It's been a week or two since i wanted to make VNs and I'm not doing so well. For starters, Ren'py, a powerful tool for creating VN, easy to use, is still too complex, and resources (tutorials I mean) are scarce, and not in-depth. I considered using other engines as well but I don't really have the time to learn another engine from the roots up again. What would you do?
Welp, I discarded using Ren'py for the same reason than you. I have NO idea about programming, and no matter how much tutorials I try to watch, it's like explaining colors to a blind person.
If you are willing to learn some Python, then you should try staying on Ren'py. There's no one rushing you, after all.
But you could also try other engines that don't require coding knowledge at all, like RPGM (yeah, you can make some good VNs with this engine).
If you are willing to learn some Python, then you should try staying on Ren'py. There's no one rushing you, after all.
But you could also try other engines that don't require coding knowledge at all, like RPGM (yeah, you can make some good VNs with this engine).
- Aug 25, 2017
- 1,734
- 3,848
Someone else here has suggested before that once you know the basics of Ren'py you take apart a game you personally like and see what makes it tick.
I have no idea about the engine or coding in general but that seemed like solid advise to me.
I have no idea about the engine or coding in general but that seemed like solid advise to me.
You should start simple, it is normal you get overwhelmed if you are already trying to make world maps, phones, inventories, etc. You are giving up too quickly imho.
you could say that, I learn fast but Ren'py got tricky and tutorials became scarce, even the offline documentation wasn't helping much.
Not that I'm giving up. It's that I like a challenge because I learn something new every time I try, but the idea of not having any way to go through that is really sad.
I actually read about this too while I was searching for a VN engine, and I don't really know if it works. Maybe the theory is Ren'py can open Python based games? IDK lol
Specifically, this channel:
You must be registered to see the links
All seems well then all of sudden this happens:
You must be registered to see the links
.As for the things I read, well, I go about almost everywhere reading stuff so I don't remember, sorry. lol
- Jun 14, 2018
- 1,611
- 2,258
Yeah. Elaine's tutorials are pretty good.
Though I'm not sure I made it that far when I was watching them.
As for the video that causes you a headache... Most devs don't use live compositing.
If you couldn't follow the video... then just ignore it and don't use compositing either.
That particular video... she's focused on creating complex images using compositing.
Basically, that's using various images overlaid on top of others to create a much more complex single image.
In this case, she has a single character body drawn without eyes and a mouth.
Then she's using lots of different statements to add those mouths and noses back on to the drawing.
The main method is to put different pictures of eyes and mouths into different folders. Then build up an image using variables to pick which folder to use. So the variable picks which "expression" to use. Each expression/folder has a different mouth and different eyes to match that expression. Change the variable and you end up with a different images.
So in much the same way you might write " mc "My name is [pc_name]" to put the main character's name in a dialogue.
She's building up a filename using "Lemos/[expression]/[expression]_eyes.png" type naming...
... to end up with something like "./games/images/Lemos/Happy/Happy_eyes.png".
Then she's using some clever stuff like random pauses between eye blinks and such.
Then she's using other variables to pick which image to use based on their values (like "if jill_beers > 4" use drunk image otherwise use sober image).
Finally she's using one set of composite images to create another one. In this case the base image + eyes composite + mouth composite to create the final image.
The main reason for using this style of image creation is size. By using one medium sized image and lots of small images... it's possible to create lots of character variations in a fraction of the space.
That said, most devs will just render the full character with the various expression separately and end up using 3 or 4 times the amount of disk space to do the same thing... because it's "easier" to do multiple renders than it is to do this sort of compositing.
- May 3, 2018
- 1,403
- 1,011
Taking a break is alright, so long as you come back to keep working.
Why? What would I do?
Well here is what I did:
in fifth grade, I wanted to learn electronics. But when I looked into it, it had scary math and I had only just learned multiplication. so I ran away from the idea.
Sixth grade, it felt like I wasn't doing anything with my life, math was the only thing I was good at, so I grew a pair (of balls) and spent the summer studying electrics. Damn did that feel good, I felt so powerful being able to make a dream a reality.
7th grade, to get better at electronics I moved to microcontrollers and spent a year learning programming.
8th grade, I wanted to make video games, but I heard that you needed to understand physics for that (for game engines), and physics needed higher level math, that seemed scary, I decided I would wait till senior year where high school would teach me the math I needed and physics.
only half 8th grade goes by and I am already bored of waiting, so I teach myself calculus, physics, and linear algebra for the remainder of the school year.
through high school, I basically just show off, get better by writing custom engines and simulations, start focus on studying human behavior, as well as improving my English skills from special-needs to honor-student because I realized I could if I tried.
college gets started and I have more free time, so I worked on my socializing skills and taught myself 2D and 3D art (I only started doing 3D art a year ago).
Basically, if you get interested in something, so long as you keep coming back to it (like with making posts on f95zone) and still have an interest in it, you should be fine.
