Lesbian content in Harem games/getting to know the harem playerbase

[Ayhsel]

I am making a Harem game, and I would like to know the playerbase.

Would you mind your LI having sex with each other?

Would you mind your LI having a romance between them?

A lot of you have strong opinions about it, and I would like to know them.

Aside from that, what do you like/search for in a harem game?

Any suggestions are also welcome!

I think they fact that you are asking these questions already puts me off to read a novel. Seriously, fuck this kind of post!

The amount of people here that believe a game is tailored to them is ridiculous.

My advice is successful games differentiate from unsuccessful games in two things:
1) either they taylor to a specific fetish. In this case, just another "mc is gift from god to women, so even if they are amazing women with their own agenda, they will accept becoming just another number in a group" game, for self insert players.
2) they have strong story, characterization, world building, dialogue.

They key thing is that your approach of how you develop your game will put 1 or 2 on top priority.

In other words, whether some characters would accept conditions of a harem or not should be believable. So if you want a harem, you should device the plot in a way it makes sense. The character and the world setting you create will them answers this questions for you.

Or you can impose them from the beginning and then create the characters and the world around those rules.

If you develop the story and characters before making these decisions, you may find later than different characters may be ok or against the questions you are asking. In my opinion, there is little more off putting than when a character is acting extremely out of character just to please the player.

That is the difference between mindless stupid games like WVM or Grandma's House or something like Pale Carnations.

 

[Magic Harem]

I think they fact that you are asking these questions already puts me off to read a novel. Seriously, fuck this kind of post!

The amount of people here that believe a game is tailored to them is ridiculous.

My advice is successful games differentiate from unsuccessful games in two things:
1) either they taylor to a specific fetish. In this case, just another "mc is gift from god to women, so even if they are amazing women with their own agenda, they will accept becoming just another number in a group" game, for self insert players.
2) they have strong story, characterization, world building, dialogue.

They key thing is that your approach of how you develop your game will put 1 or 2 on top priority.

In other words, whether some characters would accept conditions of a harem or not should be believable. So if you want a harem, you should device the plot in a way it makes sense. The character and the world setting you create will them answers this questions for you.

Or you can impose them from the beginning and then create the characters and the world around those rules.

If you develop the story and characters before making these decisions, you may find later than different characters may be ok or against the questions you are asking. In my opinion, there is little more off putting than when a character is acting extremely out of character just to please the player.

That is the difference between mindless stupid games like WVM or Grandma's House or something like Pale Carnations.

Thank you, I'll think about what you just said. I am aiming for the 2.

 

[Ayhsel]

Thank you, I'll think about you just said. I am aiming for the 2.

Wish you the best luck!

 

[Juerhullycin]

LOL both Pale Carnation and Sexbot are bottom of the Barrel dreck

 

[c3p0]

LOL both Pale Carnation and Sexbot are bottom of the Barrel dreck

Yet, Pale Carnation is a very successful game for Patreon standard, earing around $ 3k to $ 8k what put its on the top 13% of best earing adult games on Patreon. Also it is most likely more successful than My Dorm ($ 4k) and around the same as Grandma's House ($ 4k to $ 11k).

 

[Ayhsel]

LOL both Pale Carnation and Sexbot are bottom of the Barrel dreck

I don't know Sexbot, but what is the metric you are using to make those claims?

 

[JJJ84]

I am making a Harem game, and I would like to know the playerbase.

Would you mind your LI having sex with each other?

Would you mind your LI having a romance between them?

A lot of you have strong opinions about it, and I would like to know them.

Aside from that, what do you like/search for in a harem game?

Any suggestions are also welcome!

I think adding slightly to what Ayhsel said above what I tend to focus more are the following than the whole kink with Harem:

- Lore
- Characterization
- Conflict (While I get I could just say story, I'd say conflict really drives home the story for me in terms engagement)

Spoiler: Simpsons providing another value lesson

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- World building


As for harem specifically though I guess I only have one advice;

With harem, there's following options.

