Ren'Py Summertime Saga [v21.0.0-wip.5791] [Kompas Productions]

[dkatryl]

That is absolutely not true at all if you go to any high class restaurant.
I don't agree with your new best buddie here, either, but lol. Lmao even.

I mean, we are definitely putting this chef's analogy through its paces lately, but...

If you go so high end that the chef takes the position that you should like whatever nonsense they serve up?

And if you dont then you're just some unwashed pleb that cant possibly understand what is good because you aren't a chef?

But dammit, you paid premium prices for it, so of course the chef must be correct!

So you convince yourself that you are just uncultured swine that has no business commenting about the shitty food and service.

I mean, i guess that analogy still works?

 

[Bellua]

Just saw the Abandoned tag and all I have to say is lol
lmao

 

[fidgetspinner]

I don't want to be negative, I don't want to let emotion cloud judgement, I don't want baseless accusation. I just want a clear, concise, no-bullshit answer.

What the fuck is this dev doing for the last 18 months? Why is everything taking so much time for so little? Why is it so hard to have frank discussion instead of always having this adversarial Corporate empty speech and pitchfork mob anger?

 

[HentKingdom]

I don't want to be negative, I don't want to let emotion cloud judgement, I don't want baseless accusation. I just want a clear, concise, no-bullshit answer.

What the fuck is this dev doing for the last 18 months? Why is everything taking so much time for so little? Why is it so hard to have frank discussion instead of always having this adversarial Corporate empty speech and pitchfork mob anger?

Is having 2 years of no updates not enough reason to feel a bit upset?

This game updates at a snale pase. And this is one of the oldest games on this website.

How things are now it fear it will take the rest of cookie's life to maybe finish it.

 

[fidgetspinner]

Is having 2 years of no updates not enough reason to feel a bit upset?

This game updates at a snale pase. And this is one of the oldest games on this website.

How things are now it fear it will take the rest of cookie's life to maybe finish it.

I'm past that, I just want to understand.

 

[TGafy]

Even after Tagged as a "abandoned" i'm still afraid to say anything from the backlash of the games defenders...
They traumatized me for life !
i still have a Nightmares of the verbal abuses and the facepalm emojis...

What will they do now, i wonder...

Yes, shame they removed the facepalms. Now you can get traumatized by angry emojis staring you down too.

 

[harem.king]

I don't think you've met many quality Head Chefs, based upon that statement. In their minds, they create masterpieces that anyone with a cultured and educated palate would savour and salivate over. If the creation matches the Chef's expectations, usually the person who disagrees with them is considered a pleb who has eaten far too many sawdust burgers or sucked on pig and chicken asshole sausages out of sidewalk carts where rats have shat better turds than the meat found in the cart.

While such people EXIST, they are the kind of awful chefs that would end up on the gordon ramsey show as he tears them a new one for their unwarranted self importance.

 

[PayneToTheMax]

Yes, shame they removed the facepalms. Now you can get traumatized by angry emojis staring you down too.

We also have that swearing reaction now.

 

[Xupuzulla]

Even after Tagged as a "abandoned" i'm still afraid to say anything from the backlash of the games defenders...
They traumatized me for life !
i still have a Nightmares of the verbal abuses and the facepalm emojis...

What will they do now, i wonder...

Who bullied you,the flower guy?

 

[RT5X]

Who bullied you,the flower guy?

wouldn't blame em
he's in damn near every thread lol

 

[Marphey]

Yes, shame they removed the facepalms. Now you can get traumatized by angry emojis staring you down too.

Problem is people now start using "ROFL" emoji in negative sense so now you don'T know if people laugh at your joke or if they laugh at you.

 

[memelman]

Honestly? DC is probably terrible at managing people.

It isn't just DC, it is most of the developers for games on this site. While they may be some combination of a good artist, coder, writer, and developer; they are rarely good managers of people or projects.

