RPGM The Last Sovereign [v0.77.2] [Sierra Lee]

[Nivla456]

tl;dr TLS is a lot more subtle than f95's usual stuff thanks to the element of in-character choice, but can we really blame people for thinking otherwise?

I think another thing that makes the harem element more powerful is that the women in Simon's harem are there by choice, and I'm not talking about some momentary infatuation either- they've made informed decisions to be there, with the probable exception of Megail, but even then I think she's had some independence in the decision by accepting it as the inevitable consequences of her actions.

To me, it's a lot more meaningful that all of the harem members actually have the choice of seeing people outside the harem, but all the non-succubi choose not to, and in the case of the succubi, they only fuck other people because they're literal turbo sluts by nature- might as well ask a dog to stop thinking of you as a god, or ask for a cat to start.

Honestly, I think what's throwing people off is that they come into TLS expecting a typical porn game, and getting a little blindsided because both the plot and the *~plot~* elements are more complex than the stuff you usually find here. I'm not ragging on anyone who prefers that stuff, mind you; I like me some Miel, which is the fast food of porn games (I guess you could call them Happy Miels? ) and Free Cities, and I'm certainly not going to blame anyone for hearing that 'women in TLS can have a sex life outside the harem' then thinking it's going to be an NTR fest because that's what you usually get with h-games like that.

And yeah, it's turbo frustrating since this game is the exception, as well as the whole 'Madonna-whore' binary inherent in the assumption (but that's a whooole other can of worms, and I'm not sure I can do the concept proper justice), but I think this picture sums it up best:

View attachment 2936470

they did the chosen characters dirty, always horny brats want to stick in everything.

 

[manscout]

Then stop calling it a "harem" and treat it what it really is, simply a poly relationship, I believe this would solve a lot of headache for everyone. Yes, by definition harems are that as well, but it's also a very dumb, very silly and unrealistic power fantasy. A lot of this is the fault of writers unable to create either a proper story or good character development to subvert the genres shortcomings.

Aye, obviously TLS is a great game with a really good story and outstanding character development, but precisely because of that it feels like a very annoying misnomer by the game to insist on categorizing Simon's relationship with his lovers as being that of a "harem, but good", pretty much because a "harem" stripped of its negative institutions and only salvaging that which would conform to modern morals and gender equality would simply be a "polyamorous relationship".

I think this problem spawns mostly from the fact the game threads the line between "satire" and "deconstruction", in simple terms I think of the first as being an entirely negative depiction of the subject, while the latter is more ambivalent. In-game examples would be that the "Chosen" are a satire of adult game MCs since they are strictly portrayed in a negative light, while the game's treatment of "retro RPG tropes" would be closer to deconstruction, because while the game is willing to make fun and point out some of the nonsense of it all, it still treats them with some reverence at times and even makes use of them to create a better experience for its audience.

With that in mind, I think that for whatever reason the dev decided that "harems" would be a target of deconstruction in TLS, not satire, which ultimately means that the writing needs to insist on the ambivalence of "harems" by not distancing itself from the subject when giving positive portrayals. This results in the game insisting on portraying Simon's relationship with his lovers as being "a relationship that has the harem institution as a basis, but this one is actually nice and fully respectful of women's autonomy and equal standing", which leads back to the problem that personally I think that everything "good and moral" about a "harem" can autonomously stand on its own as simply being "polyamory", so there is no need to reinvent the wheel by trying to whitewash the word "harem", since this ends up creating confusion.

It is technically a Harem though, in the traditional sense and not in the porn sense. The sultans of the Ottoman empire for example supported the women who chose to be there, making sure their families were financially supported for what they were providing.
Modern poly relationships just took the classic harem dynamic and rebranded it with the lingo of today.

Medieval women in male dominated cultures rarely had the autonomy to "choose" to be in relationships that afforded political and economical benefits to their families. It is absolutely a fantasy to think it wasn't historically a sexist institution, even though it can be deemed more fair than alternatives such as concubinage. Also obviously the institution did not afford the possibility of the women choosing to have other male partners aside from the owner of the harem, something modern poly relationships could support, so it is erroneous to call it a simple "rebranding".

