My bad, i misanderstood you, never studied english so sometimes I interpret things wrong.
- Thread starter Eva Kiss
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I have a feeling that person doesn't mean Ian getting tongue-tied, because if that's all it took to make him "the most unlikable protagonist" then that'd make for the most petty complaint.
Hopefully they can clarify what they meant.
I would agree with everything you said except for one big caveat -
All the male-mc(Ian) conversations go like this, they're clumsy like real life.
On the other hand, all the Lena-mc conversations flow very easily, as well as the LI's and third party males amongst each other. Your statement "no matter how chad Ian is, he would still say stupid stuff" - is correct! - but that's not really the relevant statement. The relevant statement is "no matter how chad Axel is, he would still say stupid stuff"...... and he doesn't. None of his competitors do. From the start it feels like the deck is stacked against Ian, because it is, by choice of the dev.
This is my beef with most games in the cheating-corruption genre. The male mc (or non-mc, just generic male bf/husband) is nothing more than a prop for cheating fantasies. You have a small amount of control, but at the end of the day when he walks into a room, the frame is already pre-determined, the social hierarchy is already rigidly cast.
My specific rant in that earlier post was how Ian is written equally as an insecure mop and a douchebag to his friends. The screenshot is at the first conversation with Wade after you see his gf cheating, and there's NO option for what would be the most natural response - you tell your good friend his gf's cheating on him. To tie this in with the upper half of this post - these responses sharply contrast with the way the female mc and other LIs converse with each other - they're very direct and natural (or they have a choice to not reveal indiscretions, but it's a choice!)
Ian has no competition tho(they cant really fuck "your" girls if you dont want them to), and Jeremy says stupid shit all the time, Axel is complete idiot when he talks with Lena, he only charismatic when he is with other people.
Ian is a chad in most sex scenes anyway, you can dominate Lena and even ignore her wishes in one of the scenes and fuck her anyway when she denies you, so i dont really see your point in terms of "chadness", all Minerva scenes are good example too.
Correct me if am wrong, but there's currently no instance in the game of Cindy cheating on her boyfriend with anyone but Ian. So i don't see why you'd want Ian to make shit up.
Regarding Ian being the only one incapable of smooth dialogues, i think it's at least to some degree confirmation bias on your part. Other characters also have instances where they get all awkward and don't quite know how to react.
His GF is not cheating tho, and he does not owe Wade any explanations since he is friends with both and she asked you to not tell him about the photoshoot specifically, they are hardly good friends anyway, they were, back in school, now they barely meet(perry words).
Btw, your example of great flow of Lena conversation and a choice to be honest with Louise is a weird one, since even tho you can be honest here and be an angel to most of your friends, you still treat Louise like shit in most future conversations, Lena constantly brushes her off and never does anything with her, ditches her for a new friend Holly, just like in real life some friendships are not equal i guess.
Lena is more charismatic then Ian imo, she is a hot model with no shame, probably had plenty of friends and she dated Axel ( cool dude with connections) for some time, Ian on the other hand was a nerd for most of his life, even then, you can do some good persuasion dialogues if you build your stats, Axel or Jeremy would never be able to talk it out with Robert they way Ian did it for example.
When you go out to the bar earlier and go to Shine with Cindy, and she gives her number to Axel. I suppose it's not cheating by a dictionary definition, but the way its written it's definitely sleazy, and definitely something a boyfriend would want to know about. If this were the opposite - two female friends, and the boyfriend of the female friend who stayed home went out with the other, and chatted up a random girl at the bar and gave her his number, the girlfriend who stayed home would know about it THE NEXT DAY, if not the same night lol.
It's not that Ian's incapable of being smooth, it's that others are incapable of being awkward. What's one scene where another character comes off as snivelly or awkward? (EXCLUDING the by-design awkward characters like the two male roommates)
lul people complaining about too much story/drama and too less porn while I'm sitting here thinking there's already too much porn xD I get that the porn is part of the appeal of the game so I don't intend on complaining but the porn scenes are just not my cup of tea. game needs more handholding and hugging scenes lol
As it happens, Ivy, Lena's best friend walks on Ian fucking Cindy in the back alley. Not only Lena doesn't learn about it the next day; Ivy doesn't tell her about it at all. Jeremy, who also sees it, doesn't immediately tell Wade. And unlike Ian they don't even hint about it. So, it's hardly just Ian who is holding back on his friend.
