On slow-burn games and raising up characters

[SpoiledPrince]

I consider to be "slow-burn" games those that take a considerable amount of time on world-building, inviting the readers/players into it, establishing characters and developing them outside the "sex-sphere", setting the rules for the context and such, before the first rewarding porn scene takes place. That is... story-focused games with tons of words where kinky intercourse happens and drives some of the plot points, but it's not the main focus. The kind where you could easily introduce a sexy discretion shot and remain a coherent and enjoyable gaming experience.

Do loads of non-sexual text scare players off?

About the "raising the character" part... I have always liked the idea of getting to know the character from a very early stage and helping him/her become what I intended him/her to be, not just an insta-hero/villain for divine design. Helping them discovering the world at the same time than the readers, with about identical amount of information from the beginning and their guidance. That includes corrupting and twisting their personalities, of course.

Does dedicating an intro (of one or several chapters) to shaping their morals, preferences, initial abilities and beliefs sound appealing to you?
And if it does, what happens if the corruption the MC experiences at your hands is NOT of the sexual kind, but more in the shape of mental issues and traumas, religious fanaticism, prejudices and self-hate?
It could be done by filling a character sheet, but I consider those a bit soulless.

I have been developing a game for some months already, but I have just realized that I never got to make a market analysis for one such as mine (aside from the very kind people who are helping me with directing, translating... Thank you, as always) so I don't know what kind of response to expect.
70k words and counting without being halfway into the intro part, lol.
It's going to be a free game, but still... Knowing its potential would always be nice.

What's your opinion on the subject?

*Thanks and sorry about the broken English.

 

[Cenc]

This is interesting since some of the best VN's I've played would be classed as a slow burn. Personally It's a Visual novel, im there for the story, the mature scenes should compliment it.

Though I do not begrudge a game that has sex as it's main focus. some games are like that, If the developer / writer is upfront about the type of game / VN it is, then more power to the players.

 

[M$hot]

I'd compare it to having a conversation on a train versus reading a book on the train. If the dialogue flows and I'm being stimulated and expected to parttake in some (small) way, I can deal with a large amount of words just fine. My problems are when you're presented an 8 page short essay on a subject I'm NOT YET invested in.

Also, I'm sure it wasn't your intention to skew answers to the poll, but I would still like to clarify. I voted 'The sexual and non-sexual content should be balanced, around 50/50' but I don't agree with the 50/50 part. There should be balance, but it's different for each story and style of game and it depends on the creator.
Do you want a sex game that's got a bunch of text or weave a beautiful narrative that happens to include a bunch of sex? If I know what to expect from a game I won't be disappointed. If I'm expecting simple wanking material with some dialogue in between then a long swathe of story will ruin me. If however I'm told up front, I am okay with that as demonstrated by me booting up the game.

I was raised with 'don't say it, do it' (E.G: 'Don't say you're sorry, let your actions show that you are') so while I'm open to learning about the inner turmoil of a character or why they are making certain moves that seem out of the blue, I don't really want to be told about a change, I want to experience it.
Not to say you can't say some stuff about it but you can even demonstrate it by having weird choices for example. Guy kicks a ball against the side of your door, and along with the 'stay calm' and 'give them a stern talking to and get their insurance information' you sneak the option 'slice his throat, nobody is watching' in there or something. We can clearly feel there's something absurd there. For sure you can say it, but then actions, future dialogue and such need to be in line. If you tell me he's a tortured soul but show me no evidence of it, then I get really annoyed. Either he has traits or he doesn't. An agoraphobic introvert going clubbing means I'm 'Shift+Delete'ing your game.

Find your story, find your voice and then find your own balance. Most guys don't last an hour and most guys can't do it more than 3x a day with vigour. Assuming they sleep/shower/breakfast for 9 hours, that still only has a man spending 20% of his actual time doing sexual stuff. But if he's getting very little action he might spend his entire working day thinking about it, which means his day is 60% sexual content. Like I said, find the balance that fits your story.

Good luck.

