I've tried looking for a long time and I generally don't see great visual novels that really nails the novels part. My ideal visual novel are stories like Fate/Stay Night and White Album 2 where the sex serves as a wonderful culmination of a rewarding character and plotline. I've read stuff like Dreams of Desire and Depraved Awakening and it really takes me out of it when all the porn talk starts 5 minutes into every conversation and the plot is paper thin.
Why is almost every VN here a nukige?
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- Nov 15, 2018
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Mb you should try kinetic novels? Seems like you don't need any gameplay.
I don't understand what you mean, more story does not imply less gameplay. If anything it's maybe less sex.
- Jun 11, 2017
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Try The DeLuca Family if it's a great story you are searching, there is some sandbox elements but I am sure you'll love it.
https://f95zone.to/threads/the-deluca-family-v0-05-hopesgaming.15459/
- Jun 10, 2017
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The plot of Depraved Awakening is "paper thin" ? Really ?
Writing isn't the best point of Philly, it's the CG, but he's far to be bad at this, and there's an effective story, that effectively develop during the game, and the character have a real deep personality and a background.
This unlike too many of the Asians VN where the story is limited to "get the girl". They have more dialog, but there's no story as background ; you are a guy, generally at school, who will try to put one of the girl he talk to into his bed, point. And the said girls generally have a cliché personality, just enough to make them differ from the others girls available in the game.
It doesn't mean that you don't have the right to like this kind of games ; it's obviously a mater of personal taste, and we all have a different one. It's just that the amount of dialog lines, and the percentage of them that aren't related to sex, doesn't define the depth, complexity and interest of the plot. In fact it tend to be the opposite, here the numerous dialogs exist to hide the emptiness of the effective story.
- Jun 21, 2017
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It sounds like you want a romantic VN, is that right? More focused on dating than sex?
Look for dating sims if that's the case.
Look for dating sims if that's the case.
On depraved: Paper thin is sort of an exaggeration but it's still nukige tier, like Euphoria or Bible Black.
Stories like fate stay night and so on are certainly on another level. Your generalization about Asian VNs is wildly off, it makes it sound like you've never read an actual VN and only ever played only nukiges... If that's the case try reading Ever17, Cross Channel, or Tsukihime, they might just freaking blow your mind.
I agree what you described sounds fucking terrible but great stories aren't like that at all lmao.
Not at all.It sounds like you want a romantic VN, is that right? More focused on dating than sex?
Look for dating sims if that's the case.
High quality eroge: Sex is integrated into the story because it's a natural part of human interaction.
Nukige: Story serves only as context to an endless parade of sex scenes.
Basically the former would be something more like game of thrones without the fade to black on the sex.
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Try out starship inanna
https://f95zone.to/threads/starship-inanna-v8-5-mad-docs.775/
You might like Katawa Shoujo
https://f95zone.to/threads/katawa-shoujo-four-leaf-studios.4276/
https://f95zone.to/threads/starship-inanna-v8-5-mad-docs.775/
You might like Katawa Shoujo
https://f95zone.to/threads/katawa-shoujo-four-leaf-studios.4276/
- Jun 10, 2017
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So you can exaggerate (according to your own words) and it's alright, up to us to understand that it's exaggeration. But when I use "too many", it's an unacceptable generalization ?
Well, I'll not even answer to what you said after this, you clearly don't expect this to be a discussion thread.
Sorry I guess, I didn't say it was unacceptable I was just offering information where I felt it might be necessary. Also I really thought you were describing nukiges, which is definitely not what I want.
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Katawa Shoujo is the bomb, but I read it like 10 years ago. I'll def check out starship inanna and Deluca family recommended above, but I really don't feel like what I said was an exaggeration. I've been using this website for a year and checked out a LOT of VNs.
Well... I don't know why these question never end...
Because those devs they had other opinion in good VN
you had one you like as you say fate stay night etc
and for me... fate stay night is boring
but I wouldn't say it is not good
as same as all VN game in this site
I don't like them either
but there always someone like them
so they got created...
the dev create something they enjoyed
and if you ever create something for people
you will know you never can please every one
there always someone doesn't like your work
if you want something suit your taste more making
there are only one effective way to make it happen
go fund/hire someone/team to do it
Otherwise, you can just hope it will happen...
And if I say why fate stay night like dev not on this site?
Mostly because of this site is not Japanese forum
so the dev more on the west world culture
if you want to access more japan VN style
it's not too late to learn Japanese
That is the other effective way...
Because those devs they had other opinion in good VN
you had one you like as you say fate stay night etc
and for me... fate stay night is boring
but I wouldn't say it is not good
as same as all VN game in this site
I don't like them either
but there always someone like them
so they got created...
the dev create something they enjoyed
and if you ever create something for people
you will know you never can please every one
there always someone doesn't like your work
if you want something suit your taste more making
there are only one effective way to make it happen
go fund/hire someone/team to do it
Otherwise, you can just hope it will happen...
And if I say why fate stay night like dev not on this site?
Mostly because of this site is not Japanese forum
so the dev more on the west world culture
if you want to access more japan VN style
it's not too late to learn Japanese
That is the other effective way...
Yeah good point, though atm I'm less into japanese VNs and I'm looking for western VNs. I don't think "good stories" is a unique cultural point for Japan. I'm not saying nukiges are wrong, I just expect there to be at least some that aren't nukiges. But the most highly rated ones on this site are nukiges or trainers which is confusing to me.
