In Space

DarthSeduction

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So, I have a problem... every time I read the words "In Space" in a game's description or title I hear it in that cheesy narrator shouting "IN SPAAACE!!" behind it.

What bugs me is that I actually really enjoy sci-fi, but every time I look at the descriptions for one of these games I immediately wonder, do these games have a narrative purpose for being set in space, or is it just a setting change for a story that could just as easily take place on earth.

Anyone have thoughts on this? Am I alone in this?
 

redknight00

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Heresy, everything is better when in space :mad:

On a more serious note, the setting, as much as anything in a well planned game, should play a important role in the story and gameplay, enough that it should be recognizable on its own even when devoid of the characters.

That said, it's a good gimmick as any to spice a story, I can't quite complain when people try new things.
 
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Gomly1980

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Starship Inanna is probably the only one i've played with the plot revolving around space and other species.

Spaced Out is great but it could be set anywhere.
 
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Dparx

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they could say
"on Starbase .... " or "The Colony of ??? " space is just so boring :p
 

Random

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Simple test: Change aliens to orcs, or elves, whichever seems most appropriate. Change the setting to medieval times. Does the story seem to suffer for it? If yes, then yes, space is necessary to the story. If no, then the story is probably pretty weak to begin with. Magic and fantasy should be nearly diametrically opposed to good sci-fi. There are a very, very few stories that would work in both of those settings without massive changes. That's my test for both sci-fi and high fantasy, if I can switch the setting between the two without noticing any degradation of the story, the story is probably pretty weak.
 

Zippity

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So, I have a problem... every time I read the words "In Space" in a game's description or title I hear it in that cheesy narrator shouting "IN SPAAACE!!" behind it.

What bugs me is that I actually really enjoy sci-fi, but every time I look at the descriptions for one of these games I immediately wonder, do these games have a narrative purpose for being set in space, or is it just a setting change for a story that could just as easily take place on earth.

Anyone have thoughts on this? Am I alone in this?
I think it depends on the visual novel/game, as to whether it's just a pointless setting to seem different, or if it actually goes full board with the whole sci-fi theme in space... Of course, being more into the narrative of a VN/Game I would prefer the setting had some purpose and influence over the story beyond just being a place for stuff to happen... You could ask all the same questions about post-nuclear fall-out shelter settings as well... Is it just a place for it to happen, or will there be more to it then just that?

Sometimes, you get a VN/Game set in space, and it may have a few doodads that befit the space setting or sci-fi setting, but in the end it plays such a minor role, because those little doodads were just window dressing to help portray the locations existence in the story, without actually meaning much...

I find it hilarious when you get what first seems to be a sci-fi based space story, but most of the story takes place on planets where it's all High Fantasy, or Modern Day, or Historical Earth like, etc... It's like the story can't make up its mind on what setting it wants to stick with... So it just included it all...
 

DarthSeduction

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Simple test: Change aliens to orcs, or elves, whichever seems most appropriate. Change the setting to medieval times. Does the story seem to suffer for it? If yes, then yes, space is necessary to the story. If no, then the story is probably pretty weak to begin with. Magic and fantasy should be nearly diametrically opposed to good sci-fi. There are a very, very few stories that would work in both of those settings without massive changes. That's my test for both sci-fi and high fantasy, if I can switch the setting between the two without noticing any degradation of the story, the story is probably pretty weak.
Eh, I have no problem with high fantasy existing in space though. As you may or may not gather from my avatar and name. There's nothing sci-fi about star wars, its a fantasy, or as its more commonly known, space opera.
 

Zippity

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Eh, I have no problem with high fantasy existing in space though. As you may or may not gather from my avatar and name. There's nothing sci-fi about star wars, its a fantasy, or as its more commonly known, space opera.
Actually, Star Wars is a Western in space... The bad guys wear black, the good guys wear white... They have shoot-ups, and bar fights, damsels in distress, etc... rofl... I took a cinema class a long time ago, and one of the class projects was sitting down in separate groups, tearing apart the 1977 Star Wars movie into it's basic components, and analyzing how time works in movies, etc... Twas a very fun course...