Lena regularly loses her shit around Axel, even to the point where she can't decide what she wants to say at all. Robert gets all clingy and pathetic around Lena. Axel definitely doesn't act all cool and composed in situations where Lena is involved with another guy, even Ian notices this. Cindy very much falls apart after she cheats on her boyfriend with Ian. Alison can't bring herself to talk honestly with Ian about her feelings if her life depended on it. Louise gets so snivelly and clingy Lena actually finds it annoying. The list could go on.
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Jeremy gets into awkward situations with womans constantly, he is a "simple but endearing dude with giant cock that likes to fuck", he is not your typical BBC material that for sure, most of his scenes with Ivy/Louise has awkwardness in them when he gets called out on stuff(has zero exuses), most of his scenes with Lena has this too, since he does not know how to deal with her because of Ian, she had to practically force herself on him.
Axel attempt at seducting Lena in his photoshoot if you are not receptive are pathetic and needy(even if you show zero interest and refuse to follow his directions he still forces himself on you and goes for the kiss).
Robert lol.
Most Wade scenes in relation to Cindy, they all talk how cool he used to be, but look at him at the club when he meets Axel.
Get out; this is a classy porn game, not some degenerate filth.
- Nov 25, 2022
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The Ivy example is a fair point, though I never thought of her as Lena's bestie, shes just the party-girl friend; Louise is the bestie, but i guess it depends how you play it. I wouldnt call Lena "losing her shit" around Axel, rather just storyboarding for reluctance to go back for the "bad boy" - and when it comes to him being jealous, notice her emotions are always fear or anger, but never repulsion. Agreed on Cindy and Louise.
Agreed on Robert, I'll change what I said in that he's certainly dynamic.
On Jeremy/Axel, I simply don't agree. Jeremy is as token as you can get. (well, maybe thats not fair given how many awful ntr-bbc fetish games there are lol), still, he's brutish from the start - he's written to be immediately unlikeable when he just wails on Ian during boxing training.
Or maybe here's a different way I could try and get you to see it; other than the shaggy sing-a-long (though making fun of a guy for being too much of a player is kinda a joking gentle jab), when is Jeremy ever humiliated? When is Axel ever humilated? Ian has loads of scenes with potential humilation given the wrong choices.
Jeremy just doesn't strike me as breaking stereotypes. Breaking stereotypes is like the black guy in "A Happy Marriage" who's a software ceo and secretly loves femdom. There's nothing inherently wrong with having characters act a certain way, these are porn games, ppl can like what they like, but if you can't see this dev has a huge interracial/alpha-bully-guy fetish, and writes the characters accordingly, you're not seeing the forest for the trees.
- Nov 25, 2022
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Jess calls him an idiot and a looser in front of his friends. There is that.
Pretty sure Ivy being her best friend is ingame canon, no matter how much you try to be good to Louise, you cant(i tried very hard, she is my favorite "love interest"), i wish it did depend on how you play it tho.
I dont think its fair to use all potential times protag "can get humiliated", i personally dont really see anything humiliating about the scene we were initially talking about(Wade/Ian dialogue about Cindy), Axel and Jeremy simply dont have that many scenes for them to get humiliated, they are side characters with very narrow purposes, especially Axel, we only see him like 3-4 times for a short time and its almost always work related in some way( photoshoot), Jeremy is too dense and simple to get humiliated, i dont think he would care or even notice.
I played recently as Ian that fucked everyone he can(bro with Jeremy and sharing girls path), and i dont remember stumbling into any humiliating scenes, you know what i remember tho?
Jeremy finishing first in a threesome with Alison and going away while Alison commenting how much better Ian is and they keep fucking.
Pretty much every girl at some point will remark on how good Ian is in bed, i'm pretty sure even Lena says at some point that "it was the best sex" or something and she dated Axel.
When you stumble into something that you consider Humiliating on purpose i dont think it counts, you as a player have too much control of what you can say or do after all.
Now if he was forced to be humiliated all the time i would get your point, but that not his character in this game, hell, there is even "chad Ian" variable in the game that has points.
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Ivy is canonically "Lena's closest friend and the only one she still keeps from her high school years". It's right there in her bio in the Agenda. In contrast Louise and Lena are said to be "good friends" in Louise's entry.
- May 16, 2020
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Ian's father is clearly based on Jordan Peterson. But what about Perry? Is he based on Neil Druckmann?
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