VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch.13.3.4] [Eva Kiss]

[Tallyhoe]

I don't want to be paraniod, but Eva silent almost two weeks on Patreon. Any news on Discord?

You know we used to never have any update at all between versions?

And tbh I actually prefer radio silence to updates with false promises.
I don’t think she could give the exact date yet and it’s not closed to finished that’s why she doesn’t want to hype it too much. Too much hype+delay = backlash, every time.

Better be quiet and deliver.

 

[dontcarewhateverno]

She's probably mad stressed trying to meet or get close to deadline and tuning everything out but getting the work out and balancing her own self mental care right now.

Anyone with a huge load of work on their hands in a development cycle or a creative-work deadline will know exactly how that goes - even moreso on the creative end, since you can't just force good work out. (Well, unless you don't care and are fine with releasing crap).

 

[TamaMountain]

Mid to late October is my guess, seeing that we will have to account for the weekly previews. Idk.

 

[dontcarewhateverno]

because Female Writers usually write women better(a lot of dudes seem to have trouble since they, appraoch female characters as some alien race, Manga industry especially has this issue), and since the focus of most porn games are having sex with the women, it just all works out.

*Bad writers can't write women well, or more generally, bad writers can't get into the humanity and thought processes of characters who aren't just like them, whether the writer is female or male. I don't think most porn game writers, game writers in general or manga writers are very good, imo. With a few exceptions, like whoever wrote the story/screenplay for some of Satoshi Kon's films. My tastes run more towards character development than plot concepts though, which is almost a different writing skill. You can squeak by without good character development if you're great with plot or with stylized concept work.

 

[Ashley young]

Me! I really couldn't give two hoots about the male protag, to be honest, I basically rush through that content to get to the female mc stuff. But it is what it is I suppose. If Eva turned off the male protag right now I would be happy as a dog with two tails

Its the exact opposite to me, the female segments feel a lot like GGGB (which is not a bad thing, but it feels like I've seen it all before). The male segments are interesting because Ian's story itself is interesting.
I know what will happen to Lena, she'll soon start having sex with randos and before you know it she'll be having BBC gangbangs while be a druggie. Ian's future is up in the air though, he has that writing gig, but he might also end up as a renown fighter, or even as a part of a band. Lena is basically a toned down version of Ashley from GGGB. Ian is basically Dave from GGGB, which is fine because I found Dave to be a very good character.

 

[scor099]

Yeah Stan still has a really big question mark. I do have a question for everyone here though, if Eva changes Stan to be very different from how he currently is will that take away the reasoning fans like him so much?

I actually like this version of Stan and I wanna see where it's going, Stan isn't in love with Lena at the moment so it's all about voyeurism but what could possibly come after that? Stan falling in love with her and this voyeurism turns into cuckold?

I'm assuming that Eva is going to change his character based on something she said before, I don't remember where and when but something along the lines "if I had an idea or a new mechanism that I want to implant I'm going to do it since the game is still being developed" or something like this.

 

[Rickster82]

"Wake me up when September ends." - Green Day (2004)

 

[Vinfamy]

TBH I suspect Eva's original rationale for having a male protagonist as well for Our Red String is probably just to broaden the audience and gain more Patreon support that way.
Too many 'ew, I can't play a female protag game, it makes me gay!' people around. Would have been unfair if Eva missed out on potential patrons despite a quality project in every way just because of the female protag tag.
But then by chance, Ian's segments end up being more interesting so far. Perhaps this is because Eva being female end up writing better female love interests for Ian and rather one-dimensional male love interests for Lena. You could see this for GGGB too tbh, while it's an excellent game, most of the dudes that Ashley can bang are walking stereotypes.
But yeah, now that the story has progressed a bit, having both protags being able to make significant decisions do seem to be more work than she can handle within the promised bi-monthly release timeframe.

 

[BlandChili]

TBH I suspect Eva's original rationale for having a male protagonist as well for Our Red String is probably just to broaden the audience and gain more Patreon support that way.
Too many 'ew, I can't play a female protag game, it makes me gay!' people around. Would have been unfair if Eva missed out on potential patrons despite a quality project in every way just because of the female protag tag.
But then by chance, Ian's segments end up being more interesting so far. Perhaps this is because Eva being female end up writing better female love interests for Ian and rather one-dimensional male love interests for Lena. You could see this for GGGB too tbh, while it's an excellent game, most of the dudes that Ashley can bang are walking stereotypes.
But yeah, now that the story has progressed a bit, having both protags being able to make significant decisions do seem to be more work than she can handle within the promised bi-monthly release timeframe.

Not that this couldn't have had an influence of course, I don't think it's unreasonable to suspect that Eva wanted to broaden the audience appeal she could conjure.

