Ren'Py Seeds of Chaos [v0.4.08] [Vénus Noire]

[Nightmare800]

Se Need a real Hero!!!

I can't wait to see Rowan gut him like a fish.

By the way this game's tags have a female protagonist listed in them, where can I choose that?

 

[Nightmare800]

In times like these when the update has dropped and the thread is barren of links I ask myself...

View attachment 1332137

Judging from the acute lack of progress in the past five years I can guarantee you this will be abandoned eventually.

 

[Ataman87]

Judging from the acute lack of progress in the past five years I can guarantee you this will be abandoned eventually.

Tell me of a game with this kind of scope, hand made art , size and so on that is made on a donation model (on this site or elsewhere) where the progress is faster. These are small teams progress is slow . Here at least is frequent every two mounts. And the treat of abandonment lingers over every game that uses this model of development and funding.

 

[Nightmare800]

Tell me of a game with this kind of scope, hand made art , size and so on that is made on a donation model (on this site or elsewhere) where the progress is faster. These are small teams progress is slow . Here at least is frequent every two mounts. And the treat of abandonment lingers over every game that uses this model of development and funding.

What, you think I know the exact progress rate of every smut VN around? What I know is that this is a classic case of Patreon milking that has unfortunately became a staple of smut games nowadays unless they are japanese titles. I concede the art style is pretty good but for a VN to move to 0.2 in FIVE years stinks of either greed or laziness, or both. I can guarantee you that if patreon would work on the basis of pay-per-update (say six bucks per one tenth of the game) this wouldn't have happened.

Sure, it may sound awful rude for me to say this, considering I got the game for free, but this abhorrent practice of lazy assholes milking their patrons for meagre updates with endless development cycles is something I cannot simply agree with. To me it's betrayal of their trust and it's ultimately causing the donators to be cynical about donating at all, which hurts people who actually deserve it.

 

[rivon]

They have 13-14 k income.
They are in top 50 most founded projects on Patreon in Adult games subcategory.
So no.

 

[Nightmare800]

They have 13-14 k income.
They are in top 50 most founded projects on Patreon in Adult games subcategory.
So no.

Was that meant to be a reply to me or Ataman87?

 

[sickdude]

What, you think I know the exact progress rate of every smut VN around? What I know is that this is a classic case of Patreon milking that has unfortunately became a staple of smut games nowadays unless they are japanese titles. I concede the art style is pretty good but for a VN to move to 0.2 in FIVE years stinks of either greed or laziness, or both.

Well I agree, I bought this game on steam randomly and then supported them on patreon to make development bc I wanted this game to finish fast (how foolish I am ) but tho I love the quality and all updates, the content is too little for the amount of support they get. So I quitted the patreon and support other smaller developers on patreon.

Btw can anyone tell me when they will share new content link ? or update steam version?

 

[Ataman87]

Dude the model is flawed- yes. But before it there were zero western porn games of this quality (and i dont care about 99 % of jap games becouse they suck - maybe due to poor localisation or cultural diferences) . Japan games are made by actual comercial studios on a purchase - release model. Like a finished product that has development deadlines and a fixed preinvested budget. So there cant be comparison. I have couple of favorite games with 2d art that get upd regulary (slowly but again regulary) . As long as people are interested and the dev are alive and working we get updates piece by piece. Maybe with the money they make there shoud be noticable increese in development time - more artist , more coders, writers but i think with smaller studios there is no real project managment on that scale. I hope that this donation model will evolve in to actual profestional western porn game industrty. There are a few such studios like the one that made Subverse but there you have an other problem - the kinks. You see for a large studio to direct resources and make the nececery advertisment (since sells are more important and you cant hope only on donations) they need to tone down on the kinks. Or they will get heat from censors and other "moral" organisations. So no incest , no futa , no kinky demon sex , no violence , no monster fucking. Or not least on the depraved and erotic level we get here. Again i undestand what you are saying the model is flawed , but think about it before that we never got games like this one. Think it like this - the dudes here writers , artist , coders behind this game are freelancers and in the end amateurs (im not saying they lack the skills) but they have a fix resourse and they make things at a set phase. Its slow yes - but again its regular. The money they get is for them they dont have a real motivation or the know how to organise a large studio that can crank things on a pro industry level. The are developers (most 3d art) games that some how work faster but again we are talking about simple visial novels with 3d art.

