VN Ren'Py A Wife and Mother [v0.215f] [Lust & Passion]

[Bishop Robert]

Whats this Dylan event most likely gonna be anyways?

 

[Alley_Cat]

Whats this Dylan event most likely gonna be anyways?

We're not even going to get a teaser for the event, so really it's anyone's guess. But considering last event he was in was him meeting Marie and her actively pursuing him, I would assume something about that. Does make me curious what will happen during the Dylan/Emma event with Marie pursuing him

 

[Bane71]

Arguing over Sofia's things in her bag is absolutely inappropriate. The bag is large enough that you can easily put jeans, blouse and shoes in it so that it looks empty.

It's like sticking to a pole on the street! Not to mention the fact that we are distracting the L&P for nothing.

 

[Sabertooth__]

I think you completely missed the point of the post you are quoting:
The passion and drive and beauty and technique and skill and patience and persistence of L&P are not in doubt and do not go unappreciated.

That said, this was announced back in December (or even earlier?) as a small update. So if the Aiden event, projected to be (I forget, but maybe 25%?) of an announced small update with a 90-day total production schedule, was completed in two weeks we'd all applaud the fact that for the first time in literally two years a scene was developed and completed way ahead of schedule. Instead we're on about week six I think, so that's about 40 days now, of a projected 90-day schedule, spent on (25%?) of the update. And remember, we have no photoshop or programming/translation for the Aiden scene either. Even if it's fast relative to creation it's still adding at least another week.

If I've got it all wrong and the Aiden event was supposed to be 50% of the update then so be it, I may be on about nothing.


Correct: way behind schedule.

As of now the Aiden event is more or less 35% of the update. 300 renders out of approximately 850 renders.
Yes the production has been very slow and I am not saying that it is okay that he is going this slow. He should have more concrete planning. But when people start being so nitpicky about the renders wouldn't it piss him off. His renders are already far more detailed than the average renders in games. He takes pride in it. You are basically hitting his pride.
People were surprised as to why L&P even bothered to talk about the bag. The reason is that the very logic is being questioned. Another thing that he wants to give as much as possible to this game.

 

[Talcum Powder]

As of now the Aiden event is more or less 35% of the update. 300 renders out of approximately 850 renders.
Yes the production has been very slow and I am not saying that it is okay that he is going this slow. He should have more concrete planning. But when people start being so nitpicky about the renders wouldn't it piss him off. His renders are already far more detailed than the average renders in games. He takes pride in it. You are basically hitting his pride.
People were surprised as to why L&P even bothered to talk about the bag. The reason is that the very logic is being questioned. Another thing that he wants to give as much as possible to this game.

Nah, not digging at pride, don't misunderstand. Digging at lack of organization and inability to stick to a plan, which doesn't appear to be a point of pride for L&P. If it were, the developer's updates wouldn't focus on how many images were created but instead would focus on how the project is on schedule and they've even found extra time to do another mini-event just for fun.

In another life from decades ago I was engaged in creative endeavors so I know firsthand one of the major challenges is staying in scope. Another major challenge is avoiding the temptation to focus in on a specific area or aspect of the work without taking time to pull back and assess the work as a whole. If you get too far into a specific nook you will get stuck there and spend a lot of time and energy making sure that nook looks perfect. When you leave the nook having spent so much time in it without reflecting on it's surroundings you may well find that the nook, while "perfect" in isolation, is causing major continuity problems, particularly in terms of balance, proportion, and even thematically, with the overall work.

That's why the Aiden event (this time around), among others, stir up so much commentary: I think there's a consensus forming that the contrivances and gimmicks needed to get Sophia out of the bridal salon and on that bike will be out of step with her character and the circumstances (the reality), which will have to be ret-conned by a bit of forced dialogue either in set up or later on down the line. It is this overarching sense that things are getting out of whack IMHO that leads to folks nitpicking on things like boots in bags and speculating wildly about what besides a leather body suit was in the shopping bag. It's the sense that when taken in broader context it won't make sense.