- Full Harem: MC just gets all the LIs (in a single playthrough)
- Partial Harem: harem is only available to only a subset of LIs, and not all. Some LIs are only solo-exclusive routes

Now, given your thread question, my guess is you're leaning towards the former.
But honestly? There is no right answer to the formula.
There are devs who did full harem well, yet there are also devs who did partial harem well.
It all depends on how the story and relationships are believable.

Now, to the brunt of the matter.
Regardless of which route you decide to take, make sure you're 100% concrete clear and sure on it before you start developing your game.
One of the worst thing that can happen is a dev going into the game not sure how MC's relationships with the LIs is defined.
And when you decide on the path (full harem or partial harem), make sure to stick to your guns to the end regardless of what other people say.

Folks may try to pressure you to do otherwise, but stick to your guns. You are the creator, not them.
Yet there are instances where some people put so much pressure on the dev that the dev sometimes caves in.
I've already seen one game where the story and MC's relationships with LIs messed up in a way due to the dev not being firmly set on it from the start and caving in to some players' demands.


So yeah, that's all I gotta say (and enough rant out of me lol).
Good luck with your game.

 

[Magic Harem]

I think adding slightly to what Ayhsel said above what I tend to focus more are the following than the whole kink with Harem:

- Lore
- Characterization
- Conflict (While I get I could just say story, I'd say conflict really drives home the story for me in terms engagement)

Spoiler: Simpsons providing another value lesson

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

- World building


As for harem specifically though I guess I only have one advice;

With harem, there's following options.

- Full Harem: MC just gets all the LIs (in a single playthrough)
- Partial Harem: harem is only available to only a subset of LIs, and not all. Some LIs are only solo-exclusive routes

Now, given your thread question, my guess is you're leaning towards the former.
But honestly? There is no right answer to the formula.
There are devs who did full harem well, yet there are also devs who did partial harem well.
It all depends on how the story and relationships are believable.

Now, to the brunt of the matter.
Regardless of which route you decide to take, make sure you're 100% concrete clear and sure on it before you start developing your game.
One of the worst thing that can happen is a dev going into the game not sure how MC's relationships with the LIs is defined.
And when you decide on the path (full harem or partial harem), make sure to stick to your guns to the end regardless of what other people say.

Folks may try to pressure you to do otherwise, but stick to your guns. You are the creator, not them.
Yet there are instances where some people put so much pressure on the dev that the dev sometimes caves in.
I've already seen one game where the story and MC's relationships with LIs messed up in a way due to the dev not being firmly set on it from the start and caving in to some players' demands.


So yeah, that's all I gotta say (and enough rant out of me lol).
Good luck with your game.

Thank you very much, I appreciate your comment, I am now working on the base to make it, as you said, concrete clear. These types of comments are great

 

[Ayhsel]

Conflict (While I get I could just say story, I'd say conflict really drives home the story for me in terms engagement)

Good that you mentioned it. I take it soo much for granted that I forget to mention it.

But let me say it with more strength. If you have no conflict, your game it's not a story in my eyes.

If everything is perfect, why would I care to read about your story? If you want the story to continue, there must be conflict to be resolved. Otherwise, end the game.

There is a reason why stories END with "they live happily ever after".

 

[Magic Harem]

Good that you mentioned it. I take it soo much for granted that I forget to mention it.

But let me say it with more strength. If you have no conflict, your game it's not a story in my eyes.

If everything is perfect, why would I care to read about your story? If you want the story to continue, there must be conflict to be resolved. Otherwise, end the game.

There is a reason why story END with "they live happily ever after".

100% true. Conflicts must be there to bear and overcome, with that the characters develop and the story unfolds.

 

[chainedpanda]

I'm not a fan of lesbian content in any game, especially not harem games. I never found it attractive, and used to just skip passed it. However, as time went on a few things began to bug me, most notably MC's reactions, and the expectation that all men love lesbians, and eventually it became something of a pet peeve overall.