High Fantasy in Space is just mixing 2 things, what I was mentioning is when the number of settings is practically infinite without any good explanation as to why... At least Stargate SG-1 gives reasons for all the different settings, and same with Firefly... But I've played a couple sci-fi visual novel/games, where you don't get a feasible explanation, it's just what it is...
 

DarthSeduction

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Actually, Star Wars is a Western in space... The bad guys wear black, the good guys wear white... They have shoot-ups, and bar fights, damsels in distress, etc... rofl... I took a cinema class a long time ago, and one of the class projects was sitting down in separate groups, tearing apart the 1977 Star Wars movie into it's basic components, and analyzing how time works in movies, etc... Twas a very fun course...

High Fantasy in Space is just mixing 2 things, what I was mentioning is when the number of settings is practically infinite without any good explanation as to why... At least Stargate SG-1 gives reasons for all the different settings, and same with Firefly... But I've played a couple sci-fi visual novel/games, where you don't get a feasible explanation, it's just what it is...
The original star wars, especially a new hope, is a western. However the series as a whole is a fantasy series. Especially when you take in the deeper lore, like what you see in Clone Wars or Rebels. The advantage of the fact that each story is self contained, combined with its franchise, is that each film can take on its own genre as necessary. You can have a spy film set in the galaxy far far away, Han Solo is planned to be a western. Rogue one was a heist film. So while the elements of the western are baked into the original trilogy, the overarching story is one of fantasy.

Also, none of the things you listed, beyond the "shoot-ups" are exclusive to westerns. Sauron and his black plate armor, gandalf and his white robes. Bar fights happen in lots of eras. Damsels in distress are pretty basic to all genre.
 
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Zippity

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The original star wars, especially a new hope, is a western. However the series as a whole is a fantasy series. Especially when you take in the deeper lore, like what you see in Clone Wars or Rebels. The advantage of the fact that each story is self contained, combined with its franchise, is that each film can take on its own genre as necessary. You can have a spy film set in the galaxy far far away, Han Solo is planned to be a western. Rogue one was a heist film. So while the elements of the western are baked into the original trilogy, the overarching story is one of fantasy.

Also, none of the things you listed, beyond the "shoot-ups" are exclusive to westerns. Sauron and his black plate armor, gandalf and his white robes. Bar fights happen in lots of eras. Damsels in distress are pretty basic to all genre.
I was just referring to the original Star Wars, not the entire saga... You see a lot of similar themes used in various different movies and books... lol...
 
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Random

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Eh, I have no problem with high fantasy existing in space though. As you may or may not gather from my avatar and name. There's nothing sci-fi about star wars, its a fantasy, or as its more commonly known, space opera.
I'm a fan of the Star Wars universe, in a general sense, not necessarily the movies, but a few of my favorite books come from that franchise, so I'm familiar enough with it. Is it Sci-Fi, or fantasy? It is sci-fi. You can not transpose the Star Wars storyline into a high fantasy setting and have it still make sense. It works because its setting has access to high technology, and the locations can be massively different from one planet to another, allowing for multitudes of cultures and planet types within 'easy reach' of each other. That doesn't work well in any fantasy setting.

To illuminate my point a little, the Lord of the Rings tries to give some reason for all the different cultures to exist within contact of one another. We ended up with some of the longest, most complained about travel sequences in all of fiction. J.R.R. couldn't just say 'they switched on the hyper drive, and fell asleep. Poof they appeared in orbit around Mordor.' Granted, I doubt he would've either way, but it is a very different story device when you have to allow months, or years for your characters to get from place to place, or simply can cut it out by invoking medical comas, and ftl travel.
 

spambot

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For me, sci-fi is just a gimmick that serves as the initial hook. A story, sci-fi or otherwise, is only as good as its ability to comment or reveal something meaningful about the human experience. Take the best sci-fi movies from recent years for example, Arrival is ultimately a meditation about parenthood and destiny; Marjorie Prime is a study of human relationships and how we project ourselves onto others; while Colossal is a literal blowing-up of our neuroses and anxieties, as well as a sharp commentary about contemporary gender relations.

