Ren'Py Hero Party Must Fall [v0.5.5 Bugfix 1] [Nitrolith]

[Hfap5]

"The life of a critic is simple in many respects, we risk little and have power over those who offer their work and their service in our judgment" xd

One of the best games of 2023 and the best ntr of 2023.
This man understood the concept ntr.
Good eroge content and good story. Both sides will be satisfied, those who want a story with good dialogue and those who want good hentai material

I hope the Dev continues with it's work for a long time, there are no good ntr in this place, it's all cuck, bbc, interracial. Few understand the concept ntr

10/10

 

[SpikeyNite]

is there a walkthrough for this game? or like, a wiki or something? i went through like 8 pages of the thread and ngl, every comment is a fucking thesis. not that i am complaining, the game is fucking fantastic and deserves all this speculation and contribution and that is also what i am looking for. is there a file or a thread where someone has compiled certain elements and key points?

 

[Mommysbuttslut]

Maaaaan it's gonna suck when next update comes out and we have to temporarily commit to one of the paths. I was pretty adamant I'd go with the Sera one because she's 100% best girl and she deserves to be the wife of someone who'll actually love her, no matter how fucked up he is. Then all of a sudden we get torn between miniature Ceci, Mars saying "I love you mother" to Elena and an adorable and completely in love Erin. I hate running multiple saves but I don't see any way I'm getting around it, I want to see all 4 of their storylines next update.

 

[SpikeyNite]

Maaaaan it's gonna suck when next update comes out and we have to temporarily commit to one of the paths. I was pretty adamant I'd go with the Sera one because she's 100% best girl and she deserves to be the wife of someone who'll actually love her, no matter how fucked up he is. Then all of a sudden we get torn between miniature Ceci, Mars saying "I love you mother" to Elena and an adorable and completely in love Erin. I hate running multiple saves but I don't see any way I'm getting around it, I want to see all 4 of their storylines next update.

seriously fr. i was kinda trying to balance all the things and it was a pleasant surprise that so far in the game there are no lasting choices. but i also dont see any other way than running multiple saves.

 

[Alandir]

Maaaaan it's gonna suck when next update comes out and we have to temporarily commit to one of the paths. I was pretty adamant I'd go with the Sera one because she's 100% best girl and she deserves to be the wife of someone who'll actually love her, no matter how fucked up he is. Then all of a sudden we get torn between miniature Ceci, Mars saying "I love you mother" to Elena and an adorable and completely in love Erin. I hate running multiple saves but I don't see any way I'm getting around it, I want to see all 4 of their storylines next update.

Nitro said the character development from the route you didn't choose will largely happen offscreen and the status quo from after the timeskip won't be too different.

 

[White]

I miss Sera, I wish the next update will have some content with her.

 

[Alluring]

This is one of the best H games in terms of story I have played ever, this shit is so fucking good holy fucking moly. Easy 50/10. Nitrolith did an incredible job with the story telling and reader engagement.

 

[irreverent69]

I havent seen anything explain the second row of grayed out options while training, sometimes they get unlocked and you can use them but im not sure if its a combo thing that unlocks them. I can get the multiplier up and keep the bars proper with items but nothing is intuitive about the second row of gray bars? if there is an answer thats been pointed out from other asking maybe add this question to the FAQs?

 

[dAELSO]

I absolutely cannot wait to start feminizing Erin

 

[petersenk]

Poor bastard has too much free time, ...

Yeah, I've got all the time in the world. You jelly?

..., look at this sheets damn.

There, there. No need to be intimidated by a few words. They wont hurt you. Are all those projected hours you'd need to read and digest my "sheets" nauseating you? I'm so sorry.

"The life of a critic is simple in many respects, we risk little and have power over those who offer their work and their service in our judgment" xd

Where are you two guys coming from? The discord? Ohhh... you must be from the discord shilling team, pissed off at me, because I made fun of you? top kek

But no, if you're doing it for free, then it's rather just genuine feedback, and not an official "critique". If you can't tell the difference: A "critic" shows up after the fact, to divide the world into good and bad, to judge it.
Genuine feedback - such as mine - on the other hand, is given before a product is finished, and understanding that making something out of love (art) is an incremental process. Genuine feedback is supposed, or tries to make the (not yet) final product better, it doesn't judge it.

