Patreon Is Hardening Their 'Adult Content' Guidelines. Discussion Thread

OctoPriest

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Mar 28, 2017
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Either way, I can't help but think it will scare off potential game designers from attempting to develop future adult games with regards to using Patreon as a monetary platform for getting their projects funded and off the ground. While I can understand Patreon's reasoning and the legalities behind such a move, here's hoping that folks find a more welcoming platform elsewhere that's a bit more geared towards games of the adult community. Honestly, so long as the content provided is clearly stated as being of a fictional nature and are involving only those over the legal age, I don't see why there should be any problem, regardless of the fetishes involved.
 

Ignazzio

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It's a matter of mentality. States thing. I wonder what would happen with Japan if they would ban erotic content in games. USA is quite creepy sometimes
 
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OhWee

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It's a matter of mentality. States thing. I wonder what would happen with Japan if they would ban erotic content in games. USA is quite creepy sometimes
They'd probably find some way to include those fun Japanese Porn Game Shows in that case. I'd be sad. Sure, they are fake, but nonetheless it's fun to watch the porn actors portraying normal people, who end up having to fuck each other because of how the 'game show' rules work.
 

Ignazzio

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They'd probably find some way to include those fun Japanese Porn Game Shows in that case. I'd be sad. Sure, they are fake, but nonetheless it's fun to watch the porn actors portraying normal people, who end up having to fuck each other because of how the 'game show' rules work.
Yeah. Sexual culture of Japan is impressive. It's so deep within their culture that those american ideas feel abstract for them. Thank God for that
 

anne O'nymous

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This is the level of ignorance that some have.
Of course they are ignorant, but because they want to.
Parenting is a job and it mean that you need at least to implicate yourself in the life of your child, and be aware of some norms, like age restrictions but not only this. If you don't want to do that, then you aren't ignorant, you're just a stupid irresponsible selfish brat and shouldn't have had the right to have a child.
Perhaps I flare up a little too much, but seriously, what to think when some don't even take the responsibility of their own errors and blame them on others ? After the fact that video games make you violent (because everybody know that violence started in the 1970, never before there was a single act of violence), now it's what ? Adult games that make you rapist ?

Well, I have something to tell you, if your son is a depraved rapist, it's only because you refused to talk about sex with him. He had to learn it by itself, without no one to guide him and correct his misconceptions, no one to tell him that fetishism can be a thing for some people, but that consent MUST be a thing for everyone... How do you expected it to end ?
Yes, of course adult games depict things that aren't really a good behavior, but like shooter they are an... what's the English word ? In french it's "exutoire"... Well, whatever, they're a way to express what they feel without doing any harms to others.
Ban them, and you'll have more depraved rapists, not less...
 
Aug 24, 2017
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You know, I think I'VE FIGURED THIS OUT. This shit with the new FCC rules is just a front. The real objective is to cut out the money that goes from USA to Russia mostly and then other countries... think about it, how many russian games on Patreon that get revenue from people in US ?! Most games that I play from Patreon are made by russian devs. Tinfoil hat off ;)
 
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Aug 24, 2017
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Of course they are ignorant, but because they want to.
Parenting is a job and it mean that you need at least to implicate yourself in the life of your child, and be aware of some norms, like age restrictions but not only this. If you don't want to do that, then you aren't ignorant, you're just a stupid irresponsible selfish brat and shouldn't have had the right to have a child.
Perhaps I flare up a little too much, but seriously, what to think when some don't even take the responsibility of their own errors and blame them on others ? After the fact that video games make you violent (because everybody know that violence started in the 1970, never before there was a single act of violence), now it's what ? Adult games that make you rapist ?

Well, I have something to tell you, if your son is a depraved rapist, it's only because you refused to talk about sex with him. He had to learn it by itself, without no one to guide him and correct his misconceptions, no one to tell him that fetishism can be a thing for some people, but that consent MUST be a thing for everyone... How do you expected it to end ?
Yes, of course adult games depict things that aren't really a good behavior, but like shooter they are an... what's the English word ? In french it's "exutoire"... Well, whatever, they're a way to express what they feel without doing any harms to others.
Ban them, and you'll have more depraved rapists, not less...
Oui, tu as raison. Hehe, I'm not french but studied it like a year or two in high school and still remember some things.
 