Just as a detailed study of the aerodynamics of the alien crafts would be pointless in Arrival, whether or how something takes place "in space" should ideally be irrelevant and unobtrusive, quickly fading away to allow the audience to focus on the "real" story.
 

DarthSeduction

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I'm a fan of the Star Wars universe, in a general sense, not necessarily the movies, but a few of my favorite books come from that franchise, so I'm familiar enough with it. Is it Sci-Fi, or fantasy? It is sci-fi. You can not transpose the Star Wars storyline into a high fantasy setting and have it still make sense. It works because its setting has access to high technology, and the locations can be massively different from one planet to another, allowing for multitudes of cultures and planet types within 'easy reach' of each other. That doesn't work well in any fantasy setting.

To illuminate my point a little, the Lord of the Rings tries to give some reason for all the different cultures to exist within contact of one another. We ended up with some of the longest, most complained about travel sequences in all of fiction. J.R.R. couldn't just say 'they switched on the hyper drive, and fell asleep. Poof they appeared in orbit around Mordor.' Granted, I doubt he would've either way, but it is a very different story device when you have to allow months, or years for your characters to get from place to place, or simply can cut it out by invoking medical comas, and ftl travel.
Replace ships with portals via magic. Blaster technology with enchanted weapons. Large technological achievements with complex magical constructs. You could absolutely tell the exact same story with a fantasy setting. More importantly, the hyperdrive in and of itself doesn't operate within the laws of physics. As any youtuber worth their salt can tell you, the star wars franchise fails to show any sort of time dilation. In spite of the fact that some characters are constantly moving faster than the speed of light, they don't arrive back home to find everyone they ever knew or cared about has aged and died. Lightsabers, if hot enough to melt through blast doors like butter, would ignite the clothing on your body upon ignition. If you struck someone with a lightsaber, they'd explode into a bloody mist, as the heat immediately vaporizes the liquid content of their bodies.

Sci-fi is given some leeway in its science, for narrative purposes. However its not granted so much leeway as to make acceptable what occurs in a galaxy far far away. The existence of technology in star wars is taken for granted, and its very inconsistent. Sci-fi, however, like Mass Effect, tries so hard to explain its world through science. You've got random space cadets talking about kinetic kill projectiles in space, you've got the omni-tool's description in the Codex, you've got Element Zero and its weird quantum mechanical abberations. Speaking of Quantum Mechanics, you've got their faster than light communication through linked particles technology. You've got the Mass Effect drives themselve's, the game's overall explanaition for their ability for FTL travel. Still no time dilation, somehow... Regardless, there's a huge difference in how science fiction and science fantasy handle technology. Star wars could be told without typical science, Mass Effect could not.

For me, sci-fi is just a gimmick that serves as the initial hook. A story, sci-fi or otherwise, is only as good as its ability to comment or reveal something meaningful about the human experience. Take the best sci-fi movies from recent years for example, Arrival is ultimately a meditation about parenthood and destiny; Marjorie Prime is a study of human relationships and how we project ourselves onto others; while Colossal is a literal blowing-up of our neuroses and anxieties, as well as a sharp commentary about contemporary gender relations.

Just as a detailed study of the aerodynamics of the alien crafts would be pointless in Arrival, whether or how something takes place "in space" should ideally be irrelevant and unobtrusive, quickly fading away to allow the audience to focus on the "real" story.
Arrival, however, relies heavily on the scientific plot to get you to arrive at its conclusions. Without the alien presence and the process of learning their language we never accept the idea that non linear thinking results in experiencing time in a non linear fashion as well. In order to make its commentary on family, and the value of such regardless of outcomes, it relied on its science.

I haven't seen either of the other two movies you mentioned, but lets not forget Ex-Machina. As usual, we used AI in this film to explore the human condition, what does it mean to be human? What is amazing about Ex-Machina, is that while Ava is doing her turn to the villain, as almost all AI do in film, we root for her, because we empathised with her and see her escape as empowering her and giving her freedom. In the end, we accept her humanity.

Then you have something like the recent Bladerunner sequel, again exploring what it means to be human, only this time through the lens of a replicant. We aren't following the human in this story, but the replicant. We feel as he feels, we know what he knows, we desire what he desires. The commentary on the human condition through science fiction necessitates the science.