 

[215303j]

Generally having a great story makes the sex (much) hotter.
In fact, it is one of the reasons why I play these games and not just watch porn movies.

But the story does need to be great. And not only why we'd want to fuck the girl (or why she wants to fuck the MC) but also the backstory needs to be gripping and interesting. Take my favourite example: Luna from the DeLuca Family. Luna is an amazingly deep character who is both very strong and very vulnerable. She also makes perfect sense in the context of the mafia family story. Without the mafia story, Luna would be more or less just another nutjob and probably safely locked up in some mental hospital. Now that could be another interesting story altogether (the player falling in love with a gorgeous psychopath while working as a male nurse in a psychiatric hospital). But anyway the story needs to be able to stand on it's own, without the sex.

On the other hand, there is also an entirely different kind of game, where the story is rather thin and mostly a backdrop to introduce various characters. These games generally have a lot more sex but the sex generally feels much more shallow.

And there are games which somehow seem to hit the sweetspot: plenty of sex but still within a reasonable and interesting context. My favourite in this context is Midlife Crisis. Even though the story itself is not that interesting, the relationships between the girls as well as the fact that the girls have fairly well developed characters does really make it work for me.

 

[woody554]

I feel like 6 of these choises are the same, ie. "I like nukige" and 2 are "late sexual content is fine." - of those two, I'm always against instant sexual content.

story-wise, if you release tension at the beginning of the story, you could just as well roll credits. no story survives it, and that's why it's so difficult to mix porn with plot.

 

[SpoiledPrince]

Thank you so much for taking your time to answer, guys

Maintaining coherence is important, and it helps showing players their choices matter. I agree with the idea that just saying a character is "X, Y and Z" in a description is dull unless those traits are shown in their behavior several times along the game. A fatal flaw that only gets mentioned or cause trouble once makes no sense. It could very well be omitted.

Characters are not a mere shopping list of merits&flaws, but once some feature makes into that list, it should be taken into account instead of just used for a scene and then discaded. Maybe some time later, when the story gets more complex and the MC goes through different experiences those traits would evolve into different characteristics... or become deeper.

I was a bit worried about gamers feeling frustrated somewhere along the extensive trauma-conga (and world exposition) that is my intro, because sex isn't planned to happen until the last part of the demo, when the character is all grown-up and able to endure it both physical and mentally.
That will be... around 140 or 150k words after the start.
So I guess that in addition to the "story-oriented game" warning I'll have to put that upfront, too.

(I had to google what "nukige" meant, and learned a new word)

 

[M$hot]

SpoiledPrince
Wait hold up, 140-150k Words? 'The average reading speed is 200 to 250 words a minute in non-technical material' I'm all for slow burn, but you're talking 560 to 750 minutes of reading (9h20m - 12h30m) before sex happens. I would say there needs to be something sensual now and then to keep people reading a story for 10 hours before they get to have sex. If you look at the reviews for Glamour and how well received that grind is, you should REALLY indicate very well that the beginning of the game is the way it is.
I'm sure there may be sexy/sensual things on the path to the moment of sex but you are still asking a lot from your audience. If people don't know this up front your story will get reviewbombed to death so you best be super clear. When you said slow burn I expected something in the area of 2-3h of story (24K - 45K words at most). I'm not against the idea, I'm just warning you to clearly earmark it appropriately.
I for one welcome a quality story that happens to eventually have sex but I doubt I'm in the majority.
Either way, good luck.

 

[SpoiledPrince]

SpoiledPrince
Wait hold up, 140-150k Words? 'The average reading speed is 200 to 250 words a minute in non-technical material' I'm all for slow burn, but you're talking 560 to 750 minutes of reading (9h20m - 12h30m) before sex happens. I would say there needs to be something sensual now and then to keep people reading a story for 10 hours before they get to have sex. If you look at the reviews for Glamour and how well received that grind is, you should REALLY indicate very well that the beginning of the game is the way it is.
I'm sure there may be sexy/sensual things on the path to the moment of sex but you are still asking a lot from your audience. If people don't know this up front your story will get reviewbombed to death so you best be super clear. When you said slow burn I expected something in the area of 2-3h of story (24K - 45K words at most). I'm not against the idea, I'm just warning you to clearly earmark it appropriately.
I for one welcome a quality story that happens to eventually have sex but I doubt I'm in the majority.
Either way, good luck.