But personally I get the impression that there is some genuine articstic experimentation with Ian. The most obvious example of this is the fighting mechanic which Eva decided to develop and implement for no particular reason other than to enhance the experience of playing some of Ian's content. Certainly no one, I would at least dare to guess, had expected or demanded such a feature.
Another one is the whole book thing which has no short-term payoff compared to Lena's music writing, while both probably have later results for both of them Ian's book is clearly being set up for some grand player expectation.
I also think Ian's choices and routes are more sophisticated in narrative design, there are more forked narrative routes and more conflicts from his various romantic/sexual options, where as Lena's are more independent in that she basically just has to choose who to fuck or not. Holly is really the first character that gets locked out for her so far if you choose for Lena to fall in love with Ian.

 

[Cazzo_duro]

The longer and longer delays, the absence of news by the developer, the evident difficulties in writing the plot are clear signs that this game is entering a "death spiral"

 

[Mesmerizet]

Mm honest to god the wait is quite a bit but if it includes more Cindy scenes, I'm not complaining.

Keep in mind the longer the dev takes for an update, the more likely patrons may opt out, i.e. they lose revenue, so they aren't really slacking. If you think an update's being delayed, there's a good reason for it (eg. more content).

 

[Rickster82]

My condolences to everyone who paid at PATREON money for the month of September regarding ORS.

 

[dontcarewhateverno]

TBH I suspect Eva's original rationale for having a male protagonist as well for Our Red String is probably just to broaden the audience and gain more Patreon support that way.
Too many 'ew, I can't play a female protag game, it makes me gay!' people around. Would have been unfair if Eva missed out on potential patrons despite a quality project in every way just because of the female protag tag.
But then by chance, Ian's segments end up being more interesting so far. Perhaps this is because Eva being female end up writing better female love interests for Ian and rather one-dimensional male love interests for Lena. You could see this for GGGB too tbh, while it's an excellent game, most of the dudes that Ashley can bang are walking stereotypes.
But yeah, now that the story has progressed a bit, having both protags being able to make significant decisions do seem to be more work than she can handle within the promised bi-monthly release timeframe.

Could be. I also suspect that she's splitting her own personal experiences and desires in half to write both characters: Her career and creative aspirations as well as friendships more informing her writing of Ian and her own fetishes, fantasies, stray sexual thoughts and relationship needs more informing the writing of Lena (as well as potential hardships and struggles). Maybe why Lena seems to be more of an empty character in some ways, but with more complex problems than Ian has.

 

[BloodyMares]

Louise, on the other hand, is a bit too naive, and too close to her emotions, while having little control over them - both which make a person very easy to manipulate. She assumes the worst of Stan (regarding her panties) without evidence because she doesn't like him, she assumes the worst about Ivy (as the one who she believes tempted Jeremy) simply because she doesn't like her, and she believed the best about Jeremy until she has irrefutable evidence in the photo Ivy shows her, because she doesn't want to believe that he's a POS. She also jumps into bed with Lena on the rebound simply because Lena is nice to her and there for her (and because she clearly looks up to her). She's very easy to manipulate - Lena could get Louise to do anything in her vulnerable state, if she wanted to.

That's an accurate character analysis, but it doesn't take into account relationship between Louise and Ivy. Louise hates Ivy, probably even more so than Stan. And under no circumstances would she be willing to do anything sexual with her, ESPECIALLY if Ivy is in control. If anything, she would be willing to please Lena by letting her, and only her, dominate her. The moment Ivy steps out of line and makes her uncomfortable, it would be a deal breaker. And ALSO...

The game night shows that Louise has fun ordering Ivy around, because she hopes to make Ivy uncomfortable, but to her dismay, Ivy is a total brat and is very proud of her sexuality and is open to nearly everything. Whenever it's her turn to spin the bottle, it always ends with Louise having to dare Ivy to do something, and she has this triumphant face before asking her if Ivy had any body modifications or before ordering her to strip naked. But Ivy also has fun accepting the challenge and showing Louise that she's not that creative and she needs to try harder if she wants to make her yield. But when Lena dares Louise to lick Ivy's feet, it's a hard stop for her, because she won't let herself be humiliated like that, it's not her kink.

That's why I can totally imagine their lesbian pairing where Ivy lets Louise be in charge, merely out of curiosity to see what Louise would want to do, and it'd be fun for her regardless, because, at the very least, Lena would also be involved, and that means that if sex with Louise turns out to be a bummer, Lena will certainly make up for that. Maybe Ivy actually wants to dominate Lena for the first time, but Lena tells that she can do it only if she agrees to please Louise and be her sub for a night (because she believes it might help with their rivalry).

After all, the main source of conflict is that Louise believes Ivy to be a homewrecker slut who only cares about herself, and Ivy thinks Louise to be boring. A role reversal might help them bond. If Louise comes up with some decent orders and challenges, Ivy might realize that Louise has potential, while Louise after domming Ivy and fucking her frustrations away, might feel less threatened by her company and could understand why Lena and Ivy get along. Lena might have to take one for the team to make it happen.