So, going back to my original comment, is there a narrative purpose to set your game in space? Is that setting integral to telling the story as it is meant to be told, or is it simply frogs breath added to disguise the flavor and aroma of the deadly nightshade you're using to poison us so you can escape again as usual?
 
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Random

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Replace ships with portals via magic. Blaster technology with enchanted weapons. Large technological achievements with complex magical constructs. You could absolutely tell the exact same story with a fantasy setting. More importantly, the hyperdrive in and of itself doesn't operate within the laws of physics. As any youtuber worth their salt can tell you, the star wars franchise fails to show any sort of time dilation. In spite of the fact that some characters are constantly moving faster than the speed of light, they don't arrive back home to find everyone they ever knew or cared about has aged and died. Lightsabers, if hot enough to melt through blast doors like butter, would ignite the clothing on your body upon ignition. If you struck someone with a lightsaber, they'd explode into a bloody mist, as the heat immediately vaporizes the liquid content of their bodies.

Sci-fi is given some leeway in its science, for narrative purposes. However its not granted so much leeway as to make acceptable what occurs in a galaxy far far away. The existence of technology in star wars is taken for granted, and its very inconsistent. Sci-fi, however, like Mass Effect, tries so hard to explain its world through science. You've got random space cadets talking about kinetic kill projectiles in space, you've got the omni-tool's description in the Codex, you've got Element Zero and its weird quantum mechanical abberations. Speaking of Quantum Mechanics, you've got their faster than light communication through linked particles technology. You've got the Mass Effect drives themselve's, the game's overall explanaition for their ability for FTL travel. Still no time dilation, somehow... Regardless, there's a huge difference in how science fiction and science fantasy handle technology. Star wars could be told without typical science, Mass Effect could not.
Sure, the science of Star Wars is bad, no question there. However, when was the last time you were reading a story set in that universe and the thought suddenly popped into your head 'Light sabers are bullshit!' I won't say it never happens, but on a general basis the setting hangs together to pull you into the galaxy far, far away. The setting isn't so glaringly wrong that it instantly triggers your awareness that none of it works, you accept that this plasma torch from hell works like an iron sword. You accept that people can get in a shuttlecraft and flit about like they're on a long haul flight to Paris. Not because they do a great job of explaining it, something Trek, and most modern Sci-Fi got in the habit of, but because the characters treat it as commonplace. Magic works differently, magic works in a fantasy setting because it ISN'T commonplace. Bilbo's birthday party, everyone is impressed by Gandalf's fireworks. They aren't impressed because they see this kind of magic every day, they're impressed because they never see it at all. If I walk through a portal to Sidney, Australia for work every morning, and then walk through another magical portal to New York, NY, USA to meet my fiance for supper, no firework will ever impress me.

Star Wars' setting works exactly BECAUSE it is supposed to be sci-fi. Everyone in the Star Wars universe is intimately familiar with space travel, it's commonplace. So there's no great explanation needed about how Luke ends up on Dagoba, but how the hell did he lift his spaceship out of the swamp without lighting the engines! That's magic. They hand wave away the things that are truly impressive, because they're mundane in their world. The things that we see in Vegas at a magic show scare the crap out of them because they have no experience with them, the force is different, and therefore impressive, or scary.

Would it work in a fantasy setting? Sure, you could pull all the same tricks, hit the same beats. Though you subtly lose something. Why is anyone impressed by Luke suddenly becoming a Jedi in a world where magic is so commonplace that every bar fight is liable to end in a wizard pulling a wand and zapping someone? What's the big deal about being able to charm a soldier with a wave of the hand, and a few simple words 'These are not the droids you're looking for' when yesterday morning those same troopers were getting issued their enchanted platemail, and crossbows of incredibly bad accuracy? Star Wars probably is the worst example of sci-fi in the world, because what they claim as technology could only be explained as magic, and what they use as magic looks like a Penn and Teller rerun. However, it only works storywise because of that dichotomy.
 