Sure you may want to change your game idea to a new one (I haven't finished a NSFW game yet since I am always too critical of myself, I only just now made an art style that has the best balance of speed, shortcuts/compromises, and quality/style, I still need to simplify writing and my game ideas, since they are all too big and long for my attention span), and as a result you may not stick to completing any one project for a while, but if you are interested and have fun learning how to make games and playing with ideas, then you'll make something eventually.
The main danger is the current mindset of us younger generation. Everyone has phones, and skipping over the countless documents and reports I had to write about the subject, basically, the side effect of phones is that it is making people worry more about short term, immediate satisfaction, and have less self-restraint to focus on any one task. I think it is fine if you can do both, be a workaholic sometimes, and a lazy potato another time. Aristotle's theory of happiness was that focusing on long term goals yields more satisfaction(happiness) with life overall.
So while I say it is ok to stop working for a while to keep yourself energized, maybe work on something more interesting, don't just drop the idea of making a game entirely just because it takes too long or is too big of a goal, if you just keep focusing on just trying to get satisfaction as soon as possible, your life is going to be nothing more than looking for your next fix, and you'll never be able to stop, rest, and relax happy knowing you don't need to worry, because immediate satisfaction always leaves you wanting more while eternal happiness (self-accomplishment) lets you sleep easy at night.
FYI the main way people learn things by them self, be it game making to knowing what car to buy, where and when, is not by being an expert or listening to an expert. you just keep exploring, you stumble across hidden gems, such as how to make homemade penetration oil. The main issue with studying electronics, 3D modeling, advanced mathematics or other things is that you don't know the names of anything, so you can't google anything to learn about them, so sometimes you do just need to sit down and watch an hour-long video just to learn the big idea or keywords. So you keep checking up on the subject, eventually tripping over enough things to start mastering the subject, and so long as you keep coming back, staying up to date with things like new videos on youtube and staying in the loop, you will be pretty much an expert on anything. So it is not about knowing or having the skill, or even really practicing what you learn, it is just keeping an interest in the subject to look it up from time to time.
So slow and steady wins the race, not fast and amazing.
Why? What would I do?
Well here is what I did:
in fifth grade, I wanted to learn electronics. But when I looked into it, it had scary math and I had only just learned multiplication. so I ran away from the idea.
Sixth grade, it felt like I wasn't doing anything with my life, math was the only thing I was good at, so I grew a pair (of balls) and spent the summer studying electrics. Damn did that feel good, I felt so powerful being able to make a dream a reality.
7th grade, to get better at electronics I moved to microcontrollers and spent a year learning programming.
8th grade, I wanted to make video games, but I heard that you needed to understand physics for that (for game engines), and physics needed higher level math, that seemed scary, I decided I would wait till senior year where high school would teach me the math I needed and physics.
only half 8th grade goes by and I am already bored of waiting, so I teach myself calculus, physics, and linear algebra for the remainder of the school year.
through high school, I basically just show off, get better by writing custom engines and simulations, start focus on studying human behavior, as well as improving my English skills from special-needs to honor-student because I realized I could if I tried.
college gets started and I have more free time, so I worked on my socializing skills and taught myself 2D and 3D art (I only started doing 3D art a year ago).
Basically, if you get interested in something, so long as you keep coming back to it (like with making posts on f95zone) and still have an interest in it, you should be fine.
Sure you may want to change your game idea to a new one (I haven't finished a NSFW game yet since I am always too critical of myself, I only just now made an art style that has the best balance of speed, shortcuts/compromises, and quality/style, I still need to simplify writing and my game ideas, since they are all too big and long for my attention span), and as a result you may not stick to completing any one project for a while, but if you are interested and have fun learning how to make games and playing with ideas, then you'll make something eventually.
The main danger is the current mindset of us younger generation. Everyone has phones, and skipping over the countless documents and reports I had to write about the subject, basically, the side effect of phones is that it is making people worry more about short term, immediate satisfaction, and have less self-restraint to focus on any one task. I think it is fine if you can do both, be a workaholic sometimes, and a lazy potato another time. Aristotle's theory of happiness was that focusing on long term goals yields more satisfaction(happiness) with life overall.
So while I say it is ok to stop working for a while to keep yourself energized, maybe work on something more interesting, don't just drop the idea of making a game entirely just because it takes too long or is too big of a goal, if you just keep focusing on just trying to get satisfaction as soon as possible, your life is going to be nothing more than looking for your next fix, and you'll never be able to stop, rest, and relax happy knowing you don't need to worry, because immediate satisfaction always leaves you wanting more while eternal happiness (self-accomplishment) lets you sleep easy at night.
FYI the main way people learn things by them self, be it game making to knowing what car to buy, where and when, is not by being an expert or listening to an expert. you just keep exploring, you stumble across hidden gems, such as how to make homemade penetration oil. The main issue with studying electronics, 3D modeling, advanced mathematics or other things is that you don't know the names of anything, so you can't google anything to learn about them, so sometimes you do just need to sit down and watch an hour-long video just to learn the big idea or keywords. So you keep checking up on the subject, eventually tripping over enough things to start mastering the subject, and so long as you keep coming back, staying up to date with things like new videos on youtube and staying in the loop, you will be pretty much an expert on anything. So it is not about knowing or having the skill, or even really practicing what you learn, it is just keeping an interest in the subject to look it up from time to time.
