VN VNs: sex scenes very early, is it a good idea?

[xxx3me]

One more "pubic consultation".

I played a lot of games, like most of you. There are some good games/VNs that, at least for me, were ruined by overwhelming amounts of grinding (I won't bring up names) before any sexual content, what - if player is interested on sex scenes, what is more than expected for x-rated games - it can be a real pain in the ass. So, the MC has to work a lot, do a lot of shit, blabla until he gets a basic blowjob scene. Same for female MC and even games that are not 'grindy', but protagonists doesn't have sex so soon.

I understand it for specific plots and stories. Example: in Good Girl Gone Bad, it wouldn't make sense if the MC was a debased slut from start. She is a sexually repressed/behaved person (of course this quickly changes and she is banging one-night standers in a club toilet 30 minutes into the story). But anyway, it's later in-game.

Do you think there is a point within a story/game where sex scenes should start? A MC having sex scenes early will spoil the player too much, or do you miss exactly this possibility?

 

[Mimir's Lab]

I'm of the mindset that if you introduce sex scenes early on, you are telling the player that your game is sex-heavy versus if you don't, you will be more story heavy. This assumes your releases are 30+ minutes each. If your releases are 10 minutes long and you have a sex scene after 5 updates, that's still relatively early from a player's perspective. People who are in it for quick sex won't like your game very much if you entice them with early sex but then go story-heavy for 5 updates. Likewise, people who are playing for the build-up won't like it when you release sex scenes without building up the characters. Most of the time, it doesn't even matter which decision you choose because most people don't even touch first releases anyway.

 

[paust.alex]

There is a game called WVM. In the first version there were four sex scenes. The author began to earn about 10k$ a month. Think about it.

 

[Doorknob22]

My initial release sucked ass, with horrible bugs and gameplay issues but people remained highly interested because of the good sex scenes and my kick ass writing. In other words: the sex scenes showed them the potential of the game.

Offering sex scenes early shows your future players how you approach the subject: do you offer dialogs during sex or just "Oooh!"s and "Ahhh!"s? Animations? Multiple angels? Is your lighting any good? The sex can be between minor, even disposable characters but I don't think adding sex in the first release is likely to cause damage. Think of action films starting with an action scene: no one leaves the cinema after an opening action scene thinking "fuck, too much action..."

 

[bobdickgus]

If your gonna do a slow burn you better have a really damn good story. Most don't.

 

[Fatalmasterpiece]

Does it make any difference if the sex scenes really happen in the story or if they are dreams/fantasies of the player character?

 

[PrinceOfShades]

Keep in mind that an early sex scene is also sort of a "test drive". Sex scenes are undoubtedly an important part of an adult game. If you manage to have a great sex scene at the beginning, people who like it will feel more confident in playing.
Also, not all sex scenes have to be with regular characters. You can have a random girl in a believable scenario as well. At least until you develop the primary characters through story (and even then, it's a breath of freshness to bring in another character for a short while). Just make sure the sex doesn't come out of nowhere though, that usually doesn't end up well.

Does it make any difference if the sex scenes really happen in the story or if they are dreams/fantasies of the player character?

I can't say for others, but for me there's a big difference. I'd much prefer if they actually happened.

 

[PochitaTheChainsaw]

i definitely prefer games that have scenes early on. i dont like feeling like im never going to get a sex scene like with some of the routes in "ramen no ouijisama". even after playing for an hour on Ren's route i only got 4 of her scenes. 1 of which was an almost kiss, another was a drunken kiss, another was a masturbation scene and i cant even remember the other one. after a certain i just gave up on reading the text and skipped through it all. no scenes after skipping through what probably amounts to 30-90 minutes worth of content. meanwhile games like "apocalypse" by epiclust that have progression based sex scenes that are easy to build up to while having a decent story are fun because i can get the sex scene that i want and my boner doesnt get killed by speaking of lawsuits.

 

[Fatalmasterpiece]

I can't say for others, but for me there's a big difference. I'd much prefer if they actually happened.

I only ask because of the old adage, "Wanting is better than having". It is important that the player wants something they can't have (yet) and difficult to craft a risk reward system while still giving players ample adult content in the game. Some games take waaaaaaay too long for this, Witch Trainer is a perfect example. Even Being A Dik made the player wait a fairly long time before getting to a real sex scene, and then they may miss it depending on choices. On the other hand, some games, sex is too easy and common, such as Corruption of Champions or TiTs. You literally have to skip scenes all the time or else it gets really repetitive.

 

[Shakira]

Does it make any difference if the sex scenes really happen in the story or if they are dreams/fantasies of the player character?

I don't think it matters too much for someone who just wants to see some h-scenes. I personally think it's a good way to introduce early sex/h-scene because it doesn't mess with the actual story.

 

[Hadley]

I hate when Games do that. What is coming after that? More Sex?