Arg! 12 hours? That sounds nightmarish haha The 140-150k words would include all branches, that obviously wouldn't be playable in a single run *the initial decision has a big weight, an offers two very different starting statuses and stories until they join again* and there are lots of mutually exclusive choices. Most of the content requires several runs. Otherwise players won't meet some characters, get a curse or a blessing, learn abilities and important things from dialogues. For replayability value, mostly.
It also includes bits about angsty sexual preferences that won't be applicable to those who choose something less... troublesome for the time period.
People who have died due to certain decisions would be alive, you won't be scolded from mistakes you haven't made.
So... I think a first run should be around those 3, 4 hours of reading, yeah. But for reaching that part I need to write the previous story and all it's branches, the 12 hours-worth of content.
If I were to put 140k words for each route in the demo, I think I'd go crazy lol

 

[M$hot]

Arg! 12 hours? That sounds nightmarish haha The 140-150k words would include all branches, that obviously wouldn't be playable in a single run *the initial decision has a big weight, an offers two very different starting statuses and stories until they join again* and there are lots of mutually exclusive choices. Most of the content requires several runs. Otherwise players won't meet some characters, get a curse or a blessing, learn abilities and important things from dialogues. For replayability value, mostly.
It also includes bits about angsty sexual preferences that won't be applicable to those who choose something less... troublesome for the time period.
People who have died due to certain decisions would be alive, you won't be scolded from mistakes you haven't made.
So... I think a first run should be around those 3, 4 hours of reading, yeah. But for reaching that part I need to write the previous story and all it's branches, the 12 hours-worth of content.
If I were to put 140k words for each route in the demo, I think I'd go crazy lol

Ah! That makes more sense. You wrote 'That will be... around 140 or 150k words after the start.' so I didn't account for branching. If you will only get so much (2-4 hours worth depending on factors) per run then that seems fine.

I do wonder how interesting it is to replay the intro on a different path if all paths are supposed to converge at point X (You're basically spoiling the ending of all your other intro paths as soon as someone has played 1 intro path) but that's up to you.

Good luck, you still have to write all that which is a bit of a beast of a task. (At ~500 words per page, that's nearly a 300 page novel to put it in real life terms)

 

[SpoiledPrince]

Ah! That makes more sense. You wrote 'That will be... around 140 or 150k words after the start.' so I didn't account for branching. If you will only get so much (2-4 hours worth depending on factors) per run then that seems fine.

I do wonder how interesting it is to replay the intro on a different path if all paths are supposed to converge at point X (You're basically spoiling the ending of all your other intro paths as soon as someone has played 1 intro path) but that's up to you.

Good luck, you still have to write all that which is a bit of a beast of a task. (At ~500 words per page, that's nearly a 300 page novel to put it in real life terms)

At the moment there are two premature bad ends *deaths* and 5 regular endings planned for the demo. Most routes share some common, unavoidable fragments that act like milestones. The MC has to go through them for the story to make sense, because several traits can't be chosen. Whatever he does, there are several factors that don't depend on him and will always happen.

Depending on his personality and the things he has done by then, they will have different effects/impact on his life.
The replayability thing has more to do with those decisions. Murdering someone, snitching or not on another character, get more or less attached to his mentor figures and following their advice or not has the potential of transforming him. Someone who plays by the rules, and takes things at face value won't have the same stats as an experienced backstabber.
Trying to make the MC a good, decent person despite his circumstances (when everyone is more or less grooming him to be a monster) offers different outcomes than playing him as an ambitious sociopath.
The same with a character who embraces magic and one who rejects it as something tainted and filthy.
And the sex scenes change, too.

