Ren'Py Seeds of Chaos [v0.4.08] [Vénus Noire]
- Jul 27, 2017
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- Apr 14, 2018
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Hey question for you folks, if you can pry yourselves from the pro vs anti NTR debate for a moment please, (As for me, I couldn't really give less of a fuck about NTR. I'm poly so NTR is pretty much a foreign concept to me anyway. As long as the gameplay is good, that's all I care about). There are 2 events that always crash the game out for me. The end of week event after I build the brothel & the second time we see the blonde elf girl, (Larry or whatever her name is... ~goes to look it up~... Liuaria... fuck it, close enough), where she does all Rowan's paperwork then makes him tea. Both those events crash the game out. Has anyone else ran into this issue? & if so, is there any way to work around or fix it?
- Apr 14, 2018
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Jar Jar? Nah man. I blame the Ewoks for that. Those weird ass progerian midget bears.
- Apr 14, 2018
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By the way, since the devs are here, I do want to say you've made a very good game. The erotic content, for me personally, I really don't care that much about. But the gameplay & character development is, for this genre, top notch. So a job well done to you.
- Apr 14, 2018
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I don't exactly want to disagree, but rather give you some feedback to ponder. There are 2 factors that I think the writer of that scene overlooked that I think would have made the scene play out more realistically &, in my opinion, better, though it wouldn't have made for as easy of a segue into an NTR scene. The first is actually thinking through the actual consequenses of the choice he makes. Granted, yes, in taking Helayna in, it would necessitate breaking their marital vows, however, if I remember correctly, she & Rowan grew up in the same town correct? So she would be familiar with Helayna already & would already know about the history & bond Rowan had with her as her teacher, (or whichever relation you selected in your gameplay). She would also be familiar with how deep, strong & meaningful, albeit platonic, that bond is. I mean here in the United States, a Military veteran can go into any VFW & already have an instant respect & kinship with fellow veterans that runs almost as deep as that with family, yet be complete strangers to them. Historically, that bond ran as deep, if not deeper then than it still does today. So we already that that bretheren in arms bond as a factor here, add to that the fact that Helayna is not only a sister in arms, but one that Rowan personally knew, mentored & developed a bond with, that equates to a very important thing. That that this girl is a person whom would be valued essentially as family due to the dynamics of their bond. Someone whom, in many ways, is like a child to Rowan & as such, someone whom he not only cares about deeply, but also feels a great deal of responsibility for. Add on top of all that the guilt & shame he already was having to shoulder for betraying her by, not only aligning with the twins to begin with & having her see her mentor, whom she held in such high regard, not only fall from his pedastal & betray their shared values, virtues & ethics, but also now standing as her enemy on the battlefield & defeating her, that is a LOT of context to consider, ALL of which Alexia is FULLY aware of.
So with all that in mind, Had Rowan not taken her in, she would have been left to be defiled by waves of Orcs & who knows what after. A fate that Helayna, Rowan & yes, Alexia too, all know would have been far worse than if Rowan had simply killed her on the spot, if nothing else than to spare her the indignity of her fate.
Now keep in mind, at the very beginning of this story, Rowan took off into the woods to rescue the daughter of a complete stranger, putting his own life & safety at risk without hesitation. & Alexia was completely supportive & in favor of this knowing full well that his decision could result in him dying & never returning home to her, leaving her a widow. As noble as his intent may be, I believe it could be argued that THAT decision would be an even greater transgression against their marital vows. But it was this same nobility, selflessness & heroicism that caused her to love him so dearly to begin with.