To understand why I hate it so much in harem games, we first need to understand what makes a harem game different from non-harem games. Fundamentally, a harem is a power fantasy where multiple characters are devoted to the MC. That could be romance, or submission, either way the core concept remains the same. In the case of adult games, devotion can basically be contributed to emotional and physical devotion. While mental devotion does matter, it's less significant since the stories we tell generally aren't that deep. Even corruption games which should greatly emphasize mental states rarely do in any significant way. There are other forms of devotion as well, but they're not commonly seen in adult games. Thus, once could assume that emotional and physical devotion are the two main pillars for a harem fantasy.

When two harem members have sex with anyone but the MC, one can doubt their physical devotion to him. If they're willing to satisfy their sexual desires with someone else, why do they even need the MC in the first place? Therefore not only impacting the devotion aspect of the fantasy, but also the power aspect.

In some cases, you can argue that they're only doing it to please the MC since it's expected that all men like lesbian (or bi) situations, but ultimately that is part of the mental devotion tree, and as stated that isn't as important of a pillar compared to physical devotion. Therefore, you're sacrificing one pillar for one that's generally less impactful.

Furthermore, it also causes future sexual interactions with the MC to be less impactful. Since the character willingly engaged with others that isn't MC, and likely enjoyed it, that suggests that she doesn't apply emotional weight to sex and it's just for sex. Once that happens, all future interactions events with MC will seem less impactful since the character doesn't have emotional attachment to sex in the first place. Which can make someone doubt their emotional devotion to the player.

If we remove the devotion aspect from the fantasy entirely, therefore making these assumption irrelevant, than is this even a harem game anymore? What makes it different from other power-fantasy games that allows the MC to sleep with anyone at anytime? IMO, there really isn't one. It stops being a harem game, and is basically more-or-less a free use game.

And all of this is ONLY assuming sex between harem members. If we delve into romantic feelings among members, than the problem only increases 100x.

 

[JJJ84]

100% true. Conflicts must be there to bear and overcome, with that the characters develop and the story unfolds.

The thing is, Conflict is one of those things that devs generally tend to say "Oh yes, of course!" but when it actually comes to implementing it, some implement them well, whereas others?..........not so well.

I've seen several games where they start off incredibly strong, but falls just flat in their second update (as the saying goes, Easier said than done lol).
And I'm not saying with conflict, it's always "bam bam bam bam" fights/action/physical altercation all the time.

Conflict can be something verbal or psychological, emotional etc.
But it's gotta be something which keeps the tension so that it doesn't dissipate completely (the dissipate should only be occurring only at the end, as Ayhsel put "happily ever after" finale point).

 

[Magic Harem]

The thing is, Conflict is one of those things that devs generally tend to say "Oh yes, of course!" but when it actually comes to implementing it, some implement them well, whereas others?..........not so well.

I've seen several games where they start off incredibly strong, but falls just flat in their second update (as the saying goes, Easier said than done lol).
And I'm not saying with conflict, it's always "bam bam bam bam" fights/action/physical altercation all the time.

Conflict can be something verbal or psychological, emotional etc.
But it's gotta be something which keeps the tension so that it doesn't dissipate completely (the dissipate should only be occurring only at the end, as Ayhsel put "happily ever after" finale point).

I'll remember that (or try to)

 

[c3p0]

The thing is, Conflict is one of those things that devs generally tend to say "Oh yes, of course!" but when it actually comes to implementing it, some implement them well, whereas others?..........not so well.

