VN Bonds of Trust - A game idea with the focus on a Dom/Sub-relationship

[GhostPhil]

So true - if just more people would understand it like you do!

Well it took me some time as well

Nailed it.
Whatever engine is going to be chosen for this game - it will require simple definitions that can be translated into code.

Which is why i gave the pseudocode example further down. Pseudocode is basically just a simplification of all you wrote earlier and cooked down to the actual necessary facts (attributes or fetishes). As it is supposed to be coded one day you will need some definition of limits - yes. An engine cant decide for you. You have to define each and every fetish and the conditions necessary to obtain/fulfil them. From what you wrote you want the player to decide - but you still have to define the playing field and the rules that apply. So limitations are actually good and necessary. One cant use the hardest spanking tool wqhen they are just starting out with spanking, spanking probably comes earlier than other fettishes etc etc. Everything is bound to have some kind of condition to be fulfilled before one can make the choice. Or the choice itself gets limited in duration or how heavy the actual performance can be. All this needs some rough translation into simple attributes and simple conditions - best written into pseudocode which is not tied to any particular engine. But pseudocode is easily understandable for a coder - and its those you lack right now to help you. These definitions make up the 'framework' of your story because they will lead to actual code and functions to perform whatever has to be executed in real code later.

Well it would be possible to bring hardcore stuff in early, but that would or should end into a "Game over" and I hate game over. And as I want to focus on consent, I obviously need to restrict the early game fetishes. Especially when I want one of the characters to be totally unexperienced.

At the moment I am experimenting a bit around with pseudocode and a flowchart. As I am a visual guy I need some kind of sumery/ schema.

You have to set the rules. Let me use a sport example to make clear why: In football (or soccer for our american friends here) you have a playing field and a given set of rules. But the players decide how to shoot and play the ball - there is no outside control about that. Your game has to work the same way. You deliver the contents of the playing field (fetishes and the connected rules and limitations/conditions for each of them but the players can choose how and if they want to use any or all of the available stuff.

Yeah something like: First BDSM-Play-Session - X specific fetishes are unlocked to use. Player can decide out of Y different fetishes with which to start. Session 1 has for example two scenes. Then I could make some kind of fetish categories. Like "Spanking"- category, which starts of with the hand. After using the hand an amount of times, you unlock the next level in this category, for example the paddle.
That would be an example, but as I don't like grinding games, I want to make the scenes different even by using always the hand. So yeah that's something I have to think about.

No you wouldnt. If you dont limit the choices or create rules you will end up in total chaos and thus your game becomes unplayable. Imagine a new player being able to basically torture the shit out of your new submissive right from the start - sounds wrong, correct? You could have it end in a game over of course - which would just lead to the player feeling miserable and cheated because you gave him the freedom to begin with. Users always ask for freedom but that is seldom 'total freedom'. Often they actually mean 'variety' and 'choices' when they talk about freedom. We as humans tend to require rule sets. We like to bend those rules or try to avoid them at times but we are naturally trying to find an order in something. Games without rules usually dont work and rules always mean limitation in some way.

I guess I kind of summarized it above :coldsweat:

It is and should be used more often. It is a great tool of communication between the hardcore geeks and writers or non-coders.

Yeah somehow there has to be an interface between them :biggrin:

 

[toolkitxx]

Regarding your multiple scenes per same action in a fetish:

That's why i stressed that you need a framework to begin with. Once you have sorted the simple fetishes and their conditions it's a piece of cake for a coder to add an extra setting/counter behind each of them to enable your multiple scene thing.

P.S.: To explain in layman's terms: The framework is static stuff - never changes. Its your base of everything. The multiple scene thing can be a randomized part out of a given set of scenes - but those need some kind of field/attribute that connects them to a given fetish to begin with.

 

[GhostPhil]

Regarding your multiple scenes per same action in a fetish:

That's why i stressed that you need a framework to begin with. Once you have sorted the simple fetishes and their conditions it's a piece of cake for a coder to add an extra setting/counter behind each of them to enable your multiple scene thing.

P.S.: To explain in layman's terms: The framework is static stuff - never changes. Its your base of everything. The multiple scene thing can be a randomized part out of a given set of scenes - but those need some kind of field/attribute that connects them to a given fetish to begin with.

I guess this is going to be the most difficult part for me. I don't really have the mindset for coding. So yeah this could take me the longest time at some point, although the whole rendering stuff isn't as easy as someone might think it is :coldsweat:


What I was actually thinking about, is to start of with some kind of short-visual novel/ mini-game.
Specifically to go the same direction by just making one single BDSM-playing-session.
That way I don't have to think into the future too much and don't need that many atributes.

