A Thought About All The Games With DAZ3D Models For Their CGs

[Welwigo]

Okay, so... To get my bias out of the way first, I absolutely refuse to play most of these 3DCG games. Now with that done...

There are a lot of things that, to me, are negatives against using 3D models. For one thing, a lot of games end up looking the same because everyone uses the same seven or so DAZ3D models with the same assets bought from the DAZ store. It doesn't help that so many of them go for the same storylines and character archetypes (a consequence of being porn games, I suppose). The other thing is that... I mean, shit -- DAZ3D models are fucking creepy. They sit right in the middle of the uncanny valley for me. The dead eyes, way too stiff smiles, the "clothes" that are vacuum sealed to every contour of the body (don't use textures as clothes, kids), the broken wrists/ankles/necks with certain poses, the too inflated proportions that go beyond curvy and into party balloons attached to bodybuilder muscles, and the glossy wax-like skin with pores the size of lunar craters all just set off my monkey brain. Combine that with poor renders that have a lot of noise, ridiculously artificial lighting, lack of reflections and multiple shadows (often to reduce render time), and barren scenes where nothing at all is in the background, a lot of these renders turn out as a worse looking option than almost any other. All this shit kills my boner and makes me want to avoid these works as much as possible.

That said, I know why they're used and I know what the limitations are. Yes, getting an artist is hard and expensive. And splitting your time between art, story, coding, and project management is a pain in the ass. Yes, I know these DAZ3D models are easier to get your hands on, and they're modular. Yes, you can animate them if you so wish. Yes, you can import the models into Blender and get better results for the renders. And yes, you can make a thousand little permutations of the scene as your heart so desires with just a few tweaks. But I really question if these boons are worth the many banes of this method and these tools.

As a small aside (and poll), how many of you actually enjoy these images? How many of you simply tolerate them? Does anybody just absolutely avoid them at all costs like me?

 

[Clown fish]

It's just that everyone wants to make a "game" as quickly as possible to farm patreon without even trying to understand the subject. As you point out, you can work through Blender, which will reduce the rendering time, but also the picture will not be as terrible as Daz.
I don't even look at these games anymore. Maybe there's a good story/gameplay, but that's the kind of visual I can't stand.

 

[Vengel]

It's just that everyone wants to make a "game" as quickly as possible to farm patreon without even trying to understand the subject. As you point out, you can work through Blender, which will reduce the rendering time, but also the picture will not be as terrible as Daz.
I don't even look at these games anymore. Maybe there's a good story/gameplay, but that's the kind of visual I can't stand.

ehhh ... I'm repeating myself again ... and some soft handed kids here hate me for that ... but ...
The problem is NOT the tool. Actually Daz studio is the perfect bomb for the job. The problem is the talent. It's non existent. And the fanatical clingy (sometimes outright pedofile oriented) desperate fandom is the next big issue. The russian scammers and their paid actors ... and let's not forget - the all time classic - Creator who has "mental problems" from rendering the same copy/paste asset from another game!

There is like 2 actual talented people here (that use daz3d and create adult games posted here) that know what style is ... identity and human anatomy. The rest are just creeps and pseudo wanna be artists that have been clicking around in daz3d between the shifts in Cosco and suddenly decided that they are artists. Just look at the ART subforum and you can realize how much there is NO talent at all. Bunch of deluded dudes posting slapped assets with no custom editing whatsoever ... discussing light and DOF while rendering the same boring overused asset again and again and again ... clapping to each other and giving themselves handjobs and so on ... annnd the same goes for the games ...
I see a couple of local stars here (game creators) ... starting or doing their new games and oh my god - they believed in their own farts and the results are obvious right away. In their infinite wisdom this time around they decided to not use something ready and sculpted by a professional and jumped right in blender for renders and the results are brutally BAD. Complete TRASH.
Also ... I think we have way too many people from third world countries that have a taste for women that look like wax dolls. Just look at the common perception for a MILF - 22-23 year old top model !!!
So ... no ... the tool is not the problem. You just have no real artists ... just people who are scamming.
Just look at the boring absolutely OVER RATED games like WMV (this one simply hold the throne for idiotic looking characters) ... BADIK ... TON ... Big brother ... milfy city and so on. The same bullshit over and over and over again and all the fanatics jumping around like Jesus is coming back on every update

 

[zger]

I somewhat agree with u. Iv seen some sims4 "rendered" games that look better than 95% of daz games.
also all "games" made with honey select or stuff like that should be ignored
"ill just take some screenshots from honey select and write my text over it and now its my game!"
rly sad.

