Why is netori as rare as it is?

[DuniX]

Because in order for that to make sense the player character would have to be Chad.

The problem is most players cannot identify with Chad as they are the opposite of Chad.
They are the Betas that are getting cucked not doing the cucking and any reminder would trigger their IRL insecurities.

In fact how most Harem Games work is there is no male competition in the game at all, the human male population has gone extinct and you are the only dick left in the world.

 

[Icarus Media]

Because in order for that to make sense the player character would have to be Chad.

The problem is most players cannot identify with Chad as they are the opposite of Chad.
They are the Betas that are getting cucked not doing the cucking and any reminder would trigger their IRL insecurities.

In fact how most Harem Games work is there is no male completion in the game at all, the human male population has gone extinct and you are the only dick left in the world.

Are you saying Harem players are insecure and this is why they remove all competition in their games and choice of games? Because they inwardly fear they couldn't compete in the real world and thus don't want it in their games?

 

[DuniX]

Are you saying Harem players are insecure and this is why they remove all competition in their games and choice of games? Because they inwardly fear they couldn't compete in the real world and thus don't want it in their games?

It's pretty much a standard in all dating sims, not just harems.

Even if there is males it would be your supporting best friend(that is probably gay) or other "joke" characters that aren't real competition, if others exist they would be off screen and not relevant.

If you actually had competition then we would call that genre....

The only exception to netori is the "ugly bastard" meme or using some sort of mind control, that is no longer about triggering their insecurities, that is fully giving in to their insecurities.

 

[obibobi]

Because in order for that to make sense the player character would have to be Chad.

The problem is most players cannot identify with Chad as they are the opposite of Chad.
They are the Betas that are getting cucked not doing the cucking and any reminder would trigger their IRL insecurities.

In fact how most Harem Games work is there is no male competition in the game at all, the human male population has gone extinct and you are the only dick left in the world.

Your making another one of those look down on others comments that isn't even true.

The most popular characters to self insert as are the Chads, the Geralts of Rivia, the Ezio, the Batman, some of the most well written and highly regarded games, Being a Dik and Superhuman have Chad MC's with friends who fuck.

The reason its common place to have the MC with no strong personality and almost no other males, is because it's easier for inexperienced writers to pull off, let the focus be the females.

Are you saying Harem players are insecure and this is why they remove all competition in their games and choice of games? Because they inwardly fear they couldn't compete in the real world and thus don't want it in their games?

This again falls back into inexperience of writers, even romance manga, which is infamous for how Asian audience values purity, where it even extends to their pop stars with some needing to have this persona of being pure, almost always has competition. But you can't just throw the competition in, you need to develop the story and world that most devs either don't have the time or skill for.

Some devs do try, but there are a number of games that are hampered by their attempt to create a broader story, of course I don't think they should stop trying, but if you want to work on it create a story first for a fanfiction website, a story without smut, developing the characters and if it stands on its own, you can then combine them and make something that's greater than the sum of its parts, a well written story with smut.

 

[tanstaafl]

In fact how most Harem Games work is there is no male competition in the game at all, the human male population has gone extinct and you are the only dick left in the world.

Sometimes it's nice to have a game like that. Sometimes. It's like when I want to watch a no brainer popcorn action flick sometimes. But yeah, some of the dedicated harem fans are way overboard. I remember one game where the dev was pressured into completely rewriting one of the LIs in his game, not because there was another penis, but because the LI rocked the MCs world. It was one of those "best childhood friend" deals that never panned out until the MC was older. When the MC finally hooked up with the girl, the girl rocked the MCs world...literal "How are you so good at this" dialogue. People went sideways.

The implication that the girl had been with other people, in the past, not mentioned in the story, despite not even being around the MC for YEARS, was enough to send the harem crowd to the shed to grab their pitchforks and torches. It was sad really.

edit: A link to me getting annoyed in that thread

 

[Tadpol]

Netorare, is crystal clear: an MC who gets his girl stolen, or the variant of the MC who dreams of banging a woman but can't manage it, and sees her end up with someone else.

Netorase, too, is pretty clear, the guy who'd love to see his wife with other men, swinging but where it's just the wife swinging and the husband watching.