 

[toolkitxx]

Things are probably simpler than you see them right now. You wrote a very detailed list of fetishes you wanted in the game - but most of them classify as an element of a group. So condensed you are looking at maybe 10 different major groups with a lot of sub-festish below them.

KISS (keep it stupid simple) also applies to any game development. Take just a handful of major groups like bondage, humiliation, exhibition, pain. Sort them by how you want them to be available and give them some artificial condition - nothing too strict or complicated. Simple stuff. That makes your framework you will build on to figure out if and how a mechnic works with those few. Adding is just painful work after that - the biggest problem is usually to get a mechanic to work at all. Once the simple version works its just about adding all the detailed ones into the same concept.

 

[GhostPhil]

Things are probably simpler than you see them right now. You wrote a very detailed list of fetishes you wanted in the game - but most of them classify as an element of a group. So condensed you are looking at maybe 10 different major groups with a lot of sub-festish below them.

Yeah I am always making things too difficult :coldsweat: Putting them in groups seems like the best way to organize them.

KISS (keep it stupid simple) also applies to any game development. Take just a handful of major groups like bondage, humiliation, exhibition, pain. Sort them by how you want them to be available and give them some artificial condition - nothing too strict or complicated. Simple stuff. That makes your framework you will build on to figure out if and how a mechnic works with those few. Adding is just painful work after that - the biggest problem is usually to get a mechanic to work at all. Once the simple version works its just about adding all the detailed ones into the same concept.

What do you mean with "artificial condition"? It doesn't make that much sense when I translate it...:coldsweat:
A working skeletal structure sounds like wise beginning

 

[toolkitxx]

Artificial in the sense that its logical but isnt necessarily your end condition. Since the list would expand - so would those conditions.

 

[GhostPhil]

Artificial in the sense that its logical but isnt necessarily your end condition. Since the list would expand - so would those conditions.

Ok that makes sense. Thanks for explaining it

 

[TheDevian]

Sorry it took me so long, I opened this page, and then got distracted and forgot about it...

Notes
One thing to keep in mind is that the best doms are the best subs, so having some occasional role swapping is not out of the question.It is good to be able to know what it is like on both ends.

One option is to have your bar/club run by a brother/sister pair of doms, who each train other people, they don't have to train each other. That way you still get your dynamic, and the down side of that is that you need at least 2 more models and people would want them to get together at some point.

Branding, tattoo, even a collar with a nametag works, it doesn't matter what it is exactly, the point is to show 'ownership'/'dominance', not necessarily 'damage the goods'.

I am a big fan on multiple paths, I like to be able to control the way the story flow, and I don't like being punished for playing the path I choose.

Personally I am not a big fan of playing a female character in a sex game, though a big part of that is due to the plots usually revolve around them getting raped or abused, being a dom does help in that regard, but I would only want to do yuri scenes if I were playing a female character. Even as a woman, I am not chasing after guys... XD

 

[GhostPhil]

Sorry it took me so long, I opened this page, and then got distracted and forgot about it...

No problem at all

Notes
One thing to keep in mind is that the best doms are the best subs, so having some occasional role swapping is not out of the question.It is good to be able to know what it is like on both ends.

Well I kind of was thinking about a more mature Dominatrix (maybe a friend of the dominant protagonist), who was some kind of teacher for him/her.

One option is to have your bar/club run by a brother/sister pair of doms, who each train other people, they don't have to train each other. That way you still get your dynamic, and the down side of that is that you need at least 2 more models and people would want them to get together at some point.

Do you mean that they trained the dominant protagonist to be a Dom? Well as I wanted to make more character nonetheless, I guess it would be ok.

Branding, tattoo, even a collar with a nametag works, it doesn't matter what it is exactly, the point is to show 'ownership'/'dominance', not necessarily 'damage the goods'.

I am totally up for the collar. I mean something permanent is nice, but I am not the biggest fan of "single" tattoos. Well some kind of piercings could be nice as well. And of course no permanent "damage"!

I am a big fan on multiple paths, I like to be able to control the way the story flow, and I don't like being punished for playing the path I choose.

I totally agree with this and I also hate Game Overs!