 

[S3vatari0n]

You've just listed all the reasons I so dearly wish the newest updates page had a DAZ3D tag. So I can exclude it. I'd just search by 2DCG, but then I'd miss out on the actually good 3D games that use appealing models like Honey Select (I know that crowd can have major issues, too but on the whole, the models I've seen here are an order of magnitude less horrifying) or SFM hentai models (Yes, most of them are asset rips or very cartooney, but at least they don't look like an eldritch abomination piloting a skin suit).

Someone mentioned talent being the lacking factor, and yeah, I'll agree that's pretty much the sticking issue. But I think I've only seen one good Daz modeler, and that was on LoversLab for a Skyrim mod that's been about 5 years defunct.

 

[apatheticcreative]

The problem is NOT the tool. Actually Daz studio is the perfect bomb for the job. The problem is the talent. It's non existent.

There is like 2 actual talented people here (that use daz3d and create adult games posted here) that know what style is ... identity and human anatomy. The rest are just creeps and pseudo wanna be artists that have been clicking around in daz3d between the shifts in Cosco and suddenly decided that they are artists.

I don't disagree, but even great artists had to start somewhere. I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with lower quality, amateur art if it means someone is getting better at it. Still, there does seem to be an abundance of "My First Porn Game" efforts and an absolute dearth of quality content. Maybe most of the genuinely talented artists aren't interested in making porn games for coomers.

What grinds my gears isn't really the lower quality efforts so much as the low effort games just slapped together without the slightest care and plopped up on to Patreon demanding money. You can really tell the difference between a beginner's true labor of love and someone else's low-effort cash grab. The former can be pretty rough looking, but it has heart and it represents a stepping stone towards greatness. The latter is trash and probably shouldn't exist, even when made by a "talented" artist.

 

[MissFortune]

There is like 2 actual talented people here (that use daz3d and create adult games posted here) that know what style is ... identity and human anatomy. The rest are just creeps and pseudo wanna be artists that have been clicking around in daz3d between the shifts in Cosco and suddenly decided that they are artists. Just look at the ART subforum and you can realize how much there is NO talent at all. Bunch of deluded dudes posting slapped assets with no custom editing whatsoever ... discussing light and DOF while rendering the same boring overused asset again and again and again ... clapping to each other and giving themselves handjobs and so on ... annnd the same goes for the games ...
Also ... I think we have way too many people from third world countries that have a taste for women that look like wax dolls. Just look at the common perception for a MILF - 22-23 year old top model !!!
So ... no ... the tool is not the problem. You just have no real artists ... just people who are scamming.
Just look at the boring absolutely OVER RATED games like WMV (this one simply hold the throne for idiotic looking characters) ... BADIK ... TON ... Big brother ... milfy city and so on. The same bullshit over and over and over again and all the fanatics jumping around like Jesus is coming back on every update

Says the guy doing absolutely nothing himself.

If you think it's so easy, then why don't you do it yourself and cash in? I bet you'd rake it in with your ability. I mean, I get it, with anything popular comes the contrarian who can't handle seeing other people's success. ICSTOR aside, Braindrop, PinkCake, etc. didn't just get there overnight. They have clear renders, good animations, and likeable characters (or writing thereof). Then there's rendering it, coding/scripting everything, and then putting it up for people like you to dump all over it.

What I'm seeing here is blind hate by someone who doesn't know what he's talking about. Sure, Daz isn't Blender or Maya, but it's not just "clicky-click, pose, click, render, and done". Lighting is a real challenge, framing is a real challenge, posing and animation (in Daz) are/can be a challenge. Look, I get it. It's not your taste. But who are you to say it's not art, or it's bad, that there's no talent involved? Especially when you've never put in the effort to do any of it yourself? I mean, looking at your post history, you obviously have a hard-on for 3DCG. So, why keep going to them?

"Let's be clear on something. There is NO real talent/professional writer among the game creators"

I'm pretty sure there's a few published writers making games/VNs on here. Again, have you written professionally? Guessing not, given your punctuation and grammar being a complete mess. How would you know what that said talent is if you've never actively pursued it yourself?

 

[Damzok]

"clicky-click, pose, click, render, and done"

Yes that's about how the vast majority of the game on Daz looks like, which causes a negative reaction.
You talk about lighting, when often you can meet developers who haven't even heard of Smoothing Modifier.

What I'm seeing here is blind hate by someone who doesn't know what he's talking about.