I add to that, conflict is what drives a story. It is not the setup when eg. your MC want to be a billionaire what makes the story, but how he does. If he only need to snap with his fingers and everything falls in line, that get boring rather fast. He needs some challenge/confilct whatever they are.
The only "no conflict" game that works is a fuck fest (or life sim) and after you had HJ, BJ, TJ, vaginal, anal, .... with every of the 20 characters it becomes boring if there isn't anything else there. So, even those do good to have a little story that engange the player.
Also I don't need a life sim. I have one already on nightmare setting (highly unfair, randomise stats on max, can't even create/customised your PC, one life with perma death, no save and no load at all) with ultra high graphic and physics settings (every part of the universe is simulated and graphic is indistinguishable from RL).

 

[Ayhsel]

Also I don't need a life sim. I have one already on nightmare setting (highly unfair, randomise stats on max, can't even create/customised your PC, one life with perma death, no save and no load at all) with ultra high graphic and physics settings (every part of the universe is simulated and graphic is indistinguishable from RL).

I have played that game. It sucks!!

 

[c3p0]

I have played that game. It sucks!!

You too? Sure, it does have all that crappy pay to win content in it. But at least it has massive multiplayer support.

 

[Ayhsel]

You too? Sure, it does all that crappy pay to win content in it. But at least it has massive multiplayer support.

Its player base is a bunch of douchebags!

 

[Juerhullycin]

Yet, Pale Carnation is a very successful game for Patreon standard, earing around $ 3k to $ 8k what put its on the top 13% of best earing adult games on Patreon. Also it is most likely more successful than My Dorm ($ 4k) and around the same as Grandma's House ($ 4k to $ 11k).

To my eternal dismay that fact isnt unknown to me. But in the same vain people enjoy Disney slop in quantities that it still makes millions at the box office.

I don't know Sexbot, but what is the metric you are using to make those claims?

My metric is that we talk about harem games and they both have noting of value to add for that specific genre. One of them is full to the brim with cuckshit and whores and the other has unavoidable NTR.

Hell i even concede the point that people say Pale Carnations writing is superb ( i never checked it because i start vomiting from reading the tags in combination alone.) But you will learn nothing from it that helps you make a harem game, I guess it can work as an example of what you shouldn't do.

Its player base is a bunch of douchebags!

worse then the one of League of Legends!

 

[JoeTheMC84]

You mean a small loud and very annoying minority on a minority site?

As has been proved by porn metrics over the last 40 years, Lesbian sex is still in top 3 most searched/watched by men. The annoying voices here a small minority who think all women should devote themselevs to the MC's cock and not even look at each of the other MC's women.

Make the game you want to make. Trying to make a game to cater to people before you've even started it...well...I'll tell you know it will already be a failure.

The metrics on porn sites are irrelevant to what would work for AVNs because AVNs aren’t porn. What you’re saying is like someone going, “Romance novels are the best selling books, so romance movies should be the best preforming movies and do way better than a superhero or action flicks.” But that isn’t the case because movies and books are different things. Using porn as a metric for anything related to AVNs (let alone the content and story as many devs do) will inevitably lead to failures, which we see over and over again on this site. Just my two cents from reading the first page of the thread. Might comment on some other stuff, we’ll see.

 

[c3p0]

The metrics on porn sites are irrelevant to what would work for AVNs because AVNs aren’t porn. What you’re saying is like someone going, “Romance novels are the best selling books, so romance movies should be the best preforming movies and do way better than a superhero or action flicks.” But that isn’t the case because movies and books are different things. Using porn as a metric for anything related to AVNs (let alone the content and story as many devs do) will inevitably lead to failures, which we see over and over again on this site. Just my two cents from reading the first page of the thread. Might comment on some other stuff, we’ll see.

This are the top ten adult games (in number of paid members);


For harem tag:
Only NLT and Adeptus Steve have the Harem tag here.

So from 10 top devs only 2 (on place 7 and 9) make games that have the harem tag - not even saying that those games are harem games in your eyes. Sure, we have 2 or 3 creater her that mostly won't be catergorised as game creator, but even then they are still 7 game dev and for games only dev CyanCapsule doing worse than the games with harem tag.