Personally I am not a big fan of playing a female character in a sex game, though a big part of that is due to the plots usually revolve around them getting raped or abused, being a dom does help in that regard, but I would only want to do yuri scenes if I were playing a female character. Even as a woman, I am not chasing after guys... XD

Well it would be perfect to choose what sex the two characters have, but that might be to much work, so maybe I have to stick with a male and a female. Because if I provide a lesbian option then I have to provide a gay option as well and that would be too much work. :coldsweat:

 

[TheDevian]

Well I kind of was thinking about a more mature Dominatrix (maybe a friend of the dominant protagonist), who was some kind of teacher for him/her.

I see, then if you want a male who is younger then, you could go aunt, or mother's friend, who runs the club, and who has taken a shine to the kid, maybe training him as her apprentice.

Do you mean that they trained the dominant protagonist to be a Dom? Well as I wanted to make more character nonetheless, I guess it would be ok.

I just mean that the best doms, have been subs at some time. If we are talking about the Male Protagonist, and you are using the protege option, then he was her sub, and now he is starting to train as her assistant, and you are giving him his first sub, or maybe that was just his origin, and he has now trained many at the start of the game. Say he is mid 20, she could be 30's, maybe even early 40's.

I am totally up for the collar. I mean something permanent is nice, but I am not the biggest fan of "single" tattoos. Well some kind of piercings could be nice as well. And of course no permanent "damage"!

Yes, a piercing isn't too bad, and many subs have those, but especially if you go with the labia or worse, that can be pretty hardcore too, but the nipples aren't bad, I kind of go back and forth on that, depends on the mood I am in that day.. XD

I totally agree with this and I also hate Game Overs!

No doubt, bad ends suck. That one in My Cute Roommate/Cousin really annoyed me, kicking me out for spanking it in the only way it let me... I wanted to do it in the shower like a normal game, but NOoo...! :winkytongue: Why give me the option then?

Well it would be perfect to choose what sex the two characters have, but that might be to much work, so maybe I have to stick with a male and a female. Because if I provide a lesbian option then I have to provide a gay option as well and that would be too much work. :coldsweat:

No doubt, I am planning one in which I have about 4 routes for each character, and on top of that, the protagonist is a genderbender, so I will need 2 versions of every scene for that too. That is one up side of using the sprite rigging system, I like the way Oni did it in Rogue-Like, but it is also way too much work, that said, getting Rogue turned on so much that you can get her into an infinite loop by spanking her ass, is pretty fun! XD
But as I was saying, due to the MC being able to turn into a female (might work a futa option too later if it goes over well enough), I will need a lot of options at some point, so I am sticking to certain fetishes for each potential love interest. (males and females, since I assume some people will like that, based on the fan art I see).

What I would suggest is to take it slowly, just work on one scene at a time, just add things as you can, and slowly build it up to your dream, one step at a time. If you keep plugging away at it, you will get there, especially if you can get something like Daz to work for you, and if you are only doing stills. Working up to animations will take longer, but for stills, once you get the models created, then it is just posing them and rendering them, not that bad, relatively speaking. That is one reason these CGI games can pump out updates so fast compared to our 2D counterparts. Of course that is assuming you are comfortable with the game engine you are using.

 

[TheDevian]

The problem is, that almost any way you go, odds are people are going to want scenes with the Female Protagonist, especially with that MILF fetish out there. If you are going with the protege option, then that could at least be in the background, as part of your intro, showing him as her sub, then as he starts to train others... that is one nice thing about having him training his first girl, you can have her saying something to the effect of 'now you need to give her your love', and him wanting to crawl back, like a baby bird leaving the nest. XD

The nice thing about this intro, is that you can more or less use the same pictures for both the male and female intro, just change the dialogue and perspective for it a bit.

 

[GhostPhil]

I see, then if you want a male who is younger then, you could go aunt, or mother's friend, who runs the club, and who has taken a shine to the kid, maybe training him as her apprentice.

I am actually not sure, if I want to put in any incest at all. I kind of feel that it isn't necessary I am just up for a more mature woman, that the dominant protagonist met in in the past.

I just mean that the best doms, have been subs at some time. If we are talking about the Male Protagonist, and you are using the protege option, then he was her sub, and now he is starting to train as her assistant, and you are giving him his first sub, or maybe that was just his origin, and he has now trained many at the start of the game. Say he is mid 20, she could be 30's, maybe even early 40's.

It could be an idea to make it a bit like a trainer game, but I kind of want to make it more into a relationship that contains some love as well Let's say I am not sure about it xD

Yes, a piercing isn't too bad, and many subs have those, but especially if you go with the labia or worse, that can be pretty hardcore too, but the nipples aren't bad, I kind of go back and forth on that, depends on the mood I am in that day.. XD

I love piercings, especially on the more sexual zones of the body :biggrin: I want to include it that the sub gets these as some kind of rewards for being good to the master and to show that he/she is his/hers.

