BlandChili

Engaged Member
Dec 15, 2020
2,388
5,462
I imagine it's difficult to find the right balance between optimizing the work flow and still keeping the same artistic control over the product.
Absolutely and this is especially enunciated when it comes to individual developers, it can feel very - almost perverse - to include other people in your work. I knew this games developer from Norway back in the day who had made enough money from releasing through steam greenlight to live, but she absolutely refused to include other people in her work, even when she could have benefited from hiring a music composer for example.
She's talking about it in a rather general way, and I get the sense that she's probably also being a bit hard on herself.
This is just my impression, but I think this is because her plan is "only" very general. From the way she talks about GGGB (and how it ended) and the bits she's talked about her work with ORS, I've had the impression for a while that Eva only has a general plan for the direction she wants the story to go but nothing written down in terms of concrete end-point and plot twists she wishes to include.
I don't think many other than herself think it's taking unfairly long…
I think some do. :ROFLMAO:
At least going by the language some posters here use.
It would've been really interesting to have a post after the next update about what specifically she's struggling with. Like one specific scene and then deconstructing it and going into the details of what issues she's had to solve, both relating to the scene in itself and regarding its place in the story as a whole.
Sure, getting more intimate details of her work is always interesting! :giggle:
 

jaylop09

Newbie
Nov 24, 2019
85
294
My guess is that probably most of the people demanding right now the new chapter aren´t even patreon subscribers. And I say this as someone very saddened by the fact that probably we will have to wait at least 3 more weeks.
 
Nov 15, 2020
418
1,882
This is just my impression, but I think this is because her plan is "only" very general. From the way she talks about GGGB (and how it ended) and the bits she's talked about her work with ORS, I've had the impression for a while that Eva only has a general plan for the direction she wants the story to go but nothing written down in terms of concrete end-point and plot twists she wishes to include.
That seems likely. And, of course, she can't say too much if she wants to avoid spoiling the upcoming episode. "I'm struggling to write a sex scene between Lena and Holly because [reasons]" would have been more specific and informative, but more than we need to know at this point. ;)

The plan may be rather general, but there's also a lot of proof in the game of those things she does plan. Every episode hints at several upcoming events. And as I mentioned, I get the impression she's had a few "checkpoints" for the story planned from the start. If she has a vague plan that Cindy and Ian will get together around episode 7, that Lena releases a big hit song after 12 episodes, or that Allison tells Ian she wants to have a baby 15 episodes into the story (I'm just making stuff up now), that makes it a lot easier than if you don't even have those midway points to help structure the story.

Regarding GGGB, I agree with those who've said that the last part of the game suffers somewhat from what probably was a lack of planning. But I vaguely remember Eva talking about that herself too, right? My impression is that she's good at learning from her experiences and mistakes, and I suspect she at least has some idea of where she wants to end up this time. I think the planned time skip also indicates that.
 

Sexy11

Member
Jul 13, 2017
103
62
For those who may complain about the slow update, well consider come back in a year or when the game tagged "Completed".
Based on the previous game GGGB, story progression can go very slow and sometimes some path have no content at all on the new update. RedString scope at current stage already feel bigger than GGGB.
 

Tallyhoe

Member
Feb 21, 2019
205
710
I think, realistically, this project is a 4 year development.
1 year to kinda lay the ground work. 2nd year to get into the habit and general feel of doing it. 3rd and 4th is just repeating the process.

If she aims for 20 chapters, and judging by 3-4 months cycle, we are 13 chapters out which will take around 3 years. That’s on course for that 4 years projection. So don’t expect this to be completed by 2023.

If you can’t be patient then better leave and come back then.
 

doctor13

Member
Oct 13, 2018
271
783
If I can muster the will power, I'll be taking a break from the game (though still subscribed to Patreon) for the remainder of the year and coming back at around Chapter 10. That's the plan anyway which I'm sure will fail 5 minutes after Chapter 8 comes out : D
 

Nifferman

Active Member
Feb 7, 2018
926
2,177
Doubtful. She had been releasing updates around every 3 months for the latest three chapters. More likely that we will see the alpha around the third or the fourth week of may.
Actually it's 70-80ish days not 3 months and previous updates had 10k plus lines this one will have around 7k hence faster release
 

