Java Corrupted Saviors [Release 58] [CSDev]

[Kalloi]

I've already done all the distortions in my various loop 1 runs to familiarise myself with the gameplay (and what I wish the game told you was "don't try to do Negotiation in a run where you do any non-Negotiation temptation") but it took me until today to realise that the cor/sig/min vulns on a chosen ALSO influence their starting Forsaken stats. It's just a lot of mechanics and setup that feels very unintuitive to use or learn how to use (because most forsaken will have a crushingly high EE cost that you would spend an entire loop's worth of days training down if you so desired).

Imo that's my main issue with the forsaken, it's just three layers of complexity that only kick in after you already have spent multiple hours working through a loop


so far it has been completely "forsaken don't work for me at all and I don't even know where to start unfucking this" for me, which is a shame because I can see the appeal of the system, I just feel like I'm seperated from it by a pane of glass

Everyone has given some great advice so far so I don't know what else to really add, but it really helps to focus on what kind of forsaken you want, and how you want them to work.

So you want a low-cost forsaken, hone in specifically on what you want that low cost forsaken to do. Do you want the low-cost forsaken to easily break T2 vulnerabilities on chosen? Do you want a low cost forsaken to jump-start your distortion process to get off a distortion faster and easier? Figuring out that is the first step and from there maximize the potential/purpose of that forsaken as much as you can.

For example, if you want a low cost forsaken that excels at sodomizing chosen, go for an appropriate distortion that accents this (probably negotiation or aversion for INJU bonus) If you have a forsaken with a punisher that gives a INJU bonus to chosen they drain use that on your future sodomizing forsaken. Once they're forsaken, train them in a one or two damage style and any kind of training session you have with them is adding expertise damage to that forsaken.

Having simple roles and thinking like this allows you to figure out everything you need to do to your forsaken, even when they're still chosen. Allowing you to pick out punishers to use on them, what distortions you should go with and even what type of chosen would be viable for the role in the first place.

Going back to the earlier example and tweaking some things, say I want a low-cost forsaken that is built just to deal T2 morality breaks. Then I would distort the chosen with either aversion or rampancy, use punishers that help build HATE damage and train their expertise in a one or two circumstance damage style. Another thing I can do is make sure the forsaken I want for this role has braggart breeder (a punisher that grants bonus damage for every chosen they impregnate.) so now I have more of a clear indicator of who would be good candidate for the chosen I want. It may be overkill to a degree, but it makes it easier to see what chosen are useful to me.


Personally I have about 4 "roles" I keep in mind when I'm looking for potential forsaken to fill my roster. By doing this I can easily look at the chosen I encounter in a loop and figure out what I can do with them and I want I want to do with them.

Piercers - This role is a low-cost forsaken built to break the T2's on chosen quickly and easily. Often times I go for one damage type since they're meant to do one thing in the first place, but there is some merit to having a two-style forsaken. I try to have at least 4 piercers, one for each damage type. And sometimes few more with different damage types to cover my bases.

Punishers - This role as it's namesake are forsaken I keep solely for their punishers, I want their Disgrace to be low to fully utilize their abilities and their fighting style isn't as important as a piercer. I keep a solid assortment of these forsaken but mostly those that offsets the drawbacks of distortions or grants damage bonuses

Distorters- This role varies the most in that some of the forsaken in this role I train so they can help distort chosen faster and easier and some forsaken I train in this role simply to maximize the usage of their unique distortion traits/defiler. The main commonality is that the usage of the distortion defilers. Its good to have a wide variety of these forsaken in terms of EE cost since some chosen personalities are harder to crack with a distortion than others.

Generals- This role is something I thought of recently but forsaken built to handle the final battle in loops. while punishers and some of the other forsaken roles could accomplish this, I think the thought put into making a proper one is worth making a entire role for. It's good to have a variety of these similar to distorters since depending on the loop you're in or the distortions you're working with, it may not be viable to have all these forsaken at 100+ EE

This method is my way of organizing what I need to do to my forsaken and I highly recommend adopting something similar if you're having trouble figuring out how to make forsaken work for you

 

[SuperSkippy]

I've already done all the distortions in my various loop 1 runs to familiarise myself with the gameplay (and what I wish the game told you was "don't try to do Negotiation in a run where you do any non-Negotiation temptation") but it took me until today to realise that the cor/sig/min vulns on a chosen ALSO influence their starting Forsaken stats. It's just a lot of mechanics and setup that feels very unintuitive to use or learn how to use (because most forsaken will have a crushingly high EE cost that you would spend an entire loop's worth of days training down if you so desired).

