Can a protagonist that engages in incestuous acts ever be truly likeable?

[Conviction07]

This is the conundrum I have. I'm currently in the early stages of a game that ideally will include incest, but I worry that it may be at the expense of a sympathetic, relatable and all in all likeable main character. I ask this because from my experience playing countless incest related games, I don't think I've ever truly rooted for a character after he's say fucked his mother or sister. Do any of you experience this? Or is it something you're truly able to look past?

In other words...


Is she worth becoming despicable for?

 

[N1K17Y]

protagonists in incest (but not exclusively) games have often non existent character. either because the dev doesn't have the skill to write one (other characters are bland as well) or its done on purpose so the player can get into to role of MC.
personally i cant think of any likeable protagonist in an incest game (maybe long live the princess, but just because the fairy is there to comment on his actions which makes it funny) but not because its an incest game. just the MC doesn't have much of a personality, so there isn't much to like about him. but in theory likeable character later having incestous relationship wouldn't make me dislike him because i know its a game, a fantasy.
oh and the girl is absolute babe, but i think because of the hair she reminds me of Melissa (Acting lessons)

 

[Domiek]

Yes it's possible but the reason for it has to be more than "whoa, moms got big tits. Time to drug her coffee and stick a pinky up her bum."

 

[Conviction07]

protagonists in incest (but not exclusively) games have often non existent character. either because the dev doesn't have the skill to write one (other characters are bland as well) or its done on purpose so the player can get into to role of MC.
personally i cant think of any likeable protagonist in an incest game (maybe long live the princess, but just because the fairy is there to comment on his actions which makes it funny) but not because its an incest game. just the MC doesn't have much of a personality, so there isn't much to like about him.
oh and the girl is absolute babe, but i think because of the hair she reminds me of Melissa (Acting lessons)

Thanks... but I have no idea who Melissa is (haven't played acting lessons). To the topic at hand though, I do think incest games gel much better with faceless, blank slate characters where likability is hardly necessary, which is where my concern comes in. Is it just bad writing that's to blame for all these generally hateable protagonists, or is it intrinsic to the genre?

 

[N1K17Y]

Thanks... but I have no idea who Melissa is (haven't played acting lessons). To the topic at hand though, I do think incest games gel much better with faceless, blank slate characters where likability is hardly necessary, which is where my concern comes in. Is it just bad writing that's to blame for all these generally hateable protagonists, or is it intrinsic to the genre?

i mean you said it yourself, how can you like a character if he is faceless and blank ? its done on purpose so any player will be able to identify with the MC and "get in role" even in games where writing is solid, MC can still be bland so its a conscious choice the dev makes. and its not exclusive to incest games. if you want your MC to be interesting its best if the story is told from 3rd person perspective, he has his own name and all and the player is just observer of the events.
personally i dont hate MC's in such games unless they are complete assholes or tries to rape people by drugging them or something (bad brother/bobby saga) i really dont care about the MC, he is just bland and makes whatever choice i force him to make, so why would i hate him ?

 

[Avaron1974]

Considering a lot of them involve spying on people in the shower and raping them in their sleep .... it's safe to say a lot of incest MC's are unlikable cunts.

 

[u z i]

well to be honest most incest games dont really have a solid storyline, according to me atleast. but there are exceptions ofcourse. i don't know about the protag to be likable but two games come to mind which have great storyline and writing which separates them from the other incest games with bland storylines( Haley's story, My sister my roommate). its actually pretty tough i think to make incestuous relationships plausible but it is possible with good writing.

(btw i think she is worth it )

 

[DarthSeduction]

It's absolutely possible. You just have to go through all the drudgery to get there. You have to have the characters acknowledge what makes incest wrong, you have to have them come to terms with their mutual feelings, and you have to make them both consent. Remember, people who play incest games are willing to accept that sometimes feelings are more important than taboos.

I think it's best, with incest, to make the aggressor be the sister/daughter/brother (in the case of female or gay protag). That clears your MC of any implication of pressuring the character into anything they aren't ready for, or haven't considered. It also makes your characters better for it, most npcs are not proactive, their passivity can sometimes make them come off as more bitchy or cold than necessary, and of course, like gold diggers. So, you manage to make your MC look more respectable and have a more engaging plot!

This doesn't work with mom or dad however, because of the perceived coercive nature of their authority. So you have to be really careful here to make things mutual at every level, while also not making either person come off as creepy. To be honest, I haven't been able to think up something where an M/S or F/D relationship works that doesn't do the separated at a young trope. Sisterly Lust, if you ignore the part about her job, actually does a good job of giving us the M/S progression. I actually enjoy that plot more than any other M/S plot I've played. But, as I stated, it has the separated at a young age trope. It's a lot harder to not make mom or dad out to be total creeps if they raised you.