I sigh a little bit whenever I see a game here get successful and then the developer(s) say they are going to hire/contract more people. Because it means there is now an 70% chance the game is going to start being developed a whole lot slower, a 20% chance it keeps about the same pace of production as when it was just the original dev working on it, and only a 5% chance it will actually result in the game getting done more quickly.

I'd really just prefer they just pocket the money they are making and keep plugging away the same way they had been. If they want to try running a team they should study up on project management (or hire a project manager) and plan their next game to be a team project from the beginning.

 

[cloud77777]

It isn't just DC, it is most of the developers for games on this site. While they may be some combination of a good artist, coder, writer, and developer; they are rarely good managers of people or projects.

I sigh a little bit whenever I see a game here get successful and then the developer(s) say they are going to hire/contract more people. Because it means there is now an 70% chance the game is going to start being developed a whole lot slower, a 20% chance it keeps about the same pace of production as when it was just the original dev working on it, and only a 5% chance it will actually result in the game getting done more quickly.

I'd really just prefer they just pocket the money they are making and keep plugging away the same way they had been. If they want to try running a team they should study up on project management (or hire a project manager) and plan their next game to be a team project from the beginning.

A lot of development problems for western-made games on this site is due to all of them being supported by monthly subs on patreon/subscribestar. A lot of devs promise things to get more subscribers, like animated scenes for an example, when a goal is hit and then said addition ends up slowing down the updates due to the amount of extra work and need for extra artists, animators, voice actors, or whatever needed to fulfill their promise. In addition, a monthly subscription incentivizes smaller, less frequent updates and there's no actual reason for devs to feel incentivized to complete their game. It's insane the amount of games on here that have been in development for 5+ years and don't feel anywhere near a complete game, while normal indie developers pop out completed, polished games in a year or two.

 

[Marphey]

A lot of development problems for western-made games on this site is due to all of them being supported by monthly subs on patreon/subscribestar. A lot of devs promise things to get more subscribers, like animated scenes for an example, when a goal is hit and then said addition ends up slowing down the updates due to the amount of extra work and need for extra artists, animators, voice actors, or whatever needed to fulfill their promise. In addition, a monthly subscription incentivizes smaller, less frequent updates and there's no actual reason for devs to feel incentivized to complete their game. It's insane the amount of games on here that have been in development for 5+ years and don't feel anywhere near a complete game, while normal indie developers pop out completed, polished games in a year or two.

For real. The whole Patreon thing was a mistake. Developers have no motivation to actually finish their product because why would they ? They already have steady income they don't need to sell anything for profit. Infact finishing the game would mean they would have to come up with something else to keep people subscribed so finishing the game is not even in their best interests.

Also like you said they will make promises to people so they give them more money. Daily lives of my countryside is exemple of game that's overbloated with characters because the dev keeps adding more of them instead of finishing content for those already in the game.

 

[RT5X]

For real. The whole Patreon thing was a mistake. Developers have no motivation to actually finish their product because why would they ? They already have steady income they don't need to sell anything for profit. Infact finishing the game would mean they would have to come up with something else to keep people subscribed so finishing the game is not even in their best interests.

Also like you said they will make promises to people so they give them more money. Daily lives of my countryside is exemple of game that's overbloated with characters because the dev keeps adding more of them instead of finishing content for those already in the game.

I'll be fair and say patreon (or any monthly payment site) plays a part in the motivation
the thing that kills most devs motivation depends

1: Lots of Money (this is the leading cause of most big abandoned projects, once you get a livable income from doing basically nothing its hard for some devs to be motivated.

