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Lostanddamned

Engaged Member
Mar 29, 2019
2,854
18,503
the 2 worst villains of the 2 games....
It's hard to classify P as a out and out villain though - it's more like he's misunderstood.

It's a trope that's commonly used on antagonists - you give them a detailed background to give them humanity, so that they appear that they are not out and out evil.

SFS aren't doing that with their villains though - the Pfizer boss and Vince (the hitman) don't have redeeming qualities. Sure, they are presented as Bond villains - unrealistically evil, but that's their role in the story and someone has to do it.

I hate it when devs add a bunch of villains then they shape them out as grey characters and in the end there are no villains in the story.
 

felicemastronzo

Devoted Member
May 17, 2020
11,686
22,576
It's hard to classify P as a out and out villain though - it's more like he's misunderstood.

It's a trope that's commonly used on antagonists - you give them a detailed background to give them humanity, so that they appear that they are not out and out evil.

SFS aren't doing that with their villains though - the Pfizer boss and Vince (the hitman) don't have redeeming qualities. Sure, they are presented as Bond villains - unrealistically evil, but that's their role in the story and someone has to do it.

I hate it when devs add a bunch of villains then they shape them out as grey characters and in the end there are no villains in the story.
either there is a huge plot hole in the early chapters or the parents, although not classic villains, are the antagonist in Jaye and MC's relationship

even though they then pretend to have wanted to remain neutral
 
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Cabin Fever

Engaged Member
Nov 23, 2018
3,347
5,452
the 2 worst villains of the 2 games....
How is James a villian? If nothing else he's presented in the story as a pretty flawless good guy.

It's hard to classify P as a out and out villain though - it's more like he's misunderstood.

It's a trope that's commonly used on antagonists - you give them a detailed background to give them humanity, so that they appear that they are not out and out evil.

SFS aren't doing that with their villains though - the Pfizer boss and Vince (the hitman) don't have redeeming qualities. Sure, they are presented as Bond villains - unrealistically evil, but that's their role in the story and someone has to do it.

I hate it when devs add a bunch of villains then they shape them out as grey characters and in the end there are no villains in the story.
Except that's not the Prizer boss, it's Jaye's father.
 
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Cabin Fever

Engaged Member
Nov 23, 2018
3,347
5,452
Never said that it was the Prizer boss. I was giving the Prizer boss as an example to the guy I replied to, since the topic of the post was villains to begin with. :rolleyes:
Fair enough. But can't blame me for being confused when you add a 3rd entirely unmentioned character to a response that shows only P & J.
 

felicemastronzo

Devoted Member
May 17, 2020
11,686
22,576
How is James a villian? If nothing else he's presented in the story as a pretty flawless good guy.


Except that's not the Prizer boss, it's Jaye's father.
all the problems between Jaye and Mc are his (and his wife's) responsibility, if there is a chance that Mc will let Jaye drown at sea it is his responsibility.

and I'm not talking about secret theories but directly recounted events

why don't Jaye and MC talk to each other for years leading, at least on Jaye's part, to an apparent hostility?
because Mc as a child decides not to accompany her to school any more and for this Jaye takes great offence.

but James and Sara know what happened and reassure MC that they'll work things out with Jaye, but they never do (Jaye only finds out through MC's mouth) and are content to watch as the two foster siblings grow more and more estranged from year to year, until the final breakup during the high school graduation party, and even after that they watch MC risk his life to travel the world and Jaye struggle in this failed relationship.

but then they have the courage to tell mc that they knew all about the feelings between the 2, but decided to remain neutral. the perfect parents. :cautious:
 

motseer

Engaged Member
Dec 17, 2021
3,615
8,825
all the problems between Jaye and Mc are his (and his wife's) responsibility, if there is a chance that Mc will let Jaye drown at sea it is his responsibility.

and I'm not talking about secret theories but directly recounted events

why don't Jaye and MC talk to each other for years leading, at least on Jaye's part, to an apparent hostility?
because Mc as a child decides not to accompany her to school any more and for this Jaye takes great offence.

