the project with me. Unfortunately, we never managed to make any substantial progress.

Naturally, the only logical next step for me was abandon ship – or do everything myself. And so, I started learning Unity and C#. Just as I expected, this isn’t really my thing. I’m being realistic here – I suck ass at the technical side of game development. Sure, I can do the job (on my level anyway), but it will take more time than it needs, and the result will be subpar.

is a link to a stable build I can show. I changed a few things right before building without proper testing, but I think it should be fine. It’s not a demo or anything of the sort, don’t mind the name. It’s more of a playground for testing the game’s mechanics. I’ve programmed a number of systems, but most of them still need polishing. There’s a dialogue system, inventory system (including exchanging items between containers and trading), craft system, companion system, combat system (easily the biggest and most underdeveloped system – for now the NPCs use random actions instead of applying predefined logic, and the values are not dependent on the characters’ stats), quest system, sleep system (which includes a scene viewer, forwarding time, and leveling up), and save system (well, kinda – I only have autosave for now, to persist the game state between scenes, but the framework is there), and a number of other things, like an in-game encyclopedia, action buttons, backlog, etc. Aside from that I spent a shit ton of time implementing and re-implementing a decent localization system. I know there’s a popular package for that, but I opted for something I was comfortable with.

About the request. You may wonder, why I’m posting here. Well, I’m planning to cobble together an actual demo before the end of the year, so I figured I could use more experienced hands, granted there are people interested in working with me. Yes, I’m aware of the Unity shitstorm unfolding, and I don’t like what’s going on, but I simply have no resolution to re-educate myself to use another engine for the sake of a project that most likely won’t land. If you use Godot, I’m open to the idea of switching, but I won’t be of much help. The porting will be pretty much exclusively on you.

About development roles. If you’re a writer, I would greatly appreciate your help with proofreading and editing, maybe some rewriting. English is not my native language, and the texts I have might sound a bit awkward. If you’re a C# programmer, I’m ready to delegate the work on the combat system or anything else you may be interested in, like overhauling an existing system. If you’re an artist, I could do with some body sprites and backgrounds. Currently, the plan is to utilize AI-generated art since I’m unable to commission due to the challenges of paying abroad from Russia without resorting to questionable third-party methods. For audio, I found some clips and music that I think are okay to use as long as you credit the creators. For UI, I primarily rely on paid assets, so I’ll only share the bare minimum.

About sex. Even though I have a solid idea as to what the sex system should look and play like, I won’t start working on it until: 1) the rest of the demo is ready and it looks sufficiently polished; 2) people are interested in the project. Why? The main reason is that in Russia, it’s illegal to produce explicit pornographic content, and I want to have this project on my hypothetical gamedev resume. I find it absolutely ridiculous, but I must adhere to the regulations of the country I reside in.

About monetization. Don’t expect to get paid. Consider this project a game jam. Your name will be in the credits, and I won’t prohibit you from using this project as a bullet point in your own portfolio. And since it won’t have explicit sex, you will be able to show it basically to anyone. Sure, we can arrange a Patreon/Subscribestar account in someone else’s name, but then I won’t get paid. Look, I’m a very charitable person, but I’m no charity. I won’t be able to work on the game if everyone on the team but me gets monetary incentive to continue the development.

About life after demo. Once the demo is out and polished, I’ll try to promote it a bit and see if people like what they see. If they do, then I’ll try to move slightly past the demo zone, but if the game goes unnoticed, I’ll probably just make the project public (excluding assets such as UI, for obvious reasons), for people to make use of my scripts. I’ve invested a significant amount of time, about 8-9 months, not including time spent on writing, into this project, and I would hate for all that effort to go to waste. If you’ll end up interested in continuing development, you’ll have my support, even if my direct contributions may be limited. I have some worldbuilding and lore ideas I could share.

To get in touch, you can use the contact information provided in my initial post. Both my Discord account and email address are still active. However, I would prefer using Discord as the primary means of communication since that email isn’t my main one, and it might take me some time to go check for new messages there.
 

Man don't hop

Member
Game Developer
Nov 25, 2022
361
525
Hey, everyone. It’s been a while since I posted on this site. Over a year, actually, and almost two years since the very first request I posted. I’m talking about [this] request and the one I put a link to previously.

So, uh, it’s been rough. A big thank you to everyone who contacted me in the past (except that one person who ghosted me after promising to send the files, which I presume was due to them having done virtually nothing over the span of several months – yes, I’m still salty after all this time), and tried working on the project with me. Unfortunately, we never managed to make any substantial progress.