No doubt, bad ends suck. That one in My Cute Roommate/Cousin really annoyed me, kicking me out for spanking it in the only way it let me... I wanted to do it in the shower like a normal game, but NOoo...! :winkytongue: Why give me the option then?

I mean seariously, why implimenting something so I have to reload at some point? I hate it! I mean if you include that you can rape someone, then have the balls to go with the consequences or just leave it be :coldsweat:

No doubt, I am planning one in which I have about 4 routes for each character, and on top of that, the protagonist is a genderbender, so I will need 2 versions of every scene for that too. That is one up side of using the sprite rigging system, I like the way Oni did it in Rogue-Like, but it is also way too much work, that said, getting Rogue turned on so much that you can get her into an infinite loop by spanking her ass, is pretty fun! XD
But as I was saying, due to the MC being able to turn into a female (might work a futa option too later if it goes over well enough), I will need a lot of options at some point, so I am sticking to certain fetishes for each potential love interest. (males and females, since I assume some people will like that, based on the fan art I see).

A genderbender sounds really interessting as a character. And well doing some routes is kind of a must, when you want to make a game with choices, so we have to deal with the work it makes
I am not too familiar with the sprite rigging system, but I am not quite familiar with 2D games at all :coldsweat:
Well it is always good to start with a limited amount of fetishes, I think adding more later is always an option

What I would suggest is to take it slowly, just work on one scene at a time, just add things as you can, and slowly build it up to your dream, one step at a time. If you keep plugging away at it, you will get there, especially if you can get something like Daz to work for you, and if you are only doing stills. Working up to animations will take longer, but for stills, once you get the models created, then it is just posing them and rendering them, not that bad, relatively speaking. That is one reason these CGI games can pump out updates so fast compared to our 2D counterparts. Of course that is assuming you are comfortable with the game engine you are using.

Yeah it would never work, if I try to work on more things at the same time xD And stills are good for me. Better do some nice stills before doing some bad looking animations
Well as I love 3DCG games, I think DAZ Studio is the best option for me and Ren'py would be the best as an engine I think.

The problem is, that almost any way you go, odds are people are going to want scenes with the Female Protagonist, especially with that MILF fetish out there. If you are going with the protege option, then that could at least be in the background, as part of your intro, showing him as her sub, then as he starts to train others... that is one nice thing about having him training his first girl, you can have her saying something to the effect of 'now you need to give her your love', and him wanting to crawl back, like a baby bird leaving the nest. XD

The nice thing about this intro, is that you can more or less use the same pictures for both the male and female intro, just change the dialogue and perspective for it a bit.

Well I am always open for suggestions with scenes, but I have my limits on what I want to do. And I might considers scenes like a sharing event with the mature teacher, but nothing permanent. Just something like a single BDSM session.
I definitely consider the option of both the MP and FP being unexperienced

 

[TheDevian]

I am actually not sure, if I want to put in any incest at all. I kind of feel that it isn't necessary I am just up for a more mature woman, that the dominant protagonist met in in the past.

No, not needed, there are plenty of ways to get a milf in there without her being related, I only mentioned it because others were talking about it at the beginning.
The other option is to make it optional, by asking their relation, but it changes the dynamic so much that it's easier to write if you just pick something and stick to it.

It could be an idea to make it a bit like a trainer game, but I kind of want to make it more into a relationship that contains some love as well Let's say I am not sure about it XD

I am debating that right now myself, I actually like the idea of stats, but I can see the appeal of simply ticking off flags too.

I love piercings, especially on the more sexual zones of the body :biggrin: I want to include it that the sub gets these as some kind of rewards for being good to the master and to show that he/she is his/hers.

Exactly, it can work like a brand or a tattoo, much like a collar.

