VN Ren'Py Some previews of my first VN and I need advices.

[Parsion]

Hey Guys, since less one month, I'm working on my first ever visual novel.

The first preview is already done. It's a game about drastic choices on the spirit of gamebooks. Every time a choice will be shown to the player, there will be different routes. I'm planning a "classic" route, and some others I wil not name.

I'm drawing it in black and white, in a webtoon style (webtoon is the type of webcomics from South Korea).

My patreon page is already ready for the realeasing but I need an advice on something :

After how much content it's a good idea to release the first version ? I'm planning to release it after the first 1 or 2 NSFW scenes, after 1 or 2 choices, it's enough you think ?

For 1$ everyone can have access to the game, 5$ they can vote on the polls I will give, 10$ they can have access to the discord, for 15$ they will have the webcomics which is adapted from the game. Every timeline I'm planning will have his webcomics. And for 20$ they will have their name is the credits as "producers" at the next update. Will you agree with these awards ?

I'm doing this game by passion as first, but I have a shitty and dangerous part time job I want to live. I'm not good enough in coding so I'm focused on the story, the NSFW scenes in a webcomics style and the differents routes of the choices. I'm building the story with the help of Xmind, and every week I'm adding some in it. here what is like now (you can't zoom for spoilers lol) :

Spoiler

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About the art, I'm drawing in black and white to earn time because I'm lacking of free time because of my art studies and my part times jobs (yes, jobS, I have two).
I always dreamt to live by telling stories, for me Visual Novel is the best mix between comicbooks and video games. ANd I love gamebooks too so I'm deep in it now.

There are some previews of the art (game/webcomics, same art) :

Spoiler

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So, my questions : are you interested by maybe playing a VN like this ? (I know 3D is famous but I hate 3D models, they all look the same for me)
Do you think the rewards of my future patreon page are interesting enough ? Maybe you have some ideas ?

 

[dudebroman]

Hey bro

Love the branching story idea, gamebook style! Art is nice (like the MCs expressions xD), though maybe needs some pa-zazz? I think black-and-white is fine, but lack of colour means you'll have to try harder to make characters look distinct and memorable. Don't want it to look like some old anime, where all the characters look the same I dunno, just a suggestion I'm only basing this on the bits of art you've provided.
Patreon tiers look okay, but you should probably release the first few versions for free here on F95 just for the feedback and whatnot. As such, you should be okay to release a demo with minimal content whenever you feel ready

 

[Parsion]

Hey bro

Love the branching story idea, gamebook style! Art is nice (like the MCs expressions XD), though maybe needs some pa-zazz? I think black-and-white is fine, but lack of colour means you'll have to try harder to make characters look distinct and memorable. Don't want it to look like some old anime, where all the characters look the same I dunno, just a suggestion I'm only basing this on the bits of art you've provided.
Patreon tiers look okay, but you should probably release the first few versions for free here on F95 just for the feedback and whatnot. As such, you should be okay to release a demo with minimal content whenever you feel ready

You are completly right on the black and white section, about forcing me drawing different characters, it's the spirit I have, I'm trying to not buildings same characters.

Thanks you for your feedback. If you want, DM me and I will give you the link for the actual version of the game. This is very short, only cutscenes, but full episode 1. Episode 2 will have the first drastic choices.

 

[DarthSeduction]

So, I'm also a first time developer, but I've written my story with its branches and all to be about 45 minutes of content, if you actually read it. I didn't so much put a lot of thought into how many choices, but instead made the choices in places where I could allow the player to define the MCs personalities. There are 2 chances for the player to have the twin sister in my first release do something that teases her brother sexually. There is 1 chance for the player to decide if the brother will give in to his desires for his sister. I used variables to determine conditions later where the story will branch. In this way, the story was mostly linear.