So with that in mind, when he takes Helayna in, Once she is aware of WHOM it is & WHY he had to do it, her response just doesn't make sense. The line of reasoning of "He didn't choose to serve the twins just to hold us together after all, but because he needs to be the warrior & champion & hero to someone" just does not fit. In fact, to be consistent with her character type, her reaction was actually backwards. This wasn't "just some girl that he saved because being a hero was more important to him than his vows to his wife", this was HELAYNA. This was his sister in arms & the girl he was a mentor & hero to. Someone they both knew well. Someone whom was like a daughter to him. Someone whom he felt deep responsibility to & whom he also had just betrayed on the battlefield. & knowing what fate she would have endured had Rowan not taken her in, If Alexia's character is to be interally consistent, she SHOULD not only understand WHY he did it, but actually be proud of him for doing it. She already knows that he has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that Rowan's love for her is beyond reproach. After all, if being the hero was what was important to him, he would have abandoned her & taken up arms against the twins in the coming war. He chose to SERVE the twins & completely abandon his faith, his values, his honor, his pride & all that he believed in & held dear & serve all that he stood against for his whole life for the sole purpose of being with her & keeping them together. So there should be absolutely no shred of doubt in her mind of his loyalty to her. So Knowing that, & knowing that the naked woman that was carried into his room is the metaphorical daughter & literal sister in arms & former student of his whom he just betrayed & devastated emotionally on the battlefield FOR HER, (due to their bondage under the twins), & additionally knowing what fate would befall Helyana Had he not taken her in, Alexia should already understand that fucking Helyana is not something Rowan would do or, (character here, not the pervy players mind you), even humor the thought of if he had any other choice. She should understand that after having already hurt someone that he cared about as deeply as he had, that this was the ONLY way that he could at least minimize her suffering & indignity & maybe buy some time to get out of her condition. That he wasn't bedding her willingly, but because he has no other choice. With all that taken into consideration, if Alexia is being internally consistent, her response would be one of understanding, sympathy to him & Helyana & pride in Rowan doing whats right & honorable despite the fucked up circumstances of it. Just like she did when he put himself at risk of death by charging off into the woods to save a complete strangers fictional daughter.
So when she is so internally inconsistent with herself like this, then on top of that, when someone she full well knows is one of the architects of ALL their current hardships & heartaches INCLUDING the very one currently thrust upon Rowan, one of the ones responsible for causing this very situation to happen in first place, comes knocking at her door, instead of lashing out at him with all the rage & anger that she would logically harbor for causing all this to happen to begin with, she instead is pleasant & friendly with him & then chooses to give herself to him. I mean that just does not add up. I mean it's not a matter of "noooo don't NTR my waifu" shit or anything like that, it's just not consistent with her character. It's just plain illogical. Even in the heat of anger & empassioned jealousy, it just does not fit. She could clearly see that Rowan wasn't happily skipping away to his bedchambers to have some extramarital fun, he was clearly shambling to them dejectedly & visibly displeased & disgusted with the acts that he would HAVE to perform to protect someone whom he had just betrayed & was like a daughter to him. That it was not something that he wanted to do, but would rather avoid had he any other choice.
So with these notes in mind, I ask that you would kindly take my feedback under consideration when writing out Alexis's part in this tale. Not to pander to me mind you, but, (& I hope you will agree), because my arguments have considerable merit & her character deserves to be written in a manner that is more consistent. Granted, yes, it might make giving the NTR fans their fap material, & I'm sorry to you NTR fanboys out there if my words cause such to happen, but to me, & I'm sure others like me whom care more about crafting well rounded & robust characters, well written stories & good quality gameplay would agree, What I have laid out here is something we would much rather see. Maybe in a future update of the game, that part can be updated & redone with more options on how Alexis responds based on how Rowan responds to her & what role the player chose that Rowan played in Helyana's life? Or maybe even give a choice in what direction Alexis's internal thoughts go on the matter? If that is possible I know I would definitely appreciate it & those whom care more about character & story would too. Thanks for your time.
- Sep 1, 2017
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That is another thing that pissed me off with that part, is the inconsistency.
That, and how Alexia leaves Rowan for saving a person from being raped, which somehow gives me a 'Rowan = Bad husband/bad person' vibe that I seem to be getting from that scene. Which just makes me angry, and petty... and downright fucking furious.
Sorry Alexia, but that is not going to fly with me. Not one bit. If Alexia were a real person, I'd give her a down-to-earth talk about why she is being a fucking idiot, either in person, through skype, or via textual means, in as civil a manner as I may.