 

[Dortan]

What, you think I know the exact progress rate of every smut VN around? What I know is that this is a classic case of Patreon milking that has unfortunately became a staple of smut games nowadays unless they are japanese titles. I concede the art style is pretty good but for a VN to move to 0.2 in FIVE years stinks of either greed or laziness, or both. I can guarantee you that if patreon would work on the basis of pay-per-update (say six bucks per one tenth of the game) this wouldn't have happened.

Sure, it may sound awful rude for me to say this, considering I got the game for free, but this abhorrent practice of lazy assholes milking their patrons for meagre updates with endless development cycles is something I cannot simply agree with. To me it's betrayal of their trust and it's ultimately causing the donators to be cynical about donating at all, which hurts people who actually deserve it.

This is most certainly not a "classic case of Patreon milking". Ignoring the overall quality of presentation that is lacking in most of the titles here, the game has gone through several changes in story, art and is currently going through an overhaul of the mechanics which is significant since this is NOT just a VN.

I understand not being happy with the amount of progress but the fact is that even the development of small indie games can stretch on for years and looking at the consistency of the devs in recent years i really don't think that they are just lazy .
Also, i think they are working simultaneously on a second game if i'm not mistaken .

 

[Oriandu]

I think a big part of the problem with SoC is that the development team is somewhat unprofessional in both capability and attitude. They don't know how to design a video game. They may have the technical and artistic skill but they are completely lacking in an understanding of how to put that ability together in a coherent and functional way. As evidenced by the fact that progress is basically nonexistent in terms of the ongoing structure of the game, and the presence of so many scenes with no completed artwork, and the semi-regular reworking of systems that never seem to actually get finished. This should be expected as most of the people who work via patreon are amateurs and it shouldn't be held against them. However SoC would greatly benefit from bringing on a staffer with actual experience in game design, the only problem there is to bring someone like that in you would have to match salary and an experienced game designer would eat up half of their income.

Of course the catch 22 of them going the standard route of designing the game before development starts and then sticking to that design document would likely lead to a project lacking in imagination since there is always a certain level of things changing as they go and that usually has an even greater impact on people who are not as well versed in game development. SoC is, for better and worse, an amateur project. Expect things to take a while and that doesn't necessarily mean we're getting milked, but at the same time patreon more or less encourages slow development of content.

 

[Rein]

Judging from the acute lack of progress in the past five years I can guarantee you this will be abandoned eventually.

Whoever compiles ever single post from the last FIVE FUCKING YEARS saying we'll obviously abandond this game AT ANY MOMENT NOW, I will make your self-insert get cucked by Andras in a one-off map event.

Just a few lines of reference. No art. You don't get sommy for this.

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

And here i was wondering how this thread was going free of armchair devs for quite some time. Now two pop up at the same day...

 

[diebesgrab]

While I agree that the slow rate of story progress combined with the small team size opens the game up more to the always present possibility of “shit happens,” I’m curious if anyone’s actually aware of any large scale smut games that have had a more organized, more efficient team outside of the Japanese market? Or for that matter, any smut games that have produced more content in a similar period of time?

I’m honestly curious, I don’t play a lot of western porn games, and a lot of people accuse this game of a lack of progress. I understand most of them are just looking at the version number and making assumptions based on that, and I already granted that main story progression is really slow, but in terms of the amount of work being done and the content that’s been added, I’m actually curious what western porn games are out there that compare favorably.

 

[Trapitalism101]

While I agree that the slow rate of story progress combined with the small team size opens the game up more to the always present possibility of “shit happens,” I’m curious if anyone’s actually aware of any large scale smut games that have had a more organized, more efficient team outside of the Japanese market? Or for that matter, any smut games that have produced more content in a similar period of time?