 

[rayminator]

depends on the game story line

 

[Adabelitoo]

I think that most people would prefer having sex too early rather than too late, I'd even go as far to say that most people would prefer having sex too early rathen than mid-game /early mid-game/ late early game.

Of course it mostly depend on what you want for your game. A game usually has more than one LI, let's say 4, girl A can have sex scenes realy early, girl B can have sex scenes later than girl A but still way early than girls C and D. Not all girls need the same amount of time/events before sex. Having early sex scenes doesn't mean it'll be a heavy sex based game, at least for me.

IMO, an early sex scene can be an excellent resource to build the story. A classic doujin story is the mother who's being cheated on so she gets drunk and tells her son that she feels lonely and ugly, which ends in sex and the next day she feels regret for what she did but she can't stop thinking about how perfect that night with his son was. That early sex scene makes players happy and is an excelent way to develop the story.

About dreams/fantasies, that's a turn off for me. If I know it isn't a real scene before it happens, then I'll feel kinda sad, if I don't know that it wasn't a real scene until it ends (for example the sex scene happens and then the MC suddenly wakes up) then I'll feel sad and betrayed. Not "betrayed" like in "That fucking dev tricked me!" but more like "Man... I wish that scene was real...". What I do like is when the player isn't supposed to know if it was just a dream or not at the end of the scene, that's also a good resource to tell a story.

What I definitely would advice new devs is to add at least 1 sex scene no matter what for mostly two reasons. 1) The dev has to show players what he's capable to do, and 2) The dev has to show himself that his sex scenes are indeed good enough in the first place, that players like them. The dev needs that feedback to know that he's doing right, in the same way that a story based game needs feedback about the story/characters to know that he's doing things right.

 

[woody554]

A classic doujin story is the mother who's being cheated on so she gets drunk and tells her son that she feels lonely and ugly, which ends in sex and the next day she feels regret for what she did but she can't stop thinking about how perfect that night with his son was. That early sex scene makes players happy and is an excelent way to develop the story.

that happening early always makes me awfully disappointed and I usually just stop reading. where as if the same exact thing happens after a long build up of reluctance, denial and finally caving in against your better judgement...10/10. I can't stress how much easy/early sex puts me off.

and yeah, early dream sex is the worst version of this.

 

[Fatalmasterpiece]

I'm leaning more towards no early sex and no complete sex dream. Going back to the BaDIK example, I hate the dream sequences with Cathy. It ruined any incentive to pursue her as a LI which sucks because her following story about the photos getting leaked is a good set up. I completely skip all the dream sequences in that game.
Heavy teasing seems to be the way to go, up until relationships develop. Having optional sex scenes with side characters seems best if you really want to include some in your initial release.

Doujin isn't a good example because they have a limited number of pages to work with.

 

[jamdan]

It depends on the situation. If the MC has a GF/BF, wife, husband etc. it makes sense to have sex scenes with them early. They're in a relationship.

But for characters who aren't in the relationship, you need buildup first. How much buildup is dependent on who the characters are. A shy nerdy girl will require more buildup than a slutty bimbo. A friend of MC may need less, or more, than a newly acquainted person you just met.

Sexual dreams needs a compelling reason for it to be included. Not just "Wow, X is hot I wanna dream about them". That may be realistic IRL, everyone has wet dreams, but in a game it can ruin the buildup. And don't actually show any direct sex, just do some foreplay & teasing. Kissing, touching etc. It makes the character dreaming want it more IRL, it can almost be a corrupting force too. Dreams show your subconscious feelings, they can be very informative if done right.

 

[Cryptist]

I will quit a game if the grinding becomes noticable. An early sex scene that is followed by more than one update without more sex will make me drop the game until it is final.

There are plenty of games to play. I won't waste time being teased, frustrated, or disappointed.

 

[Cappucinn0]

for me its depend on storyline, if the story is good maybe there's ok sex scene later, but if story isn't that good well people will get bored if to get sex scene is to much work.

example: i have played some japanese VN, most of them are good, but some of them are very boring
the good : story is good, not to much work for sex scene, many character to progress
the bad : story average coz only focus on one character, sex scene is verryyyyy later in game

 

[Pitrik]

I always preferred more to see a story between the involved characters before going into the sex scenes...

Story helps to enjoy more the future scenes for me...Seeing a couple (BF/GF or husband/wife ) that in the first release have sex is ok but if I have to see two characters that know each other since 10 minutes having sex I dont really like it and this happen often in games especially in harem ones.

What I would like to see is that two characters start to know each other better,becoming friends or lovers before having sex

But maybe im the one with strange taste

 

[Adabelitoo]

Doujin isn't a good example because they have a limited number of pages to work with.

Assuming you're talking about a oneshot which average it's 20-30 pages. More than that is enough to work with.