 

[You Don't See Me]

Arguing over Sofia's things in her bag is absolutely inappropriate. The bag is large enough that you can easily put jeans, blouse and shoes in it so that it looks empty.

It's like sticking to a pole on the street! Not to mention the fact that we are distracting the L&P for nothing.

Being the proud owner of one of Tamriel's finest "Haven Bags", I can attest to the fact that things are not always as they appear. Space is not relatively absolute! (Whatever that means.)

 

[You Don't See Me]

We are all dissectologists in our own way. L&P gives us pieces of AWAM and we struggle to assemble them as best we can. And in some small way, we benefit in that it helps to quell our Covid19 stay-at-home anxieties. So, AWAM is not only a good game, it's good for you. Who woulda thunk it!

 

[GingerSweetGirl]

Nah, not digging at pride, don't misunderstand. Digging at lack of organization and inability to stick to a plan, which doesn't appear to be a point of pride for L&P. If it were, the developer's updates wouldn't focus on how many images were created but instead would focus on how the project is on schedule and they've even found extra time to do another mini-event just for fun.

In another life from decades ago I was engaged in creative endeavors so I know firsthand one of the major challenges is staying in scope. Another major challenge is avoiding the temptation to focus in on a specific area or aspect of the work without taking time to pull back and assess the work as a whole. If you get too far into a specific nook you will get stuck there and spend a lot of time and energy making sure that nook looks perfect. When you leave the nook having spent so much time in it without reflecting on it's surroundings you may well find that the nook, while "perfect" in isolation, is causing major continuity problems, particularly in terms of balance, proportion, and even thematically, with the overall work.

That's why the Aiden event (this time around), among others, stir up so much commentary: I think there's a consensus forming that the contrivances and gimmicks needed to get Sophia out of the bridal salon and on that bike will be out of step with her character and the circumstances (the reality), which will have to be ret-conned by a bit of forced dialogue either in set up or later on down the line. It is this overarching sense that things are getting out of whack IMHO that leads to folks nitpicking on things like boots in bags and speculating wildly about what besides a leather body suit was in the shopping bag. It's the sense that when taken in broader context it won't make sense.

I think there's a fundamental divergence in opinion on the issue of renders. Some members, and L&P himself, seem to be of the opinion that there is a direct correlation between the quality of an update and the number of renders. If a tremendous effort is made and an update has 50% more renders than were planned for, the update will be better for it. If that is true, then an update with fewer renders would inherently be weaker. Why would you want an update with fewer renders when you can have one with more renders, even if that requires longer to produce? I think to some people this is a fair trade off.

The polar opposite opinion would be that renders are not directly correlated to the quality of the update. I'll speak for myself here, but I had full confidence that L&P could have created a great update with ~450 renders. For me personally, consistent updates are more important than expanding the number of renders. I mean, clearly, none of us want 100 renders for an update- that would be too extreme. But 450 renders in a 30-40 minute update is very very respectable, and if that was delivered in 90 days or fewer, WOW, that would be a win in my eyes.

But I think L&P sees this second opinion as an absolute affront to his efforts. Where I thought the game was already gorgeous, I think he now sees those old updates as ugly and substandard. Where I see diminishing returns with all the renders, he sees essential connective tissue that sets his game apart. Where as he sees the creative output as something to celebrate, I see a disorganized effort.

If my description of the two opinions is accurate, that's a hard gap to bridge.

 

[m4pII]

As of now the Aiden event is more or less 35% of the update. 300 renders out of approximately 850 renders.
Yes the production has been very slow and I am not saying that it is okay that he is going this slow. He should have more concrete planning. But when people start being so nitpicky about the renders wouldn't it piss him off. His renders are already far more detailed than the average renders in games. He takes pride in it. You are basically hitting his pride.
People were surprised as to why L&P even bothered to talk about the bag. The reason is that the very logic is being questioned. Another thing that he wants to give as much as possible to this game.