Naturally, the only logical next step for me was abandon ship – or do everything myself. And so, I started learning Unity and C#. Just as I expected, this isn’t really my thing. I’m being realistic here – I suck ass at the technical side of game development. Sure, I can do the job (on my level anyway), but it will take more time than it needs, and the result will be subpar.

is a link to a stable build I can show. I changed a few things right before building without proper testing, but I think it should be fine. It’s not a demo or anything of the sort, don’t mind the name. It’s more of a playground for testing the game’s mechanics. I’ve programmed a number of systems, but most of them still need polishing. There’s a dialogue system, inventory system (including exchanging items between containers and trading), craft system, companion system, combat system (easily the biggest and most underdeveloped system – for now the NPCs use random actions instead of applying predefined logic, and the values are not dependent on the characters’ stats), quest system, sleep system (which includes a scene viewer, forwarding time, and leveling up), and save system (well, kinda – I only have autosave for now, to persist the game state between scenes, but the framework is there), and a number of other things, like an in-game encyclopedia, action buttons, backlog, etc. Aside from that I spent a shit ton of time implementing and re-implementing a decent localization system. I know there’s a popular package for that, but I opted for something I was comfortable with.

About the request. You may wonder, why I’m posting here. Well, I’m planning to cobble together an actual demo before the end of the year, so I figured I could use more experienced hands, granted there are people interested in working with me. Yes, I’m aware of the Unity shitstorm unfolding, and I don’t like what’s going on, but I simply have no resolution to re-educate myself to use another engine for the sake of a project that most likely won’t land. If you use Godot, I’m open to the idea of switching, but I won’t be of much help. The porting will be pretty much exclusively on you.

About development roles. If you’re a writer, I would greatly appreciate your help with proofreading and editing, maybe some rewriting. English is not my native language, and the texts I have might sound a bit awkward. If you’re a C# programmer, I’m ready to delegate the work on the combat system or anything else you may be interested in, like overhauling an existing system. If you’re an artist, I could do with some body sprites and backgrounds. Currently, the plan is to utilize AI-generated art since I’m unable to commission due to the challenges of paying abroad from Russia without resorting to questionable third-party methods. For audio, I found some clips and music that I think are okay to use as long as you credit the creators. For UI, I primarily rely on paid assets, so I’ll only share the bare minimum.

About sex. Even though I have a solid idea as to what the sex system should look and play like, I won’t start working on it until: 1) the rest of the demo is ready and it looks sufficiently polished; 2) people are interested in the project. Why? The main reason is that in Russia, it’s illegal to produce explicit pornographic content, and I want to have this project on my hypothetical gamedev resume. I find it absolutely ridiculous, but I must adhere to the regulations of the country I reside in.

About monetization. Don’t expect to get paid. Consider this project a game jam. Your name will be in the credits, and I won’t prohibit you from using this project as a bullet point in your own portfolio. And since it won’t have explicit sex, you will be able to show it basically to anyone. Sure, we can arrange a Patreon/Subscribestar account in someone else’s name, but then I won’t get paid. Look, I’m a very charitable person, but I’m no charity. I won’t be able to work on the game if everyone on the team but me gets monetary incentive to continue the development.

About life after demo. Once the demo is out and polished, I’ll try to promote it a bit and see if people like what they see. If they do, then I’ll try to move slightly past the demo zone, but if the game goes unnoticed, I’ll probably just make the project public (excluding assets such as UI, for obvious reasons), for people to make use of my scripts. I’ve invested a significant amount of time, about 8-9 months, not including time spent on writing, into this project, and I would hate for all that effort to go to waste. If you’ll end up interested in continuing development, you’ll have my support, even if my direct contributions may be limited. I have some worldbuilding and lore ideas I could share.

To get in touch, you can use the contact information provided in my initial post. Both my Discord account and email address are still active. However, I would prefer using Discord as the primary means of communication since that email isn’t my main one, and it might take me some time to go check for new messages there.
First off I was surprised at what I saw. It looks good, I can really see it becoming something fun to play if enough love and work goes into it. The only thing I will say about this post is what are you trying to do and why are you doing it? There is a level of disconnect in this post that's kind of jarring. It doesn't come off as looking for a team to work together to make something fun but a group of unpaid contractors with you as the middleman to finishing a demo out of obligation (Not saying that's the case but that's just how it seems to me).

The monetization talk also rubs me the wrong way. Basically, it reads as "This is just something to do because I don't want my work to go to waste, hop in if you find that appealing. Once we're done I'll make a post or two about it so see what happens next. Oh, and no patreon. Not because having to carter to backers would hinder the flow of the game (This is a valid reason not to have one), but if I can't get paid no one can." You can't retroactively promote your stuff or do it on a whim, you're all in or you're not. It can't be a maybe, I see what you got and can see it being fun. The fact that there's not a devlog, thread, post on 5 different sites, a dev dairy, YouTube, an itch.io page or a discord is already showing me that there's no solid plan. Also, to not want others to have a chance to be paid for their time just because you can't is odd. Again, if you didn't want the problems that come with taking people's money before having a finished game I understand and think it's a smart move. But to say "Well I don't run a charity" is misguided. You're the lead, the fact that you won't have to drop cash on resources and saving time (if you had a team) is you getting paid lol. That's worth more than a $1000 a month from patreon.