And notice how I did not leave a review to rate the game. No, instead, I just came along and wrote some posts deep down into an ever moving +100 pages thread.



A bunch of older quotes
As mentioned in an earlier post, and being curious how well other anons received the Elena arc, I've been catching up reading the thread some more. Funnily enough, people wanting to turn Elena into a lewd demon mommy was always a thing: https://f95zone.to/threads/hero-party-must-fall-v0-4-9-alpha-nitrolith.100153/page-65

Of course! (and *baarf* at that ass parasite idea, thank goddness at least that did not materialize). Let's have a look at some more of those older quotes:

All the updates except the last one were bangers. I did not like the Elena stuff at all, it felt extremely forced and rushed and nonsensical.

Yeah. Also the issue here also seems to be that the author, while generally being an awesome writer, doesn't have much clue about BDSM, so he fumbled it, instead of doing some research and letting him consult by some BDSM pros that know how that shit works, the psychological side of things in particular (no, not even looking at me, total noob here. I just think this shit is hot as fuck. Just light BDSM of course, nothing bloody. Spanking is great though. gahahaha).
At least look up the term "after-care". From what I gather, it is a central topic/thing for BDSM stuff and here it's mostly absent (and no, "pillow talk" doesnt really cut it, granted "after-care" may nicely fade out into "pillow talk" that's nice...). And the premise is wrong to begin with: you don't (generally) use BDSM to humilate someone else and make them your thing that way. I mean, well, that probably is a thing too, with slave/master stuff anyways, but that just is a small part of BDSM and isn't suited for mommy Elena.

Here's what nitrolith himself had to say:

I think they'll be more effective then. Elena is a heroine I created mostly to focus on scenes with humiliation and bullying. So I want in the future for her content to have some vanilla pampering scenes with Mars, some public humiliation scenes to lower her standing/reputation with people, (...)

And the other part of the problem is that nitrolith didn't seem to have a clear and sound vision for Elena. Focusing on humiliation and bullying? Duuuude. That's what Cecille and Sera went through, the latter in particular. Public humiliation to lower her standing/reputation? For fucks sake, why would you do such a thing to your future demon mommy?

Anyways, the "demon mommy" idea was always a thing (granted, this may just entail knocking her up, and not that Mars becomes her son, taking her as a mother that way), people liked it, just not the ass parasite (*baarf*) and then... WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED? I just don't understand...

A bit earlier into the thread of the above quote:

Elena is the type of person who doesn't have any tools besides kindness to deal with conflicts, she was raised to say "Yes" and be subservient basically.
The game Mars suggests is just a distraction, Elena in that situation had no other option. From Mars' perspective, the most efficient option is to torture or rape her until she sees things his way. Soft methods like he has used with Cecille wouldn't work, so he tried to improvise something to avoid extreme methods of persuasion.

Elena is essentially a secondary heroine, the main heroines being Cecille and Sera. So not only storywise, slow corruption wouldn't work for Elena, but I wasn't interested in it. I wanted to layer a different style of corruption that contrasts with Cecille and the other heroines.

But yeah, some easing-in can definitely help. I'm still not done tweaking her part of the story. It still needs quite a bit of polish.

She says "Yes" and is subservient, because she is a good (the best!) mother, and as such 100% loyal as Vi is to Mars, and *not* because she is a slave or got trained/humiliated. "Torture and rape" isn't a different style of corruption that contrasts with Cecille and Sera at all, in fact you're doing exactly the same thing to Erina, just much worse and a lot cheaper (blackmail, threats of violence, ...). It's weak. And if you think BDSM is only about "training" and humiliation, then you don't get BDSM at all. It's (generally) not ment to be mean to each other; it's supposed to be the exact opposite, you're pampering and taking care of each other - ROUGHLY - sure, but that doesn't mean your a mean bully, doing something to someone else that isn't welcome. (of course Elena doesn't know what she wants or needs, hence some FORCE is required, UNTIL SHE LIKES IT, but that's a different story...)