Frankly, from my own opinion, the bad person is somebody who doesn't try to stop somebody being raped. And I am saying this, from the fucking depths of my being, because I've been raped, myself. If Rowan did not make any attempt to save Helayna, then he is a bystander. Somebody who witnesses a rape, but does nothing, I view to be only slightly less bad than the person who commits the rape (In the circumstances of other witnesses being afraid of retaliating for fear of death... such as in the case of a rapist owning either a firearm or weapon, I view under a different basis). and Personally it is hard to play the game without saving Helayna.
I love pretty much everything thing else about this game, except for that part. Which is a shame, at least for me. If there was some way to save Helayna without either A) Being an accomplice to rape) or B) Having sex with Helayna to make it stop or C) Making Alexia pissed off, then I would be happy.
Now, If I have to allow Helayna to get raped, just so that I can enjoy the relationship between Alexia and Rowan, can I do it? Yes, of course I can (It also isn't real-life). I've played countless games which involve rape, because god-damn are there a lot of games or stories or whatever which have it as one of the main parts, I also hear about rapes all the damn time in the news, and mentioning the Rape of Nanking is not going to make me cry or have PTSD.
So I don't have much of a problem with rape. Occasionally I might give stories or people the odd 'glance' because whilst I get why people like to fetishize 'rape' or 'non-con' because of the dominance aspect, I don't really get why some people seemingly 'Want' to be raped in games or stories et cetera. From personal experience, it isn't fun at all and I'm not sure why you seek it, but I'd say the mental aspects hurt far more than the physical effects.
It's when shit like the 'Rowan = Bad husband/bad person' vibe I get for saving somebody from a rape that fucking sets right me off, especially when it comes from somebody like Alexia, whom Rowan is dependent upon for emotional support. I also feel that it is pretty much condemning Rowan for having an extramarital affair, even though we, as a society, and as players, should try to be defending rape-victims (Or at least I should hope so), and not trying to get Alexia into the hands of fucking red demons who only want them for their pussy.
I have no problem with the NTR in this game, except for at that very moment. Precisely because I feel that it 'feeds upon the moment'. And that, makes me furious.
I play games, even porn games, either to 'get off', or to escape 'the mundane world'. Getting pissed off over this one part is not what I want to do.
I think for these reasons above, I am not very happy with that part of the story. I am sure some might understand me, and others might tell me to fuck off, some might say I'm speaking out of my ass, or some will refute some of my points (Or not). But I have presented my viewpoint and written my comment, and I have stated were I stand on this issue. I don't think I will ever budge on this issue.
As it is now, the whole vibe of that section only pisses me off.
- Feb 19, 2018
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I'm a little lost here:
"
Wulump x Alexia 1 (Oral, Monster, Tentacles, Mind Control) [1 of 1 CGs - Backer Version]
Happens automatically if Rowan tells on Alexia for helping Helayna to escape. Requires NTR to be turned on."
I claimed Helayna to my self but i never got this option available
"
Wulump x Alexia 1 (Oral, Monster, Tentacles, Mind Control) [1 of 1 CGs - Backer Version]
Happens automatically if Rowan tells on Alexia for helping Helayna to escape. Requires NTR to be turned on."
I claimed Helayna to my self but i never got this option available
Just keep playing and eventually it'll happen. Just make sure that you're not the one that helps her escape.
And all of this is why Helayna is a better waifu. Still, I would be interested to see how their three way relationship will go down if Alexia isn't attracted to Andras in your playtrough. Threesome arrangement?
- Oct 17, 2017
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Between those two comments there is too much to respond in detail. So here is a brief reply.
1. We're looking at all the sequences like that in the past and considering our options. Of late there has been a desire for more responsive events in the future. This update's Liurial scene is meant partially to test that. So we will *Possibly* consider adding more variations to the event within reason...but we like the overall charachter of the event.