If the sister was the bold tease, she masturbates before bed, to the thought of her brother taking her. If she chose not to tease him once, she goes to bed feeling sexually frustrated, because she has feelings for him, but she is fighting them back, she doesn't want to be a monster like their father who molested him. If the brother chooses to give in to his lust, he masturbates to the thought of his sister giving him a handjob, naked on her knees in front of him in the shower. If he's done that, and comes out to a sister who masturbated that night, he climbs into bed with her (they share a bed for a non sexual reason that is explained by the plot) and cuddles with her gently. If she didn't masturbate that night she seems visibly restless and frustrated so he, having given in, climbs into bed and pulls her close, wrapping both arms around her, in a protective way. If he didn't masturbate, then he climbs into bed and sleeps facing away from her, regardless of whether or not she's frustrated, because he's conflicted in having feelings for her.

However, all of that is just the last... 10 minutes, tops, of the release... probably not even that long. The rest is spent on character development. Having my characters introduced through their actions. The game opens with a violent sexual assault from the boys father on the boy 3 years prior to the story. That scene climaxes when the sister stumbles on the scene and decides to use the father's service pistol, atatched to the belt of his discarded pants, to put thee bullets through his back. She kills her father to save her brother. This is followed by the twins as our narrators, guiding us through a short montage to catch up with present day. It explains how the brother never slept in his room again, how he was supposed to sleep on the couch, but felt compelled to be near his sister, and would camp out on her floor. Eventually she invites him to share her bed. It tells a little about the trauma counseling the twins go through. It tells about their mother, forced to find work for the first time in 15 years (since she got pregnant with them) and how she struggled to make ends meet without their fathers policeman salary. The montage ends with the revelation that they are moving to Los Angeles to live with their wealthy aunt, because mom can no longer afford to save the house.

I then introduce you to my characters as they are now on a road trip. They have just finished moving the last box into their moving van, and they're driving across country to LA. They listen to music and play road games, the games providing chances to personify my characters, show them as people who live in a world similar to ours, with pop culture and films, with their tastes on display. Then I have them in a diner, the twins recount a game of D&D they played to their mother. It shows them to be geeks, increases the feeling that they're really close as twins, hints at the brother's possible bisexuality, and exposes their sense of humor. its only after all of this that we get to the Motel room they stay in the first night and we get those two sexual scenes and the sleep.

I tell you all this, because its not about how many choices, its not about how many renders. Its about hitting all the beats your story needs to hit to introduce us to your world and your characters. To hook us into your story and compel us to look out for the next release with a positive mind. We need to want to see your characters again. We need to be interested in following their journey. That is how you should structure every release. What do I need to do to advance the plot, develop my characters, and keep my audience engaged.

 

[Parsion]

Spoiler

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Me, I follow only one character. I didn't plan "classical" stories, I'm focused on humor too, on a comedic tone. I just want to let the choice to the player for every choice he can make. For now, I'm trying to build a stronger first release with at least 1 or 2 NSFW scenes. And every release will have 1 to 3 NSFW scenes. And just for the joke, I'm planning a "virgin" route, when the main character is refusing every move for every female character lol

 

[DarthSeduction]

Me, I follow only one character. I didn't plan "classical" stories, I'm focused on humor too, on a comedic tone. I just want to let the choice to the player for every choice he can make. For now, I'm trying to build a stronger first release with at least 1 or 2 NSFW scenes. And every release will have 1 to 3 NSFW scenes. And just for the joke, I'm planning a "virgin" route, when the main character is refusing every move for every female character lol

Even comedy requires character development.

Spoiler: D&D Scene

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[verzauberung]

this thread will be filled with failed game devs giving shitty advices lmao

1-2 hcontent on release isnt good imo. but ive seen many games come out with less content. but if the quality of the game is really good, people will support you even if there isnt a lot of content yet.

so as a guy who played through 400+gb of porngames, the truth is that the story, writing and gameplay doesnt matter, the most important thing is if the game is sexy and if the girls are hot. it will be hard for you to get much support if you rely on storytelling.

 

[DarthSeduction]

this thread will be filled with failed game devs giving shitty advices lmao

1-2 hcontent on release isnt good imo. but ive seen many games come out with less content. but if the quality of the game is really good, people will support you even if there isnt a lot of content yet.

so as a guy who played through 400+gb of porngames, the truth is that the story, writing and gameplay doesnt matter, the most important thing is if the game is sexy and if the girls are hot. it will be hard for you to get much support if you rely on storytelling.