 

[Shitler1071]

You have to complete the Simon's Daughter quest. Visit Robin at the academy and investigate the disturbance. You should recruit Hilstara first or you will miss a fight.

View attachment 2935062

but those disturbance doesn't happen? how to trigger it?

 

[Usudi]

It's a known bug, but the RP points reset back to 100 after the talk, I believe.

Where can i do this talk? Is it automatic or after orilise reform the person request(witch i have alerady done)?

 

[ixcez]

they did the chosen characters dirty, always horny brats want to stick in everything.

Yeah very spoilerish.

Spoiler: endgame spoiler

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[hrhr]

This doesn't seem to have relevant consequences, but asking just in case I missed something (or it's a bug, although that seems unlikely):

Spoiler

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[lostone2]

Where can i do this talk? Is it automatic or after orilise reform the person request(witch i have alerady done)?

It's a known unsolved bug.

but those disturbance doesn't happen? how to trigger it?

Just select Yes and it should happen automatically.

 

[Lolicon Kami]

it's literally impossible to get the good ending for the most part without the wiki.

That is a hallmark characteristic of a good RPG game.

And that's why all the legendary RPG games (Chronos Trigger, Radiant Historia, Dragon Quest, Rance Quest, Final Fantasy) need walkthroughs

Just for reference. Maybe these types of games aint your type?

 

[Deepsea]

Medieval women in male dominated cultures rarely had the autonomy to "choose" to be in relationships that afforded political and economical benefits to their families. It is absolutely a fantasy to think it wasn't historically a sexist institution, even though it can be deemed more fair than alternatives such as concubinage. Also obviously the institution did not afford the possibility of the women choosing to have other male partners aside from the owner of the harem, something modern poly relationships could support, so it is erroneous to call it a simple "rebranding".

I mean the Ottomans specifically. It's a harem in the traditional sense in they had a lot of political and economic autonomy inside the Harem, which was to support the women in it. Just like in TLS, which is where I think Sierra drew inspiration from.
Poly is just what the kids are calling harem dynamics these days. Modern society has just allowed more freedom in what you call it. Trying to refine it further is modern Id-Pol and that should be avoided at all costs.

is the main story of this game complete ? i haven't played it in years

Latest map, got 6 things to do before end game. So 2 or 3 more updates.

 

[Tess]

And that's why all the legendary RPG games (Chronos Trigger, Radiant Historia, Dragon Quest, Rance Quest, Final Fantasy) need walkthroughs

I feel like if a game NEEDS a walkthrough, its a subpar game. Not saying any of those games are bad or that this one is, hell i love it and support the Patreon, but personally if i need an external source to get a good ending, that it rubs me the wrong way. I would prefer if the game left hints are gave context clues as to what is a better outcome.

 

[Bob Jared]

how's the incest route in this game?

It's not a route but there is one mother/daughter scene where the mother has a futa spell while she and Simon tag team the daughter.

 

[ixcez]

That is a hallmark characteristic of a good RPG game.

And that's why all the legendary RPG games (Chronos Trigger, Radiant Historia, Dragon Quest, Rance Quest, Final Fantasy) need walkthroughs

Just for reference. Maybe these types of games aint your type?

Ehm I'm a bit confused here isn't all the games you listed very linear with only a set ending pretty much?

Chronos trigger - has a lot of endings but most of them are joke endings or early ending because you make a certain choice or actions at one point.

Radiant Historia - Sort of has multiple "endings" but they all boil down to the MC returning to a previous point after seeing what happens so the endings are not really endings but things the MC has to reach to see how things plays out to change the past so there really is only one "ending" I would say since the whole game is set on the whole see the future go back in time to change the future until you eventually can get the good and eventually true ending.

Dragon Quest - Is a bit of a mixed bag where multiple games don't have multiple endings and some of them have a few endings, though most that have more then one ending usually have an ending and a true ending, the true ending usually involves a final true boss that gives you an extended ending pretty much.

Rance quest - It does have multiple endings but from how I remember it the endings are mostly focused on what happens to the side characters while Rance usually get's summoned to a new game or something I believe or maybe thats the start of the new games xD.