2. The writing team for this game includes more degrees in ethics then you would assume by a lot. When Rowan claims he has no choice in diffrent situations, that is not really true. It's why that choice in the beginning where you can just die in a cell is so important. Rowan doesn't *have* to fuck Helayna to save her. He doesn't have to fuck anyone. He doesn't have to kill anyone. Rowan is making choices. Not easy choices. Not happy choices. But, everything he does in this game is a choice. That's why player selected choices are so important to this game.
1. We're looking at all the sequences like that in the past and considering our options. Of late there has been a desire for more responsive events in the future. This update's Liurial scene is meant partially to test that. So we will *Possibly* consider adding more variations to the event within reason...but we like the overall charachter of the event.
2. The writing team for this game includes more degrees in ethics then you would assume by a lot. When Rowan claims he has no choice in diffrent situations, that is not really true. It's why that choice in the beginning where you can just die in a cell is so important. Rowan doesn't *have* to fuck Helayna to save her. He doesn't have to fuck anyone. He doesn't have to kill anyone. Rowan is making choices. Not easy choices. Not happy choices. But, everything he does in this game is a choice. That's why player selected choices are so important to this game.
- Jul 27, 2017
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Plus emotions are complicated. It's pretty silly to say that Alexia shouldn't be mad that her husband screwed another woman and is now taking care of her. A noble too. In the same breath some of you yell out that Rowan should just dump Alexia and stick to Helayna. Perhaps this has occurred to Alexia as well? Might she be super insecure about being dumped for a superior noble model? Then her acting up to try and get attention makes perfect sense.
- Oct 23, 2017
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In my eyes that depends on what choices you made up to that point. If for example you kept Rowan loyal yet had Alexia sleep with Andras then her throwing a tantrum is indeed hypocritical of her. Alternatively if you had her stay loyal then she has every right to get mad after finding out that her husband fucked some young beautiful knight. Alexia gets a lot of shit but if you stick with a vanilla playthrough then it's pretty clear that she's genuinely a good wife. Unfortunately for her my personal preferences lean heavily towards Helayna, so sorry Alexia.
- Aug 5, 2016
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I think you need to NOT claim her to get the escape event chain, but I'm not sure because I never claim her.
- Jul 27, 2017
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Claiming her doesn't matter. You just can't help her escape, and you can't convince her to stay. She has to flee on her own, so you can blame Alexia.
- Oct 21, 2017
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You're right. Choosing to die in prison and not help the twins is a choice, but it's one that leads to a bad ending within moments of starting the game. I've actually chosen it a couple times, because in my mind it actually is the way a hero of the realm should act. Some defiance options, even if he's punished after, would be great. However, so far I've seen very little from Rowan that justifies the hero mantle the realm and its people seem to place on him. I also don't understand the goblin idolization either, because Rowan is not cunning or devious. So, hopefully, Rowan is developed because right now he's an average joe at best. Given I'm supporting this game for the promised Overlord route, there's a lot of ground work that needs to be done to build Rowan up before anything can rationalize that.
- Aug 5, 2016
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I think I've said it a billion times before but it keeps coming up so: I agree. I really think considering Rowan was known in the war as the strategist, there should've been something at this point to show him thinking about his situation. It doesn't even have to be a scene that's linked to anything or leads into anything, just a small scene here and there where he is thinking or plotting about what to do, who or what he can use,...and then the more corrupted he gets, the more extreme his thoughts become
And on my first playthrough I also died in the prison! If SoC ever develops into some kind of shared universe, I kinda feel like that should be the canon ending almost.
And on my first playthrough I also died in the prison! If SoC ever develops into some kind of shared universe, I kinda feel like that should be the canon ending almost.
- Apr 12, 2018
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There is an Event where Rown wonders about the powers of the amulet and test it's capacities by askeing a personal maid of Yzera to gather informations about the twins and help him to escape (with her ofcourse). The Helyana escape is also an Event of defiance.
And in regards to the Goblins... Rowan used trickery dureing the siege of Kandras... like sneaking out and manipulating the enemies siege engines or stealing their supplies and stuff
And in regards to the Goblins... Rowan used trickery dureing the siege of Kandras... like sneaking out and manipulating the enemies siege engines or stealing their supplies and stuff