Abandonment Issues

[Winterfire]

Not necessarily, my first game had a lot of branching.
You have to know how much you can handle, plan ahead, which is easier if you write a game design document before starting anything.

 

[BeCe]

But how do you know how much you can handle without actually doing it first? I feel like being "stuck" with a huge project that you underestimated is largely a reason why some would quit. A 1-2 hour VN however, you could polish that off without much stress and get an appreciation for what it takes to make a larger project. You could even leave the end open for work on it later if you wish.

 

[Winterfire]

People do not know because they do not have a game design document, you can't rely on your imagination alone.
If you put the game into text, an organized text, you will quickly see if the idea is doable and in how much time.

 

[jamdan]

I would advice devs to plan out their game in advance and have a defined work schedule with realistic expectations. Should have the story written out before you make the renders and any of the actual coding stuff. make a script on paper or a Word document or something "Bob: Hello there Lilly ; Lilly: Hello there Bob" with the setting, transitions and that kind of stuff.
Then you can make the renders and code. Its like making a movie, whats going to happen is already known before the actors start acting.

Would also say not to have any "I have to get the update done by...." stuff, you'll get stressed out and rushed and the end product will suffer. Doesn't matter if you update every 2 months, 1 month or 2 weeks or semi-random update schedule. You're doing this as a hobby, dont get stressed over a hobby. Your fans will support you if the product is good even if the wait is long.

 

[Sumodeine]

The only abandonment issue I face is that I wanna drop my current game and start with the next project. I've learned so much since I started this and I feel like I could build a better and more popular game from the ground up, the only thing stopping me is my commitment to finishing the story and the loyalty I owe my patrons. But then, this is something I want to do, I mean, not gunna lie I saw the money some devs were making and I wanted a slice of that pie but I am in this because I like writing, creating and sharing. If that's not why you are doing this then I can see why some will just throw in the towel if they aren't making the big bucks after a couple of months.

Are you me? I feel this so much.
When I look back at my early game now, I cringe at what I thought was good enough to release. It would take too much to go back and redo everything, so now players can see my slow progression as a game developer as they play through my game, assuming they give the beginning a chance.
The funny thing is, I'm sure that comic is accurate and we'll feel the same way as we approach the end of the next project. That's just life, I guess.

 

[periergeia]

The only abandonment issue I face is that I wanna drop my current game and start with the next project. I've learned so much since I started this and I feel like I could build a better and more popular game from the ground up, the only thing stopping me is my commitment to finishing the story and the loyalty I owe my patrons. But then, this is something I want to do, I mean, not gunna lie I saw the money some devs were making and I wanted a slice of that pie but I am in this because I like writing, creating and sharing. If that's not why you are doing this then I can see why some will just throw in the towel if they aren't making the big bucks after a couple of months.

That's the "been serious", "honoring the pledges" and "being responsible"that i mentioned in my various posts. Since you bring it up you know that after a public stance of that nature with your creation means that you need support for the "current" or "future" creations and you appealing for it. Therefore any less than completion it does follow you in future projects while "delivery" gives credibility not only to you (your work and your fans that speak about your games too).
Your conscience seams that knows it buddy ..

Keep up the good work and be safe.

 

[polywog]

Abandoning a project = failure. A friend of mine likes to say "Learn from your mistakes, or they become regrets"
If you plan your project, you can foresee some problems and adjust you plan.

You can copy an existing plan, and make a game like everyone else, and you might get by with that, but you won't make something great by playing it safe, and going with the flow. Being different sets you apart, attracts attention, and making a name for yourself is what it's all about.

There are many artists in history who where unknow while they were alive, their work wasn't discovered until after they died, and now it's worth millions. Getting your brand recognized, getting your name out there while you're alive, is a better goal, don't you think. Many famous authors sold their first books for peanuts, and they have become classics.

If you're a singer, and you get stage fright, there are ways of dealing with it so you can get the job done. If people give you a shot, and you get out on stage, and choke, they aren't likely to give you a second chance, third is out of the question. Same for devs who abandon games. People who were at that concert, aren't going to forget.

In street racing we joked "go paint your car" after beating someone so bad that it was embarrassing. Nobody would ever bet on them again, unless they changed their name. When you abandon a game, all the street cred you've built up is out the window. Sure you can change your name, and make another game, but you go back to square one.


Like others have said, make a small game first, or even a visual novel, or comic book. Gain experience, and exposure. Your fans from one franchise will follow you into another. "oh look, Frank Miller is making a movie"

Make your brand, make your website, open your offshore bank account, and stick with it. Never abandon a project, if you find that you made a mistake fix it, don't abandon it.