Final Fantasy - This game has pretty much never ever had more then one ending except for a few of the games that has more then one ending, for instance FFV has one ending but it changes depending on how many characters are alive, FFX-2 has two endings and one of them get's extended with 100% completion, FFXV has one ending and a joke ending if you buy the dlc. Some others have some changes to some scenes during the endings like FFIX if you still have the hammer the ending theater scene uses the hammer instead of a sword. But overall FF has for pretty much all their games only ever had 1 ending though you can fight a bunch of optional bosses or get more powerful gear/abilities by doing certain things while playing for the most of them.

All in all pretty much all the games you listed are great RPG's but none of them or at least most of them don't need a walkthrough to reach the endings in most cases unless your looking for some hidden boss/item or something.

While TLS is an RPG I love a lot one of it's greatest downsides is that if you go into it blind and play it like most other RPG's chances are you'll eventually just hit a brick wall and have to restart a much earlier save or even restart your game.

To give an example traditional RPG's and all the games you listed far as I know allows you to just grind enemies endlessly for xp + money to eventually grind yourself through hard content. TLS on the other hand never tells you far as I know that xp is a limited resource and that a lot of the content and enemies will go away if you don't so chances are high you will eventually become severly underleveled if you didn't know.

The investment system with ProN is also kinda all over the place since you have no idea what to really invest in chances are high that many players for instance invests in the three merc groups since they get told were building an army so soldiers are needed right? But that's like one of the worst investments early on since the help they give is very minor, you can pretty much get a similar reward without them, they will drain your ProN even more since they cost ProN each round and then to top it all off if you get a lot of ProN early on Aka will recommend the player to go transfer it into Sx so that the player can get better gear. So the investment system early on is filled with trap investments and the player companion is even trying to hinder the player as well by giving bad advice.

Another thing that is also limited is just Sx and gear/items overall like early on you can do the rats quest and the game sort of warns you not to horde potions and such or you'll die. But the game at some point pretty much requires you to unequip certain members of your party at points or really horde items by running back and forth to heal/rest for free which again is pretty much impossible to know unless you've already played the game far beyond that point or use a walkthrough.

So TLS is really not a beginner friendly game and even for RPG veterans the game takes some time to get used to since it's pretty much set as a hardcore RPG game. So while I do like the game a lot it's not an easy game to get into and compared to the other games as listed I'm pretty sure you can get through all of them by again just grinding at points you get stuck while you might not be able to 100% them without a walkthrough because you missed some obscure action/item early on all of them let's you easily playthrough them and reach the ending without a walkthrough.

 

[manscout]

I mean the Ottomans specifically. It's a harem in the traditional sense in they had a lot of political and economic autonomy inside the Harem, which was to support the women in it. Just like in TLS, which is where I think Sierra drew inspiration from.
Poly is just what the kids are calling harem dynamics these days. Modern society has just allowed more freedom in what you call it. Trying to refine it further is modern Id-Pol and that should be avoided at all costs.

I understand where you are coming from, but I think even in the Ottoman's case there's enough conditions that harm the notion of it being affirming of gender equality (which is what people were complimenting about TLS's depiction of a harem). Mainly for 2 reasons:

1. Consider how those women made it into the imperial harem, essentially groomed into it by their families from birth and through political marriages. The succession of the sultanate would still be one of male preference so that dynamic would never be reversed, difficult to call it a depiction of autonomy.

2. Even at the height of the reign of sultanas, their power was still seen as merely derivative of the sultan and they were often attacked for it by the aristocrats.

If you consider a harem to simply be equivalent to the poly relationship of 1 man with multiple women then what you are saying makes sense, but I think most people associate the word with the institution that, due to its historical and political circumstances, is associated with some degree of female subservience. But like you said, that could depend on culture, linguistics, semantics, and all that stuff that is completely pointless to argue in here.

I will just say that, anecdoctally, I have seen people that came to TLS with the wrong expectations due to the word "harem" being used, when I feel if the word "poly" had been used they wouldn't have felt misled, but that's just my opinion.

 

[Goi]

Ehm I'm a bit confused here isn't all the games you listed very linear with only a set ending pretty much?