I mean seariously, why implimenting something so I have to reload at some point? I hate it! I mean if you include that you can rape someone, then have the balls to go with the consequences or just leave it be :coldsweat:

Not doubt, I can see it setting you on a darker path, but that should be an option! XD

A genderbender sounds really interessting as a character. And well doing some routes is kind of a must, when you want to make a game with choices, so we have to deal with the work it makes
I am not too familiar with the sprite rigging system, but I am not quite familiar with 2D games at all :coldsweat:
Well it is always good to start with a limited amount of fetishes, I think adding more later is always an option

One of the Anime I have loved for a long time was Ranma, and am kind of into the fanfiction, wrote a bit of it myself, so it seemed like a good place to start. XD That said, while I have no interest in it, since he can change genders, and there are both genders chasing after him, I want to give everyone the options they might want, if those options get enough support. But it depends on what people want and what my artists will go for when we get there. It can be both a 'bad end' type thing (without ending anything), be totally optional, and gives people with certain fetishes a thing to do. This gives potential options for M/F, F/F, F/M, or M/M (if anyone wants that), including a trap and a number of crossdressers.

Well, for 2D sprites, you can set up a sprite sheet, and layer things on top of each other, so you have a base model, like a paper doll, and then you can layer clothing, hair, expressions, etc. on top and this can keep your file size smaller, and your load times faster, because you are only changing small pieces at a time, rather than the fill screen image.
I plan to do one route at a time, and one character at a time, but first I need a system, where he can go to school, fight, shop, run around town, and so on, then I can start that. The idea being that they each have a 'Like' and a 'Respect' stat, if you raise both, then you get the love route, if you lower both, then you get a hate route, and if you raise respect but lower like, then you get them being submissive, and opposite lets them be dominate. I need to be careful about how they are rewarded. You don't want the player to be able to skip events, so they need to happen in order, so you can have events unlock by having a minimum stat, but also require story events. Kind of like how Man of the House had their stars to show story progress.

Yeah it would never work, if I try to work on more things at the same time XD And stills are good for me. Better do some nice stills before doing some bad looking animations
Well as I love 3DCG games, I think DAZ Studio is the best option for me and Ren'py would be the best as an engine I think.

Yeah, keep it simple, and only progress when you feel comfortable about doing it. Personally, I am not a fan of 3D, but some of them are good, and the animations help, like in Milfy City or Sisterly Lust. Daz is good, but many people don't get their settings right, and end up with grainy renders, covered in noise. I haven't figured it out myself, but from what I have read, it has something to do with the lighting settings, so be careful of that. And as I said in the other thread, happy to help if you need some help rendering, but I am not any good at doing models or posing yet, but then I have spent next to no time on it... I figured I could do like in a Character Creator, like in the SIms or something, but it was a lot more complicated than I thought. getting decent looking nipples is challenging, some barely even try.

Well I am always open for suggestions with scenes, but I have my limits on what I want to do. And I might considers scenes like a sharing event with the mature teacher, but nothing permanent. Just something like a single BDSM session.
I definitely consider the option of both the MP and FP being unexperienced

Brainstorming is one of my hobbies, so if you ever need help making a scene work, or need ideas for something, and I am happy to help come up with ideas, just give me the restrictions you want to work within.

What I had in mind, at least at one point, was to have the two MC's have the option to have occasional scenes on the side, with each other, not with their subs. For example, the character has not trained their sub to the point that they are ready for sex, you could go to your old mistress/student for a bit of fun. That said, the idea of using them to have a 3P has it's appeal. A bit of DP is good for any sub, you could start off training them with toys, and then work up to a strap-on, but make it optional for the people who are not into 3P scenes I guess... :winkytongue:

The idea that the FP is experienced as a dom, and the MP is fresh out of training holds a lot of appeal to me, but I suppose if you want, one option is to have that switch if you play the female, but doing that means you need 4 models for the MCs, but it gives you the option to have 4 combinations. Older FP + Younger MP, Older MP + Younger FP, both old, or both younger. Even if they are both close to the same age one could easily be more experienced. But that might be too much work.

Being dyslexic, I gave up on Ren'Py myself, Unity seemed easier for me, the challenge so far seems like it will be the save system. It's all a matter of what is easiest for you, and if you happen to be familiar with their coding languages already, such as Python, C#, or so on...

P.S. Loving the new Reincarnotica sig, nicely done.

 

[GhostPhil]

Could you please quote only what I wrote, because this is really confusing :coldsweat:

 

[TheDevian]

Could you please quote only what I wrote, because this is really confusing :coldsweat:

Sorry, I got my tags wrong. Think it's fixed now...

 

[GhostPhil]

No, not needed, there are plenty of ways to get a milf in there without her being related, I only mentioned it because others were talking about it at the beginning.
The other option is to make it optional, by asking their relation, but it changes the dynamic so much that it's easier to write if you just pick something and stick to it.

Yeah no problem, bringing in a mature woman shouldn't be a big problem.
I think I can't make too many thing optional, because then the game gets overloaded and it might be too much work to progress further in the story.