No one is trying to hurt his pride.

Realism is the main driving force of the entire game. This is the reason why the game is so loved, and this is the excuse for its shortcomings.
And therefore, it is not surprising that any questions, even the smallest ones, calling into question the basis of the game, cause such heated debates.

For example, I don't understand the storyline with Ayden at all. I don't understand how Sofia could agree to blackmail from some children.
Even more, I do not understand how such an adult and intelligent woman like Sofia can conspire to meet with a young bandit, leave her car in the city, not warn anyone, change into a whore, and go out of town, into the unknown, where she can easily be locked in a basement and rape in a group.

Realism, ... but not really. Unfortunately, this topic is no longer raised here.

And about the moral state of the author.
I have met several artists in my life. And from experience I know that good criticism is sometimes more useful than blind fanaticism.

And I would really like this forum to remain a place where you can hear criticism, and not turn into a place of worship for the author. And if the price of this is that L＆P will come out of the bubble of adoration (comfort zone) and hurt his feelings, then so be it.

 

[トルフィン]

The most unlealistic in the game is leasbian route, how can Sophia that married a man and has hetero sex her entire life gone full lesbian is amazed me, It like if i see Liam kiss Dylan or Sam that so unlealistic.
The possible way Sophia has sex with someone in 30 days it has to be blackmail or debt route that the most realistic way.

 

[m4pII]

The most unlealistic in the game is leasbian route, how can Sophia that married a man and has hetero sex her entire life gone full lesbian is amazed me, It like if i see Liam kiss Dylan or Sam that so unlealistic.
The possible way Sophia has sex with someone in 30 days it has to be blackmail or debt route that the most realistic way.

In my opinion, being the wife of a “man” like Liam is in itself the best motivation for becoming a lesbian)

 

[hzjujk]

I think there's a fundamental divergence in opinion on the issue of renders. Some members, and L&P himself, seem to be of the opinion that there is a direct correlation between the quality of an update and the number of renders. If a tremendous effort is made and an update has 50% more renders than were planned for, the update will be better for it. If that is true, then an update with fewer renders would inherently be weaker. Why would you want an update with fewer renders when you can have one with more renders, even if that requires longer to produce? I think to some people this is a fair trade off.

The polar opposite opinion would be that renders are not directly correlated to the quality of the update. I'll speak for myself here, but I had full confidence that L&P could have created a great update with ~450 renders. For me personally, consistent updates are more important than expanding the number of renders. I mean, clearly, none of us want 100 renders for an update- that would be too extreme. But 450 renders in a 30-40 minute update is very very respectable, and if that was delivered in 90 days or fewer, WOW, that would be a win in my eyes.

But I think L&P sees this second opinion as an absolute affront to his efforts. Where I thought the game was already gorgeous, I think he now sees those old updates as ugly and substandard. Where I see diminishing returns with all the renders, he sees essential connective tissue that sets his game apart. Where as he sees the creative output as something to celebrate, I see a disorganized effort.

If my description of the two opinions is accurate, that's a hard gap to bridge.

This is an analysis ! Not that I agree, but it's acceptable.

 

[Alley_Cat]

In my opinion, being the wife of a “man” like Liam is in itself the best motivation for becoming a lesbian)

Plus, women tend to be more attentive to their lover than men do. In both the Ellie/Julia event and the Alyssa events, you can see the other women gauge how comfortable Sophia is with the situation. And pull back when they think Sophia is starting to get uncomfortable. It would probably take Sophia begging them to make her come (so finally being comfortable coming with someone other then Liam) for them to finally take the plunge.

 

[m4pII]

The possible way Sophia has sex with soйmeone in 30 days it has to be blackmail or debt route that the most realistic way.

It's hard to disagree. But, it all depends on who is blackmailing and what is the subject of blackmail.
This is where the problems begin.