Netori, on the other hand, is a bit fuzzier, I can't quite grasp the purpose or the concept behind the word. Is the aim to steal someone else's wife? Is it just having sex with a married woman? Does it require a desire to harm the cuckold?

 

[tanstaafl]

Netorare, is crystal clear: an MC who gets his girl stolen, or the variant of the MC who dreams of banging a woman but can't manage it, and sees her end up with someone else.

Netorase, too, is pretty clear, the guy who'd love to see his wife with other men, swinging but where it's just the wife swinging and the husband watching.

Netori, on the other hand, is a bit fuzzier, I can't quite grasp the purpose or the concept behind the word. Is the aim to steal someone else's wife? Is it just having sex with a married woman? Does it require a desire to harm the cuckold?

All of the neto* brands are more than cucking in japan. Western cultures have watered it down to cucking in most cases though.

That said, to be perfectly accurate to what the terms mean, all of them should include destruction of something "beautiful" be it a person, a relationship, or a life and the feelings that accompany that destruction. Usually it's the destruction of a relationship or love, even in Japan. The terms netorase, netorare, and netori just indicate the point of view while watching the destruction.

Edit: To clarify, I can't think of a single adult game that isn't a Japanese import that actually captures any of the actual spirit of netorare, netorase, or netori.

 

[Tadpol]

All of the neto* brands are more than cucking in japan. Western cultures have watered it down to cucking in most cases though.

That said, to be perfectly accurate to what the terms mean, all of them should include destruction of something "beautiful" be it a person, a relationship, or a life and the feelings that accompany that destruction. Usually it's the destruction of a relationship or love, even in Japan. The terms netorase, netorare, and netori just indicate the point of view while watching the destruction.

Edit: To clarify, I can't think of a single adult game that isn't a Japanese import that actually captures any of the actual spirit of netorare, netorase, or netori.

Okay, so there's a dark side to it that I didn't catch.

These aren't genres I'm crazy about, what little I've seen of them, the antagonist in a netorare story is rarely interesting. So if you reverse the perspective and go into a netori story, it must be harder to make the MC interesting.

As you said in the first post, it's certainly more challenging to write.

 

[MissCougar]

All of the neto* brands are more than cucking in japan. Western cultures have watered it down to cucking in most cases though.

That said, to be perfectly accurate to what the terms mean, all of them should include destruction of something "beautiful" be it a person, a relationship, or a life and the feelings that accompany that destruction. Usually it's the destruction of a relationship or love, even in Japan. The terms netorase, netorare, and netori just indicate the point of view while watching the destruction.

Edit: To clarify, I can't think of a single adult game that isn't a Japanese import that actually captures any of the actual spirit of netorare, netorase, or netori.

Well that just makes it depressing!

I think if people wrote a game about how much you are depressing other people and the sex was more of a weapon and the main character used it like that it would be less fun and sexy.

You're breaking into that Netflix drama zone.

 

[tanstaafl]

Well that just makes it depressing!

I think if people wrote a game about how much you are depressing other people and the sex was more of a weapon and the main character used it like that it would be less fun and sexy.

You're breaking into that Netflix drama zone.

Yeah, some of them are just downright traumatizing, lol. Others have pretty good stories though, so just depends on what you come across.

 

[wiseold6996]

Sometimes it's nice to have a game like that. Sometimes. It's like when I want to watch a no brainer popcorn action flick sometimes. But yeah, some of the dedicated harem fans are way overboard. I remember one game where the dev was pressured into completely rewriting one of the LIs in his game, not because there was another penis, but because the LI rocked the MCs world. It was one of those "best childhood friend" deals that never panned out until the MC was older. When the MC finally hooked up with the girl, the girl rocked the MCs world...literal "How are you so good at this" dialogue. People went sideways.

The implication that the girl had been with other people, in the past, not mentioned in the story, despite not even being around the MC for YEARS, was enough to send the harem crowd to the shed to grab their pitchforks and torches. It was sad really.

edit: A link to me getting annoyed in that thread

That isn't netori though.

 

[tanstaafl]

That isn't netori though.

I know. I was responding to his statement about harem by telling a funny story.

 

[chujkus]

I don't mind netori as long as it is centered around corrupting the woman. When it starts to focus on humiliating the cuck, I lose all my interest. It's just gay as fuck. Sometimes authors of netori media put the cuck in so much limelight, I feel it would be less gay if MC just forgot about the wife and fucked the cuck.