I am debating that right now myself, I actually like the idea of stats, but I can see the appeal of simply ticking off flags too.

What do you mean with ticking off flags? Stats are a two sided sword I think. On one hand I don't like them, because you always have to look at them, but on the other hand they are needed to deside how far a character can go in a scene.

Exactly, it can work like a brand or a tattoo, much like a collar.

Yeah, for me a brand is a bit too extreme and a brand or tattoo are a bit too permanent xD But collars and piercings are awsome

Not doubt, I can see it setting you on a darker path, but that should be an option! XD

I mean, if you are in prison after this, of course then it is like a game over, but then just don't impliment such a scene :coldsweat:

One of the Anime I have loved for a long time was Ranma, and am kind of into the fanfiction, wrote a bit of it myself, so it seemed like a good place to start. XD That said, while I have no interest in it, since he can change genders, and there are both genders chasing after him, I want to give everyone the options they might want, if those options get enough support. But it depends on what people want and what my artists will go for when we get there. It can be both a 'bad end' type thing (without ending anything), be totally optional, and gives people with certain fetishes a thing to do. This gives potential options for M/F, F/F, F/M, or M/M (if anyone wants that), including a trap and a number of crossdressers.

I like the idea of a genderbend character and that the story might give the options for all those relationship types. I mean I am not the biggest M/M fan, but giving the possibility in a game for it would definitely awsome. Would do it as well, if it wasn't too much work.
I am definitely planning to to some kind of fetish list to choose from at the beginning of the game.

Well, for 2D sprites, you can set up a sprite sheet, and layer things on top of each other, so you have a base model, like a paper doll, and then you can layer clothing, hair, expressions, etc. on top and this can keep your file size smaller, and your load times faster, because you are only changing small pieces at a time, rather than the fill screen image.
I plan to do one route at a time, and one character at a time, but first I need a system, where he can go to school, fight, shop, run around town, and so on, then I can start that. The idea being that they each have a 'Like' and a 'Respect' stat, if you raise both, then you get the love route, if you lower both, then you get a hate route, and if you raise respect but lower like, then you get them being submissive, and opposite lets them be dominate. I need to be careful about how they are rewarded. You don't want the player to be able to skip events, so they need to happen in order, so you can have events unlock by having a minimum stat, but also require story events. Kind of like how Man of the House had their stars to show story progress.

The biggest problem with stats is that you don't want to create a grindfest. The question is, what will happen if a player tries to mix up the different stats? Are there relationship types in between? I like when there are events that happen at some point of the game and I don't like when you have to search for events like doind X, then Y, then go to Z and then event XX happens.This only works if it doesn't have any time restrictions or there is something like a quest log.

Yeah, keep it simple, and only progress when you feel comfortable about doing it. Personally, I am not a fan of 3D, but some of them are good, and the animations help, like in Milfy City or Sisterly Lust. Daz is good, but many people don't get their settings right, and end up with grainy renders, covered in noise. I haven't figured it out myself, but from what I have read, it has something to do with the lighting settings, so be careful of that. And as I said in the other thread, happy to help if you need some help rendering, but I am not any good at doing models or posing yet, but then I have spent next to no time on it... I figured I could do like in a Character Creator, like in the SIms or something, but it was a lot more complicated than I thought. getting decent looking nipples is challenging, some barely even try.

Well animations is something I won't try early on xD But animations like in Milfy City are what make this game so popular!
And I agree lightning is very important in for the renders.
If I need help for something I will ask you or just in general on this site. People here are very helpful
A character creator would be like the best thing for a game, but in 3DCG games it wouldn't obviously work.
And especially nippels and genitals are one of the most important things in adult games

Brainstorming is one of my hobbies, so if you ever need help making a scene work, or need ideas for something, and I am happy to help come up with ideas, just give me the restrictions you want to work within.
Do you use any tools for your brainstorming?

What I had in mind, at least at one point, was to have the two MC's have the option to have occasional scenes on the side, with each other, not with their subs. For example, the character has not trained their sub to the point that they are ready for sex, you could go to your old mistress/student for a bit of fun. That said, the idea of using them to have a 3P has it's appeal. A bit of DP is good for any sub, you could start off training them with toys, and then work up to a strap-on, but make it optional for the people who are not into 3P scenes I guess... :winkytongue:
Well my problem is I don't like cheating, so it has to be something the other character knows.
With 3P you mean a third protagonist? DP is double penetration? So yeah I could definitely see the teacher of the dom join in at least from time to time.

