Just Me Thinking Aloud.

ProjectPharaoh

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Jan 28, 2019
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I sure have noticed many games that have been abandoned. Some of them I have played and actually liked, but hated when the dev just stops in the middle and scraps it. So my question here is why don't developers just work on a game and not release it to the public until it's all done? If you ask me, there are too many good games that have been abandoned which sucks. Just me and my two cents.
 

woody554

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Jan 20, 2018
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because the want money for that sweet new gaming rig. after they get it, bam, awol at v0.3. excuses vary from health problems to death in the family, but it never changes the outcome. just buys them a couple of more months of revenue without doing shit.

I don't really even click on anything under v0.6 anymore because of that. which otoh means I rarely see new games because they never make it that far. so it's mainly waiting for those handful of proven delivers.
 
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ProjectPharaoh

Member
Game Developer
Jan 28, 2019
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Ya I hear ya. But some games haven't been updated in forever like f.i.l.f. which can piss ppl off especially when they are games that have an awesome story. Just hope that games that haven't been updated for so long, when they do finally get updated, they don't have like 10 mins worth of gameplay cause it would suck
 

Sphere42

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Sep 9, 2018
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because the want money for that sweet new gaming rig. after they get it, bam, awol at v0.3. excuses vary from health problems to death in the family, but it never changes the outcome. just buys them a couple of more months of revenue without doing shit.

I don't really even click on anything under v0.6 anymore because of that. which otoh means I rarely see new games because they never make it that far. so it's mainly waiting for those handful of proven delivers.
That is the less charitable interpretation and certainly true for quite a few of them, but in a lot of cases I would also wager someone saw a basic Ren'Py or DAZ tutorial and thought "hey, I can finally make all the raunchy sex scenes exactly how I like them!" only to realise building an actual game takes a signficantly greater amount of work than just that and gave up once they realised they would be spending most of the time fixing menu bugs or shading rather than jiggling tits.

For the "slow update" variety with a decently playable existing release many of them will start getting lost in their own old codebase especially the "artistic" types who never took even a basic programming course. Sometimes projects start off as a collaboration which falls apart, IIRC "Breeding Season" died that way when according to the main dev their artist ran off and revoked all rights for usage of his artwork.
 
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woody554

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Jan 20, 2018
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if there ever is another update after lagging months, it's almost invariably something they clearly threw together in one weekend. when they begin to lag I already count them as abandoned. exceptions are rare.
 

woody554

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Jan 20, 2018
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only to realise building an actual game takes a signficantly greater amount of work...
oh yeah, definitely. if I knew what a colossal convoluted swamp renpy was I would've rather done everything from scratch. at least then anything I needed I could just trivially code myself. nothing past dialogue + backgrounds should ever be done in renpy.

but I don't think that applies to anyone who lets the donations roll after stopping working. they know they're just ripping people off and lying about working on a 'big next update'. it never comes through with those guys.
 

Mimir's Lab

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Sep 30, 2019
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I sure have noticed many games that have been abandoned. Some of them I have played and actually liked, but hated when the dev just stops in the middle and scraps it. So my question here is why don't developers just work on a game and not release it to the public until it's all done? If you ask me, there are too many good games that have been abandoned which sucks. Just me and my two cents.
It's kinda weird. If you take a look here on the forums, barring the games that have been released incrementally over a long period of time, most games that are "completed" get significantly less views and plays than games that are still being worked on. For me, the explanation is the same as why many movies are being made as franchises nowadays; It's because people don't want something they've invested time in to end. I think people come here for an ongoing experience, or at the very least, a long one.

On the dev side, I want to release early because I'm super excited about my VN and want to see how others react. Plus, Iit gives me smaller and easier milestones to shoot for, instead of the monumental task of going 0-100 without any encouragement, guidance, or otherwise. Seriously, try to tackle any large goal in life from 0-100 on your own. It's near impossible to do if you don't have superhuman discipline.
 