Make you goal "to reach 1 million fans" not "to make a buck". Then up your goal to 5 million fans.

 

[hamlet17]

1. original characters (not the Daz base models, for instance) and a customised GUI

Do you think custom character not from DAZ Shop? You can recognize all characters created for Gen 3 and 8? There is a fair number by now...
To create custom character one needs to know Blender or some other 3D software on top of DAZ. Is this really necessary?

 

[RanliLabz]

Do you think custom character not from DAZ Shop? You can recognize all characters created for Gen 3 and 8? There is a fair number by now...
To create custom character one needs to know Blender or some other 3D software on top of DAZ. Is this really necessary?

No... probably should have made that clearer! That level of customisation is so advanced it would be unfair to expect from any but the most experienced devs. But Daz allows us to do a massive amount to characters - with so many shaping morphs and skins you can make a base model unrecognisable without any great coding skills. And that’s before haircuts, body art, etc.

That’s why I avoid any game with an unedited base character with the same haircut from the original bundle (usually Michael 7 with Matthew hair when we’re talking GM3). Just a couple of hours of tweaking the dials could have made that character unique - a day spent on it (inc a bit of geometry editing and skin blending) could make something extraordinary!

 

[polywog]

Do you think custom character not from DAZ Shop? You can recognize all characters created for Gen 3 and 8? There is a fair number by now...
To create custom character one needs to know Blender or some other 3D software on top of DAZ. Is this really necessary?

 

[anne O'nymous]

But how do you know how much you can handle without actually doing it first?

It's the problem, and one that can't be solved by just planning the game. Planning tell you how many alternative you'll have for a situation, and how many parallel situations you'll have at a given point. But it don't tell you the amount of works you'll need unless you already had to face this situation.
That's why authors should always start by a small and basic project. Not just to help them handle the creation process, learn how to use the engine and things like that, but also to discover their how limitations. By doing this, you'll know how much image you use for an average scene, how many time you need to create them, how many time you need to effectively write the scene... and how much works you can do each day/week before really needing to make a break.
Then, once you know this, planning the game become more than a coding guide. You'll also know how many works you'll have to do at "this stage" of your game and how many time you'll need to do it.

With this, you can do a thing that the majority of the authors seem to never do : Separate the release process and the development process.
Mostly, dev works on their game until the release date, and they publish what they've done. But it's not how it should be done.
Unless it's a pure visual novel, the more you advance in your game, the more works you have to do. When the game start, there's almost no difference between the different routes, and nothing that need to effectively have a variation for this or that scene. But the more the game advance, the more each route become independent. To the you need to add the small variations for each scene, because this or that happened (or not) before. Where you had a single scene at the start of the game, you now have 10 scenes to do, and so need 10 more times to finish this step of the game.
When you publish as release the game as it is right now, the more you'll advance, the less content the player will see. Because the player don't care that there's 500 new images, what matter is that there's only 50 images in his own play. Therefore, to satisfy the players, you'll works your ass out to give them more images and you'll reach the burnout limit.
It's not how it should be done.

When you plan your game, you should also plan your release. Release 1 stop here, release 2 stop there, and so on. And you define this limits not based on the time you need, but based on the amount of content for a route. See your game as a stairway. Each scene (or whatever you prefer as reference unit) is a step, and each release must have x steps.
At first, you'll need two weeks to reach the release point. With a "one release/month" policy, it let you two free weeks. But don't stop. Pack your game, label it "release 1", put it somewhere, and continue working on it.
Two weeks later, it's time to publish your release 1, while on the devel side, you just finished the release 2. One month later, it's time to publish the release 2, and on the devel side you just finished the release 4.
At first, you'll be amazed by the advance you have. In 2 months of works, you've take 2 month of advance. But will come a moment where this advance will decrease, because two weeks will not be enough anymore to reach a release point. And slowly the devel process and the release process will start to synchronize. But you'll always have all the time you effectively need to give a "decent" amount of content to the players, even when you'll need four more time to generate this content. Simply because the advance you took at first is here to compensate the fact that you'll need more and more time with each release.
When you'll be near to the end of your game, you'll no more have advance, but like you planed it, you'll also not have more than one month of works to reach the next release point... The players will always be happy, you'll always be happy and you'll never be under too much pressure... What asking more ?