Teaber

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The Patreon text is... well, at the very least, contradictory and, like I said in another thread, highly hypocritical. On the one hand, as was said, due to the ambiguous writing it is hard to infere whether they are considering ALL incest as banned content or only that which is "hard to distinguish from non consexual sex". In my view, I think it is the former, as the clarification that comes after that won't make much sense otherwise.

If we take this premise, what comes next is even worse. The "...these situations are, unfortunately, part of real life" bit is absolutely stupid. If the fact that they are part of real life is the element that makes these things "complicated", it makes absolutely no sense to just pick incest or rape. Fucking ritual, sex-related cannibalism is as real a thing as incest; establishing real-life cases as the reference point by which to allow or completely ban some content is pointless.

And, finally, the treatment part. If the content is going to be allowed ONLY if it is treated, developed narratively in a certain way... well, this is yelling hypocrisy so loud it hurts. Hypocrisy because, in the first place, Game of Thrones is marked as an example of acceptable fiction, and if there is a mainstream work that includes all kind of creepy content (sex-related or not), this is Martin's series. Rape, child abuse, all kind of psychopathic behaviour, and, of course, incest relationships of all kind (romantic, abusive, toxic). If stories like GoT or Lolita (a piece of fiction written from the point of view of paedophile which allows the reader to immerse in his worldview) are allowed, almost everything should be allowed that provides a more or less clear narrative progression (and, now that I come to think of it, maybe this bit is not bat at all). But if, as the sanctimonious tone of the text seems to suggest, what they are going to take into account is whether the story is not just for the sake of fun and kinky pleasure, then creators might just have to make sure they 'Sansanise' their characters; that is, they can submit them to any kind of perversity, including being raped by a dog-lover psychopath, if they are reinforced by the experience and end up being an example of strenght against appalling circumstances.

Well, in the end, it seems that this will just end up bringing some changes: some content will have to be properly hidden so as no to hurt some people's feelings (this might mean creators will have to rely more on other sites, like this one, in order to publicise their content) and stories might have to be more carefully conceived so that they can pass the moral (double) standards of Patreon. Not as bad as it could have been.
 
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OhWee

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For completeness, just need to note that the Dreams of Desire Patreon was also suspended today, and placed under review. I've read that it's just a matter of time before it is restored (at whatever level is acceptable) but as of this post I'm still seeing the 'under review' message.


If you notice any others, feel free to post them up.
 

FeralChild

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Aug 13, 2017
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This is surprisingly vague and imprecise as worded because of the serial commas. Are they stating they do not allow incest full-stop, or are they banning incest when it becomes "hard to distinguish from non-consensual sex"...?
You can essentially read it as
We also do not allow other fringe sexual fetish content, such as incest
So I assume yes, incest games are probably no longer allowed.
They'll probably have to do the same thing SR7 does and advertise a different clean game for Patreon, then do their TOS violating games through a blog and have those advertised as free games.
 

FeralChild

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For completeness, just need to note that the Dreams of Desire Patreon was also suspended today, and placed under review. I've read that it's just a matter of time before it is restored (at whatever level is acceptable) but as of this post I'm still seeing the 'under review' message.


If you notice any others, feel free to post them up.
imo that's incredibly unprofessional and unethical for Patreon to just pull the rug out from content creators without warning.
They have to know that a lot of them have quit their jobs because of funding from Patreon, and to just suspend and probably kill an entire campaign is something only a total sociopath could do.
 

OhWee

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OK, I saw a portion of these in another post, so posting them here for completeness...


Adult Content
We ask creators to flag themselves as Adult Content if they create any content that has mature themes such as sexuality or graphic violence. When you are flagged as Adult Content your page is removed from our search. We also require that all public content on your page be appropriate for all audiences. Content with mature themes must be marked as a patron-only post.

We have zero tolerance when it comes to the glorification of sexual violence which includes bestiality, rape, and child exploitation (i.e., sexualized depiction of minors). This is true for illustrated, animated, or any other type of content. Patreon reserves the right to review and remove accounts that may violate this guideline. As a strong commitment to child safety, we will work with law enforcement whenever we come across child exploitation.

