VN Ren'Py A Wife and Mother [P2 v0.230a + P1 v0.152] [Lust & Passion]

[Talcum Powder]

M

Do you hate it more for being amateurish or for being a departure from a strict VN?

It’s so very basic a game, and should have been dropped during play testing because it’s way below the standards of every other element of AWAM, and obviously so. But that doesn’t make me hate it.

it’s a departure from what we’ve seen so far so it’s awkward, but that doesn’t make me hate it.

I hate it because it was clearly un-planned. It was so obviously an afterthought because there’s no renders between hit one, two, or three. If you miss on any of 1,2,3, the same Aiden_Fails [edit] Dylan_Fails [/edit] variable gets set, and there’s only one test: did you get all four or not?? So it was thrown in to replace a “Dylan wins” or “Dylan loses” menu, which would look even dumber than the mini game is lame.

so, how did we get here? We’ll, I propose we ended up with a mini game because L&P somehow envisioned a player who has been pro-Dylan to such an extent that they have more Dylan points than are possible up to that point in the game (54 when only 46 or so are possible) (and remember, they bothered to figure out how to cheat the points needed to proceed) and has chosen on three separate occasions to defend his mom’s honor to some hobos (L&P’s words, not mine - excellent nomenclature by the way, you fucking hack) - sorry I’m rambling.

To re-cap: THREE TIMES In this event, you’ve chosen to defend Sophia.

So I ask our discerning reader: what player who has reached this point in the script wants to lose to the hobos, be embarrassed in front of Sophia, and have things fizzle out? What player that got to that point needs to be asked a fourth time (whether by mini game or via menu):
“So it looks like you’re on the path where Dylan pursues his mom. You’ve made an awful lot of pro-Dylan choices to get here. But, and I know you’ve been pursuing this son-mom thing for almost four years now, but I still have to ask: are you sure you want Dylan to impress his mom right now?”

I mean, really? Really?

 

[JohnnyP]

Solution: Delete bugged save.

Bear in mind, that removing Save files in directory: ".../AWifeAndMother/game/saves" is not enough. You also have to remove it from RenPy backup save location.
In Windows 10 backup saves are located in directory: "C:/Users/your_windows_username/AppData/Roaming/RenPy/AWifeAndMother..."

Worked, thanks!

 

[Talcum Powder]

I was going to address this too, but it seems that the mods got to it quickly. Some people just can't handle the internet. We're all frustrated with the game, but there's a line between criticism and being a jerk. Clearly our approach is not getting through to L&P, so we can't just beat him up if we hope to ever reach him.

Yeh, right with you on this. I bitch and moan and suggest and debate and sometimes throw a hissy fit and overreach (which rightly gets deleted by the moderators). But i think we shouldn’t consciously try to launch personal attacks or denigrate the developer’s effort or question their motivations. We can question/criticize their decisions and the results of those decisions all day long, just not be attacking them personally or calling them names.
Though, admittedly, I did just call him a hack for going with “hobo”. In my defense, after all that talk about translators and what we recently learned about that process, “hobo” is just a piss-poor outcome.

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

It’s so very basic a game, and should have been dropped during play testing because it’s way below the standards of every other element of AWAM, and obviously so. But that doesn’t make me hate it.

it’s a departure from what we’ve seen so far so it’s awkward, but that doesn’t make me hate it.

I hate it because it was clearly un-planned. It was so obviously an afterthought because there’s no renders between hit one, two, or three. If you miss on any of 1,2,3, the same Aiden_Fails [edit] Dylan_Fails [/edit] variable gets set, and there’s only one test: did you get all four or not?? So it was thrown in to replace a “Dylan wins” or “Dylan loses” menu, which would look even dumber than the mini game is lame.

so, how did we get here? We’ll, I propose we ended up with a mini game because L&P somehow envisioned a player who has been pro-Dylan to such an extent that they have more Dylan points than are possible up to that point in the game (54 when only 46 or so are possible) (and remember, they bothered to figure out how to cheat the points needed to proceed) and has chosen on three separate occasions to defend his mom’s honor to some hobos (L&P’s words, not mine - excellent nomenclature by the way, you fucking hack) - sorry I’m rambling.

To re-cap: THREE TIMES In this event, you’ve chosen to defend Sophia.