RC-1138 Boss

Message Maven
Apr 26, 2017
13,711
20,875
Actually it's 70-80ish days not 3 months and previous updates had 10k plus lines this one will have around 7k hence faster release
Incorrect. 98 days between Alpha releases 0.5-0.6 and 81 days between Alpha releases 0.6-0.7 . This gives a average of 89.5 days between releases. Add what she said about chapter 8 taking some time to complete and it is not hard to imagine the release may happen closer to the end of may even if the chapter is shorter than the previous one.
 

van321

Member
Jan 7, 2021
196
348
It's probably a common refrain, but I wish there were more... decent LIs for Lena. Seeing her struggle makes Ian complaining sound like whining. Aside from Ian, they're all douchebags. Heck, the one who seems the most mature is Axel, whom betrayed her, and it feels wrong throwing her back in with him given the hurt he caused her.
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Ian and Lena make a good couple, but after that last update... man... Holly is such a sweetheart. :love:
 

BloodyMares

Well-Known Member
Dec 4, 2017
1,464
7,034
Absolutely and this is especially enunciated when it comes to individual developers, it can feel very - almost perverse - to include other people in your work. I knew this games developer from Norway back in the day who had made enough money from releasing through steam greenlight to live, but she absolutely refused to include other people in her work, even when she could have benefited from hiring a music composer for example.
I want to thank you for this comment because it was a reality check for me. Even though I only do bug-testing and occasional proofreading, I admit that pointing out plot holes is very tempting as well. From there, it's a slippery slope into "I think writing it a bit differently would improve the scene" until you find yourself playing narrative advisor and thinking you could do better. On one hand, you want to improve the end product. On another, you're kinda affecting the game and possibly getting in the way of Eva's original creative idea. And while the critique might improve the quality, it might also disrupt the work process (additions to the original plan, prolonging development time, possible rewrites, general second-guessing). I guess it's important to let go and leave the game be as it is, even if it's not perfect.
 

xgrotesc

Member
Sep 8, 2016
373
660
I want to thank you for this comment because it was a reality check for me. Even though I only do bug-testing and occasional proofreading, I admit that pointing out plot holes is very tempting as well. From there, it's a slippery slope into "I think writing it a bit differently would improve the scene" until you find yourself playing narrative advisor and thinking you could do better. On one hand, you want to improve the end product. On another, you're kinda affecting the game and possibly getting in the way of Eva's original creative idea. And while the critique might improve the quality, it might also disrupt the work process (additions to the original plan, prolonging development time, possible rewrites, general second-guessing). I guess it's important to let go and leave the game be as it is, even if it's not perfect.
To be honest it's a two edged sword. Everything you say it's true, but on the other hand an external feedback can sometimes give you fresh perspective on things, give you new ideas or even help you unblock your creativity on something that you were feeling stuck. Everyone's different, so it really depends on the person, or in this specific case, the creator.

And there's a difference between expressing your view on something that you might think it could work well and telling someone that their work would be better if they followed your view/advice. There's a clear line between a suggestion/feedback and trying to impose your view on others.

Fan feedback can either be great to improve the end result of a product or to help it derail it to oblivion. It takes some thick skin and a strong mentallity to be able to absorb external feedback and see where it can actually help you progress, without losing your own view and perspective. A lot of games in here that showed potential got really derailed by creators listening too much to their fans feedback and trying to please everyone, but there's also examples of those that actually improved.

With this I'm not saying that you or anybody else should or shouldn't give your feedback to Eva or any other creator, that's entirely up to you to decide upon yourself if you feel it's something you should or should not do. On the same way it is up to Eva to decide for herself what kinda of importance to herself and to her work the external feedback can bring to her game(s).

To summarize, I know I played a bit of a devil's advocate here, but I think it's often important to remember people that things are never just black and white, there's several shades of grey that need to be taken into consideration.
 

bauman

Active Member
Sep 11, 2018
634
2,919
Doubtful. She had been releasing updates around every 3 months for the latest three chapters. More likely that we will see the alpha around the third or the fourth week of may.
Late May for the Alpha sounds about right.

05/04/2021 + 72 and counting /Chapter 8/
02/21/2021 + 81 days /Chapter 7/
12/02/2020 + 96 days /Chapter 6/
08/28/2020 + 50 days /Chapter 5/
07/09/2020 + 38 days /Chapter 4/
06/01/2020 + 35 days /Chapter 3/
04/27/2020 + 30 days /Chapter 2/
03/28/2020 + 00 days, first release /Chapter 1/
 
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