I would suggest you come up with a reason for the incest. Is the game focused on it? If so, how? What causes your MC and the other characters to develop or realize their feelings? As I said in your other thread, a good one you can use is jealousy. A sister or cousin or even mother, can start realizing, after you get a girlfriend, that they miss their time with you, that they want to be the center of your world. Of course, you have to make their relationship a real thing though. You have to convince me that they had a great relationship. Maybe they went to the movies every week, but now that you're dating on that night you haven't gone in a while. Maybe you use the well trodden trope where a character claims they have a lover to their friends when they actually don't and then they beg you, and one thing leads to another. It's all possible, you just have to think on it.

 

[wrong]

This is the conundrum I have. I'm currently in the early stages of a game that ideally will include incest, but I worry that it may be at the expense of a sympathetic, relatable and all in all likeable main character. I ask this because from my experience playing countless incest related games, I don't think I've ever truly rooted for a character after he's say fucked his mother or sister. Do any of you experience this? Or is it something you're truly able to look past?

In other words...


Is she worth becoming despicable for?

I Do Prefer the main Character to be Shota / Virgin Young Middle School / Teenagers / Innocent & Lustful Child
i am Read Alot of Incest comic & Manga

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[gamersglory]

Poor MC development tends to be the problem in some of these games because they want to get you to "The good part" as fast as they can. We don't work that way you need to get to know the MC and the relationships before things breakout. For the story to make sense. But yes you can have a likable MC in an Insect game if you put story first

 

[DownTheDrain]

You have to have the characters acknowledge what makes incest wrong, you have to have them come to terms with their mutual feelings, and you have to make them both consent.

At this point incest is such a mainstay in western adult games that I honestly don't even think about it anymore.
It was never a fetish of mine but I'm long past caring one way or the other. It's just sex in an environment that conveniently places multiple attractive girls in your immediate vicinity.
Unless the writing is stellar I'd rather not deal with yet another coming-to-terms-with-incest story arc and just brush aside the moral issues.

Consent doesn't seem to be a problem for the majority of players either.
Judging from the popularity of many, many games here and on patreon most players seem to be perfectly fine with creepily watching their relatives in the shower, visiting them at night and coercing them into all kinds of kinky shit.
Personally I prefer my MCs flawed (or blank slate if you can't pull off flawed well enough), but if you're going for an actual good guy in a setting that is supposed to make sense then your points are certainly valid.

 

[DarthSeduction]

At this point incest is such a mainstay in western adult games that I honestly don't even think about it anymore.
It was never a fetish of mine but I'm long past caring one way or the other. It's just sex in an environment that conveniently places multiple attractive girls in your immediate vicinity.
Unless the writing is stellar I'd rather not deal with yet another coming-to-terms-with-incest story arc and just brush aside the moral issues.

Consent doesn't seem to be an issue for the majority of players either.
Judging from the popularity of many, many games here and on patreon most players seem to be perfectly fine with creepily watching their relatives in the shower, visiting them at night and coercing them into all kinds of kinky shit.
Personally I prefer my MCs flawed (or blank slate if you can't pull off flawed well enough), but if you're going for an actual good guy in a setting that is supposed to make sense then your points are certainly valid.

Did you read the premise of the thread? As a big fan of incest games, I come away from most of them with absolutely 0 respect for the MC, why? Because he's a creepy bastard. As Conviction brought up the thread with the express purpose of asking the question, "Can a protagonist that engages in incestuous acts ever be truly likeable?", I think we have to address this common issue in incest games wherein consent isn't addressed. And that brings us back to acknowledging and coming to terms with it.

The whole reason Patreon and the like are against incest is the implication that incest cannot possibly have consent. It's a stupid argument, I agree, but that's the point I'm alluding to in making sure that your MC comes across as likeable. By acknowledging what they're doing and moving forward together, in consent, the characters get over the moral hurdles and can again be sympathetic.

As to "Unless the writing is stellar" considering this thread is looking for advice on how to better write something, it's pretty safe to assume the intent is to make it a better story.

 

[baneini]

I feel like a characters likability is in the self-insert crowds domain of interests, alongside having a preference in ntr or being able to name your character. I don't really benefit from the playable character being likable, it doesn't increase the value of the game. If my character is presented with a binary choice, I'm probably going to ignore the good guy options because I want to see the end result of a bad guy option.

sympathetic, relatable and all in all likeable main character.

Heres some guidelines from E;R:

 

[DownTheDrain]

Did you read the premise of the thread? As a big fan of incest games, I come away from most of them with absolutely 0 respect for the MC, why? Because he's a creepy bastard. As Conviction brought up the thread with the express purpose of asking the question, "Can a protagonist that engages in incestuous acts ever be truly likeable?", I think we have to address this common issue in incest games wherein consent isn't addressed. And that brings us back to acknowledging and coming to terms with it.

The whole reason Patreon and the like are against incest is the implication that incest cannot possibly have consent. It's a stupid argument, I agree, but that's the point I'm alluding to in making sure that your MC comes across as likeable. By acknowledging what they're doing and moving forward together, in consent, the characters get over the moral hurdles and can again be sympathetic.