I feel as if Elena suddenly just getting very subservient to Mars and accepting his game (which feels contrived and kinda...asspull-y, no offense...really, erin cards?) because she literally got Deus Ex Machina'd is just eh. There could have been a better way to write that, with more easing into it, I think.

I know, right?


Anyways, I finished that one scene (the last of Elena arc with a Day X title, I believe)... and if you're curious, here's how that went down for me:
The Elena arc diaries: Day 30

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[petersenk]

Good news, everyone!
My boner is back!



We're so back, boys!

EDIT/P.S.: This scene should have the "Day X" titles (and go on for quite a number of days, just as a joke...), not the Erina arc days.
Way more funny. hahaha

 

[KyngC]

Does he no longer show up here? He seemed to frequent the thread quite often, at least in the early days (I still haven't cought up reading through the thread, but by now I can't wait to read how other anons liked the Elena arc).

Nah he still comes here sometimes. It just seems like you put a lot of thought into these "ramblings", so it would be shame Nitro didn't see them any time soon. But if like you said, there more of self-therapeutic thing then anything, just keep doing what your doing. (Also yes your ramblings are fun)

 

[Hfap5]

[/SPOILER]
[/CITA]

Pay attention Thorfinn, you have no enemies, no one has enemies. No one in this world deserves to be hurt

I don't know you, my comment is towards the creator of this good game

 

[Count_Unvailable]

Save file 100% v0.4.9

 

[eddardbolton]

is there a walkthrough for this game? or like, a wiki or something? i went through like 8 pages of the thread and ngl, every comment is a fucking thesis. not that i am complaining, the game is fucking fantastic and deserves all this speculation and contribution and that is also what i am looking for. is there a file or a thread where someone has compiled certain elements and key points?

It's completely linear for now with just two bad end branches.

 

[Kulman]

Gotta say, the soundtrack called Thunderbolt3 (in audio folder in game files), is absolutely amazing. It builds up so well.
Feels like something from Made in Abyss or something like that. Really well done.

Other great ones are hariironoumi and sekibaku. Wondering which ones are actually original work.

 

[petersenk]

Nah he still comes here sometimes.

Well, perfect. So he will either chose to read my shit, or not, and then he will chose to think about it, or not, and then he might chose to engage with me (or my ideas), or not. It's all up to him, and I won't pressure anyone. And yes, shitposting (i.e. my ramblings) is first and foremost a fun activity all in and on itself. That's why we do it for free. hehe

just keep doing what your doing. (Also yes your ramblings are fun)

sure, sure. And then, soon enough, I will fuck back off to go shitposting somewhere else. But I'm glad you had fun reading my ramblings.

Here's some more, and on a more positive/constructive note:

A framework for side-character "end-game"
I'm assuming a proper RPGM chibi map/world (as outlined), and will illustrate the idea with the example of Iris, the lewd maid (that I still didn't get to lewd - at all - for some unholy reason...).

First things first, and generally speaking:

• A side-character is either still unsolved (free, or undecided), or it has reached its "end-game" (or end state) due to the players actions.
  
  
• If still free, the side-character has its own cycle on the map and offers interaction options so the player can bring the side-character to its "end-game". The side-character (or its chibi) may be stuck in some place indefinitely, or it switch places, or even roam the map as seems fit (so much room for fun activities...).
  
  
• The "end-game" either opens up the side-character to be lewdable indefinitely, or it may entail a non- and never to be lewded state (the side-character may even fuck off for good, or otherwise become unavailable) depending on whether the player brought her to her "good" or "bad" ending (where good and bad are from the perspective of the side-character, and either one could mean that she's now lewdable, or not and never will be).
  Now if the side-character becomes available to be lewded, it will switch into a new "end-game" state and day cycle of fun activities. This doesn't necessarily entail much at all, and in the simplest case there's just a chibi always at the same spot on the map with a heart indicator, available to be lewded and start some repeatable scene, maybe even a "mini-game". But there may be more, with side-characters switching places (to be lewded differently and fire up another lewd scene that is repeatable), freely roam the map, and whatever scripts and fun dynamics that may be fun... (it's the little things).
  And of course, even unavailable/unlewdable "end-game" may still populate the map in some way, or another. There just won't be a heart indicator, ever.