I’m honestly curious, I don’t play a lot of western porn games, and a lot of people accuse this game of a lack of progress. I understand most of them are just looking at the version number and making assumptions based on that, and I already granted that main story progression is really slow, but in terms of the amount of work being done and the content that’s been added, I’m actually curious what western porn games are out there that compare favorably.

The only one I can think of is Flexible Survival or maybeTales of Androgeny. Both update Monthly, with ToA updating like cockwork on the first of every month.

 

[rivon]

Whoever compiles ever single post from the last FIVE FUCKING YEARS saying we'll obviously abandond this game AT ANY MOMENT NOW, I will make your self-insert get cucked by Andras in a one-off map event.

Just a few lines of reference. No art. You don't get sommy for this.

No no! Sommelier absolutely HAVE to illustrate those. You can't leave us hanging over there.

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

While I agree that the slow rate of story progress combined with the small team size opens the game up more to the always present possibility of “shit happens,” I’m curious if anyone’s actually aware of any large scale smut games that have had a more organized, more efficient team outside of the Japanese market? Or for that matter, any smut games that have produced more content in a similar period of time?

I’m honestly curious, I don’t play a lot of western porn games, and a lot of people accuse this game of a lack of progress. I understand most of them are just looking at the version number and making assumptions based on that, and I already granted that main story progression is really slow, but in terms of the amount of work being done and the content that’s been added, I’m actually curious what western porn games are out there that compare favorably.

Medieval fantasy, heavy on dialogue choices and with 2D art instead of 3D renders? None come to my mind.

 

[Deleted member 3378174]

Oh, you deceitful cretin you shall not deceive us!

Stay strong my brothers and sisters in faith, as the good book says: "The devil is a temptress and it will try to lead you astray."

Fortunately for us I have caught this devil red-handed...!



Look at the evil creature known as Rein as he gleefully milks his supporters...what the fuck am I writing? lol

I was just screwing around because no one posted a link for the new update and you people went on a holy war against Patreon porn developers lol

 

[Nightmare800]

Whoever compiles ever single post from the last FIVE FUCKING YEARS saying we'll obviously abandond this game AT ANY MOMENT NOW, I will make your self-insert get cucked by Andras in a one-off map event.

Just a few lines of reference. No art. You don't get sommy for this.

I didn't say you abandoned it, I'm saying that from the look of things you are taking your supporters for a ride in a worst way possible and that abandoning it is how it will surely end. Nice grammar by the way, I'd expect more eloquent language skills from someone who writes for living.

Well I agree, I bought this game on steam randomly and then supported them on patreon to make development bc I wanted this game to finish fast (how foolish I am ) but tho I love the quality and all updates, the content is too little for the amount of support they get. So I quitted the patreon and support other smaller developers on patreon.

Btw can anyone tell me when they will share new content link ? or update steam version?

Jesus they are actually SELLING this game on top of taking patreon monies for FIVE years and still haven't attained anything resembling a half completed product? Man if they were as obsessed with delivering as they are with milking their audience this game would have been completed in three years, no biggie.

 

[T51bwinterized]

same here. but based on what I read here, we're in the minority. People love to hate Andras. I don't care about him myself, but can't wait to see more major corruption events for Alexia, especially if he is the focus there

btw is there any chance we get to know more about the original Demon Lord? Andras and Jezara's father? or their mother? I would like to at least know how much each of them represents their father's methods. was he a cunning schemer? A ruthless conqueror? or a mix of both?

There's going to be more details within reason, especially as Rowan meets more characters related to the war.

I love you but I respectfully disagree.

The best NTR route is Greyhide, because he is adorable and deserves to have 2 new cockleeves/cumdumps.

That doesn't really much count as NTR, does it? Everyone is part of that fun.