 

[RanliLabz]

It's the problem, and one that can't be solved by just planning the game. Planning tell you how many alternative you'll have for a situation, and how many parallel situations you'll have at a given point. But it don't tell you the amount of works you'll need unless you already had to face this situation.
That's why authors should always start by a small and basic project. Not just to help them handle the creation process, learn how to use the engine and things like that, but also to discover their how limitations. By doing this, you'll know how much image you use for an average scene, how many time you need to create them, how many time you need to effectively write the scene... and how much works you can do each day/week before really needing to make a break.
Then, once you know this, planning the game become more than a coding guide. You'll also know how many works you'll have to do at "this stage" of your game and how many time you'll need to do it.

With this, you can do a thing that the majority of the authors seem to never do : Separate the release process and the development process.
Mostly, dev works on their game until the release date, and they publish what they've done. But it's not how it should be done.
Unless it's a pure visual novel, the more you advance in your game, the more works you have to do. When the game start, there's almost no difference between the different routes, and nothing that need to effectively have a variation for this or that scene. But the more the game advance, the more each route become independent. To the you need to add the small variations for each scene, because this or that happened (or not) before. Where you had a single scene at the start of the game, you now have 10 scenes to do, and so need 10 more times to finish this step of the game.
When you publish as release the game as it is right now, the more you'll advance, the less content the player will see. Because the player don't care that there's 500 new images, what matter is that there's only 50 images in his own play. Therefore, to satisfy the players, you'll works your ass out to give them more images and you'll reach the burnout limit.
It's not how it should be done.

When you plan your game, you should also plan your release. Release 1 stop here, release 2 stop there, and so on. And you define this limits not based on the time you need, but based on the amount of content for a route. See your game as a stairway. Each scene (or whatever you prefer as reference unit) is a step, and each release must have x steps.
At first, you'll need two weeks to reach the release point. With a "one release/month" policy, it let you two free weeks. But don't stop. Pack your game, label it "release 1", put it somewhere, and continue working on it.
Two weeks later, it's time to publish your release 1, while on the devel side, you just finished the release 2. One month later, it's time to publish the release 2, and on the devel side you just finished the release 4.
At first, you'll be amazed by the advance you have. In 2 months of works, you've take 2 month of advance. But will come a moment where this advance will decrease, because two weeks will not be enough anymore to reach a release point. And slowly the devel process and the release process will start to synchronize. But you'll always have all the time you effectively need to give a "decent" amount of content to the players, even when you'll need four more time to generate this content. Simply because the advance you took at first is here to compensate the fact that you'll need more and more time with each release.
When you'll be near to the end of your game, you'll no more have advance, but like you planed it, you'll also not have more than one month of works to reach the next release point... The players will always be happy, you'll always be happy and you'll never be under too much pressure... What asking more ?

Absolutely right to start out small and basic - I did two test projects before I released anything and they taught me a lot about the potential pitfalls. If I'd released either of those tests, I almost certainly would have had to abandon them due to inexperience-based structural problems - letting down any players and trashing any reputation. It's a shame because of all the work that went into them - but I thank God I didn't rush to release and kept them under my hat!

With larger projects, it's worth remembering that not every route necessarily has to be kept in tandem (although you have to make it as clear as you can to avoid players downloading content that doesn't offer much for them). For instance, my January release was the 'straight' version of my game, and my February release was a Bolt-on to that containing the LGBT alternative paths. Aside from a couple of grumbles, both were very well received (proving that players are generally pretty fair-minded as far as these things go - especially when they know that it's to give other players the content they're hoping for).

PS I can't say that I've ever been fortunate enough to find myself with 2 weeks in hand!

 

[anne O'nymous]

It's a shame because of all the work that went into them [...]

Not sure that it should be seen as a shame. It taught you a lot, including the most important thing an author must have, self-satisfaction. I'm sure that you're proud of those two small games. They probably are far to what you do now, but you know from where you started and they are you first babies.
Self-satisfaction is something important when you publicly release what you do. Sometimes it's what help you continue despite the two/three bad comments you just received. Whatever few others can think, you know that you did as right as you can. It can seem nothing, but the few seconds you'll pass remembering this are generally enough, not to forgot the bad comments, but to remember that there's also a lot of good ones.
Mostly, players don't understand why an author have quit for just a single comment, but it's because they didn't lived it. It's so easy to forget all the praise you've had, but a bad comment can haunt you for months. You need to have something to fight them, and self-satisfaction is the most powerful weapon for this.