 

[Deleted member 229118]

I consider to be "slow-burn" games those that take a considerable amount of time on world-building, inviting the readers/players into it, establishing characters and developing them outside the "sex-sphere", setting the rules for the context and such, before the first rewarding porn scene takes place. That is... story-focused games with tons of words where kinky intercourse happens and drives some of the plot points, but it's not the main focus. The kind where you could easily introduce a sexy discretion shot and remain a coherent and enjoyable gaming experience.
Do loads of non-sexual text scare players off?

It depends on how good the story is.
The problem with 99% of all visual novels is that they are boring.
A good story can make the porn seem to be getting in the way.
A bad story cause people to skip it.

About the "raising the character" part... I have always liked the idea of getting to know the character from a very early stage and helping him/her become what I intended him/her to be, not just an insta-hero/villain for divine design. Helping them discovering the world at the same time than the readers, with about identical amount of information from the beginning and their guidance. That includes corrupting and twisting their personalities, of course.
Does dedicating an intro (of one or several chapters) to shaping their morals, preferences, initial abilities and beliefs sound appealing to you?
And if it does, what happens if the corruption the MC experiences at your hands is NOT of the sexual kind, but more in the shape of mental issues and traumas, religious fanaticism, prejudices and self-hate?
It could be done by filling a character sheet, but I consider those a bit soulless.

I like the idea.
But like stories it is difficult to pull off.
I remember playing fallout 3 intro.
Stage's of life.
That kinda worked.
Sims 4 spawning to doom challange is also fun.
It can work.
But it would be a lot of work to get enough choices to make it feel organic and not just a glorified tutorial(and i really wish dev stop using campaigns as tutorials or putting in the first mission of a campaign. Seperate tutorial please. Sorry for the rant)

I have been developing a game for some months already, but I have just realized that I never got to make a market analysis for one such as mine (aside from the very kind people who are helping me with directing, translating... Thank you, as always) so I don't know what kind of response to expect.
70k words and counting without being halfway into the intro part, lol.
It's going to be a free game, but still... Knowing its potential would always be nice.

If you manage to pull it off it will be a great game to try.
I am all for as many possible options as possible.
And the idea of playing the main character from spawning to doom sound very appealing.
However i must againt warn that what you are considering is extreemly difficult to pull off.
A boring story, A bad interface, Lack of gameplay, Ugly renders, etc.
There are many ways to fail.

That said.
I useally ignore visual novels because they are just poorly written story with 1 or 2 dialog change's wrongfully called choices.
This however.
The idea of shaping my character history via my actions.
That idea appeals to me enough that i would be willing to give it a try.

 

[SpoiledPrince]

It depends on how good the story is.
The problem with 99% of all visual novels is that they are boring.
A good story can make the porn seem to be getting in the way.
A bad story cause people to skip it.


I like the idea.
But like stories it is difficult to pull off.
I remember playing fallout 3 intro.
Stage's of life.
That kinda worked.
Sims 4 spawning to doom challange is also fun.
It can work.
But it would be a lot of work to get enough choices to make it feel organic and not just a glorified tutorial(and i really wish dev stop using campaigns as tutorials or putting in the first mission of a campaign. Seperate tutorial please. Sorry for the rant)


If you manage to pull it off it will be a great game to try.
I am all for as many possible options as possible.
And the idea of playing the main character from spawning to doom sound very appealing.
However i must againt warn that what you are considering is extreemly difficult to pull off.
A boring story, A bad interface, Lack of gameplay, Ugly renders, etc.
There are many ways to fail.

That said.
I useally ignore visual novels because they are just poorly written story with 1 or 2 dialog change's wrongfully called choices.
This however.
The idea of shaping my character history via my actions.
That idea appeals to me enough that i would be willing to give it a try.

I think the boring part about the VNs you mentioned happens when the routes are created around one character each, romancing/banging them as the main goal. You've got an interesting setting, enough exposition and after being introduced to the characters... bang! Now you've got to choose whose ass you want to tap. Suddenly the whole universe revolves around that crotch, and the plot adapts to it.
Shalalala Kiss the girl/boy/unspeakable hellspawn because reality itself depends on it... shalalala
Also some plots and archetypes have been overused and got us all bored. Nobody wants to play the same story in a loop.
I have always wondered how "adventurer" could be considered a profession, for example...