You are no better. Criticism is important. You don't need to jump and clap your hands near every "new" Daz product and call their games art that has flying objects in the center of the screen, no work with light, poses, composition, post-processing, uses the same assets, locations that don't even change, etc.

Again, have you written professionally?

My favorite argument is "Appeal to accomplishment".
If you get your food ruined in a restaurant, I take it you won't have any questions because you're not a professional chef.

 

[Vengel]

Says the guy doing absolutely nothing himself.

If you think it's so easy, then why don't you do it yourself and cash in? I bet you'd rake it in with your ability. I mean, I get it, with anything popular comes the contrarian who can't handle seeing other people's success. ICSTOR aside, Braindrop, PinkCake, etc. didn't just get there overnight. They have clear renders, good animations, and likeable characters (or writing thereof). Then there's rendering it, coding/scripting everything, and then putting it up for people like you to dump all over it.

What I'm seeing here is blind hate by someone who doesn't know what he's talking about. Sure, Daz isn't Blender or Maya, but it's not just "clicky-click, pose, click, render, and done". Lighting is a real challenge, framing is a real challenge, posing and animation (in Daz) are/can be a challenge. Look, I get it. It's not your taste. But who are you to say it's not art, or it's bad, that there's no talent involved? Especially when you've never put in the effort to do any of it yourself? I mean, looking at your post history, you obviously have a hard-on for 3DCG. So, why keep going to them?



I'm pretty sure there's a few published writers making games/VNs on here. Again, have you written professionally? Guessing not, given your punctuation and grammar being a complete mess. How would you know what that said talent is if you've never actively pursued it yourself?

hahahaha
ok

This is what a 3D character artist looks like:

You must be registered to see the links

The ones you listed - are shitty wanna be ARTists ... Period!

Also ... I'm see this argument > can't handle other people success
like we are all from the same third world country with no income
If you actually read carefully my posting history you would know part of the reason for me being here.
Outside of that I'm gonna give you second clue - open Nutaku ... one of the companies with games there > my workplace

 

[Domiek]

2D: If you can't draw, you can't make a game.

3DCG: If you can't model, sculpt, rig, texture or pose, you can still make a Daz game that at least resembles reality.

Of course this doesn't excuse us from making mediocre art, we should be taking the time to improve as much as we can and learn some of those disciplines. Some certainly put in more effort than others and fair criticism can be healthy. Yet there are still some people here who constantly compare apples to oranges. An artist that takes multiple days to create and render a single image isn't exactly working with the same constraints as a dev trying to pump out many more renders in that same timeframe. I know a hobbyist that can create stuff in Daz that would put every single render on this site to shame. He'll never make a game though because it takes him 1 week to make a single render.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter if our work took a lot of effort or not. If our audience no longer likes our visuals, then it's our responsibility to fix it.

 

[Welwigo]

... I know a hobbyist that can create stuff in Daz that would put every single render on this site to shame.

...

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter if our work took a lot of effort or not. If our audience no longer likes our visuals, then it's our responsibility to fix it.

The problem is there is an inherent uphill battle to overcome the uncanny valley when using 3D. It's way more difficult than making a drawing, because there's more detail and shape information in the image. Your brain can use abstraction to fill in the details and connect shapes to form a recognizable facsimile with 2D. You need much more practice and knowledge in anatomy, lighting, and materials to stylize 3D enough to cover it up. Otherwise you have to try your best to achieve realism, and just brute force your way there with more resources.

 

[woody554]

for years I loathed and used to hate poser porn, probably mostly because of my own background in painting and computer graphics and knowing how much better it could be. the people making it had NO idea about art nor 3d, it was just the lowest way of making exploitative smut and pretending you actually knew 3d.

then at some point I stumbled on something that happened to hit right in the middle of my fetish interests, and I learned to tolerate it. very soon I realized it was almost impossible to find the same things in painted/drawn form because of both the lack of talent but also because anyone good enough shy's away from branding themselves as smut artists.

eventually I made my peace with it. if I want to see my fetish stories in visual form there's no avoiding daz. also I suppose getting old has mellowed my judgement and made me more understanding about the limited possibilities people with no artistic skills are forced to work with. and in the end if someone has a story in them they wanna tell but have no art skills, I'd rather have them do it in daz than not getting that story at all. doesn't matter how bad they are, the worst story is still more than the nonexisting story.