The idea that the FP is experienced as a dom, and the MP is fresh out of training holds a lot of appeal to me, but I suppose if you want, one option is to have that switch if you play the female, but doing that means you need 4 models for the MCs, but it gives you the option to have 4 combinations. Older FP + Younger MP, Older MP + Younger FP, both old, or both younger. Even if they are both close to the same age one could easily be more experienced. But that might be too much work.
I think I will focus on one gender combination at a time. Starting of with maledom and femsub and shortly after this with femdom and malesub.

Being dyslexic, I gave up on Ren'Py myself, Unity seemed easier for me, the challenge so far seems like it will be the save system. It's all a matter of what is easiest for you, and if you happen to be familiar with their coding languages already, such as Python, C#, or so on...

I have no experience with any engine, but I have the most fun with playing Ren'Py games, so I am tending to use this.

P.S. Loving the new Reincarnotica sig, nicely done

Thanks I am trying to make more at the moment and to improve my Photoshop skills

 

[TheDevian]

What do you mean with ticking off flags? Stats are a two sided sword I think. On one hand I don't like them, because you always have to look at them, but on the other hand they are needed to deside how far a character can go in a scene.

A flag is any event the play can do, that triggers something else, and tic(king) it off means that you have triggered it. For example, you cannot get into the back room until you find the key, so in this case, finding the key is the flag.

Yeah, for me a brand is a bit too extreme and a brand or tattoo are a bit too permanent XD But collars and piercings are awsome

Agreed, a permanent option should only be for slaves. XD

I mean, if you are in prison after this, of course then it is like a game over, but then just don't impliment such a scene :coldsweat:

Also, agreed.

I like the idea of a genderbend character and that the story might give the options for all those relationship types. I mean I am not the biggest M/M fan, but giving the possibility in a game for it would definitely awsome. Would do it as well, if it wasn't too much work.
I am definitely planning to to some kind of fetish list to choose from at the beginning of the game.

Yeah, I don't like the idea of doing the M/M content either, but I like the option being there for the people who do enjoy it. The only down side is my OCD screaming at me to do everything! XD I had to fight it to not do things like the lolis in DMD.

The biggest problem with stats is that you don't want to create a grindfest. The question is, what will happen if a player tries to mix up the different stats? Are there relationship types in between? I like when there are events that happen at some point of the game and I don't like when you have to search for events like doind X, then Y, then go to Z and then event XX happens.This only works if it doesn't have any time restrictions or there is something like a quest log.

My idea is that the stats for the girls (or whatever) will go up as you follow their story, but some things will be based on your own, in that you unlock new fighting or sex skills as your stats go up. His Libido will go up as he sees anything sexy, and once it gets to a certain point, his mom will arrive and she will help him train. There is also the old perverted master to help him in that way as well. But you are exactly right, you don't want it to be a grindfest, but when I created the system, I was playing Rogue Like, and I like the idea of being able 'train' them in certain things, like getting them to enjoy certain things, like public sex acts, in a country where even normal Public Displays of Affection are frowned upon. XD

Well animations is something I won't try early on XD But animations like in Milfy City are what make this game so popular!
And I agree lightning is very important in for the renders.
If I need help for something I will ask you or just in general on this site. People here are very helpful
A character creator would be like the best thing for a game, but in 3DCG games it wouldn't obviously work.
And especially nippels and genitals are one of the most important things in adult games

Originally my goal was something simple like Four Elements Trainer or Rogue Like, but it will depends on what kind of art I can get. For yours, since you are doing the CGI art, you have different limitations. While you can make sprites out of it, it's harder to d the rig-based animation, and they don't look as good as they can in 2D. It's not something us noobies should worry about at first.

I have no experience with any engine, but I have the most fun with playing Ren'Py games, so I am tending to use this.

I messed with them a bit, and had a rough time with Ren'Py myself, but it was far more 'code-based' than I was happy with. XD I could do some editing in it, but trying to set up a main menu had me stumped.

 

[GhostPhil]

A flag is any event the play can do, that triggers something else, and tic(king) it off means that you have triggered it. For example, you cannot get into the back room until you find the key, so in this case, finding the key is the flag.

Ok thanks for explaining it to me. Something like this is always nice as long as there is a reminder for what you are actually searching.

Agreed, a permanent option should only be for slaves. XD

Well a game with "real" slaves could be interessting as well, when it for example plays in an historical setting. But I like my slaves with some will and a mind of their own :biggrin:

Yeah, I don't like the idea of doing the M/M content either, but I like the option being there for the people who do enjoy it. The only down side is my OCD screaming at me to do everything! XD I had to fight it to not do things like the lolis in DMD.