 

[tanstaafl]

I don't mind netori as long as it is centered around corrupting the woman. When it starts to focus on humiliating the cuck, I lose all my interest. It's just gay as fuck. Sometimes authors of netori media put the cuck in so much limelight, I feel it would be less gay if MC just forgot about the wife and fucked the cuck.

That's pretty damn rare in a netori game. Common enough in manga and hentai, but not in games...at least western games. Japanese games are a whole different ballpark, but I don't really play those often.

 

[Zonic Squared]

I don't mind netori as long as it is centered around corrupting the woman. When it starts to focus on humiliating the cuck, I lose all my interest. It's just gay as fuck. Sometimes authors of netori media put the cuck in so much limelight, I feel it would be less gay if MC just forgot about the wife and fucked the cuck.

That's part of the genre that tends to be forgotten outside of Japan. Half of the genre title is destruction.

Not all NTR is negative either. Or degrading. One JAV that will stay a core memory for the rest of my life is one where a dissatisfied meets a black foreigner, engages in an affair with him and ends the movie starting a family with him, truly happy for the first time in a long time. And yet it was labeled NTR and met all the requirements, but it wasn't ugly or rapey or whatever.

When I grew older, I learned why it was labeled NTR (plays on the sympathies of a Japanese male, the target of the film, being beaten out by a lustful foreigner (black too, for extra points) stealing their women and emasculates them) but that didn't take away the positivity I felt as I watched it.

Also another reason not to self insert.

 

[lfgals1]

Netorare, is crystal clear: an MC who gets his girl stolen, or the variant of the MC who dreams of banging a woman but can't manage it, and sees her end up with someone else.

Netorase, too, is pretty clear, the guy who'd love to see his wife with other men, swinging but where it's just the wife swinging and the husband watching.

Netori, on the other hand, is a bit fuzzier, I can't quite grasp the purpose or the concept behind the word. Is the aim to steal someone else's wife? Is it just having sex with a married woman? Does it require a desire to harm the cuckold?

I'm pretty confused as to why you are confused. Netori makes way more sense to me than other neto-s.

The idea that through sheer sexual prowess MC can have any woman they want in spite of all the social, relational, personal, and moral reasons she shouldn't let you have her. Sexual domination in its most pure and uncut form.

 

[MaskedAcc]

Okay, so there's a dark side to it that I didn't catch.

These aren't genres I'm crazy about, what little I've seen of them, the antagonist in a netorare story is rarely interesting. So if you reverse the perspective and go into a netori story, it must be harder to make the MC interesting.

As you said in the first post, it's certainly more challenging to write.

That's a good point. The story would just be "I wanted to fuck this women, and then I did." The antagonists in Netorare never have to try particularly hard to get the woman in the first place. 9 times out of 10 it's either not being able to resist seeing a big dick or just rape that the woman ends up enjoying. Not much to do in a game.

 

[lfgals1]

That's a good point. The story would just be "I wanted to fuck this women, and then I did." The antagonists in Netorare never have to try particularly hard to get the woman in the first place. 9 times out of 10 it's either not being able to resist seeing a big dick or just rape that the woman ends up enjoying. Not much to do in a game.

I've tried a few NTR games and been pretty disappointed in the lack of gameplay/kink cohesion. On the other hand pretty much every one of the Netori games I have tried has been fairly strong on that front.

I think the root cause of the issue is the passive perspective of Netorare/se. The whole kink is about not being in the driver's seat.

Whereas Netori is just a male protagonist corruption game, which there are a million of because it is dead easy to gameify.

 

[tanstaafl]

Whereas Netori is just a male protagonist corruption game, which there are a million of because it is dead easy to gameify.

Most netori games are male protagonist corruption games but most male protagonist corruption games are not netori. There's definitely overlap sure, but don't confuse the two things.

 

[lfgals1]

Most netori games are male protagonist corruption games but most male protagonist corruption games are not netori. There's definitely overlap sure, but don't confuse the two things.

I mean, you sort of said it yourself. It's a squares and rectangles situation. Netori games are male PoV corruption games. There is a pretty standard and easy to deploy model for how to gamify male PoV corruption games, and nothing about Netori would preclude that model from working.

So I don't see what point you are trying to make.