 

[BloodyMares]

So, when somebody telling me that it is a hard hard hard long long long job which requires so much time - i say yes, i believe, if that someone is a 5 year old kid - it's defenetly an achievement. But for a grownup, or even a group of grownups, it maybe not so good as it could and should be. Unless someone just wish to make "the development" as longer as possible. Why not? If patreons still pay per mounth, but not for all job's done )

The art and the coding are fairly mechanical tasks that you can train yourself to do fast enough. Of course, you conveniently skipped over the writing so that you could sell your point across. You know, the actual CREATIVE process that you can't force yourself to do any faster than you can? If you have any of your writers friends, ask them how long it takes to write a full 250-300-page fictional storybook (Chapter 7 had more words than Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone). If they tell you they can do it in 2 months, then I'd be very curious to find out about their work so I could review it and share my honest opinion about their writing quality.

 

[Nifferman]

The art and the coding are fairly mechanical tasks that you can train yourself to do fast enough. Of course, you conveniently skipped over the writing so that you could sell your point across. You know, the actual CREATIVE process that you can't force yourself to do any faster than you can? If you have any of your writers friends, ask them how long it takes to write a full 250-300-page fictional storybook (Chapter 7 had more words than Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone). If they tell you they can do it in 2 months, then I'd be very curious to find out about their work so I could review it and share my honest opinion about their writing quality.

She did state during last chapter release she is having difficulties in writing if u (total unrelated but try reading ultimate husband that has like 12k pages and is fairly good apart from the silly translation mistakes )

 

[BloodyMares]

If people are complaining here, then I am sure there are patrons who are complaining too. And I am glad there are people like the, aforementioned. If Eva is going to push out an update let's suppose in 5 months, it's because of these people who complain.
If people like 'no problem, Eva. You can take as much time as you want' were the only ones in the world.
We would be seeing one update in 1 year. Encouraging, supporting someone goes a long way but we definitely need a fair share of people who will criticize and keep everything in check.

That's assuming that Eva's intention is to milk her patrons and prolong the development. Correction: Eva doesn't want to spend her entire life writing a single game. She wants to properly move the storyline to a decent place, too, so she could finish it in 3 years and start something new. She could milk GGGB to this day if she wanted to simply milk her patrons as long as she can, like most devs do with their games, but she chose to actually finish it. And you could see that close to the end, the pace got really fast, because Eva herself couldn't wait to finish it and call it a game. And it was a big risk, too, since quite a few people dropped their support after GGGB, not liking ORS' 2-protagonist direction and less crazy sex acts. So, even if you assume the worst in Eva's personality, at least take into account that she doesn't enjoy working on a single project indefinitely because it's boring as fuck. If Eva is anything like me, I'm sure her brain is already full of different ideas for some other project that she could start after finishing ORS.
And yes, people are getting anxious on Discord, too. But their main concern is if Eva is okay and is feeling well, not "How dare she take so long and milk us of our money". She hasn't been answering my PM, which means she's in a hard crunch mode where she filters everything out and is solely focused on progressing with the Alpha. It's not that she doesn't release an update because she's lazy, she just can't meet a deadline because there's too much bloody work.

 

[fortuna95]

Four months will definitely be a new record. I honestly didn't think it would ever take that long. Sure, Eva always delivered and it could be an exception, but you first got used to one month at GGGB, then two months at ORS and now of course it seems like it would take forever until the new update. And it seems at least 3 months is the new update chronology.

btw: I am a Patron, so I can complain just a little because game is great and I can't wait

 

[okfairenough]

I'm one of those guys. I actually enjoy a game written by a female, although there are some good games written by guys as well. I just like a female perspective on stuff though, especially when a character is hot and horny.

I prefer them too. Especially ones that portray a strong female character who gets into sexy situations on her own will and not because she was blackmailed. Unfortuantely, most female protag games portray the second kind of character. The storyline typically goes like this -

You've moved to a new city so you need to find a job and an apartment, you need to pay rent every month and if you don't, you need to blow the creep home owner to make up for the rent. Your boss is also a creep and if you don't do sexual favors, he's going to fire you. You walk down the street and a homeless man starts chasing you, you have to give him a handjob or else you get assaulted etc.

I'm thankful that there a few games that have strong female characters like ORS, GGGB, Lust Campus, Female Agent (please suggest me more if you know of any), but it is a genre that definitely needs more representation.

 

[sbarabaus]

Its the exact opposite to me, the female segments feel a lot like GGGB (which is not a bad thing, but it feels like I've seen it all before). The male segments are interesting because Ian's story itself is interesting.
I know what will happen to Lena, she'll soon start having sex with randos and before you know it she'll be having BBC gangbangs while be a druggie. Ian's future is up in the air though, he has that writing gig, but he might also end up as a renown fighter, or even as a part of a band. Lena is basically a toned down version of Ashley from GGGB. Ian is basically Dave from GGGB, which is fine because I found Dave to be a very good character.

i agree, but another reason why Ian's side of the story feels more interesting then Lena's is that a lot of his love interests aren't just random hookups

fucking Cindy and Emma means you're cucking your best friends
for other girls, you have to get them before Jeremy does (and you know he will)

compare this to Robert and Mike... if you ignore them they can just disappear from the story
it feels the best storylines for Lena are only just starting, like Axel, Seymour or her lesbian options