I'd still prefer someone decent painting the story, like the jdseal's 'the guide' or the stuff jabcomix makes, but even with those guys the problem is that besides their great art they have no clue how to tell a story. it's just incredibly rare to have anyone be decent at both. and after you've read all your atilio gambedottis, serpieris and manaras etc a thousand times over, there's not much more.

so in the end I'm currently even preferring daz stuff for almost any painted stuff, because latter is extremely bad as well. or when it's not totally bad it's fictional cp like so much of the japanese stuff.

 

[Felicityskye]

hahahaha
ok

This is what a 3D character artist looks like:

You must be registered to see the links

The ones you listed - are shitty wanna be ARTists ... Period!

Also ... I'm see this argument > can't handle other people success
like we are all from the same third world country with no income
If you actually read carefully my posting history you would know part of the reason for me being here.
Outside of that I'm gonna give you second clue - open Nutaku ... one of the companies with games there > my workplace

You make the claim there are no talented/professional writers here. Then you bring up Nutaku. You have to be kidding yourself if you're implying games there specially the free to play freemium games, have talented writing/storytelling. lol

 

[Vengel]

You make the claim there are no talented/professional writers here. Then you bring up Nutaku. You have to be kidding yourself if you're implying games there specially the free to play freemium games, have talented writing/storytelling. lol

What !? Where have I claimed anything about writing ?
Who the FUCK are you ?! GTFO of here !
Oh and by the by ... there is no professionals here in anything !!

 

[K.T.L.]

If you want perfection from your developers, you'll have a pool of about three games to choose from and you'll be paying a fortune for them.

 

[Ross_69]

all "games" made with honey select or stuff like that should be ignored
"ill just take some screenshots from honey select and write my text over it and now its my game!"

You've just listed all the reasons I so dearly wish the newest updates page had a DAZ3D tag. So I can exclude it. I'd just search by 2DCG, but then I'd miss out on the actually good 3D games that use appealing models like Honey Select

The duality of man.

Personally would say that Honey Select *is* preferable, working with the studio is not like just screenshotting HS gameplay. But I found those two comments in same threat funny.

 

[baloneysammich]

The problem is the talent. It's non existent.

Also ... I think we have way too many people from third world countries that have a taste for women that look like wax dolls. Just look at the common perception for a MILF - 22-23 year old top model !!!

This is what a 3D character artist looks like:

You must be registered to see the links

 

[Baka_Energy_studios]

Yeah ... riiight.

Newsflash: Just because you prefer one thing over the other, that doesn't make you better than them. And if you run around rubbing your opinion into other peoples face, feeling oh so superior, than your just the same douchebag like Quarterback-Kyle who bullied you because you have a waifu pillow.
Why is this toxicity always coming from the 2D weebs? It's not the first thread I stumbled upon with this unfathomable mindset.
I can't remember that I have ever read anything like that from the 3D corner.

 

[S3vatari0n]

Yeah ... riiight.

Newsflash: Just because you prefer one thing over the other, that doesn't make you better than them. And if you run around rubbing your opinion into other peoples face, feeling oh so superior, than your just the same douchebag like Quarterback-Kyle who bullied you because you have a waifu pillow.
Why is this toxicity always coming from the 2D weebs? It's not the first thread I stumbled upon with this unfathomable mindset.
I can't remember that I have ever read anything like that from the 3D corner.

Yeeeeaaahhhh, no.

This is nothing like "Quarterback Kyle". Forums are for opinions and discussing thereof. You have to choose to enter the thread, which has a free preview before you click to see if it's anything remotely like what you want to read.

Quarterback Kyle gives you no choice, you chose to read and comment here. You chose to let your jimmies get rustled. Just because you didn't like OP's opinion and fely the irresistible urge to rub your opinion in OP's face, too. Pot, kettle, black.

 

[Baka_Energy_studios]

Yeeeeaaahhhh, no.

This is nothing like "Quarterback Kyle". Forums are for opinions and discussing thereof. You have to choose to enter the thread, which has a free preview before you click to see if it's anything remotely like what you want to read.

Quarterback Kyle gives you no choice, you chose to read and comment here. You chose to let your jimmies get rustled. Just because you didn't like OP's opinion and fely the irresistible urge to rub your opinion in OP's face, too. Pot, kettle, black.

Making a thread for circlejerking, to feel validated by his peers ... much like Quarterback-Kyle when he bullied weeb boy. By opening a thread you're asking for others to join in ... duh. And having a different opinion doesn't equate to get the jimmies rustled. The world isn't black and white. That Republican mindset is a dumbed down version of the endless shades an opinion or argument can have. But hey, maybe you will learn that someday. I wish you the best.
Peace out.