2: Over promising and being in way over their heads (This always leads to burnouts and a loss of motivation)

3: Loss of passion (another leading cause, if a dev keeps making a bunch of side games then it's likely their passion is waning)

4: Only making a game for money only (The main reason this site is filled with Koikastu/Honey Select/Daz Slop)

(There's obviously more reasons but i dont wanna make this too long lol)

From what I'm seeing is DC's reason for being so slow is poor management and having a shit tons of money

we still have fast devs like Majalis,Mity
and the kind of slow but consistent devs like Breadman

 

[CUNTBLAZER420]

A lot of development problems for western-made games on this site is due to all of them being supported by monthly subs on patreon/subscribestar. A lot of devs promise things to get more subscribers, like animated scenes for an example, when a goal is hit and then said addition ends up slowing down the updates due to the amount of extra work and need for extra artists, animators, voice actors, or whatever needed to fulfill their promise. In addition, a monthly subscription incentivizes smaller, less frequent updates and there's no actual reason for devs to feel incentivized to complete their game. It's insane the amount of games on here that have been in development for 5+ years and don't feel anywhere near a complete game, while normal indie developers pop out completed, polished games in a year or two.

To be fair, most "normal" indie games were being worked on years before anyone ever heard anything about them. Most games in general are like that. The thing with patreon games is you see all the bullshit that happens in the background before the game would normally be announced. I also, don't really think you can compare StS to a "normal" indie game because it is not a "normal" indie game. A "normal" indie game is like a sidscrolling metroidvania, rougelike card battler, boomer shooter, survival craft, ect. Not near as many art assets or writing generally. Still not the bottleneck though, that's between the coding and the decision to remake 5+ years of content in one go.

 

[josh963]

It seems that the wait for the end of May will be a long ride...

 

[cloud77777]

To be fair, most "normal" indie games were being worked on years before anyone ever heard anything about them. Most games in general are like that. The thing with patreon games is you see all the bullshit that happens in the background before the game would normally be announced. I also, don't really think you can compare StS to a "normal" indie game because it is not a "normal" indie game. A "normal" indie game is like a sidscrolling metroidvania, rougelike card battler, boomer shooter, survival craft, ect. Not near as many art assets or writing generally. Still not the bottleneck though, that's between the coding and the decision to remake 5+ years of content in one go.

Let's not pretend Summertime saga is some super ambitious game. It's literally just an adult VN with sandbox elements. There's tons of indie visual novels you can play that have way more writing and art than Summertime Saga currently has (Sable's Grimoire is a good example). And it is a normal indie game, idk what you're on about there. Indie just means it was made independently without a publisher. If anything, Summertime Saga has more people and more resources than a lot of indie games being developed and still isn't anywhere near done 8 years after the initial release.

 

[CUNTBLAZER420]

Let's not pretend Summertime saga is some super ambitious game. It's literally just an adult VN with sandbox elements. There's tons of indie visual novels you can play that have way more writing and art than Summertime Saga currently has. And it is a normal indie game, idk what you're on about there. Indie just means it was made independently without a publisher. If anything, Summertime Saga has more people and more resources than most indie games being developed and still isn't anywhere near done 8 years after the initial release.

I think you and a lot of other people on here underestimate just how ambitious the game really is. If were really that simple why aren't there more? Name 10 completed 2d sandbox adult visual novels of the same quality. Hell, name 5. Hell, name any.

 

[cloud77777]

I think you and a lot of other people on here underestimate just how ambitious the game really is. If were really that simple why aren't there more? Name 10 completed 2d sandbox adult visual novels of the same quality. Hell, name 5. Hell, name any.

You did not just unironically "you read? name 10 books" me LMAO. That's an awfully specific ask, as most VNs don't bother with sandbox and just do routes. That being said, Sable's Grimoire meets the criteria outside of being a sandbox. I think you do have to patch the adult content in the game, but it's there. Crazy how you guys think this is actually some massive undertaking, when its just a ren'py game with better art than most on F95. Play any non-adult VNs and you'll see that StS isn't some revolutionary game, it just has way more lewd sex in it than a majority of VNs.

There aren't more because of the literal thing I was just discussing, which is that Patreon being used to fund games results in none being completed because developers aren't incentivized to, as they're getting paid every month no matter if they complete their game or not. I can point to several incomplete adult VNs just like this one though lmao.