Eh, you need both. If people only wanted sex they'd be on pornhub. What makes this medium great is the ability to get people invested. I can say, from a story standpoint, he's objectively wrong, but only because DS already laid the groundwork for the characterization we gave Alice in this.

As for content, well, we plan on a bi-monthly release schedule, so the content will grow fast.

 

[verzauberung]

Eh, you need both. If people only wanted sex they'd be on pornhub. What makes this medium great is the ability to get people invested. I can say, from a story standpoint, he's objectively wrong, but only because DS already laid the groundwork for the characterization we gave Alice in this.

As for content, well, we plan on a bi-monthly release schedule, so the content will grow fast.

teachers pet, bb, summertime saga, icstor games and so many other games have a basic ass incest story that is literally copy pasta. the writing in all those games is nothing special and again only basic. the gameplay in all those games is annoying and bad. you can get people who want to jerk off invested with very simple and basic gameplay and stories.

yeah ofc a good story and gameplay and so on will help the game, but it wont make or break it.

 

[Parsion]

Eh, you need both. If people only wanted sex they'd be on pornhub. What makes this medium great is the ability to get people invested. I can say, from a story standpoint, he's objectively wrong, but only because DS already laid the groundwork for the characterization we gave Alice in this.

As for content, well, we plan on a bi-monthly release schedule, so the content will grow fast.

I'm completly agree about the release schedule, but me, as now, it's hard to follow that, that's why I'm planning short update every time.

this thread will be filled with failed game devs giving shitty advices lmao

1-2 hcontent on release isnt good imo. but ive seen many games come out with less content. but if the quality of the game is really good, people will support you even if there isnt a lot of content yet.

so as a guy who played through 400+gb of porngames, the truth is that the story, writing and gameplay doesnt matter, the most important thing is if the game is sexy and if the girls are hot. it will be hard for you to get much support if you rely on storytelling.

I will have character development, and I'm conscious a lot of people are here to fap. But for me the secret of success is freedom and interactivity. I'm trying to avoid frustration as far as I can. There is a big story arc in my game (a party) but if the player doesnt want to go in this route, he can refuse the invitation.

teachers pet, bb, summertime saga, icstor games and so many other games have a basic ass incest story that is literally copy pasta. the writing in all those games is nothing special and again only basic. the gameplay in all those games is annoying and bad. you can get people who want to jerk off invested with very simple and basic gameplay and stories.

yeah ofc a good story and gameplay and so on will help the game, but it wont make or break it.

You are so wrong man, the stories in Summertime Saga are no way a copypasta of everygame I played. There are jokes, mini games, open world and crazy characters ahaha and art is fucking great.
Incest Story is classic as hell because the character is fucking creepy as he want to corrupt his family. Like the twist.

And I'm agree with darthseduction, there are games, and every game is different. Me, I just want to do a NSFW comedic gamebook. And I really enjoy to do it. For now, it's about passion and money because I just need to have like 250$ a month to leave my fucking shitty and dangerous job, I had accidents and it's not payed enough to worth the risk.

And for the fapping section, I'm doing a webcomics for every route with the same art, like a CG rip you know, and at every ending of the game, I'm planning to put every sex scenes at the end to replay them.

 

[verzauberung]

i have seen more games with a lot of patreon support on this site with retarded ass stories that dont make any sense, english that noone understands and gameplay that is straight up unfun and annoying BUT with 1 or 2 hot girls in them, than i have seen games with good stories and gameplay but only basic looking girls.

older sister that cams. mum after fathers death/divorce that feels lonely. neighbors girl that already had a crush on you but is shy. horny aunt. lil sis that doesnt know anything about sex and you will help/teach.

this is literally the copy pasta of every porngame. and dont forget the sleep molesting scenes. and you really wanna tell me that most known games arent very similar?

but i really hope your game will work out, i do like the art style (even tho im kinda sick of different routes and choices in games tbh, feels like you just miss out 50% of the content and it's kinda annoying). just giving me honest opinion and my exp with porngames.

 

[DarthSeduction]

teachers pet, bb, summertime saga, icstor games and so many other games have a basic ass incest story that is literally copy pasta. the writing in all those games is nothing special and again only basic. the gameplay in all those games is annoying and bad. you can get people who want to jerk off invested with very simple and basic gameplay and stories.

yeah ofc a good story and gameplay and so on will help the game, but it wont make or break it.