Would just like to point out it's actually better to not let Cliohna and Shaya dominate you, turning the tables on them to make you an equal has better overall results. 100% with Shaya and definitely will with Cliohna too it may be important later on.

Depends on your goals and what kind of Rowan you want. But getting enthralled by the castle's spymaster if you want to plot a rebellion is perhaps not wise.

In times like these when the update has dropped and the thread is barren of links I ask myself...

View attachment 1332137

Where Booba indeed

You are right. If we look at things from the perspective of 'what actions can strenghthen Rowan's position and give him advantage for eventual future rebellion' then it's definitely worth to stand on even grounds with Cliohna and Shaya. In my previous message I just wanted to point out that Jezera as a castle spymaster is ignorant of these matters. She probably doesn't even know that both Cliohna and Shaya play their own game with Rowan and doesn't intervene in their efforts to subdue Rowan.

Jezera may not know everything, but she definitely isn't that dumb. And in the Shaya case, she does genuinely trust her (for reasons discussed in the plot).

What, you think I know the exact progress rate of every smut VN around? What I know is that this is a classic case of Patreon milking that has unfortunately became a staple of smut games nowadays unless they are japanese titles. I concede the art style is pretty good but for a VN to move to 0.2 in FIVE years stinks of either greed or laziness, or both. I can guarantee you that if patreon would work on the basis of pay-per-update (say six bucks per one tenth of the game) this wouldn't have happened.

Sure, it may sound awful rude for me to say this, considering I got the game for free, but this abhorrent practice of lazy assholes milking their patrons for meagre updates with endless development cycles is something I cannot simply agree with. To me it's betrayal of their trust and it's ultimately causing the donators to be cynical about donating at all, which hurts people who actually deserve it.

Hem hem. The rest aside, a clarifying detail. We're on build 2.65. which means we're on our 65th full build after the prologue. Not our second.

I think a big part of the problem with SoC is that the development team is somewhat unprofessional in both capability and attitude. They don't know how to design a video game. They may have the technical and artistic skill but they are completely lacking in an understanding of how to put that ability together in a coherent and functional way. As evidenced by the fact that progress is basically nonexistent in terms of the ongoing structure of the game, and the presence of so many scenes with no completed artwork, and the semi-regular reworking of systems that never seem to actually get finished. This should be expected as most of the people who work via patreon are amateurs and it shouldn't be held against them. However SoC would greatly benefit from bringing on a staffer with actual experience in game design, the only problem there is to bring someone like that in you would have to match salary and an experienced game designer would eat up half of their income.

Of course the catch 22 of them going the standard route of designing the game before development starts and then sticking to that design document would likely lead to a project lacking in imagination since there is always a certain level of things changing as they go and that usually has an even greater impact on people who are not as well versed in game development. SoC is, for better and worse, an amateur project. Expect things to take a while and that doesn't necessarily mean we're getting milked, but at the same time patreon more or less encourages slow development of content.

We've never been shy about the fact that yes are original pretentions didn't quite meet our vision. As time as has gone on, different team members have come in to work on different aspects and rework them. It's not a scam, it's a consequence of ground up development based on excitement about a project instead of capital.

But, I think you're too harsh by a bit on our ability to design. Rein has been handling our systems redesign and he's quite talented. I think the amount of complaining about game systems will drop in a substantial way (though definitely not entirely, we didn't change everything).

 

[Nightmare800]

This is most certainly not a "classic case of Patreon milking". Ignoring the overall quality of presentation that is lacking in most of the titles here, the game has gone through several changes in story, art and is currently going through an overhaul of the mechanics which is significant since this is NOT just a VN.

I understand not being happy with the amount of progress but the fact is that even the development of small indie games can stretch on for years and looking at the consistency of the devs in recent years i really don't think that they are just lazy .
Also, i think they are working simultaneously on a second game if i'm not mistaken .

With the money they are raking in they could easily employ professionals or at least part-timers yet apparently, profit is more important. The fact I'm not the first person to raise this concern and the way the developer reacted tells me my arguments aren't just some idle fancies of mine.