NTR is a HUMILIATION fetish

[MaskedAcc]

Humiliation This is the key point that is always missed in the endless debates about NTR. The most important thing that makes something NTR is the guy going "I'm such a pathetic loser, I can't please please a woman, now my girlfriend is having sex with a real man and all I can do is jerk off my tiny dick, boohoo." He's being humiliated, and that's what sets NTR apart from other similar seeming porn tropes. This explanation also solves some oddities about the trope, like how it can happen with girls in the MC's family or a girl he just has a secret crush on. There's no reason they shouldn't be having sex with guys who aren't the MC. He's not being cheated on or even really cucked. So why is it clearly NTR? Because the story focuses on the guy feeling humilated because of it.

This is also the case with NTS, a sub-section of NTR. It's still about the humiliation , but it's done consensually and the guy wants it to happen. Real life cuck fetishes also fit in here. The guy is getting off on being humiliated. I don't get it either, but hey, some guys are into getting their balls crushed, to each their own. This why so much NTS porn eventually slips completely into NTR. They're way more similar than people seem to think and the humilition 'play' eventually becoming 'real' is an obvious plot progression.

Things that are not NTR/NTS, with this understanding:

Cheating-There's plenty of porn where a married woman has an affair, but that alone doesn't make it NTR. If the guy getting cheated on isn't the focus or acknowledged in any meaningful way, there's no humilation aspect. The focus is just two hot people having sex, like any vanilla porn.

Sharing/hotwifing- Yes, this also includes a girl having sex with other men, with the guy knowing about it and even watching, but it is not conjuring the same emotions. In real life hotwifing, the guy often feels pride in having, well, a hot wife, or at the very least just using his wife to make porn he can watch in an emotionally neutral way. In porn there is often a master-servant dynamic going on, where the guy is more lending out property than doing something that would cause him humilition

Swinging/open relationships- Again, lots of sleeping around, but everyone involved is explicitly comfortable with what is happening. People are just doing it for fun and there are no negative emotions involved. It's easy to tell the difference when looking at porn that is just happpy swinging fun times, and porn that by all rights should be happy swinging fun times, but the author has one of the guys feel cucked and humilated anyway (looking at you entaglement).

This post will surely end all NTR debates on this website, thank you for coming to my TED talk.

 

[eaudecologne]

This post will surely end all NTR debates on this website, thank you for coming to my TED talk.

Ntr is gay, masochistic yadda yadda

 

[desmosome]

This post will surely end all NTR debates on this website, thank you for coming to my TED talk.

You are talking about cuckold fetish with all that humiliation and rubbing it in to the cuck's face, with optional gay-adjacent themes like cock torture or licking up the cum.

Japanese NTR usually has a corruption focus. Exploring the fall of the woman. Male MC is oblivious to what's happening for most of the game, so he isn't getting humiliated directly until much later in the story as a final payoff for the corruption being completed. Don't get me wrong, humiliation does come as part of the "NTR reveal" near the end of the story, but it's not the focus of the main arc.

So no, you are simply just giving your own interpretation of what you think NTR is.

 

[olaf_yaddax]

This post will surely end all NTR debates on this website, thank you for coming to my TED talk.

 

[tanukk1]

All porn is cuck porn, because other people are having sex and you're paying just to watch.

This post will surely end all NTR debates on this website, thank you for coming to my TED talk.

 

[eaudecologne]

All porn is cuck porn, because other people are having sex and you're paying just to watch.

This post will surely end all NTR debates on this website, thank you for coming to my TED talk.

The only question left then is, if we're watching cartoon porn are we cucked by the cartoon guy or the artist? or is the artist getting cucked by the cartoon guy he himself draws? That's crazy work bro...

 

[MaskedAcc]

You are talking about cuckold fetish with all that humiliation and rubbing it in to the cuck's face, with optional gay-adjacent themes like cock torture or licking up the cum.

Japanese NTR usually has a corruption focus. Exploring the fall of the woman. Male MC is oblivious to what's happening for most of the game, so he isn't getting humiliated directly until much later in the story as a final payoff for the corruption being completed. Don't get me wrong, humiliation does come as part of the "NTR reveal" near the end of the story, but it's not the focus of the main arc.

So no, you are simply just giving your own interpretation of what you think NTR is.

Depends on what you are talking about. That might be true in Japanese games, but I also read a lot of porn comics and that is not the case there. Most doujins have limited page count and simply aren't going to spend a lot of time on the guy just not having any idea what's going on and not involved. Usually he's peeping from the start. Regardless, it's still the case that the humiliation is the important part. There can be as much focus on the girl getting corrupted as you want, but the presence of the cuck to be humiliated is what turns the genre from 'standard' corruption/moral degradation into NTR

 

[SinisterPortal]

Yeah, NTR, NTS and cuckold are all about emotional masochism (or emotional sadism for those who don't self-insert as the cuck). That said, there's plenty of japanese NTS where the husband is not humiliated, but the underlying that he is inferior in sex, premature ejaculator or small dicked is very present even in 'wholesome' novels.

 

[Icarus Media]

NTR fans well used to NTR discussion threads when another dude stands before them making a thread once again to analyse their fetish, personified.

 

[SinisterPortal]

no no, NTR fans should enjoy other people shaming their kink - it is so humiliating! In reality tho, NTR games' threads are the most toxic game threads I've been to, I was even surprised by how furiously people react there. Like, you'd expect these people to be less vulnerable due to being accustomed to humiliation but for some reason the NTR crowd is extremely insecure lol

 

[eaudecologne]

NTR crowd is extremely insecure lol

You should have saved this gem for a separate thread bro

 

[ViralRivalz]

There's really only one way to win an NTR debate, and that's to point out that:

1. NTR is a vague definition that doesn't work as a catch-all term.
2. People who like NTR have different preferences for the specific qualities that fall under that definition.
3. It's complexity should be embraced, not trying to distill it down to a single unifying theory.
4. The debate is generally useless outside of marketing concerns.