DarthSeduction

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magic works in a fantasy setting because it ISN'T commonplace.
Assuming a soft magic system, and some explanation for why only a small percentage of the population is capable of magic. There are plenty of forms of fantasy though. The Kingkiller Chronicles, for instance, uses a hard magic system, it has rules and those rules dictate who can use it and who cannot. Its magic, of which there are two forms, the most common of which is known as sympathy, allows a person to bind and mentally control things to a certain extent, and depending on their own strength as well as other factors. For instance, a person, using sympathy, can light a fire using their own body heat, however, doing so is dangerous, as you could drain your heat so much that you'd die. In that world, using runes, Arcanists are able to create feats of "technology" that utilize sympathy in a way that might as well be sci-fi. One such contraption is made by the main character of the story, it is an object to be hung from a carriage or wagon that repels incoming arrows. It was made using complex sympathetic magic and then sold at as low a price as possible to protect caravans. In this way, though the device is new, magic pervades the world.

Would it work in a fantasy setting? Sure, you could pull all the same tricks, hit the same beats. Though you subtly lose something. Why is anyone impressed by Luke suddenly becoming a Jedi in a world where magic is so commonplace that every bar fight is liable to end in a wizard pulling a wand and zapping someone?
Setting aside that this relies on being original trilogy or later in the series, this is actually where that second form of magic comes in, from Kingkiller chronicles. Naming. In the lore, everything has a name. In fact, the first book is called "The Name of The Wind". However, the names of things aren't something you can study. Naming is something that can only be taught to those with the aptitude, and even then, those who are capable of naming are usually only able to learn a single word or two. True namers however, are able to call upon the wind, or the earth, or Iron, or whatever to bring about great change. Also, there is a barrier for entry before even this. Sympathy, the first magic system, requires an exceptionally cunning mind. You have to be able to convince yourself that something you know to be true, like gravity, is false. Being capable of sympathy is the prerequisite for most of the entrants to the University in the world, and only at the university could you find a person with the knowledge to train a namer.

Kvothe, the main character in the Kingkiller Chronicles is devilishly intelligent. He is one of the youngest to ever enter the university, and he did so without a single coin to his name, leveraging his potential and using his cunning tongue to get them to establish for him a scholarship, with a stipend for living expenses, something they'd never done before. As a result, the things he's able to do, just with sympathy, are amazing even to others who are capable of sympathy, because intelligence is a barrier to power.

Writing a magic system that both makes it prohibitive, but commonplace, isn't impossible, it's just not what we see most often. I chose to use KKC as an example, but I could just as easily have pointed to Dungeons and Dragons, or Dragon Age, or World of Warcraft, where feats of magical power are commonplace enough to where all know of them, but prohibited by aptitude and wealth enough that only few actually have diverse experience with them. Another such example could be found in the hard magic systems of Full Metal Alchemist, or Avatar the Last Airbender, where only a small percentage of people are actively using magic. Alchemy, though presented as science, is very much magic in the world of FMA, and only those who understand the underlying scientific law of equivalent exchange can actually use alchemy. Bending, in the Avatar universe, is not something that everyone can inherently do. Katara is the only bender in the southern water tribe. Most people in their universe are not Benders. And again the avatar is above even that level of mundane magic, in that he is able to access all the elements for the purposes of bending.

Simply put, while Tolkein might be the father of modern fantasy fiction, his vision is but one in a multitude of fantastic fiction. Technology in star wars is a form of minor magic, something mundane enough that any with money can access it, like enchanted items in a fantasy realm. You don't question why a golem is animated, and you don't question how a droid works.
 

Random

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Assuming a soft magic system, and some explanation for why only a small percentage of the population is capable of magic. There are plenty of forms of fantasy though. The Kingkiller Chronicles, for instance, uses a hard magic system, it has rules and those rules dictate who can use it and who cannot. Its magic, of which there are two forms, the most common of which is known as sympathy, allows a person to bind and mentally control things to a certain extent, and depending on their own strength as well as other factors. For instance, a person, using sympathy, can light a fire using their own body heat, however, doing so is dangerous, as you could drain your heat so much that you'd die. In that world, using runes, Arcanists are able to create feats of "technology" that utilize sympathy in a way that might as well be sci-fi. One such contraption is made by the main character of the story, it is an object to be hung from a carriage or wagon that repels incoming arrows. It was made using complex sympathetic magic and then sold at as low a price as possible to protect caravans. In this way, though the device is new, magic pervades the world.