but James and Sara know what happened and reassure MC that they'll work things out with Jaye, but they never do (Jaye only finds out through MC's mouth) and are content to watch as the two foster siblings grow more and more estranged from year to year, until the final breakup during the high school graduation party, and even after that they watch MC risk his life to travel the world and Jaye struggle in this failed relationship.

but then they have the courage to tell mc that they knew all about the feelings between the 2, but decided to remain neutral. the perfect parents. :cautious:
You are absolutely correct and I recall thinking the same when I read it the first time. In fairness, James and Sara were just following the script. Heh. They should have tried an ad lib. :p
 
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felicemastronzo

Devoted Member
May 17, 2020
11,686
22,576
You are absolutely correct and I recall thinking the same when I read it the first time. In fairness, James and Sara were just following the script. Heh. They should have tried an ad lib. :p
What is jarring is this claim of neutrality, because if they had wanted to intentionally distance their children it would have been manipulative but understandable (of course not when they were children, but later as teenagers)
 
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motseer

Engaged Member
Dec 17, 2021
3,615
8,825
What is jarring is this claim of neutrality, because if they had wanted to intentionally distance their children it would have been manipulative but understandable (of course not when they were children, but later as teenagers)
Honestly, this story has quite a lot of examples of miscommunication, comedy of errors and low-brow human nature. Sometimes I get to thinking that it could have been written with a bit more subtlety. Then I think about some of the people I've known and the things they've done or not done... Or I spend five minutes catching up on the news... I'm sure you can infer the rest.
 

ename144

Engaged Member
Sep 20, 2018
3,420
14,167
either there is a huge plot hole in the early chapters or the parents, although not classic villains, are the antagonist in Jaye and MC's relationship

even though they then pretend to have wanted to remain neutral
As the old saying goes, never attribute to malice what is better explained by stupidity. Sarah and James mean well and clearly love their children, but they're terrible parents. They just can't bring themselves to put their foot down long after it's clear the hands off approach has backfired.


all the problems between Jaye and Mc are his (and his wife's) responsibility, if there is a chance that Mc will let Jaye drown at sea it is his responsibility.

and I'm not talking about secret theories but directly recounted events

why don't Jaye and MC talk to each other for years leading, at least on Jaye's part, to an apparent hostility?
because Mc as a child decides not to accompany her to school any more and for this Jaye takes great offence.

but James and Sara know what happened and reassure MC that they'll work things out with Jaye, but they never do (Jaye only finds out through MC's mouth) and are content to watch as the two foster siblings grow more and more estranged from year to year, until the final breakup during the high school graduation party, and even after that they watch MC risk his life to travel the world and Jaye struggle in this failed relationship.

but then they have the courage to tell mc that they knew all about the feelings between the 2, but decided to remain neutral. the perfect parents. :cautious:
Yeah, I hate that coda with Sarah and James in Sicily. Even when the MC says flat out he needed help, they still sit on their hands and mock the notion parents could possibly intervene in the lives of their children. It's ridiculous - and IMHO it makes the MC's attitude towards Jaye at the start of the game even less explicable than it already was.

Not one of this game's shining moments.
 
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saynotoNTR

Active Member
Mar 17, 2021
885
1,952
[QUESTION] I am on Ch.3. If I ignore the sister during the game will I be punished with a 'Bad Ending'? I wanted to have a romance just with Mallory.

I know the game is still in development, but has the developer commented on whether having a romance with MC's sister is a deciding factor for the player to achieve in 'Happy Ending'?
 

Kirel

Member
Mar 18, 2018
371
554
[QUESTION] I am on Ch.3. If I ignore the sister during the game will I be punished with a 'Bad Ending'? I wanted to have a romance just with Mallory.

I know the game is still in development, but has the developer commented on whether having a romance with MC's sister is a deciding factor for the player to achieve in 'Happy Ending'?
You do not need to romance Jaye to have a happy ending with Mallory.
 
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Lucifel

Member
Sep 20, 2018
218
424
Holy crap what a game. I gather this is mostly a Mallory/Jaye game but Lisa and Bianca are also out of this world. The mother, sister and aunt trifecta is an incredible goal to aim for. Don't know how much more game is planned but if the dev sticks the landing with a good harem ending this is definitely an all time great. Especially if MC knocks them all up
 
4.60 star(s) 360 Votes