So slow and steady wins the race, not fast and amazing.
- Jun 10, 2017
- 10,976
- 16,232
That's a tutorial that can be completely skipped and replaced by one regarding
You must be registered to see the links
.Honestly I haven't tested them, and if I should make something like this, I would probably stand to LiveComposite or equivalent, because it fit more my vision of dynamism. But for someone that have no or few knowledge in coding, and so isn't as corrupted as me, layered images are undeniably the best solution. And also a solution way easier than LiveComposite and other dynamic displayables.
There is a Easy way to learn Renpy i did it this way and its strange but helped me to learn how stuff works.
I took a game that i liked and i wanted to have somthing similiar (beginn simple with just a forward game with 1-2 options dont go crazy with smartphone and inventory at the beginning)
Then EXTRACT THE GAME with all this tools that are here aviable.
So you will have completly encrypted Renpy game that you can READ whole script.
You will see how they made chapters how they linked from 1 chapter to an other how they linked pictures and text ect. You will learn this way faster at least for me because i openeds 2nd Text File entered the stuff i liked with my pictures and tested it ... tada i got similiar game but my own version with my own pictures.
Its good way to learn how stuff works BUT: Dont rip the game 1to1 just LEARN and rewrite stuff your own so you will save it better in your brain for further using.
I took a game that i liked and i wanted to have somthing similiar (beginn simple with just a forward game with 1-2 options dont go crazy with smartphone and inventory at the beginning)
Then EXTRACT THE GAME with all this tools that are here aviable.
So you will have completly encrypted Renpy game that you can READ whole script.
You will see how they made chapters how they linked from 1 chapter to an other how they linked pictures and text ect. You will learn this way faster at least for me because i openeds 2nd Text File entered the stuff i liked with my pictures and tested it ... tada i got similiar game but my own version with my own pictures.
Its good way to learn how stuff works BUT: Dont rip the game 1to1 just LEARN and rewrite stuff your own so you will save it better in your brain for further using.
Now that's a very effective way of learning, and, uhh...unethical (haha)... I'll try this out. Now I feel stupid for not doing this before O.O
I like this approach way better too... drawing faceless characters and just doing the expressions one by one... :3
Thanks jeah somtimes you need to think out of the box. All this tutorials on youtube are good but it dosent help me if i dont know how to combine this stuff in a working game that i like.
And with decompling an existing game you see exactly how stuff works.
"Ahh in this file i need to put this line so it links to my chapter"
"Ahh here i can enter my logos that rotating with my Patreon"
"Ahh this is how he makes a MENU OPTION to pic option 1 or option 2 and this is how he links them to the other chapter"
"Ahh this is how he made correct return after the end to his menus"
Lot of stuff they offer so you can learn from them.
But dont take a Game like Holiday or so this games i extracted to see how he made side menu .... there are 10.000 lines of code till you find the part that you need you allready dead.
I recommend trying small games that only have 1 Chapter or are just 0.1 Demos. From them you learn the most but take one that you like not somthing generic that from renpy allready created =).
- May 19, 2017
- 4,065
- 6,295
Like others have said, no use reinventing the wheel.
It's ok to look over your classmates shoulder sometimes and copy their answers.
Find a game that you like, and just replace the images with your own. Replace some text, shake things up.
You can't learn heart surgery from a book, you gotta cut someone open.
Crack a game open and see what's inside.
- Jun 29, 2018
- 145
- 132
I think the complexity of using RenPy depends a lot on what you want to do with a game. If you are doing a Visual Novel you can start easy and just work on simple thins like changing images as the text gets displayed. The code to display images is very basic and is basically the same over and over with just changing the image name.
If you want to bring in more options like tracking stats, making portions of the image 'clickable', or having some type of in game economy it can get much more complex.
I'm a big believer in looking at the code for games you have already played. You can use UnRen.bat to be able to view the code for a lot of RenPy games. Then look at the code for specific scenes and you can see how the code is put together. Look for things like how text is displayed on the screen, how images are changed, or how stats are tracked through the game.
If you like video tutorials (which I prefer) here is a Youtuber that has a very basic starting level series of videos on using RenPy:
If you want to bring in more options like tracking stats, making portions of the image 'clickable', or having some type of in game economy it can get much more complex.
I'm a big believer in looking at the code for games you have already played. You can use UnRen.bat to be able to view the code for a lot of RenPy games. Then look at the code for specific scenes and you can see how the code is put together. Look for things like how text is displayed on the screen, how images are changed, or how stats are tracked through the game.
If you like video tutorials (which I prefer) here is a Youtuber that has a very basic starting level series of videos on using RenPy:
You must be registered to see the links