Setting aside that this relies on being original trilogy or later in the series, this is actually where that second form of magic comes in, from Kingkiller chronicles. Naming. In the lore, everything has a name. In fact, the first book is called "The Name of The Wind". However, the names of things aren't something you can study. Naming is something that can only be taught to those with the aptitude, and even then, those who are capable of naming are usually only able to learn a single word or two. True namers however, are able to call upon the wind, or the earth, or Iron, or whatever to bring about great change. Also, there is a barrier for entry before even this. Sympathy, the first magic system, requires an exceptionally cunning mind. You have to be able to convince yourself that something you know to be true, like gravity, is false. Being capable of sympathy is the prerequisite for most of the entrants to the University in the world, and only at the university could you find a person with the knowledge to train a namer.

Kvothe, the main character in the Kingkiller Chronicles is devilishly intelligent. He is one of the youngest to ever enter the university, and he did so without a single coin to his name, leveraging his potential and using his cunning tongue to get them to establish for him a scholarship, with a stipend for living expenses, something they'd never done before. As a result, the things he's able to do, just with sympathy, are amazing even to others who are capable of sympathy, because intelligence is a barrier to power.

Writing a magic system that both makes it prohibitive, but commonplace, isn't impossible, it's just not what we see most often. I chose to use KKC as an example, but I could just as easily have pointed to Dungeons and Dragons, or Dragon Age, or World of Warcraft, where feats of magical power are commonplace enough to where all know of them, but prohibited by aptitude and wealth enough that only few actually have diverse experience with them. Another such example could be found in the hard magic systems of Full Metal Alchemist, or Avatar the Last Airbender, where only a small percentage of people are actively using magic. Alchemy, though presented as science, is very much magic in the world of FMA, and only those who understand the underlying scientific law of equivalent exchange can actually use alchemy. Bending, in the Avatar universe, is not something that everyone can inherently do. Katara is the only bender in the southern water tribe. Most people in their universe are not Benders. And again the avatar is above even that level of mundane magic, in that he is able to access all the elements for the purposes of bending.

Simply put, while Tolkein might be the father of modern fantasy fiction, his vision is but one in a multitude of fantastic fiction. Technology in star wars is a form of minor magic, something mundane enough that any with money can access it, like enchanted items in a fantasy realm. You don't question why a golem is animated, and you don't question how a droid works.

Thanks for the reminder on KKC, haven't read that in ages gonna go back and read it again.

The point was more that they use technology as a setting element. KKC makes the assumption that caravan robberies are common enough that this new technology sells well. But people don't know anything about it, it could be a trick and they don't actually work or do anything at all, and as long as the bandits were in on the scam they'd work just the same way. 'This one has a lamp, he's paid the protection money.' As you say though, they work more like technology because not everyone is familiar with magic. They have an advantage on the late Star Wars universe in that at least they know magic exists, the force more or less being forgotten at a certain point, but little more than that.

My point being, there are ways to turn magic into technology, it is kind of a cop out, but it is done often enough, but magic needs to maintain wonder for people in the fantasy world to care about it. It is always rare, there may be rules on who has it, why they have it, etc, but find me a fantasy series where almost everyone has access to the magic system. Even in worlds prolific with magical toys most of the common people have access to the magical equivalent of a tech gadget, but couldn't make one or even understand the underlying force behind it. Sort of like computers in our world. Nearly everyone has one, several in most cases, but I'd guess less than ten percent of the population could give you a good explanation on why they work, though I suspect that number is increasing year on year as they get more common. Tech is tech, regardless of what underlies it. No matter how many midichlorians you have, it is still magic.
 

spambot

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Jun 10, 2017
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Arrival, however, relies heavily on the scientific plot to get you to arrive at its conclusions. Without the alien presence and the process of learning their language we never accept the idea that non linear thinking results in experiencing time in a non linear fashion as well. In order to make its commentary on family, and the value of such regardless of outcomes, it relied on its science.