We also do not allow other fringe sexual fetish content, such as incest, necrophilia, or fetish content that is hard to distinguish from non-consensual sex.

We understand that some topics on this list such as incest or rape are a little bit more complicated because these situations are, unfortunately, part of real life. As a result, when reviewing this type of content, the Trust and Safety team will take into consideration context including personal, historical or educational narrative. For example, survivor stories or fiction such as Game of Thrones or Lolita are allowed on Patreon.

Lastly, you cannot sell pornographic material or arrange sexual service(s) as a reward for your patrons. You can’t use Patreon to raise funds in order to produce pornographic material such as maintaining a website, funding the production of movies, or providing a private webcam session.
 

Ignazzio

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Lastly, you cannot sell pornographic material or arrange sexual service(s) as a reward for your patrons. You can’t use Patreon to raise funds in order to produce pornographic material such as maintaining a website, funding the production of movies, or providing a private webcam session.
Maybe here someone will tell me what it means. Doesn't it mean that every dev is breaking those rules as every reward is connected with their games which are pornographic material?
 

Teaber

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Maybe here someone will tell me what it means. Doesn't it mean that every dev is breaking those rules as every reward is connected with their games which are pornographic material?
I would say that might have to do with some people using Patreon accounts to offer nude pics of themselves or, as is said, webcam shows.
 

LewdDao

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I think much of it has to do with the fact that adult content is supposed to be a patron only post, it can be a free patron only post, but many developers have been posting nude images as public. Before today a few games that I know of, sure there is more out there, have been breaking the Patreon adult content rules. I think some of this is cracking down on the rules and making the stiffer to combat these infringements on the rules.

The new wording is confusing. Someone obviously tried to write it in legalese. I think the main points are that any adult content posted on Patreon has to be in a patron post and not a public one, and no forced content. It seems the last paragraph would point to the fact that as long as it is fiction, not RL life content, then it most cases it will be allowed as long as it is sexual violence in some way. DMD's site is already back up, so we know that consenting incest and corruption will be allowed.

Though, I am hoping that Patreon will post a clarification or re-word the clause as I am sure they are probably getting flooded with questions, etc.
 
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OhWee

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OhWee said:
Lastly, you cannot sell pornographic material or arrange sexual service(s) as a reward for your patrons. You can’t use Patreon to raise funds in order to produce pornographic material such as maintaining a website, funding the production of movies, or providing a private webcam session.
Maybe here someone will tell me what it means. Doesn't it mean that every dev is breaking those rules as every reward is connected with their games which are pornographic material?
Yeah I'm struggling with this paragraph too. As I read that, nobody making an adult game can ask for funds on Patreon, because they are producing pornographic material, and it'd be hard to prove that the funds raised aren't being used for the production of said pornographic material.

As I read this EVERY SINGLE adult game developer who solicits for donations on patreon has run afoul of this paragraph. Obviously, Mr. Dots got through this dragnet somehow though so I guess Patreon is just ''putting on a show" for the feds.
 

Teaber

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The new wording is confusing. Someone obviously tried to write it in legalese. I think the main points are that any adult content posted on Patreon has to be in a patron post and not a public one, and no forced content. It seems the last paragraph would point to the fact that as long as it is fiction, not RL life content, then it most cases it will be allowed as long as it is sexual violence in some way. DMD's site is already back up, so we know that consenting incest and corruption will be allowed.

Though, I am hoping that Patreon will post a clarification or re-word the clause as I am sure they are probably getting flooded with questions, etc.
Regarding real-life content, I think their adding the "educational, personal stories" means that, either pure fiction or based on real events, what matters the most is the tone of the story. In my view, they are implying that, if the content conveys some story of superation or whatever, then it will be favourably looked upon. Otherwise... But, as I said before, adding Got and Lolita as examples of acceptable fiction makes everything anything but clear. And the fact that games showing incest, etc., that had been taken down are already back should mean that, for the moment, all they are asking is discretion regarding problematic content.
 

LewdDao

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I took the "educational, personal stories" to mean in regards to survivor stories of Rape, etc.

adding Got and Lolita as examples of acceptable fiction makes everything anything but clear.
... or it is insanely popular and we will lose lots of money...