Well, yes, the intro is a tutorial, in the same way a childhood is a tutorial for adulthood. (And apparently I got all the wrong skills anyway lol) My MC is just a naive and credulous boy who knows nothing about the world he lives in and someone has to lecture him about that.
Heavy lore aside the main lessons are:
*Actions have consequences
*Be prudent and sensible
*Choose your battles, bide your time
*There's always a bigger fish
*Everybody lies and has an agenda
Mere common sense, nothing worth writing home about, but still...
It's a reminder that the world where the game takes place in is cruel, unforgiving and second chances are very, very rare. Cocksure characters do poorly in it, and they'll find it soon enough. Almost everyone could wipe the floors with you if you disrespect them. It's a matter of being clever until you can be strong enough to take the heat and survive.

About the renders... There are none. Just 2D sprites *growing up and changing their slyle through the centuries* and BGs. Somebody told me that one of the female characters looked like a man because... she had realistic proportions and a Roman nose. Apparently women must only have a snub or turn up one... lol

 

[Zippity]

Some of my favorite Erotic Visual Novels and Erotic Games have a healthy mix of both erotic content and good story telling... If that comes in the form of a slow burn for some characters and/or the main plot, then I'm fine... Throwing in some side story/content that includes some erotic stuff, while going through the slow burn, can sometimes help balance things out... That doesn't mean I want to see the protagonist getting it on, every other page and/or starting the whole kit and caboodle with lots of sexual content just designed to initiate some interest as an initial teaser...

It really boils down to the intention of the VN/Game in the first place... If the focus is story over porn, and the porn comes in slow waves, it will depend if the story is interesting enough and the characters feel well crafted and interesting, as to whether I can handle the slow burn, working through some light erotic stuff here and there leading to some sort of story climax which may or may not involve some heavier erotic content... It will all depend on how enjoyable the content and story is as it plays out over a given amount of time...

If the focus is porn over story, yet still contains a fun and interesting story that keeps me wanting to come back for more as the content slowly plays out, once again it's a matter of how well it's done... Too much sexual content too often or too quickly, might be detrimental to the story side of the Vn/Game... Again, it depends on how good the developer is and how it's being conveyed...

The best ones I've read/played, that were slow burners, usually tended to be romance based stories with the occasional side erotic stuff as the romance played out between the protagonist and the target romance/lust character/s (mostly there to keep things interesting and add some flavor at just the right moments without hindering the main overall plot)...

Now, if the slow burn takes too long to get to certain levels of the story, and begins to feel unnecessarily drawn out, then I might begin to lose interest (or possibly even think the developer is milking the development for money over a long development period)... It's a balancing act that the developers have to do in order to keep the content meaningful with a deep enough story to spark continuous interest...

If I wanted a fast burn, there are plenty of real porn vids I could go watch... I want more from my VN/Games, then simple 2D/3D versions of B-rated live porn snippets...

One issue I ran into a few times, is where a given project under development might have a nice balance of story and erotic content for a large portion of the product, then out of nowhere it suddenly just becomes super focused on the erotic content and the story begins to suffer greatly... I think this sometimes happens when either the developer is either running out of ideas, or they might be listening to their paying patrons far too much and change gears for the almighty dollar (or perhaps just to get the whole thing done faster so they can move on)... I become very disappointed when I see good products take such drastic turns in development... It's like being given a piece of candy every day, with each piece of candy being better then the last, but then after months/years of enjoying all this magnificent candy, you're given a can of spinach with some sugar added to help with the bitterness of what you're now being presented with...

Zip

 

[Synx]

Creating a good slow burner VN is hard. It requires an actual good story and plot, and doesn't really work if the story setting is 'normal' where the main goal is to get laid. There is nothing interesting about reading a whole essay about your normal school day or your normal day at the office.