You're confusing plot with story. Teachers pet has some of the best written characters I've seen in any game. Each of them behaves like a real person and not just a handful of traits thrown at an otherwise blank canvas.

Big Brother started out amazing. Eric was the best idea ever. However as BB continued the game reverted back to being entirely basic with 2 dimensional characters and a lot of people lost inetrest. What kept him going was not how sexy his art was, but how he went about rewarding his fans with that art. DS stumbled upon the sunk cost fallacy, in which people attribute greater value to a reward that they spent more time, money, and energy to get. Grind, the thing everyone complains about, is actually what kept people playing.

The early RPGM ICSTOR games frustrated me, however Milfy City does right, everything BB did wrong. Each character, Sara, Caroline, your mother, have depth. Sara is a gamer and she really good. This translates into the game in a neat way, creating a way for you and her to bond. Caroline is a shop owner who's struggling, however she's willing to do what it takes to win. The way she interacts with you makes perfect sense in this context. Your mother is the first in any game I've ever played where mom actually is the aggressor in the relationship. Holy fuck that's unique, and what's more is her internal struggle with her feelings is well written and compelling.

Maybe you think, that when I say writing, I mean long winded paragraphs and narration ala Tolkien, but you'd be wrong. When I say writing, I think more in the terms of screenplay, movies. Too much exposition will bore an audience. You need to develop your character's through visuals and action. Even in a romantic comedy, the development should be something that moves, and keeps interested. If you know what you're doing, writing is far more powerful than art.

 

[Parsion]

i have seen more games with a lot of patreon support on this site with retarded ass stories that dont make any sense, english that noone understands and gameplay that is straight up unfun and annoying BUT with 1 or 2 hot girls in them, than i have seen games with good stories and gameplay but only basic looking girls.

older sister that cams. mum after fathers death/divorce that feels lonely. neighbors girl that already had a crush on you but is shy. horny aunt. lil sis that doesnt know anything about sex and you will help/teach.

this is literally the copy pasta of every porngame. and dont forget the sleep molesting scenes. and you really wanna tell me that most known games arent very similar?

but i really hope your game will work out, i do like the art style (even tho im kinda sick of different routes and choices in games tbh, feels like you just miss out 50% of the content and it's kinda annoying). just giving me honest opinion and my exp with porngames.

FOr the 50% content missed, don't worry, there is a "perfect" route when you fuck EVERYONE lol
And if you want to try everyroute without playing it, I will release a webcomics for every single route, see that as an "illustrated walktrough".

Thanks you both for your advices, yes the feeling of copypasta is here because of the clichés but for the rest, SUmmertime Sage is better because of the art and gameplay, same as BB and The Twist.

 

[verzauberung]

Big Brother started out amazing. Eric was the best idea ever. However as BB continued the game reverted back to being entirely basic with 2 dimensional characters and a lot of people lost inetrest. What kept him going was not how sexy his art was, but how he went about rewarding his fans with that art. DS stumbled upon the sunk cost fallacy, in which people attribute greater value to a reward that they spent more time, money, and energy to get. Grind, the thing everyone complains about, is actually what kept people playing.

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH OMFG IM DONE. there is no point in talking with you anymore.

 

[Parsion]

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH OMFG IM DONE. there is no point in talking with you anymore.

Eric was a good idea, but not well done, because everyone hate him and everyone wanted to delete him with Ikaru Mod, me first lol

 

[DarthSeduction]

HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH OMFG IM DONE. there is no point in talking with you anymore.

You hated Eric, right? Do you know what hated is? It's an emotional response. The writing in his game had you so invested that you hated a fictional character. That is a win.

Where Eric failed was that he was invincible. Everyone believed him and the game became broken by his presence, however, done correctly, an Eric creates competition.

An example of this is Robert and Silver from Babysitter. They fill, essentially the same role Eric was meant to, a rival for the protagonist over their "love interest". However, they are on equal footing with the MC, it is up to him to fail in order for them to win. Had Eric been implemented in the same way, it would have worked, and instead of the women in the game working against you getting laid, it would have been Eric working against you getting laid.