I haven't seen either of the other two movies you mentioned, but lets not forget Ex-Machina. As usual, we used AI in this film to explore the human condition, what does it mean to be human? What is amazing about Ex-Machina, is that while Ava is doing her turn to the villain, as almost all AI do in film, we root for her, because we empathised with her and see her escape as empowering her and giving her freedom. In the end, we accept her humanity.

Then you have something like the recent Bladerunner sequel, again exploring what it means to be human, only this time through the lens of a replicant. We aren't following the human in this story, but the replicant. We feel as he feels, we know what he knows, we desire what he desires. The commentary on the human condition through science fiction necessitates the science.

So, going back to my original comment, is there a narrative purpose to set your game in space? Is that setting integral to telling the story as it is meant to be told, or is it simply frogs breath added to disguise the flavor and aroma of the deadly nightshade you're using to poison us so you can escape again as usual?

In the context of this board, I think zero-g sex might be the only thing that requires being in space (though I suppose it's not strictly fiction since we already have space stations, and who know what those kinky astronauts are up to...) If you don't distinguish between sci-fi and fantasy, you can also include inter-species sex on this very short list.

But I think you're asking for more than an obligatory zero-g sex scene in every game set in space. Just better story telling perhaps? After all, I can't think of one sci-fi story that actually NEEDS its sci-fi elements.

Going back to Arrival, I think the entire arrival of the aliens can be taken as a metaphor for the awe and sheer immensity of parenthood, and could have been replaced with some natural phenomenon of equal magnitude--an avalanche perhaps? In this sense, the story of the film doesn't even start until the very end, the essence of which boils down to "how do we cherish something we know to be doomed." The aliens and their non-directional sense of time aren't required because it would be the same story had her child been diagnosed with a fetal birth defect instead.

I haven't seen Ex Machina but I have seen the new Blade Runner, and I think sci-fi is even more unnecessary here. Aside from being told that he's a replicant, what distinguishes Ryan Gosling's character from the archetypal gruff-but-sensitive human male leads found in so many other stories? He and his AI girlfriend are far too sensitive to not be human (or be reworked as human characters). As far as I can tell, the only benefits of sci-fi for Blade Runner are the gorgeous set-pieces, like Ryan Gosling juxtaposed with the giant hologram, or his flying car weaving through the sepia ruins of Vegas.

Maybe good sci-fi stories tend to transcend their genre whereas other types of stories are defined by them. Get Out is a great film because it is a trenchant satire on the contemporary non-white experience, just as Brokeback Mountain is not only a great story of romance, it is an epic story of gay romance. Arrival, on the other hand, cows us with the enormity of an alien invasion, then crystallizes its sci-fi epic to hone in on the human story of one mother and her child.
 

DarthSeduction

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Going back to Arrival, I think the entire arrival of the aliens can be taken as a metaphor for the awe and sheer immensity of parenthood, and could have been replaced with some natural phenomenon of equal magnitude--an avalanche perhaps? In this sense, the story of the film doesn't even start until the very end, the essence of which boils down to "how do we cherish something we know to be doomed." The aliens and their non-directional sense of time aren't required because it would be the same story had her child been diagnosed with a fetal birth defect instead.
It wouldn't, because as the story points out, she lived and died and she knew how it all happened, she knew exactly how it would affect Jeremy Renner's character when he found out, she still did it anyway. The magnitude of her choice given the prescient nature of her understanding was absolutely integral to the story having the emotional punch it does.

He and his AI girlfriend are far too sensitive to not be human (or be reworked as human characters). As far as I can tell, the only benefits of sci-fi for Blade Runner are the gorgeous set-pieces, like Ryan Gosling juxtaposed with the giant hologram, or his flying car weaving through the sepia ruins of Vegas.
Then you missed the significance of the VI girlfriend. She wasn't AI. The same thing she said to him that made him feel special is what the huge ad says to him later, after she's gone, and he's all alone. She felt real, she gave him the feelings he needed, but unlike him, unlike humans, she was just programmed to be who he needed.