So I ask our discerning reader: what player who has reached this point in the script wants to lose to the hobos, be embarrassed in front of Sophia, and have things fizzle out? What player that got to that point needs to be asked a fourth time (whether by mini game or via menu):
“So it looks like you’re on the path where Dylan pursues his mom. You’ve made an awful lot of pro-Dylan choices to get here. But, and I know you’ve been pursuing this son-mom thing for almost four years now, but I still have to ask: are you sure you want Dylan to impress his mom right now?”

I mean, really? Really?

I guess I don't really disagree with any of your points, it just didn't bother me. I was just happy to see something different, even if it really isn't very well done in the grand scheme of things. If this is the start of more, and better, mini games, I think that would be a good thing. If this is the only time he does a mini game, it will be a real head scratcher. I'd like to know how much time this took him to assemble.

 

[Talcum Powder]

in the U.S, nothing is private in prisons, except lawyer/prisoner conversations

Yes: only attorney/client privilege is protected.

 

[Sabertooth__]

It's erotic in the context of what's happening in the place & time. It's a matter of personal taste but to me there is no erotic charge in a son lusting after his mother but many fans are playing this game for the incest. Until people started having a jab at the blackmail, I had nothing to say on either subject. Now I find I'm posting about the Aiden path regularly, even though it's far from the only reason I play AWAM. Instead of speculating about where it could, (& probably won't) go, many posts seem to express disapproval in some form.

Every single adult corruption game I've ever played contained coercion. This was usually of a much cruder, straightforward type than has so far featured in AWAM, which up to now has been blackmail with a vanilla flavour but has still managed to be erotic. Just as it could be wondered as to why I play a corruption game containing incest, (which I avoid when I can), so it could be mystifying as to why the coercion factor has not been taken for granted in a game of this genre & pulls in so many negative comments. It's an integral part of the theme folks.

There are so many options available for those who find it too much, from never starting it at all, to myriad ways of ducking out of it, with more to come. Incest is MUCH harder to avoid. Even I didn't grasp when I started playing, just how important an aspect it would be. I understand that people all have widely differing tastes in the AWAM fanbase but here's the thing..... I like the blackmail. I find it erotic. I'm never going to apologise for that. I'm here to indulge in dark fantasies in an entirely fictional world, as are incest fans. It doesn't mean that either of those branches of the fanbase would take part in such practices in reality. I will not be kink-shamed, have blackmail labelled as toxic, or otherwise sit back when some of this story's best bits (IMO), are under attack. Nor will I do what I've long considered, ie drop in to make some disparaging remark about the incest, in the style of the blackmail critiques.

Playing AWAM, whether for incest, blackmail, or anything else, does not make any of us greater sinners than we already are.

So agree with you on this. People calling groping close to rape is bizarre to me. Rape does not have a subjective meaning, it has a definite one. This is sexual harassment. Not saying it's right at all but people really make a big deal out if everything that happens, I don't what kind of corruption games you guys have played where there was no groping without consent or MC being forced to do something. Here it is still far more in control.

One is continuously making the choice of Sophia wearing revealing clothes, going out of town among unknown people, showing breasts to a stranger, will everything be very smooth even after all this. I would believe absolutely not. At that point anyone could have groped her. If one of the students had done that without her consent it wouldn't be made into an issue.

And people making an issue of Aiden's groping and The shota content, it's not like it is being forced on you, a clear choice to leave them is available at numerous points in the story. There are people who are disgusted by incest like most are by blackmail and shota, they however don't have much of choice. The primary storylines Dylan Ellie and Patricia are needed even for other storylines at times. So you are pretty much not having even 30% of the content of you don't like incest.

Also I feel the Aiden could grope Sophia only because she didn't know it was Aiden. She was more or less tricked. Just like how Dylan sneaked a kiss before his match. Does not mean Aiden can get to grope Sophia again in the next task. I feel the next task will be a regression from this.

 

[Old Dog]

Yes: only attorney/client privilege is protected.

Thanks.This could add an interesting slant on things

 

[Talcum Powder]

I guess I don't really disagree with any of your points, it just didn't bother me. I was just happy to see something different, even if it really isn't very well done in the grand scheme of things. If this is the start of more, and better, mini games, I think that would be a good thing. If this is the only time he does a mini game, it will be a real head scratcher. I'd like to know how much time this took him to assemble.

If I could read the code and figure out what it’s doing (I am a novice at best) then it’s safe to assume this took probably no more than ten-fifteen minutes of googling and testing.

let’s roll back about 2.5 years: Ellie asks Dylan to help with her computer. Player must complete a sequence of mini game stages to fix her problem and is subsequently rewarded with a smiling and hugging cheerleader captain in tight shorts. Ah, precedent.

but no, there’s no evidence that mini games were ever intended to be a part of this.