 

[Onnivan]

Ha ,you guys couldn't be more wrong .Its not a mental issue or psihologic ,it's biological . Youre spermatozoids actually have a battle and kill other alien spermatozoids. So seeing youre woman get fucked should get you hard as nature means to replace the other guy genetic material. Gelosy ,anger are only on the surface.

 

[SinisterPortal]

You should have saved this gem for a separate thread bro

hehe dw I will never tire of bringing that up when it comes to NTR

 

[eaudecologne]

hehe dw I will never tire of bringing that up when it comes to NTR

It's a hot topic for sure I love discussing it

 

[MaskedAcc]

There's really only one way to win an NTR debate, and that's to point out that:

1. NTR is a vague definition that doesn't work as a catch-all term.
2. People who like NTR have different preferences for the specific qualities that fall under that definition.
3. It's complexity should be embraced, not trying to distill it down to a single unifying theory.
4. The debate is generally useless outside of marketing concerns.

The problem is that the term NTR is so often used as a thought terminating cliche by large population of, if I may be frank, deeply insecure people who just use it as a shorthand for 'anything I don't like or makes me feel uncomfortable.' Just throwing up your hands and going "no one can possibly know what it means! It's all just vibes!" is surrendering the term to having such a broadened definition as to make it meaningless. If people are going to use the term NTR to talk about media (and boy do they ever) and you want to have an intelligent discussion about its complexity, there needs to be some benchmark of agreement about what it does and doesn't include

 

[Letstryitout]

It's definitely one of the fetishes of all time, I'm sure of that.

 

[aifman7]

Yeah the constant reuse and redefining of NTR has even been difficult for some of us who enjoy aspects of those fetishes. It's taken me a pretty long time to learn that I don't actually like NTR in really any of the "defined" forms, my personal preference is more in line with sharing/hotwifing as outlined in the OP. Pimping would be another good way to phrase it too, and it would be a pretty massive stretch to call an actual IRL pimp a cuckold I think, lol.

I don't think there will ever be consensus among western audiences about NTR definitions, due to the variation in content between the different types.

I do wonder if folks in Japanese gooner culture understand the differences between the types of NTR more inherently, since these terms originated there? Or is this the same frustrating topic among those audiences too? I've always been curious about that. Or to phrase my question better: is the difficulty around parsing this topic just because we're seeing it through foggy, poorly-translated lenses?

I really do think that NTR is made into a much bigger "issue" here on F95 simply because it's a catch-all tag that encompasses different types of content that just don't fit together. F95 placing all of the (wildly different) types of NTR under one tag was always asking for trouble. I would almost think it was done intentionally, if not for the poor moderators that have to go in and clean up all of the fallout and arguments that result in game threads over this subject

To compare it to a similarly distinct set of tags, imagine if F95 merged the Male Protagonist, Female Protagonist, and Futa Protagonist tags all into one just named "Protagonist" - technically it's fine, right? They're all the three different types of protagonists! See how this makes no sense? That's exactly the same case for merging the NTR types into one tag, too.

They really shot themselves in the foot by not separating the NTR types into separate tags, but at this point it's probably too late since they've stated many times that it will not be changed. Would probably take too much effort to fix now...

 

[desmosome]

Depends on what you are talking about. That might be true in Japanese games, but I also read a lot of porn comics and that is not the case there. Most doujins have limited page count and simply aren't going to spend a lot of time on the guy just not having any idea what's going on and not involved. Usually he's peeping from the start. Regardless, it's still the case that the humiliation is the important part. There can be as much focus on the girl getting corrupted as you want, but the presence of the cuck to be humiliated is what turns the genre from 'standard' corruption/moral degradation into NTR

If you are talking about hentai manga/doujins, it's even less about humiliation. Because if you had to categorize them as a pov, they would be female protagonist stories.

How can you say it's humiliation focused when >90% of the story is dealing with how the female falls and her thought process/motivation?

There are plenty of stories where the cuck never learns about the cheating. Like the ending is that she goes back to the oblivious guy and act like nothing happened but she has a devious glint and leaking cum in final panel.

If you are talking about humiliation in the abstract sense, then I could agree. There is a character that is being clowned on whether he finds out or not, whether he is prominent in the story or just mentioned for the backstory and comparison to the bull.

 

[MaskedAcc]

If you are raking about hentai manga/doujins, it's even less about humiliation. Because if you had to categorize them as a pov, they would be female protagonist stories.

How can you say it's humiliation focused when >90% of the story is dealing with how the female falls and her thought process/motivation?

There are plenty of stories where the cuck never learns about the cheating. Like the ending is that she goes back to the oblivious guy and act like nothing happened but she has a devious glint and leaking cum in final panel.

If you are talking about humiliation in the abstract sense, then I could agree. There is a character that is being clowned on whether he finds out or not, whether he is prominent in the story or just mentioned for the backstory and comparison to the bull.

If the story is entirely female pov and the guy getting cheated on is just an incidental character who doesn't come up or find out at all, then that's not NTR, that's just regular cheating. You'll notice I already said this in original post. In instances of strictly male pov games where the NTR is 100% closed off to the player (which I know exist although they are far less common than you seem to be letting on) I would argue that it's still about the humiliation of being a cuck, because you the player know about it and is presumably why you are playing the game in the first place. To get that realistic pathetic cuck experience. Humiliation doesn't necessarily mean hardcore masochistic torment.