Sphere42

Active Member
Sep 9, 2018
926
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It's kinda weird. If you take a look here on the forums, barring the games that have been released incrementally over a long period of time, most games that are "completed" get significantly less views and plays than games that are still being worked on. For me, the explanation is the same as why many movies are being made as franchises nowadays; It's because people don't want something they've invested time in to end. I think people come here for an ongoing experience, or at the very least, a long one.
Make sure to divide the number of views by the number of updates, and if you want to be rigorous by the average number of "next update when?" type posts in between said updates as well. For plays make sure to only count those of the latest version, or again divide by the number of versions. Simple qualitative engagement metrics are utterly useless when comparing different development models.
 

Hadley

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Sep 18, 2017
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If I had to choose the normal Game release structure would definitely be way better. The problem with the monthly updates is that it doesn't really put any pressure on the Devs to actually finish the Game as fast as possible.
 

Joshua Tree

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Jul 10, 2017
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If I had to choose the normal Game release structure would definitely be way better. The problem with the monthly updates is that it doesn't really put any pressure on the Devs to actually finish the Game as fast as possible.
If they had gone with a release when completed, their monetizing returns would been just a drop of what it is with ongoing releases. Majority of the people making these games doesn't do it out of the kindness of their heart and charity to the "fap fap happy"...
 
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Silver

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I think majority of people make games for money only, not because out of passion. Before this site started, I remember developers who make games solely for money had little to no chance to exploit people, because back then it's difficult to find a platform to advertise their games, but nowadays because of sites like these they get a big opportunity to exploit people. So I think these sites (this, and other similar sites) can only address this problem by controlling quality of the content they advertise on their websites. I don't blame this or any other site, I am saying shady developers exploit sites like these to earn money, and it should be stopped. good developers should be rewarded, and shady developers should be penalized by not advertising their games on the site. This is no longer just a pirate site.
 

Joshua Tree

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Jul 10, 2017
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I think majority of people make games for money only, not because out of passion. Before this site started, I remember developers who make games solely for money had little to no chance to exploit people, because back then it's difficult to find a platform to advertise their games, but nowadays because of sites like these they get a big opportunity to exploit people. So I think these sites (this, and other similar sites) can only address this problem by controlling quality of the content they advertise on their websites. I don't blame this or any other site, I am saying shady developers exploit sites like these to earn money, and it should be stopped. good developers should be rewarded, and shady developers should be penalized by not advertising their games on the site. This is no longer just a pirate site.
With monetizing platforms such as Patreon it became more available. But you can find many of these games on torrent sites as well. Like first time I did download Avengers "Son of a bitch" I did that through Piratebay years ago.

Why you want to impose some sort of controlling oversight over these games? What people chose to end up support or not, is more than enough to measure on their success or not. Majority of the creators does this on a hobby basis. Changes to real life situation can more often than not to delay or park projects all together.

This is a pirate site, we abuse creators to get their stuff for free. Raging on them for exploiting you for money at the same time, seems a bit hypocritical. Do you pledge to every creator (of good creators) you play a game of? I know I don't. It is what it is. Bad creators get a bad wrap and users of this site usually won't linger to long support any of them. That they still might pick up a large following on their patreon is not because of sites like this, but because of a whole lot of other sites, where they doesn't necessary have an active community that help weed out what is good, or bad.
 

Cndyrvr4lf

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Jun 16, 2017
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Why you want to impose some sort of controlling oversight over these games? What people chose to end up support or not, is more than enough to measure on their success or not. Majority of the creators does this on a hobby basis. Changes to real life situation can more often than not to delay or park projects all together.
So much Yes. Real life can get in the way of anything. I know I don't live my life to make a bunch of other people happy rather than worry about myself. Granted I think they should all go to a per release system rather than a every month system but that's my opinion not the "way it should be".
 