That's the general framework to populate the map with side-characters (naturally there should be quite a few noname chars/chibi too all over the place; ugly gossiping hags and such...) and bring it to (nukige) life - as an ideal complement to the narrative heavy main story/VN and to break it up, so overall pacing is in the hands of the player.
By the point our hero Mars is in the cuck shed together with Elina, there should be already at least a handful of side-characters on the map that can be brought to their "end-game". But not all side-characters should appear from the beginning, or at the same time. Introduce some later on (some daughter returning from boarding school, a new family that settles, some bad girl released from prison, whatever...). Or like Odette that only appears once you "unlock" Yvet first. Having certain conditions for certain side-chars to even show up might be part of the puzzle.

Alright, let's look at an example, and how I imagine my Iris (the lewd maid) "end-game". I'm assuming an inn with, say 2 floors and a bunch of rooms for the guests, and maybe an utility room, and what not. The theme of Iris "end-game" is free-use:

• If the player enters the inn, Iris is placed in a random room and cleans something (or some other activity). This also determines her lewdable position for the scene (e.g. she might be cleaning standing, on a ladder, bent over or be on all four on the flour or something). Slap a heart icon on her. Now Mars is free to come by and lewd her. See that image I've just posted earlier with Cecille showing off her ass? Something like this (depending on the position), then a small "mini-game" where you can feel her up or just push it in or whatever you feel like. hahaha. Anyways, just define a bunch of such positions throught the inn and have a fitting scene for each of them.
  
  
• Have an Iris timer that randomly resets after a (fairly) short while, and just make chibi Iris switch rooms to go clean (or whatever) another room, to be lewded elsewhere. Maybe have a lewdable scene for when she's moving and you catch her in the floor...
  
  
• Occasionally/randomly Iris may be stuck somewhere (switch heart indicator to confused/angry indicator). In the washing machine, under the table, in the couch, the dumbest, most tropiest shit for being stuck to get fucked things you can imagine. And you can imagine the rest. hehe I think it's funny, but that's just an optinal idea; not necessary, but it would be fun to do. And that's the beauty of these nukige side-characters.

Oh, oh! And let's quickly talk about an unavailable/unlewdable state for iris: You mess it up, one way or another, and so Iris fucks off (for good) and quits her job at the inn. What now happens is that the inn hires a new maid, but unfortunately the new maid isn't lewd or sexy at all, but still a fantastic maid (feel free to make it a point and let the inn be super dirty all the time with iris, with rubbish objects and such all over the place, maybe even dirty textures/walls or what not, and as soon as the new, ugly, but competent maid is here, you switch the inn to be perfectly clean from here on out... pretty good, eh?). Just not lewd. Or lewdable. You fucked up, Iris will never come back. You suck and this is your price. The end.


And yes, totally guilty: I just wanna see more original and lewd (side-)characters from nitrolith. SHOW US WHAT YOU'VE GOT. hahaha. Also I can imagine that writing and implementing such side-characters is actually a really fun activity. There's no pressure, things may be short and sweet and then fuck it, or you can go places too, if you have a fun idea...

 

[destroyerofassholes]

Well, perfect. So he will either chose to read my shit, or not, and then he will chose to think about it, or not, and then he might chose to engage with me (or my ideas), or not. It's all up to him, and I won't pressure anyone. And yes, shitposting (i.e. my ramblings) is first and foremost a fun activity all in and on itself.

Nitro used to be very active here but now he only comes after an update and remains for a day or two. He also does not really answer criticism anymore. He used to answer a lot of shit here. Though your comments are rather...unrepliable in format.

 

[nitrolith]

Gotta say, the soundtrack called Thunderbolt3 (in audio folder in game files), is absolutely amazing. It builds up so well.
Feels like something from Made in Abyss or something like that. Really well done.

Other great ones are hariironoumi and sekibaku. Wondering which ones are actually original work.