As to "Unless the writing is stellar" considering this thread is looking for advice on how to better write something, it's pretty safe to assume the intent is to make it a better story.

Maybe it was a mistake quoting you specifically. I only did because your view on this topic is mostly opposed to mine and made it easier to highlight the differences.

Let me rephrase that to fit the OP's question then, incest has become so common in adult games that it has zero effect on the likeability of the MC for me. If I dislike a character for being a creepy rapist the exact (blood-)relationship between abuser and victim doesn't enter the equation.

 

[DarthSeduction]

well to be honest most incest games dont really have a solid storyline, according to me atleast. but there are exceptions ofcourse. i don't know about the protag to be likable but two games come to mind which have great storyline and writing which separates them from the other incest games with bland storylines( Haley's story, My sister my roommate). its actually pretty tough i think to make incestuous relationships plausible but it is possible with good writing.

(btw i think she is worth it )

I just got back to this. I would say that My Sister My Roommate is a perfect example of a game that handles the incest somewhat well. It does have an early bit of creeper vibe, but that disappears pretty quick as the sister becomes the aggressor.

 

[gamersglory]

I feel like a characters likability is in the self-insert crowds domain of interests, alongside having a preference in ntr or being able to name your character. I don't really benefit from the playable character being likable, it doesn't increase the value of the game. If my character is presented with a binary choice, I'm probably going to ignore the good guy options because I want to see the end result of a bad guy option.

Your answer here is why you don't see much development in Incest titles is because almost everyone who plays them wants to go on the Bad/domination path. So developers don't need much if any story to take that route. That's why they're a dime a dozen. No creative writing skills needed. Don't know how to write don't Write or speak English and google translate will work just fine then make an Ntr/incest game with the MC being a douche. Not like anyone is going to read the plot of the game anyway. they came just for the fap.

 

[Floga]

I think the games where the MC is not proactively going towards the family members but it just sort of happens is the kind of MC I'd like. The two games that come to my mind is

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. The thing about these games is the MC is not coercive and persuading. Usually when the mother knows it's wrong the MC pushes her for more, telling it's alright. "Nothing should come between true love" or "We should not care about what others think". The feeling first occurs within the MC and then like some magic, the family members fall for him. But in these games, there's simultaneous reciprocation of feelings by the female member of the family. MC doesn't coerce or force them into a relationship and there's no "best friend" to tell the family members to let go of their inhibitions.
Edit: Sister in My Sister My Roommate is kinda like a wing-woman for him, tries to get him laid, helps him break out of his shell. He actually likes some other girl in the game.

 

[gamersglory]

well to be honest most incest games dont really have a solid storyline, according to me atleast. but there are exceptions ofcourse. i don't know about the protag to be likable but two games come to mind which have great storyline and writing which separates them from the other incest games with bland storylines( Haley's story, My sister my roommate). its actually pretty tough i think to make incestuous relationships plausible but it is possible with good writing.

(btw i think she is worth it )

Bland Story It's called build up just because you don't have fap material starting off does not mean it's bland you have to set up the characters so people give a shit about them and make the story flow organically. If you get sex in every update then someone is hiding their lack of writing skills and story development.

 

[Conviction07]

Did you read the premise of the thread? As a big fan of incest games, I come away from most of them with absolutely 0 respect for the MC, why? Because he's a creepy bastard. As Conviction brought up the thread with the express purpose of asking the question, "Can a protagonist that engages in incestuous acts ever be truly likeable?", I think we have to address this common issue in incest games wherein consent isn't addressed. And that brings us back to acknowledging and coming to terms with it.

The whole reason Patreon and the like are against incest is the implication that incest cannot possibly have consent. It's a stupid argument, I agree, but that's the point I'm alluding to in making sure that your MC comes across as likeable. By acknowledging what they're doing and moving forward together, in consent, the characters get over the moral hurdles and can again be sympathetic.

As to "Unless the writing is stellar" considering this thread is looking for advice on how to better write something, it's pretty safe to assume the intent is to make it a better story.

I actually don’t think discussing consent is worthwhile at all to be honest, because it goes without saying that a protagonist having non consensual sex with another character would be deplorable regardless of if they were related. I suppose my question isn’t something that can be analyzed, so much as it’s just a gut feeling you have. For example, think of the greatest love story you know of, whether it be a movie or novel, and then make those characters siblings. Would you still be on board with their journey and root for them? Or would the depravity of their incestuous relationship mar the entire thing?

 

[u z i]

Bland Story It's called build up just because you don't have fap material starting off does not mean it's bland you have to set up the characters so people give a shit about them and make the story flow organically. If you get sex in every update then someone is hiding their lack of writing skills and story development.

haha you misunderstood me. VNs (with incest) with sex scenes right off the start with no build up is what i feel to be bland. that is why i recommended to check out the games i mentioned.