I am actually thinking about making the characters pansexual or at least bisexual. That way some interssting constelations could occur

My idea is that the stats for the girls (or whatever) will go up as you follow their story, but some things will be based on your own, in that you unlock new fighting or sex skills as your stats go up. His Libido will go up as he sees anything sexy, and once it gets to a certain point, his mom will arrive and she will help him train. There is also the old perverted master to help him in that way as well. But you are exactly right, you don't want it to be a grindfest, but when I created the system, I was playing Rogue Like, and I like the idea of being able 'train' them in certain things, like getting them to enjoy certain things, like public sex acts, in a country where even normal Public Displays of Affection are frowned upon. XD

At some point you need any kind of stats, but of course you don't need to display them ingame. I was thinking of doing some kind of affection stats to certein fetish groups. But not sure how far I want to go with stats.

Originally my goal was something simple like Four Elements Trainer or Rogue Like, but it will depends on what kind of art I can get. For yours, since you are doing the CGI art, you have different limitations. While you can make sprites out of it, it's harder to d the rig-based animation, and they don't look as good as they can in 2D. It's not something us noobies should worry about at first.

Yeah I have to say I like some really nice still shoots a lot better than seeing some bad animations

I messed with them a bit, and had a rough time with Ren'Py myself, but it was far more 'code-based' than I was happy with. XD I could do some editing in it, but trying to set up a main menu had me stumped.

I bet I will have quite some problems with everything I will try :coldsweat:

 

[Segnbora]

My recommendation would be to pick one power relationship and stick with it all the way through the game. Male dom/female sub or whichever one you want. I'm not saying don't consider a temporary or exploratory role-reversal somewhere in the story, if that's something you want to do, but rather to avoid unnecessary complexity by trying to allow the player to decide that, halfway through a game in which they've played a dom, they'd really rather be a sub. But as you develop the narrative and the scenes that form that narrative, both textually and visually, keep in the back of your mind that you want to preserve the flexibility to swap out the characters.

When the game's done and out there, go back and recreate it with as many of the other permutations as you feel comfortable rendering: female dom/male sub, same-sex versions thereof, transgender, futa...basically, at that point you can do whatever you want. (By comparison with the rendering time, going through the game script and swapping out names — though if the main characters' names are user-defined you don't even have to do this — pronouns, and body part references would be a piece of cake.) Eventually you'll have complete games to satisfy whichever gender and role preferences your audience has.

I'd also start with a somewhat limited set of kinks/fetishes. As others have suggested, divide them into categories, and then rank them by "degree of difficulty" within that category. Then do one of two things: either select a few from each category that you most want to see included and build the game as an exploration of just what kind of kinks/fetishes the characters are into, or select everything from a single category and build the game as an exploration of just how far the characters want to take a specific kink/fetish. (My personal preference would be for the former approach, but it's not my game.)

Once you've got a reasonably coherent story and progression from "I'd like to try being blindfolded, or handcuffed, or maybe even tickled" to "I am your pain slave and you are my godlike Master; please use the stuffed polar bear on me, Sir" or whatever craziness you want to achieve by the end, you can go back and start adding more scenes with more kinks and fetishes, wherever you think they should fall in the progression. If you maintain a little bit of separation between the BDSM "scenes" and the greater storyline, these should be pretty painless to insert; this is where we have long conversations and stat-build so that you trust me enough to try the nipple clamps, but this is the scary-looking room where we go to actually make that happen rather than discussing whether or not you liked the waffles I made. If you see what I mean.

This is a framework that will allow you have a playable game and then to retroactively add pretty much any kink or fetish you want to add. If you include "climbing the ladder" menu options (you've successfully tried spanking and you had a good time at the zoo, so she's willing to try flogging, but only on her ass; tomorrow, since she enjoyed both that and breakfast, she's okay with you using it on her breasts; the violet wand was amazing, no matter how much she enjoyed the farm tour you are not using the cattle prod on her, but if you're still making her happy by the end of the weekend she's interested in skipping over that and trying out the TENS unit) with each BDSM scene, players can route around anything that squicks them out.

Throw in a sildeshow "ending" in which whatever things the characters actually did is briefly revisted, and I think you could have yourself a hell of a game.

 

[toolkitxx]

@Segnbora +1 for the stuffed polar bear (with current climate changes probably even a realistic thing)