Thunderbolt3 is a track made by a friend of mine, it's inspired by this track:

You must be registered to see the links

hariironoumi and sekibaku on the other hand are tracks I found on a Japanese website for royalty free music.

Well, perfect. So he will either chose to read my shit, or not, and then he will chose to think about it, or not, and then he might chose to engage with me (or my ideas), or not. It's all up to him, and I won't pressure anyone. And yes, shitposting (i.e. my ramblings) is first and foremost a fun activity all in and on itself. That's why we do it for free. hehe


sure, sure. And then, soon enough, I will fuck back off to go shitposting somewhere else. But I'm glad you had fun reading my ramblings.

Here's some more, and on a more positive/constructive note:

A framework for side-character "end-game"
I'm assuming a proper RPGM chibi map/world (as outlined), and will illustrate the idea with the example of Iris, the lewd maid (that I still didn't get to lewd - at all - for some unholy reason...).

First things first, and generally speaking:

• A side-character is either still unsolved (free, or undecided), or it has reached its "end-game" (or end state) due to the players actions.
  
  
• If still free, the side-character has its own cycle on the map and offers interaction options so the player can bring the side-character to its "end-game". The side-character (or its chibi) may be stuck in some place indefinitely, or it switch places, or even roam the map as seems fit (so much room for fun activities...).
  
  
• The "end-game" either opens up the side-character to be lewdable indefinitely, or it may entail a non- and never to be lewded state (the side-character may even fuck off for good, or otherwise become unavailable) depending on whether the player brought her to her "good" or "bad" ending (where good and bad are from the perspective of the side-character, and either one could mean that she's now lewdable, or not and never will be).
  Now if the side-character becomes available to be lewded, it will switch into a new "end-game" state and day cycle of fun activities. This doesn't necessarily entail much at all, and in the simplest case there's just a chibi always at the same spot on the map with a heart indicator, available to be lewded and start some repeatable scene, maybe even a "mini-game". But there may be more, with side-characters switching places (to be lewded differently and fire up another lewd scene that is repeatable), freely roam the map, and whatever scripts and fun dynamics that may be fun... (it's the little things).
  And of course, even unavailable/unlewdable "end-game" may still populate the map in some way, or another. There just won't be a heart indicator, ever.

That's the general framework to populate the map with side-characters (naturally there should be quite a few noname chars/chibi too all over the place; ugly gossiping hags and such...) and bring it to (nukige) life - as an ideal complement to the narrative heavy main story/VN and to break it up, so overall pacing is in the hands of the player.
By the point our hero Mars is in the cuck shed together with Elina, there should be already at least a handful of side-characters on the map that can be brought to their "end-game". But not all side-characters should appear from the beginning, or at the same time. Introduce some later on (some daughter returning from boarding school, a new family that settles, some bad girl released from prison, whatever...). Or like Odette that only appears once you "unlock" Yvet first. Having certain conditions for certain side-chars to even show up might be part of the puzzle.

Alright, let's look at an example, and how I imagine my Iris (the lewd maid) "end-game". I'm assuming an inn with, say 2 floors and a bunch of rooms for the guests, and maybe an utility room, and what not. The theme of Iris "end-game" is free-use:

• If the player enters the inn, Iris is placed in a random room and cleans something (or some other activity). This also determines her lewdable position for the scene (e.g. she might be cleaning standing, on a ladder, bent over or be on all four on the flour or something). Slap a heart icon on her. Now Mars is free to come by and lewd her. See that image I've just posted earlier with Cecille showing off her ass? Something like this (depending on the position), then a small "mini-game" where you can feel her up or just push it in or whatever you feel like. hahaha. Anyways, just define a bunch of such positions throught the inn and have a fitting scene for each of them.
  
  
• Have an Iris timer that randomly resets after a (fairly) short while, and just make chibi Iris switch rooms to go clean (or whatever) another room, to be lewded elsewhere. Maybe have a lewdable scene for when she's moving and you catch her in the floor...
  
  
• Occasionally/randomly Iris may be stuck somewhere (switch heart indicator to confused/angry indicator). In the washing machine, under the table, in the couch, the dumbest, most tropiest shit for being stuck to get fucked things you can imagine. And you can imagine the rest. hehe I think it's funny, but that's just an optinal idea; not necessary, but it would be fun to do. And that's the beauty of these nukige side-characters.