So TLS is really not a beginner friendly game and even for RPG veterans the game takes some time to get used to since it's pretty much set as a hardcore RPG game. So while I do like the game a lot it's not an easy game to get into and compared to the other games as listed I'm pretty sure you can get through all of them by again just grinding at points you get stuck while you might not be able to 100% them without a walkthrough because you missed some obscure action/item early on all of them let's you easily playthrough them and reach the ending without a walkthrough.

you can get through the game blind and reach the ending without the walkthrough easily here

the whole this game is very Linear and with a set ending pretty much sums up TLS

just the standard rule of talk to everyone and do everything will get you threw in fact the game is designed well enough that you can beat the game with getting the worst outcome in every section(which is even harder than best because the gam has built in help mechanics to help you out if you are not doing well)

 

[ixcez]

you can get through the game blind and reach the ending without the walkthrough easily here

the whole this game is very Linear and with a set ending pretty much sums up TLS

just the standard rule of talk to everyone and do everything will get you threw in fact the game is designed well enough that you can beat the game with getting the worst outcome in every section(which is even harder than best because the gam has built in help mechanics to help you out if you are not doing well)

It's true that even with the worst outcomes the game is doable, though the main concern in my opinion is the combat. Getting bad outcomes or missing stuff means you will have much worse gear or lower lvls. Far as I know the built in help mechanics only gives a small boost or the similar boost as being max lvled during certain parts during the lengthier scenarios or during the incubus prison if you want to go with easy mode.

However there is no help against certain fights if you wield subpar items and are low lvl'd for instance one of the major stop gaps is during the erosian war when you fight against the big group of enemies. On my first playthrough that place really curb stomped my team and no matter what I did or what team setup I had my team would get killed in the first or second turn there are other places as well but overall if you reach the late game and your severly underleveled and haven't been doing a lot of the stuff so your gear is also bad chances are high that even random enemies will kill your group over and over again and some of the harder fights are almost impossible to beat unless you get really lucky with the RNG.

Since for instance if your teams agi is too low the enemies will always act first. Or for instance versus Lilith + Mestan if you like me didn't know about their mechanic to debuff your whole team over and over and didn't have stat immunity items for your whole team it can become impossible to even try to fight them. Unless you somehow get super lucky but my whole team got paralyzed over and over until they died on my first try sadly I barely had any status immunity items on that playthrough so my solution at the time was to reload a much earlier save and loose a few hours of game play because of it which sucked. I could probably go on but just from the top of my head at least 10ish fights I believe are pretty much unbeatable unless you have a minimum of party strength and I honestly don't know of any where the game has help mechanics outside of the incubus prison but feel free to point them out.

 

[sin(α)]

you can get through the game blind and reach the ending without the walkthrough

True.

easily

False. Pretty soon you'll have some terribly hard times trying to beat powerful bosses and monsters with next to nothing as you failed to get better stuff.

And at the end you'll stand and look at your devastated lands and cities under your rule and try to figure out what went wrong.

TLS is an orgy of hidden variables you have no f*cking idea they even exist. (Without some sort of guide or wt ofc.) And those variables tend to determine the outcome of pretty much everything in TLS.

 

[Goi]

You don't really get equipment from doing well and you can easily buy equipment that can cover things also not keeping status blocking you get enough for free or can buy some

also Levels by the end of the third war(aka the AoA war) mean pretty much nothing in terms of combat( I did cheat a level 99 party once and it died as easily as normal level party by then),

you don't need to know the hidden values to get good results I certainly didn't on my first playthrough and it was fine generally got second best results or even best results( I was no where near optimal() though but that is expected even with the walkthrough have redone it a few time since then think on my 5 or 6th one now not that much has changed for them

 

[52000758]

Man, I just went through Zelica sex scene and it's one of the most depressing thing I've seen. I was getting horny and it got shut down completely.

 

[Shitler1071]

It's a known unsolved bug.


Just select Yes and it should happen automatically.

it doesnt work, even after avoiding any fight. robin still not appeared in my party

 

[Nivla456]

I Played this game for adults scenes, now I play for story and grind funds for invest , love the no random wild encounter, that sh*t is annoying