VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch.13.2 Full] [Eva Kiss]

[Zedire]

I am pretty sure that if the patreon will ever be so kind to change its policy from paying to developers not per time\update, but only will give money when all planed job completed and only if users are actually happy with it - then the same artists, coders, developers of any kind will show the miracles of job speed and users will get a fully completed games almost per every week )) Lazy asses and simulants will fall of from that market, but real professionals who actually can provide quality content really good and fast - will make all the gamers happy for about the same ammount of money, (but i am sure that even more people will wish to donate for a real job, quality and speed) which are now goes for milkers of da patreons, patreons who in most cases getting yet another portion of almost nothing trually interesting per updates for now )) imho. imho. imho ffs.

The ingenious system you've come up with would ensure that Patreon would lose almost all of its creators, because, believe it or not, finishing quicker isn't going to get the best results (ask your ex's), and neither are devs who are stressed out from working like crazy on the measly assurance that they might get paid their due when they release the content, if the Patrons are happy with what they've released (and you'd get it for free anyway). Meanwhile what are they living on? Seriously, that's just about the dumbest arrangement I've ever heard, and screams clueless entitlement.

A good number of these games likely would never be able to get made without the dev having the steady monthly income of Patrons, so what are you expecting the devs to live off if their updates take longer? If they're not getting money from Patrons then they need to have another paying job (which some of them do anyway), and if they have a job then that's less time they have to work on the game, so you certainly wouldn't get the game or updates any faster anyway!

Also, as I said before, if they're expected to speed up their work so people can get the game/updates sooner, you're going to see a drastic downgrade in quality of the product.

Yes, there are devs that abuse the system and milk Patrons for all they're worth for minimal return - but Eva sure as shit isn't one of them.

 

[BlandChili]

Spoiler: Minimized

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It would also go against the basis that Patreon is built upon. Do you know the origins of the name?

In the Roman Republic the urban poor would go around to the wealthy and "beg" for money. This stems from the time when only the Patrician class could hold office, in return for being generous to the rabble they would support you and your ambitions in Roman society. These wealthy romans were known as "Patronus".
This system was informal, not set down in republican law or anything, so essentially the Patricians did not have to give people money and the people receiving, their clients, did not have to support them either. Yet both would lose out if any went against social convention. So it was in the best interest of those involved to support the people that were financially supporting them.

Patreon gets its name from this concept.
The people pledging are Patronus to Eva who is their "client". Eva decides to set her support tiers herself, but the central idea is that any support handed out to her is voluntary and the informal agreement is that while Eva doesn't technically owe any one specific patreon anything, she would surely lose her support if she elected to neglect their interests (for example further delays to the game she is making).

If patreon started to interfere with some sort of official reward system that the creators had to abide by, the concept of its foundation gets lost.

 

[Deleted member 3064965]

If we're looking past the uninformed complaining about slower updates, I do wonder what Eva thinks about it herself, and I suspect she will adress it once the new chapter is out. Before the release of chapter eight, she was very apologetic about how much time it took, and it still ended up being released after three months, the same as chapter seven. This time she's made far less comments about it, even though we're already at four months. Which is totally OK, by the way, as nothing good comes out of blaming yourself when you're obviously working your socks off, and either way the general feedback on Patreon and Discord was that she didn't have to excuse herself.

She also commented about not being fully satisfied with chapter eight, so it makes sense if she decided to use the time needed instead of trying to push it through at a set deadline. The mystical omission of Stan from the character cards also makes me think she might have spent some of the time the last months doing some minor revisions or planning for the upcoming chapters.

Still from her previous comments I doubt she's content with using more than four months per update, so I'm wondering if she's got any plans to streamline the development further. She talked about hiring another line artist, but I suspect there's limits to how much else she could delegate without letting go of the creative control of the game.

 

[BlandChili]

If we're looking past the uninformed complaining about slower updates, I do wonder what Eva thinks about it herself, and I suspect she will adress it once the new chapter is out. Before the release of chapter eight, she was very apologetic about how much time it took, and it still ended up being released after three months, the same as chapter seven. This time she's made far less comments about it, even though we're already at four months. Which is totally OK, by the way, as nothing good comes out of blaming yourself when you're obviously working your socks off, and either way the general feedback on Patreon and Discord was that she didn't have to excuse herself.

She also commented about not being fully satisfied with chapter eight, so it makes sense if she decided to use the time needed instead of trying to push it through at a set deadline. The mystical omission of Stan from the character cards also makes me think she might have spent some of the time the last months doing some minor revisions or planning for the upcoming chapters.

Still from her previous comments I doubt she's content with using more than four months per update, so I'm wondering if she's got any plans to streamline the development further. She talked about hiring another line artist, but I suspect there's limits to how much else she could delegate without letting go of the creative control of the game.

My only protest really would be that if she were to decide that her updates just had to take longer to update, something I can live with fine, she would restructure her patreon tiers.

Paying for a specific tier when the updates are churned out every 4 months roughly becomes double the price from the ideal of bimonthly updates. I don't necessarily think she'd have to cut the tier prices greatly, but she should consider cutting a euro of each of the lower tiers and perhaps two of the higher ones.