 

[roro]

The most unlealistic in the game is leasbian route, how can Sophia that married a man and has hetero sex her entire life gone full lesbian is amazed me, It like if i see Liam kiss Dylan or Sam that so unlealistic.

Those things do happen in reality, you can find stories (real ones) of women leaving their husbands, boyfriends etc to the arms of another woman. Same thing can happen with guys.

You must be registered to see the links

Imho, the realizm aspect has blown out of proportion. How can it be realistic and include incest? I'm pretty sure incest is a real thing that still happens in real world, but the chances a woman like Sophia who is well educated, and sits well in the upper class of society to engage in incest is absolutely 0. That said, imo, realizm is relative. In comparison to any other incest centered game - this one is more realistic. Same with female corruption games. How can one expect this game to reach a final unrealistic destination with realistic steps?

What I guess L&P is doing - he's trying to move in small steps, some of them are truly realistic and some of them lack realizm but almost all of them are not truly unrealistic, in order to reach an unrealistic destination with somewhat believable steps.

 

[Old Dog]

It's hard to disagree. But, it all depends on who is blackmailing and what is the subject of blackmail.
This is where the problems begin.

The only blackmail in the game is the Aiden route

 

[Alley_Cat]

It's hard to disagree. But, it all depends on who is blackmailing and what is the subject of blackmail.
This is where the problems begin.

As I've said before, I really don't understand why Sophia would submit to the blackmail of either Aiden or Bennett. Sophia has done nothing wrong in both cases. With Aiden, Dylan even asks Sophia to be able to handle it himself, which would be his right, and when he realises he's over his head, then ask Sophia for help. That's the first time she should step in. He'll never learn to take care of himself if he's not allowed to try and fail first.

 

[Adolfo]

View attachment 1159151 View attachment 1159153

I still think it's possible to put these three things into that bag! And I don't think that a woman would leave her bag in the car in such situation! In the motorcycle dress is no place neither for her wallet nor her "women stuff"! Plus, in such situation even a woman wouldn't think about if this is the proper way to pack away her clothes. It's like your child is in danger and the mother throws her expensive Gucci bag away to help her kid. And you would say "no, a woman would never throw her expensive Gucci bag on a dirty ground"!

Sophia is the german version of Marie Kondo

View attachment 1159151 View attachment 1159153

I still think it's possible to put these three things into that bag! And I don't think that a woman would leave her bag in the car in such situation! In the motorcycle dress is no place neither for her wallet nor her "women stuff"! Plus, in such situation even a woman wouldn't think about if this is the proper way to pack away her clothes. It's like your child is in danger and the mother throws her expensive Gucci bag away to help her kid. And you would say "no, a woman would never throw her expensive Gucci bag on a dirty ground"!

Sophia is the german version of Marie Kondo

 

[hzjujk]

Those things do happen in reality, you can find stories (real ones) of women leaving their husbands, boyfriends etc to the arms of another woman. Same thing can happen with guys.

You must be registered to see the links

Imho, the realizm aspect has blown out of proportion. How can it be realistic and include incest? I'm pretty sure incest is a real thing that still happens in real world, but the chances a woman like Sophia who is well educated, and sits well in the upper class of society to engage in incest is absolutely 0. That said, imo, realizm is relative. In comparison to any other incest centered game - this one is more realistic. Same with female corruption games. How can one expect this game to reach a final unrealistic destination with realistic steps?

What I guess L&P is doing - he's trying to move in small steps, some of them are truly realistic and some of them lack realizm but almost all of them are not truly unrealistic, in order to reach an unrealistic destination with somewhat believable steps.

I would disagree!
Incest = perversion = desire > Intelligence ! In reality, education does not depend in any way on education and social class.

 

[demptd]

I would disagree!
Incest = perversion = desire > Intelligence ! In reality, education does not depend in any way on education and social class.
[/QUOTE]
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