So, L&P is what? Bored with the project to the extent that he’s starting to fool around with what has been up to this point, and despite all the delays, a winning formula? Not good.

 

[Sabertooth__]

If I could read the code and figure out what it’s doing (I am a novice at best) then it’s safe to assume this took probably no more than ten-fifteen minutes of googling and testing.

let’s roll back about 2.5 years: Ellie asks Dylan to help with her computer. Player must complete a sequence of mini game stages to fix her problem and is subsequently rewarded with a smiling and hugging cheerleader captain in tight shorts. Ah, precedent.

but no, there’s no evidence that mini games were ever intended to be a part of this.

So, L&P is what? Bored with the project to the extent that he’s starting to fool around with what has been up to this point, and despite all the delays, a winning formula? Not good.

I feel this was more of experiment just like the animation in this update. He maybe trying to learn and incorporate things in the game but since his Dev cycle is already slow he does not have time to separately sit and learn and practice this, so he incorporated into the game itself.

 

[Bill_Buttlicker]

I’m just calling out that I don’t consider it “erotic”, and specifically that word. Hot, sexy, arousing, flips my cookie, all those things: yes. Erotic, to my mind, connotes a mutual consent and enjoyment. If it were even set up where Ares says “I’m gonna squeeze your titties” - you know, says something aggressive and vulgar and then the choice is “this excites me” or “keep your fucking hands off me”, then choosing to continue, for me, at least, preserves the “erotic” element.

I’m the end, this is pure semantics and depends entirely on how broad our personal interpretation of “erotic” is. For me, Ares’s actions w/o direct consent is not erotic, it’s forcible. But, to each their own.

This whole thing with consent has gotten way out of hand ever since the #MeToo movement started. It's gotten to the point where some people and places actually drew up entire guidelines dictating how men should obtain consent for each little action, even for such innocuous things as holding hands, a quick kiss or just a tender touch on her shoulder for support. This was never a problem before and women particularly never had any problem with little things like what I mentioned previously. If they did romance novels would have never taken off in popularity with women.

How many of those books depicted strong, sexy men taking liberties with the women who desired them. From undressing them, giving them a passionate kiss, forcing them down on the ground, or taking them in unexpected places. In each case, either gently or roughly, the women were drawn to these men because the men were not afraid to take a chance and act on the moment or their passion.

I remember shortly after the #MeToo movement had started and was part of a chat with a notable female speaker and writer. She was totally against what the movement stood for and told us of a time in high school that would have never been possible if this had happened when she was a kid. She was just a teenager in high school and was with her friends watching a basketball game between her school and a rival. It was the final game for the championship and her and her schoolmates were extremely hyped up over the game and hoping to see their team win. In the end her school's team did win and by a narrow margin. Immediately the place went wild with cheers, high fives and even some dancing among her schoolmates. Suddenly a guy next to her who was celebrating the win just turned to her, placed his hands on her cheeks and gave her a deep, passionate kiss. And just as quickly let her go and walked off continuing to celebrate with his friends. She recalled how startled she was, but also how her heart beat faster and the giddiness she felt from the kiss. It turned her on ever so slightly and she never forgot that moment. It was a spur of the moment passion.

Consider if that had happened today, someone would have called the police and accused the man of assault all because he didn't get "consent". However I fail to see how the situation would have been any better if the guy had instead turned to her and calmly asked, "Excuse me may I kiss you?". That right there just comes off as creepy.

Now I'm not saying the situation with Aiden and Sophia is the same as the example I just gave, but people saying he should have gotten consent to reveal her breast and place his hand on it are just being absurd given the context of the situation. Sophia had already partially disrobed earlier, knew nudity would be required by the instructor which she was ok with and Ares was only following the instructions of the teacher. Of course he couldn't resist being a jerk and tweak her nipple at the end before going.

This "getting consent for everything intimate" has eroded our trust between men and women. Both sexes used to be able to act on their passion for small moments and no one ever had any problems with that. Now it appears that's over. That's sad.

 

[Talcum Powder]

Thanks.This could add an interesting slant on things

Slight caveat: in America you cannot be compelled to testify against your spouse AND your spouse cannot testify against you without your permission. Exceptions exist for domestic violence and child abuse.
So while the conversation could be recorded it’s not clear (from my limited understanding) whether the contents of a conjugal conversation could be used in a prosecution. It’s irrelevant in this scenario, but worth pointing out.