Oh, oh! And let's quickly talk about an unavailable/unlewdable state for iris: You mess it up, one way or another, and so Iris fucks off (for good) and quits her job at the inn. What now happens is that the inn hires a new maid, but unfortunately the new maid isn't lewd or sexy at all, but still a fantastic maid (feel free to make it a point and let the inn be super dirty all the time with iris, with rubbish objects and such all over the place, maybe even dirty textures/walls or what not, and as soon as the new, ugly, but competent maid is here, you switch the inn to be perfectly clean from here on out... pretty good, eh?). Just not lewd. Or lewdable. You fucked up, Iris will never come back. You suck and this is your price. The end.


And yes, totally guilty: I just wanna see more original and lewd (side-)characters from nitrolith. SHOW US WHAT YOU'VE GOT. hahaha. Also I can imagine that writing and implementing such side-characters is actually a really fun activity. There's no pressure, things may be short and sweet and then fuck it, or you can go places too, if you have a fun idea...

uuuuuuuh... that's quite a lot.

Your ideas are interesting for sure but to be frank, I don't want to stretch the game development more than necessary. It's already too ambitious to solodev as it is. Also the story and most things are already outlined in my specification document which I don't veer too much from.
For context, this game is something I started as a practice game, to teach myself how to draw. For example, the NPCs are just an excuse to practice character design. I even started with C-tier generic ideas like demon lord, hero ect to experiment as well as not explain certain things.

I honestly never expected to get this much eyes on it.

Nitro used to be very active here but now he only comes after an update and remains for a day or two. He also does not really answer criticism anymore. He used to answer a lot of shit here. Though your comments are rather...unrepliable in format.

It's mainly because I find forums as a slow way to exchange ideas, I started to prefer DMs or discord as it's fast and efficient.

 

[petersenk]

uuuuuuuh... that's quite a lot.

You're welcome.

I don't want to stretch the game development more than necessary.

Understandable.

For context, this game is something I started as a practice game, to teach myself how to draw. For example, the NPCs are just an excuse to practice character design.

And we all love it, you're developing a lovely style. Why not put in some more side-characters, to practice some more (hehe)? But not too much practice, you need to keep some of that wonkyness, which is super charming.

I honestly never expected to get this much eyes on it.

Well, that's just how things go. Success often comes totally unexpected. Why not take the opportunity and really polish this? That is also an important part of game development, and the final 10% are always the worst... Just imagine half-assing HPMF, only to put all your heart (and polish) in the next game that flops spectacularly for some unholy reason. That would break my heart.
HPMF - on the other hand - is beloved, you can easily tell, and there are a lot more anons out there that are absolutely going to love the shit out of it as well, if your discord shills would put in a bit more effort, that is (just kidding; then again, some shilling will be needed, that's just how things work, I guess...).

I did read, you already have plans for another game, smaller in scope, so sure, you wanna finally move on and do that. And I'm certainly not going to hold you hostage, or anything. Still, I'd suggest you at least reconsider, with a new look on HPMF and regard it not as almost finished, but as a very successful prototype. And then you duke it out... or don't. I say: it would be totally worth it.

Is your new game going to have a proper RPGM chibi world? If so, why not use HPMF to already get used to it?
And while I'm talking out of my ass now, but couldn't HPMF also be a great success on the japanese market? Use the rewrite opportunity to properly localize the game, and MTL the shit out of it. I do believe there are some english games out there that did that, offered a japanese version and sold it on DLsite or what not. Maybe try to contact one of those devs that went this route, to see how that worked out for them? There may be some good money to be made this way? Well, maybe not. I don't know.

Anyways, it's nice you've showed up again, have a good time and all the best.

I find forums as a slow way to exchange ideas, I started to prefer DMs or discord as it's fast and efficient.

Speed isn't important. Good things need to be pondered about, and slept a night or two over it. Or maybe I'm just getting old... hehe.


Anyways...


And if you're still with me, some more ramblings:

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.