Again, if you understood story you'd get this. It's obvious you're not the type to pay that much attention to what's going on. My brother isn't either, it's normal. The first game you mentioned has great writing, you bright it up as a good game. And it is. Strangely enough, it also has less sex than any of the games I'd put up as having good stories. So, again, your example proved me right.

 

[Parsion]

You hated Eric, right? Do you know what hated is? It's an emotional response. The writing in his game had you so invested that you hated a fictional character. That is a win.

Where Eric failed was that he was invincible. Everyone believed him and the game became broken by his presence, however, done correctly, an Eric creates competition.

An example of this is Robert and Silver from Babysitter. They fill, essentially the same role Eric was meant to, a rival for the protagonist over their "love interest". However, they are on equal footing with the MC, it is up to him to fail in order for them to win. Had Eric been implemented in the same way, it would have worked, and instead of the women in the game working against you getting laid, it would have been Eric working against you getting laid.

Again, if you understood story you'd get this. It's obvious you're not the type to pay that much attention to what's going on. My brother isn't either, it's normal. The first game you mentioned has great writing, you bright it up as a good game. And it is. Strangely enough, it also has less sex than any of the games I'd put up as having good stories. So, again, your example proved me right.

Competition, holy shit, I never saw that in BB, this is genius, indeed.

 

[DarkDemon]

Although i'm sucker for a good story and game play like 'Depraved Awakening" for example. It makes the game much more enjoyable and appealing to people, but I have to agree with @verzauberung that sexy models, beautiful artwork and presentation is a lot more important in adult games. Look at "Secret Family": the guy release a short demo with stunning artwork, little to non story, didn't even keep his one and only deadline, and still then he has got around 200 patrons and making $700+ per creation.
Best of luck for your game

 

[anne O'nymous]

so as a guy who played through 400+gb of porngames, the truth is that the story, writing and gameplay doesnt matter, the most important thing is if the game is sexy and if the girls are hot. it will be hard for you to get much support if you rely on storytelling.

Well, as someone who've played, er... According to my computer, more than 2Tio of adult games, the writing is what matter the most and make the difference between a "fap and forget" game and a "still two days before the next update, how can I wait this long ?" one. Which is confirmed by both the Patreon pledges and popular games here. I don't say that only good written games can succeed, but among the succeeding games, more than 50% of them have average story, average CG, serving a well written game.
Relying on another thing than the writing can works for a time, but people will quickly switch to the new comet game. Between the story copy/paste and the limited amount of free/cheap Daz3D assets, the public will always have ten or more look-like game at the same time, and yours will just be one of them.
The writing is what make the difference between

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,

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and

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. Both started during the last summer. One is a loved game because it's well written (and well codded), one is an average game, and the last is already abandoned since months.

As for the "hot girls" part, it's just impossible to achieve this. What is hot for one is disgusting for another. Just look at the endlessly looping, "OMG girls with big boobs are [...]", discussions...

 

[verzauberung]

Well, as someone who've played, er... According to my computer, more than 2Tio of adult games, the writing is what matter the most and make the difference between a "fap and forget" game and a "still two days before the next update, how can I wait this long ?" one. Which is confirmed by both the Patreon pledges and popular games here. I don't say that only good written games can succeed, but among the succeeding games, more than 50% of them have average story, average CG, serving a well written game.
Relying on another thing than the writing can works for a time, but people will quickly switch to the new comet game. Between the story copy/paste and the limited amount of free/cheap Daz3D assets, the public will always have ten or more look-like game at the same time, and yours will just be one of them.
The writing is what make the difference between

You must be registered to see the links

,

You must be registered to see the links

and

You must be registered to see the links

. Both started during the last summer. One is a loved game because it's well written (and well codded), one is an average game, and the last is already abandoned since months.

As for the "hot girls" part, it's just impossible to achieve this. What is hot for one is disgusting for another. Just look at the endlessly looping, "OMG girls with big boobs are [...]", discussions...

Slonique get's 800$ a month. for most people here he is by far the worst dev EVER and just a joke. but he still makes bank because.... story, dev, writing and all that shit dont make or break a game. other devs wish they would make as much as
Slonique.