Her tiers already took a price hike when she updated them from $ to € without accounting for the currency difference, so I don't think this would be outlandish to consider.

 

[Poxmax]

If you check Eva's posts on Patreon, you'll see little to no comments of people complaining about the lack of updates.
The number of her patrons has been relatively stable over the past months:

You must be registered to see the links

Most users of this forum get to play the game for free and they can voice their opinion if they want to, but only her patrons have the legitimacy to complain when an update gets delayed or postponed. They can also stop supporting her whenever they want to.
It's not surprising that the vast majority of her patrons don't do either of these things - Eva Kiss has proven time and time again that she's reliable and trustworthy.

There's an old saying in motorsport, "You are as good as your last race", just because she delivered in the past, doesn't mean she will deliver in the future

 

[Deleted member 3064965]

There's an old saying in motorsport, "You are as good as your last race", just because she delivered in the past, doesn't mean she will deliver in the future

She’s been delivering consistently since she started making GGGB four years ago. But if you want to overlook that for an old motorsport saying you dug up for the occasion, then be my guest.

 

[Poxmax]

She’s been delivering consistently since she started making GGGB four years ago. But if you want to overlook that for an old motorsport saying you dug up for the occasion, then be my guest.

Is she delivering now? She's not even putting a effort on her weekly status reports

 

[sevensham]

when will be new update release?

 

[John Doe Jr.]

Is she delivering now? She's not even putting a effort on her weekly status reports

Probably because she's working to the bone to satisfy all the complainers such as yourself.

 

[lipe2410]

Just remind that Eva is a human being, and human beings get tired, need rest, have some bad days in pace of work departament. She is not a machine that can easily work in high gear every single day

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

Guess today is the "armchair dev Day"...

 

[scor099]

Is she delivering now? She's not even putting a effort on her weekly status reports

and who are you to complain? are one of her patreons? if not then what gives you the right to demand something you didn't even pay one cent for ? if you are one of her patreons then you know where to complain and something in return for your money.

we all want the new update to drop as soon as possible but since we are not paying shit for, it all we have to do about it is wait.

 

[Rico_Suave]

Pirates getting real comfortable demanding content. Wonder how many are actually pledged to the patreon

 

[Death_dark]

If people are complaining here, then I am sure there are patrons who are complaining too. And I am glad there are people like the, aforementioned. If Eva is going to push out an update let's suppose in 5 months, it's because of these people who complain.
If people like 'no problem, Eva. You can take as much time as you want' were the only ones in the world.
We would be seeing one update in 1 year. Encouraging, supporting someone goes a long way but we definitely need a fair share of people who will criticize and keep everything in check.

 

[Rickster82]

when will be new update release?

When will be peace all over the world?

 

[Amahl Farouk]

It isn't really surprising that this release is delayed. Choosing to make a game with only one protagonist is difficult enough given the variety of choices and outcomes there are in an Eva Kiss game, but this increases exponentially when you have 2 protagonists and I personally feel she has bitten off more than she can handle at this point.

I am not criticizing Eva and her team, I have no doubt they are doing their best but I can see this game turning into a 2 update per year thing as a result. As someone who doesn't support her work I will just sit and wait for it to drop, if I were a supporter, chances are I would still keep supporting it as long as the update quality stays the same and the amount of content is good across all the paths.

This isn't a regular peek/don't peek kind of game and as a result, and given the complexity of the different paths it really will take some serious time to code and prepare the overlays and images

So, I guess we just have to be patient, when the update is ready it will be released and I have no doubt it will be as good as her usual work

 

[kartolas]

I always doubt about everything, even more when there's money involved.

 

[scor099]

like I said before, my guess is that this update is taking so long because it has something to do with Stan's character. if she's going to change his character then she needs to change everything back to chapter 1, at least I'm hoping that's reason behind this delay, not posting his Card and what she said about explaining everything when chapter 9 drops.

 

[Deleted member 3064965]

Is she delivering now? She's not even putting a effort on her weekly status reports

It’s impossible to say if she’s delivering now before the new update is out. I will use its size, quality and complexity as a measure of that.

But weekly status reports are infrequent, yes. You can add that to your list.

So, you can either base your verdict on
– Consistant delivery for more than four years
or
– An old motorsport saying AND infrequent weekly status reports.

I’d say you still have a pretty shitty case. Also the solution to the weekly status reports is probably just to take out "weekly" from the name; she’s still updating us when there’s anything new to tell, and her total amount of Patreon updates are either way very high.

 

[lcvargas]

Who is that guy you picked for Axel? Not only does he look a lot like him, he's hot af. Dayum!
lmao with George Clooney as Seymour - nice! Does anyone know the actual person Seymour is modeled off?
Lastly, gotta say I wouldn't be in a hurry to kick Lena's dad out of the bed if he looked like that guy. He also looks familiar - is he an actor from some Mafia tv show?

Santiago Abascal, the basis for Seymour.