Again, not trying to attack you or anything. I can see this being good (I like the UI). But honestly, with this approach, you might as well stay solo, have fun, and hone your craft on your own. If you want a team then more planning will have to go to having a team of volunteers, because this isn't it.
 

MangoFish

New Member
Sep 5, 2023
5
3
On the one hand this seems to be a serious project with real effort being put in, on the other hand you don't seem to have an idea what to actually do with it
Monetization wise is the problem that you don't know how to actually monetize it (due to restrictions on adult games)? Because that can be solved quite easily

I read your GDD and while i was impressed by how much thought was put in the idea, from a technical POV it's ridiculous, even if you somehow get someone like me to code your project AND an artist to create all your assets for free it would be a multi year commitment

I've send you a request on Discord, name: mangofishdev, i can't really afford to work on something like this for free but i will be able to give you an idea on how you would even attempt to implement some of the features you want , althought i might be willing to program the grid travel system (depending on the exact scope) because it seems interesting enough of an idea and the parts of it i don't like (creating the UI itself) is already done
 
May 18, 2019
97
144
First off I was surprised at what I saw. It looks good, I can really see it becoming something fun to play if enough love and work goes into it. The only thing I will say about this post is what are you trying to do and why are you doing it? There is a level of disconnect in this post that's kind of jarring. It doesn't come off as looking for a team to work together to make something fun but a group of unpaid contractors with you as the middleman to finishing a demo out of obligation (Not saying that's the case but that's just how it seems to me).

The monetization talk also rubs me the wrong way. Basically, it reads as "This is just something to do because I don't want my work to go to waste, hop in if you find that appealing. Once we're done I'll make a post or two about it so see what happens next. Oh, and no patreon. Not because having to carter to backers would hinder the flow of the game (This is a valid reason not to have one), but if I can't get paid no one can." You can't retroactively promote your stuff or do it on a whim, you're all in or you're not. It can't be a maybe, I see what you got and can see it being fun. The fact that there's not a devlog, thread, post on 5 different sites, a dev dairy, YouTube, an itch.io page or a discord is already showing me that there's no solid plan. Also, to not want others to have a chance to be paid for their time just because you can't is odd. Again, if you didn't want the problems that come with taking people's money before having a finished game I understand and think it's a smart move. But to say "Well I don't run a charity" is misguided. You're the lead, the fact that you won't have to drop cash on resources and saving time (if you had a team) is you getting paid lol. That's worth more than a $1000 a month from patreon.

Again, not trying to attack you or anything. I can see this being good (I like the UI). But honestly, with this approach, you might as well stay solo, have fun, and hone your craft on your own. If you want a team then more planning will have to go to having a team of volunteers, because this isn't it.
Thanks for the input. You asked what I'm trying to do and why I'm doing it. I don't think it's hard to recreate my steps and train of thought. I got an idea for a game, then wrote a design document, then tried to find a group of people who might find it interesting and work on the thing together, then failed to find anyone, then decided to do most of the work myself, and now I'm at the stop where I'm about to produce something that can remotely be called a game, and if I can find people who might want to join, then it'd make things much easier. In short, I wanted to make a game for fun, see if it gets popular, and if it did, continue the development. Then the ongoing political event happened that made it virtually impossible for me to get money out of the project, even if it got popular. Or in the project, for that matter.

I think you misinterpreted my monetization rant. What I was trying to convey is: I can't logistically establish a fundraising campaign, so that would be egregious of me to promise any money. That's why I asked to think of this project as a game jam. If you find the project interesting, have time and skills to contribute, then I'd be grateful if you brought it to the table -- not for my sake, but for the project's. I sincerely believe that there are people who are willing to work on something out of sheer enthusiasm, although I agree it's a rare thing.

Another thing that you may have misinterpreted is my attitude towards others trying to make money with the project. I didn't really mean to come across as someone who'd pull a stinker if someone on the team tried to make a Patreon dedicated to the project and then share the profits between other team members who actually could get the money that way. What I was trying to say is that personally I wouldn't be able to spend as much time as I previously could on the project. So far, I had some free time on my hands. But I need to pay bills and eat, so I'd have to leave the team -- eventually. This is what I meant by not being charity. If I can't get paid, then I'd have to cease the work, leaving everything to others.