 

[Old Dog]

Slight caveat: in America you cannot be compelled to testify against your spouse AND your spouse cannot testify against you without your permission. Exceptions exist for domestic violence and child abuse.
So while the conversation could be recorded it’s not clear (from my limited understanding) whether the contents of a conjugal conversation could be used in a prosecution. It’s irrelevant in this scenario, but worth pointing out.

Thanks but I was getting at that Morello could make Liam listen to the tape to show how reckless he has been and what he has put his wife through

 

[Talcum Powder]

I feel this was more of experiment just like the animation in this update. He maybe trying to learn and incorporate things in the game but since his Dev cycle is already slow he does not have time to separately sit and learn and practice this, so he incorporated into the game itself.

I’m not bothered with the experimentation, I’m bothered that he didn’t have the awareness that this was a fish out of water and should have been cut. He could have just narrated or (god help me for saying this) had Dylan think to himself about his training or his rage, and that gave him the eye of the tiger, the strength to defeat a drunk hobo.

 

[Talcum Powder]

Thanks but I was getting at that Morello could make Liam listen to the tape to show how reckless he has been and what he has put his wife through

Yes, absolutely. And as much as I don’t want development time spent on a one-on-one with Liam and Morello, that could put some additional spice into certain situations.

 

[Sonny86]

If you're sitting down and haven't just eaten a large meal, by all means keep reading.

Spoiler

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If you're not sitting down or there is any risk of nausea or loss of consciousness, just open script4.rpy and comment out lines 21534 through 21545, and then insert $ results = 4 just before line 21546.

I thought l&p said there would be cheats and point upgrades in order to get through all of the update? Is that not the case?

 

[Dr.SigmundFap]

I thought l&p said there would be cheats and point upgrades in order to get through all of the update? Is that not the case?

The cheat and upgrades are the point adjustments on the phone and the option to name save your file.

 

[Alley_Cat]

For me, it doesn't matter if the content is avoidable. I don't want to be associated with a game or a creator that is making that sort of content. Some content I can ignore if it's avoidable, and then there's some content that you shouldn't ignore even if you avoid it. Sexual content with minors is something that all of us should take note of, and it should spur debate. I would rather L&P just come out and tell us that he's into Shota and that he wants the game to include it- that would make it very easy for me to decide what I need to do. As it is, I have one foot out the door already but will take a wait and see approach for now.

The difference for me (from what I understand of what shota is), is that Dylan, Sam, etc are at least in the ballpark of the age of majority, and above the age of consent. So they're around the age of majority, they just look young.

Where people like me are having issues is that there isn't really any way to know what the ages of the boys in the second side job. We're only told they're "high school age". For which in America I believe junior high begins at age 12. So if the twins are as young as 12-13, that's not only below the age of majority, but below the age of consent. Which isn't shota but pedo.

 

[Talcum Powder]

I thought l&p said there would be cheats and point upgrades in order to get through all of the update? Is that not the case?

My code edits in script4.rpy isn't a cheat, per se, it literally comments out the mini game and sets the tested variable to the required value to skip the fight and go straight to Dylan wins.

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

The difference for me (from what I understand of what shota is), is that Dylan, Sam, etc are at least in the ballpark of the age of majority, and above the age of consent. So they're around the age of majority, they just look young.

Where people like me are having issues is that there isn't really any way to know what the ages of the boys in the second side job. We're only told they're "high school age". For which in America I believe junior high begins at age 12. So if the twins are as young as 12-13, that's not only below the age of majority, but below the age of consent. Which isn't shota but pedo.

Most high schools in the US are grades 9 through 12, roughly the ages of 15 through 18 (though it depends on when your birthday is). Like, it isn't impossible that Ellie could be 19 and still be a high school senior. It's also possible that a high school freshman could be 14.

 

[Alley_Cat]

Most high schools in the US are grades 9 through 12, roughly the ages of 15 through 18 (though it depends on when your birthday is). Like, it isn't impossible that Ellie could be 19 and still be a high school senior. It's also possible that a high school freshman could be 14.

Yeah, I usually dismiss Ellie being 19 because then Dylan would be 18, and no reason L&P wouldn't outright say their ages like he does with Marie, Nathalie, and I think Vicky.

Most high schools, yeah, but as far as I know middle school can also be known as junior high, so it really depends on which definition L&P is using. And the issue as I stated is that we just don't know, with every reason for L&P to keep it vague.