With larger projects, it's worth remembering that not every route necessarily has to be kept in tandem (although you have to make it as clear as you can to avoid players downloading content that doesn't offer much for them). For instance, my January release was the 'straight' version of my game, and my February release was a Bolt-on to that containing the LGBT alternative paths.

Done like this, [summarized]pair releases a route, odd releases the other[/], it works. But once again mostly authors tend to do it in a more random way. Or they say that the other(s) route(s) will be added once this one is finished. But the game need to be really good for this to works ; it's adult games, even when we love to have stories, we mostly play them as pure entertainment and will not replay it just to see the other route ; or we are only interested by this other route and we will wait for it to be implemented before effectively playing the game.

Aside from a couple of grumbles, both were very well received (proving that players are generally pretty fair-minded as far as these things go - especially when they know that it's to give other players the content they're hoping for).

Players can be fast to complain, but they aren't stupid ; too bad that some authors forget it. It's hard to wait, but it's harder to see rushed content or almost nothing interesting for us. So obviously we'll wait and we are glad that the author took the time to warn us.

 

[redle]

Hypothesizing on the "why" is a moot point. There are many answers and they all have some basis of truth. The real point is, this is nothing new at all. It has existed as long as people have existed in the world. How many people do you think have started writing a diary/journal, a book, a novel and yet never finished/quit? How many times has a person decided that they will grow their own vegetable or flower garden, maintained it for a season or 3 only to never touch it again? Some start their own business but eventually return to a more typical job as an employee of someone else. Some start a plumbing project, building a deck, installing a pool... only to eventually hire a professional to finish the job. People buy a membership to the gym with the promise of getting fit only to go twice before returning to their old ways.

There are thousands upon thousands of examples of people starting something and not finishing it. This is nothing even slightly new. Computer games are no different. People have been starting and abandoning ideas often enough in years past. The "newness" is that it has become much easier and in-fashion to request money for early stage projects and that it has become easier and in-fashion to share early stage projects. This means people are exposed to a higher percentage of the projects that are started (less and less are projects started silently and vanish without ever being seen if abandoned). Once upon a time people only heard about a project if it had a massive budget or was already pretty much complete. Now we hear about a game before it is even a full idea:

(Hey everyone, I'm going to make a game. Okay, it is going to have a main character. They are going to, uh... hmmm... I don't know; I'll figure out what they will do later. But they will be in a city. Yeah, that's good. So there is person in a city and there will be other people too. What do you think? I think this is a real great idea! Please donate money so I can make this game. Everyone will love it!)

Yes, the fact that people can see money changing hands early and often increases the total count of how many people are starting projects. But that's about it. Well, the anonymity of the internet does not hurt either. Close down/never log in to a single email account after abandoning a project and one erases all complaints from existence. But really, projects get abandoned all the time. There is nothing new about it.

 

[8873672413434]

Hypothesizing on the "why" is a moot point. There are many answers and they all have some basis of truth. The real point is, this is nothing new at all. It has existed as long as people have existed in the world. How many people do you think have started writing a diary/journal, a book, a novel and yet never finished/quit? How many times has a person decided that they will grow their own vegetable or flower garden, maintained it for a season or 3 only to never touch it again? Some start their own business but eventually return to a more typical job as an employee of someone else. Some start a plumbing project, building a deck, installing a pool... only to eventually hire a professional to finish the job. People buy a membership to the gym with the promise of getting fit only to go twice before returning to their old ways.

There are thousands upon thousands of examples of people starting something and not finishing it. This is nothing even slightly new. Computer games are no different. People have been starting and abandoning ideas often enough in years past. The "newness" is that it has become much easier and in-fashion to request money for early stage projects and that it has become easier and in-fashion to share early stage projects. This means people are exposed to a higher percentage of the projects that are started (less and less are projects started silently and vanish without ever being seen if abandoned). Once upon a time people only heard about a project if it had a massive budget or was already pretty much complete. Now we hear about a game before it is even a full idea:

(Hey everyone, I'm going to make a game. Okay, it is going to have a main character. They are going to, uh... hmmm... I don't know; I'll figure out what they will do later. But they will be in a city. Yeah, that's good. So there is person in a city and there will be other people too. What do you think? I think this is a real great idea! Please donate money so I can make this game. Everyone will love it!)

Yes, the fact that people can see money changing hands early and often increases the total count of how many people are starting projects. But that's about it. Well, the anonymity of the internet does not hurt either. Close down/never log in to a single email account after abandoning a project and one erases all complaints from existence. But really, projects get abandoned all the time. There is nothing new about it.

Couldn't of said it better myself.