Joshua Tree

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Jul 10, 2017
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So much Yes. Real life can get in the way of anything. I know I don't live my life to make a bunch of other people happy rather than worry about myself. Granted I think they should all go to a per release system rather than a every month system but that's my opinion not the "way it should be".
Someone a bit down on their luck, and maybe go into creating such games on their free time to help on their economical situation. For them the bills doesn't stop come monthly, and they won't wait until you possible have a update release 3 months down the line. Patreon is after all about support the creators.
 

Hadley

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Sep 18, 2017
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If they had gone with a release when completed, their monetizing returns would been just a drop of what it is with ongoing releases. Majority of the people making these games doesn't do it out of the kindness of their heart and charity to the "fap fap happy"...
By that retarded logic no indie game would make any money.
 

Winterfire

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Sep 27, 2018
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I think majority of people make games for money only, not because out of passion. Before this site started, I remember developers who make games solely for money had little to no chance to exploit people, because back then it's difficult to find a platform to advertise their games, but nowadays because of sites like these they get a big opportunity to exploit people. So I think these sites (this, and other similar sites) can only address this problem by controlling quality of the content they advertise on their websites. I don't blame this or any other site, I am saying shady developers exploit sites like these to earn money, and it should be stopped. good developers should be rewarded, and shady developers should be penalized by not advertising their games on the site. This is no longer just a pirate site.
YES! THIS!
Ban all bad develope... Oh shit, wait... Wait! Nooooo! :eek:
 

Joshua Tree

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By that retarded logic no indie game would make any money.
Majority of successful indie games on like Steam, get released through early access, as they need the support and funding to help complete. Indie developers doesn't have any major backers that pick up the bills while waiting for the game/product to be completed. As indie/hobby creator that use Patreon as monetizing platform, it's way more beneficial to have pledges set to monthly than per release/update. Ongoing expenses is a monthly thing after all.
 

Cndyrvr4lf

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Majority of the creators does this on a hobby basis.
If its a hobby than they have a real day job right?

Majority of successful indie games on like Steam, get released through early access, as they need the support and funding to help complete. Indie developers doesn't have any major backers that pick up the bills while waiting for the game/product to be completed. As indie/hobby creator that use Patreon as monetizing platform, it's way more beneficial to have pledges set to monthly than per release/update. Ongoing expenses is a monthly thing after all.
I'm supporting the creation of a game/artist not paying his bills. I disagree with the whole monthly thing without a release of something other than a brief note with a render about how much stuff they supposedly produced. That's how people get ripped off by developers ghosting but leaving their page on to collect. No wonder people pirate games and stuff. Because were sick of paying for something that sucks or is delayed for one excuse or another.
 

Joshua Tree

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Jul 10, 2017
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If its a hobby than they have a real day job right?



I'm supporting the creation of a game/artist not paying his bills. I disagree with the whole monthly thing without a release of something other than a brief note with a render about how much stuff they supposedly produced. That's how people get ripped off by developers ghosting but leaving their page on to collect.
You can have a good job that pays well and you can have a shitty job paying minimum wages, or you could be a student picking up a unhealthy amount of student loans. Basically anything you not doing full time is a hobby.

So you think that supporting the creator doesn't as well go towards pay their bills? :rolleyes: Supporting the creator leads to the creator being able to do their thing. No support -> no game for you.

Maybe you should start create a game, and spend every free time you can muster up to work on it? Maybe the way you value time would be a bit different?
 

Cndyrvr4lf

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Jun 16, 2017
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You can have a good job that pays well and you can have a shitty job paying minimum wages, or you could be a student picking up a unhealthy amount of student loans. Basically anything you not doing full time is a hobby.
Uh I have a real job and pay my own bills. So if they have a shitty job? Get a better one. Student Loans? Uh US Army paid for my college and I didn't have to pay a dime for it. Maybe don't spend so much to get a degree.
Maybe you should start create a game, and spend every free time you can muster up to work on it? Maybe the way you value time would be a bit different?
Maybe someday but I sure as hell know if I did it would be because I wanted to not because I NEEDED to. I also wouldn't spend all my free time to make it. See my earlier post about living my life for me rather than make a bunch of people happy cause I made a fap game.