A good story needs a clear purpose and mistery to keep me interested, which most VNs don't have. They start with a situation (a new school, moving back home after X happened) and use that as the main plot of the game. There is not really any any intrigue or mystery involved in those stories. You pretty much know what the story is going to lead to from the beginning.

This is even more enforced by the fact most slow burner VNs over explain everything. They often have whole conversations happening in the MCs head about what happened, taking away any mystery the game or a character might have had.

The good slow burner stories all got some form of mystery in them which creates a desire to know more. The DeLuca family for example starts with an interesting premise without telling why this is happening. You are moving into a maffia family, but have no clue why. That's a much more interesting starting position then exactly knowing why you are moving to somewhere new, like the majority of stories.


A good story needs to raise questions along the way. Why is this happening, why I'm a here, are they going to exceed, whats this character story, etc. Questions that keep you involved in the story. This isn't really possible if the main goal of the story is getting laid or just romancing a person. You know how the story is going to end from the beginning. This is even the case in most romance stories outside of VN adult games; in 9 of the 10 romance movies you know exactly how the movie is going to end and how the whole story is going to enfold after watching the first 15 mins.

 

[SpoiledPrince]

One issue I ran into a few times, is where a given project under development might have a nice balance of story and erotic content for a large portion of the product, then out of nowhere it suddenly just becomes super focused on the erotic content and the story begins to suffer greatly... I think this sometimes happens when either the developer is either running out of ideas, or they might be listening to their paying patrons far too much and change gears for the almighty dollar (or perhaps just to get the whole thing done faster so they can move on)... I become very disappointed when I see good products take such drastic turns in development... It's like being given a piece of candy every day, with each piece of candy being better then the last, but then after months/years of enjoying all this magnificent candy, you're given a can of spinach with some sugar added to help with the bitterness of what you're now being presented with...

Zip

I felt the same... until another thread revealed how much does developing a game costs for most people (those who are not shouldering most of the work themselves and hire paid staff). The moment I saw 5 digits my head started spinning and suddenly understood it all much better. That's a huge investment and it's only fair they want to make sure it's profitable.
When somebody does this as a business model instead of a hobby, they'd like to hit as wide a target audience as possible and that almost inevitably leads to selling out. There are games that diversify their content and do it right, but most just try to repeat patterns that have been proven succesful before, leaving the original premises behind.
The famous "The customer is always right" motto.
One can only hope that after they complete those very popular but flavourless games they get the funding they need for more personal projects...

 

[SpoiledPrince]

This is even more enforced by the fact most slow burner VNs over explain everything. They often have whole conversations happening in the MCs head about what happened, taking away any mystery the game or a character might have had.

The good slow burner stories all got some form of mystery in them which creates a desire to know more. The DeLuca family for example starts with an interesting premise without telling why this is happening. You are moving into a maffia family, but have no clue why. That's a much more interesting starting position then exactly knowing why you are moving to somewhere new, like the majority of stories.


A good story needs to raise questions along the way. Why is this happening, why I'm a here, are they going to exceed, whats this character story, etc. Questions that keep you involved in the story. This isn't really possible if the main goal of the story is getting laid or just romancing a person. You know how the story is going to end from the beginning. This is even the case in most romance stories outside of VN adult games; in 9 of the 10 romance movies you know exactly how the movie is going to end and how the whole story is going to enfold after watching the first 15 mins.

The infamous exposition bits, yeah. Reflecting too much on past actions and inner monologues can get repetitive and a borefest, but they also offer some insight on how the MC thinks or what kind of personality does he/she have. Blank slate characters are great for those who want to self-insert but they feel soulless, empty.

After so many people recommending that DeLuca game, I think I'll download it for research purposes, even if it's just hetero-based.

 

[Tataro]

Tina is hot. He he. I eat. Tina is hot. I work. Tina is hot. I go home and sleep. Dream of Tina.
Hi Tina, how was your day. Nice. Tina is hot. Work.
Tina is hot. Gym. Need to look good. For Tina. Tina is here. Hi Tina. She is hot when working out.
Repeat ad nauseam.