Again, I explicitly stated that I wouldn't mind someone taking over the project at some point. I even stated that I'd still try to help build the game's world. I have quite a few ideas that I wanted to see take shape in the game. Locations, world rules, companions, questlines, the main story -- that sort of thing. But I wouldn't have time to actually sit down and develop the more complicated stuff, like building new systems, remaking the old ones, etc.

Oh, and about 'devlog, thread, post on 5 different sites, a dev dairy, YouTube, an itch.io page or a discord'. I'm sorry but what am I supposed to show people at this stage? An alpha where you move around a test area and try game mechanics? Extracts from future in-game dialogues? AI-generated images with a caption that reads 'hey, look at the picture I'm intending to use in a game that doesn't even exist yet'? A demo is the bare minimum needed to even start those things -- in my opinion, anyway. And the demo is exactly the thing I'm trying to get done here.

On the one hand this seems to be a serious project with real effort being put in, on the other hand you don't seem to have an idea what to actually do with it
Monetization wise is the problem that you don't know how to actually monetize it (due to restrictions on adult games)? Because that can be solved quite easily

I read your GDD and while i was impressed by how much thought was put in the idea, from a technical POV it's ridiculous, even if you somehow get someone like me to code your project AND an artist to create all your assets for free it would be a multi year commitment

I've send you a request on Discord, name: mangofishdev, i can't really afford to work on something like this for free but i will be able to give you an idea on how you would even attempt to implement some of the features you want , althought i might be willing to program the grid travel system (depending on the exact scope) because it seems interesting enough of an idea and the parts of it i don't like (creating the UI itself) is already done
Not just restrictions on adult games, but the mere fact that Russia's banks are cut off of SWIFT, so I can neither send nor receive money from outside the country without relocating, as many creators did, including those who work on adult stuff. Which would be a stupid thing for me to do considering there's no guarantee the game would generate enough money for me to live abroad. I'm not Personal Ami who can ask for a 500$ commission per picture. Plus, it may have become even more difficult to get a foreign account, after almost two years of putting sanctions on Russia and her residents.

I'm not exactly sure whether you actually tried the build I posted above. The traversal system is one of the things that I have implemented already. It may not be perfect, but it seems to work alright? In fact, I think all the building blocks are ready, except for some minor things that are needed for the demo's storyline, like escaping from combat. It's about polish now. Well, for the most part (the combat system is still in super early stages of completion, for example).
 

ihl86

Member
Dec 8, 2019
403
1,334
I've tried the demo. It looks like an interesting gameplay mechanic and loop. I could see it going different places.

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to work on the game as I have 2,3 vn's of my own that I plan to do and can barely get enough work on them but if do do take it off the ground, I would be interested to see where it goes.

Have you considered using chatgpt to help you with some of the coding? It's not always accurate and sometimes it gives you wrong stuff, but if you keep correcting it and asking for specific things, in the end, it provides decent results. It can even help you with the design part of the combat system or things like that if you don't have everything already established.
 
May 18, 2019
97
144
I've tried the demo. It looks like an interesting gameplay mechanic and loop. I could see it going different places.

Unfortunately I wouldn't be able to work on the game as I have 2,3 vn's of my own that I plan to do and can barely get enough work on them but if do do take it off the ground, I would be interested to see where it goes.

Have you considered using chatgpt to help you with some of the coding? It's not always accurate and sometimes it gives you wrong stuff, but if you keep correcting it and asking for specific things, in the end, it provides decent results. It can even help you with the design part of the combat system or things like that if you don't have everything already established.
I've already been doing that for about three months now actually! It's tremendously helpful. Some of the more complicated things in my code are all curtesy of the AI and countless hours of me trying to pinpoint what exactly I want from it.

About the combat system, I pretty much know what has to be done. The problem is that it will take time and expanding other systems, like the perk system, since I'm planning to make the combat flow rely quite heavily on perks (for instance, if there's a Stunned perk on a character, they are forced to skip their turn, if there's a Bleeding perk, they lose some health when it's their turn, etc.) Besides, I still need to prepare formulas for calculating the bulk of the damage a character can deal or omit. So far, the value is only calculated based on the action and related item (this is the reason why the characters deal so little damage most the time), and defending does nothing at all. However, I would much rather start preparing a demo than lose another month or two trying to make fighting less of a chore.
 

ihl86

Member
Dec 8, 2019
403
1,334
I would suggest to implement a simplified combat system at first, yes.
While a final combat system like you envisioned might be fun I don't think it's worth it at this stage of the game to invest the time. Get a demo going, get a game going, if you have enough people that like it, you can start "upgrading" it.
 
May 18, 2019
97
144
I would suggest to implement a simplified combat system at first, yes.
While a final combat system like you envisioned might be fun I don't think it's worth it at this stage of the game to invest the time. Get a demo going, get a game going, if you have enough people that like it, you can start "upgrading" it.
Aye, that's basically my current plan of action.