- Jun 10, 2018
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Katawa Shoujo is one of the best japanese VN's I've ever played and I don't know if there's any western VN that's comparable. The problem is that games like this need a looooooooong time playing it before you'll be able to see the first glance of naked skin and I guess a lot of people prefer to have at least some eye candy, something sexual in between.
no... I'm not talk about good story
I'm talk about long story(long progress good or bad is subjective)
in japan there are culture like porn Vn with long story can sale on public for a decade
there are fandom festival market etc
but in western you can't see that
now the dev here rely on patreon or subscripstar
and other that see it is not worth to do it
because you can't sale it public
no money no deal?
do you ever work for free?
if your boss let you do something for free are you willing to do it?
it is the same for dev
the western dev with long story in mind mostly do not have motivated to jump in porn Vn business
because it has low opportunity to success
unlike the dev that like nukige style
it's easy sale so it's a win win situation
they can work with what they like and it sells well
not just do a load work job
to got some few user praise oh this is a good Vn bla bla bla for free
They just keep their project bury in their mind
and go live a life do day job
safe spare time to go travel or other hobby instead
like most of user in this forum
they had some game in mind they want to make
some game style story that they very like
but... I'm lazy/poor/busy/lack of skill bla bla bla
so I go out shout about what I want instead
and the worst is go and say bad thing on what I don't like that already created
because hell it's not my cup of tea so it's not good
it deserved to destroy...
and I can say dev for Vn with long story exist
but less of them finish it enough to be public
you are the fan of those type of Vn
so I think you already think about how hard and time-consuming for it to be made?
you can't public a long progress story porn Vn with one chapter
because it doesn't matter at all for the audience(to support them)
and after bury them self to work on 2-3 chapter
with massive of art work story gameplay
their souls is exhaust
They think about why are they do this to them self? To their family?
What the point of these work load if it's not makes money
so... they end up quit it
and it is never go public...
Haha, Katawa Shoujo is exactly the point. It's not a Japanese VN, it's a western VN written by people who actually read and studied high quality japanese VNs and wrote a free english VN with no money almost 10 years ago. Now with a much larger community and more money still nothing comes close it's bizarre.
In terms of the skin it's just a matter of writing skill. The writing needs to be compelling enough to stand on its own, and if it is then you don't even need sex at all. FSN and others have completely no-sex sfw versions because of the high (enough) quality writing. And one of the stories I mentioned above ever17 isn't an eroge at all. If you need to have sex all the time, it's probably because the writing isn't good enough.
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- Jun 10, 2018
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Lol, I didn't even know (or I forgot about it^^).
I've played other japanese style (yes, style, because I'm cautious now xD) VNs before and only a few had this high level of quality and detail. I don't know if it's exceptionally even in japan, or I just didn't play the right games.
The thing is, I believe that most people play adult games for the adult part, and take a good story as a nice to have plus. I know some people don't care much for the sex part if the story is good enough, but that's more or less a minority.
A good balance between both is a the best way for a developer.
There is a good point in the lack of 'story before sex' situation in the western market atm.
This current western adult market is only a couple of years old, so it is rather new. (not talking about the old flash games but rather this new style that more resembles the Japanese VN aka the f95 games).
It is still finding it's root. The stereotype for the western adult games is that it is more on the 'silly' side with dildo guns, porn acting dialogues, and is more on the comedy side than on the serious side.
But that slowly changed with games with devs such as DPC and phillygames that showed that there can be different styles.
And when people see success they tend to try to mimic it. Which is good. It evolves the market.
But even among the devs that say they go the heavy story route tend to add heavy sexual action quickly due to fear of the playerbase.
And they're not wrong in their fear. My own game as an example; 99,9% of my negative comments and reviews are due to one thing- lack of sex.
Or as some of them would say "Why so much text? Why no titties?"
This shows that on the western market there are still people having a hard time accepting 'non-nukige' games and that can scare new devs and make them not go for it.
Luckily, those kinds of people are becoming less and less and more games are coming out that dares to go against the stream.
Be a bit patient and you will see a big increase in different styles of games in the western market. It is constantly evolving.
About the Japanese games.
We sadly can't compete. They are companies with talented writers and artists while a guy like me who never wrote a story nor made art suddenly just jumped at it. Smash the keyboard and hopefully, some usable story and dialogues will appear.
But everything needs to start somewhere.
This current western adult market is only a couple of years old, so it is rather new. (not talking about the old flash games but rather this new style that more resembles the Japanese VN aka the f95 games).
It is still finding it's root. The stereotype for the western adult games is that it is more on the 'silly' side with dildo guns, porn acting dialogues, and is more on the comedy side than on the serious side.
But that slowly changed with games with devs such as DPC and phillygames that showed that there can be different styles.
And when people see success they tend to try to mimic it. Which is good. It evolves the market.
But even among the devs that say they go the heavy story route tend to add heavy sexual action quickly due to fear of the playerbase.
And they're not wrong in their fear. My own game as an example; 99,9% of my negative comments and reviews are due to one thing- lack of sex.
Or as some of them would say "Why so much text? Why no titties?"
This shows that on the western market there are still people having a hard time accepting 'non-nukige' games and that can scare new devs and make them not go for it.
Luckily, those kinds of people are becoming less and less and more games are coming out that dares to go against the stream.
Be a bit patient and you will see a big increase in different styles of games in the western market. It is constantly evolving.
About the Japanese games.
We sadly can't compete. They are companies with talented writers and artists while a guy like me who never wrote a story nor made art suddenly just jumped at it. Smash the keyboard and hopefully, some usable story and dialogues will appear.
But everything needs to start somewhere.