That is not slow burn. Slow burn implies some kind of flirting, erotic content if not outright sex, just some kind of developing romance. Pushing in tedium, boring day to day shit, is not slow burn. Stinted dialogue is not slow burn. Good slow burn I'd say is Gates Motel. Decently balanced, there's a lot of dirty talk and dirty thoughts but sex isn't there yet. And the game is still awesome. Class next door is an example of horrible writing. There's nothing slow burning about it. It's a boring teacher simulator.

 

[SpoiledPrince]

Tina is hot. He he. I eat. Tina is hot. I work. Tina is hot. I go home and sleep. Dream of Tina.
Hi Tina, how was your day. Nice. Tina is hot. Work.
Tina is hot. Gym. Need to look good. For Tina. Tina is here. Hi Tina. She is hot when working out.
Repeat ad nauseam.

That is not slow burn. Slow burn implies some kind of flirting, erotic content if not outright sex, just some kind of developing romance. Pushing in tedium, boring day to day shit, is not slow burn. Stinted dialogue is not slow burn. Good slow burn I'd say is Gates Motel. Decently balanced, there's a lot of dirty talk and dirty thoughts but sex isn't there yet. And the game is still awesome. Class next door is an example of horrible writing. There's nothing slow burning about it. It's a boring teacher simulator.

The "Tina" thing describes most games, although I would add the "Tina wants me to buy X/do Y quest. I give Tina X gift, because of course that's how you get laid. I cultivate Z stat she likes through grindy gameplay. Pussy unlocked!"

 

[Zippity]

I felt the same... until another thread revealed how much does developing a game costs for most people (those who are not shouldering most of the work themselves and hire paid staff). The moment I saw 5 digits my head started spinning and suddenly understood it all much better. That's a huge investment and it's only fair they want to make sure it's profitable.
When somebody does this as a business model instead of a hobby, they'd like to hit as wide a target audience as possible and that almost inevitably leads to selling out. There are games that diversify their content and do it right, but most just try to repeat patterns that have been proven succesful before, leaving the original premises behind.
The famous "The customer is always right" motto.
One can only hope that after they complete those very popular but flavourless games they get the funding they need for more personal projects...

I see what your saying, but relying on Donations is not a stable way of producing an income unless your product is of higher quality then most others... If you are running it like a business where it's your only job to support the rent, food, and other family costs then it's a highly risky one... More so then if you instead ran it as a real official business, with a business license and your own website (or possibly using Steam which seems to have become a thing in the last few years)...

At any moment, donations could trickle away or end entirely, either due to the website owners ending it because of some rule breaking or too many complaints, or due to some mistake you make in trying too hard to please a minority of the fans that just so happen to have the money to donate in the first place... Then your up the creek and possibly now carry a bad reputation to work around... You really can't reliably depend on a donation website ran system for placing on your resume when looking for a real job later, not if the company in question ends up actually looking into the background in the first place...

I think that is the main reason it's primarily a hobby driven market, rather then a real business model that thrives... Too many things could go wrong, at any time... So again, you would have to be producing very high quality products on a continuous basis if you want to make it successful in a donation based market over a long period of time... And many of the current success stories rely more on internal creativity over allowing their paying fan base too much creative control over the direction of a project over the long haul...

We've already seen time and time again, with how many products become more erratic due to far too much outside influence to the detriment of the product in the end...

Zip

 

[Hadley]

I'm one of the few who isn't interested that much in the Sex-Scenes. I want a good believable story and characters. If you look at DMD, it took like forever until the first Sex-Scene but I loved the Journey, it would probably have been ever better with less side-characters. I tend do skip the scenes about the male friends and pointless non-romance stuff.

It needs time to build up the characters. I love Games where you actually see how Brother/Sister fell in love during their Childhood. Its important to have more reason that "girl is horny" for a romance-plot. Just like good Romance-Movies, just with a little bit more Taboo and playerchoice.