In the end, what Sci-fi does best, is allow us to explore morality through the lens of technology. Older sci-fi greats, like 1984, show us a dystopian future, the world controlled by the government's surveillance state, essentially, warning us about how dangerous it is to give up freedoms for security. Most AI stories are about how the things we create are going to destroy us. Movies like Ex Machina and Blade Runner are made to make us consider what humanity is, and the answer is invariably, emotion, empathy. All premises are just an allegory, but sci-fi is the best way to explore complex moral choices, because it gives us a perspective wherein technology or science, has transcended the normal human experience.
 

anne O'nymous

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There's few games which really justify their place in space, but the same can be said about a lot of Sci-Fi stories.
, or are in space because it's behind closed doors. But put them on an isolated, and/or private, island, and you'll have the same story. Even is more a "lost on a stranger land" than a space story. Make them fly on a hot air balloon instead of a starship, and they become 1800's explorers. You don't even need to change the models, when you encounter a new "race" for the first time, they can legitimately seems like orcs for you.
is the only one crossing my mind which, for me, have a story who really take count of the space and isn't just an excuse to use Sci-Fi assets. Still it can be the story of a corsair sent on the trail of the previous vessel, itself sent to explore some part of the seas. Somewhere between Malaysia and Philippine, so there's enough islands to be as much planets, while in the same time each one can have it's one culture with still a common part. And if you put the story on the 19th century or at the start of the 20th century, there will be enough pirates to translate factions part of the story. Too bad that the game is on hold :(

But like I said, the same can be said about a lot of stories taking place in the big dark void. Most of them are just stories of events which can happen now or can have happened in the past. It's just that these particular stories happen in the future.
In the end, among the five I named, Forgotten Paradise is the only one who don't justify at all (at least actually, who know what the story will be in the future) being in the space. The NASA made many experiences where peoples were isolated on a fully closed space for more than six month ; Forgotten Paradise is just this, but in space and with the messed memory thing. The only thing tending to prove that they really are in space is what they see behind the windows. But, they were lied to since the start so, for what we know, they can still be on Earth.
All the other try to put a real Sci-Fi setting behind the story, and so why not "in space".
 

spambot

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Jun 10, 2017
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It wouldn't, because as the story points out, she lived and died and she knew how it all happened, she knew exactly how it would affect Jeremy Renner's character when he found out, she still did it anyway. The magnitude of her choice given the prescient nature of her understanding was absolutely integral to the story having the emotional punch it does.



Then you missed the significance of the VI girlfriend. She wasn't AI. The same thing she said to him that made him feel special is what the huge ad says to him later, after she's gone, and he's all alone. She felt real, she gave him the feelings he needed, but unlike him, unlike humans, she was just programmed to be who he needed.

In the end, what Sci-fi does best, is allow us to explore morality through the lens of technology. Older sci-fi greats, like 1984, show us a dystopian future, the world controlled by the government's surveillance state, essentially, warning us about how dangerous it is to give up freedoms for security. Most AI stories are about how the things we create are going to destroy us. Movies like Ex Machina and Blade Runner are made to make us consider what humanity is, and the answer is invariably, emotion, empathy. All premises are just an allegory, but sci-fi is the best way to explore complex moral choices, because it gives us a perspective wherein technology or science, has transcended the normal human experience.

Actually you missed the point about the two movies. As I've said, Arrival might easily have been about a woman raising, and treasuring every moment with, a daughter who'd been diagnosed with a prenatal defect. The aliens and their sense of time is just a gimmick uneccessary to the crux of the story. As for the AI girl in Blade Runner, she goes through a pinnochio story. She does become "real"--indeed, her experiencing rain for the first time is for me the most exhilarating, and human, scene of the entire movie. Though Ryan Gosling is initially taken with the giant hologram after her demise, she quickly reveal to be just that--a hollow facsimile of the woman he'd lost.

It's interesting you'd bring up 1984 since it's a great example of why the science and technology is actually superfluous in a great sci-fi story. The dystopia of 1984 is distinctly low-tech; in fact, I don't recall any plot points involving non-existent technology--and it's that much better for it.