Imo that's my main issue with the forsaken, it's just three layers of complexity that only kick in after you already have spent multiple hours working through a loop


so far it has been completely "forsaken don't work for me at all and I don't even know where to start unfucking this" for me, which is a shame because I can see the appeal of the system, I just feel like I'm seperated from it by a pane of glass

Ok, let's try this.

There are a lot of things a Forsaken can do that are expensive or inconvenient to do with Commanders.

Your job is to pick something you want and design around that.

Here's a good starting place: EXPO damage. This is a very useful type once the whole team is out. Your Forsaken hits the first Chosen and sets her up. Then she hits the second Chosen even harder, which also makes your follow-up surround on the first Chosen even better. Let's look at what would be an ideal EXPO-focused (1000% EXPO) damage first Forsaken. Let's get one that replaces that early loop of buying a bunch of commander upgrades before you can use a Commander that's worth much of anything. Let's start stacking!

There are two distortions that raise EXPO damage by 50%: Rampancy (Demon Knight) or Temptation (Eager Partner). Let's see what the good and bad of each one is. First, each one has an associated Defiler.

Rampancy's Defiler is the ability to break off early (Release) or Rampage (stuns self, adds some amount to surrounds).

Temptation's Defiler is the ability to switch to doing PLEA damage (also can count as Tempt action, if the Chosen has high enough PLEA).

These two types also come with special traits that have to be considered.

Rampant Forsaken take all your EE when deployed, but can be deployed for any EE cost. They also gain Motivation when deployed and lose it when they're idle.

Tempted Forsaken cost 1/4 of the regular Motivation cost to deploy as long as their Obedience stays below 40%.

But wait, there's a third set of things to consider; the type of distortion will have a significant effect on her corruption stats.

Rampant Forsaken will have extremely low Obedience (avoiding t1 CON breaks), low Deviancy (avoiding t2 INN breaks), and moderate-to-high scores in Hostility and Disgrace. This means they will recover Stamina very quickly and gain Expertise quickly to match whatever damage type you're doing. Low Obedience and Deviancy means they start out refusing a lot of training actions. High Hostility means you'll have to send them out every so often or they'll fuck up your other Forsaken, because these bitches is crazy. Rampants lose Motivation resting, and when Motivation gets below Hostility a Forsaken goes and beats up everyone at your base. Their natural cost will be low, so you'll want to use them at the beginning of a loop and use Demons or other Forsaken later in the loop.

Tempted Forsaken will have extremely low Hostility, low Obedience, and moderate-to-high scores in Deviancy and Disgrace. They'll recover stamina quite quickly (though not as quickly as a Rampant Forsaken). They'll be able to be sent out a lot of times (this Forsaken is not ass-backwards, so it costs her Motivation to go out--but the cost is reduced to 1/4 because of the trait above). Even if they lose a lot of motivation, the low Hostility means when they fuck shit up around your base no one really gets mad, they throw little foot-stomping tantrums that just make everyone else roll their eyes (low Motivation damage). They'll be hard to train in different damage types because of the high Deviancy. They may refuse some training actions because of the naturally low Obedience, but they won't be as difficult on this front as a Rampant Forsaken.

Both types will be on the lower end of the cost spectrum because of the high Disgrace value--so we won't compare these directly.

OK, so decision time. Put those advantages and disadvantages next to each other and see which one gets to live outside of the Breeding Pit!

	Advantages	Disadvantages
Tempted	consistent, predictable EE cost, like using a class of Demon Can do PLEA damage once EXPO stops raising Easy to manage--low hostility and low Motivation cost.	sucks at gaining Expertise--can't retrain easily Can't send her out until you have some EE often "stuck" in later turns, since EXPO is difficult to raise high without HATE/INJU
Rampant	Easy to send out in the beginning with low EE Can fuck up multiple Chosen, not stuck to one for 5-8 turns dealing 2 damage at the end cuz all she do is strip them Can train/retrain quickly for other needs	Occasionally fucks up your other Forsaken cuz she bored High difficulty in accepting training actions Wants to take all your money (EE) which is a lot at the end of a loop

So, I think that Tempted is better for this purpose. Switching to PLEA damage partway through a Capture is incredibly helpful for making sure that their Traumas get high. If you agree, let's talk about how you build one. Think of the end first. We need:

1) We need her to consent to doing a Grand Concert to get the associated Defiler. If her Disgrace is high, this will be easy--if not, we will have to raise it. I'll put a little training index at the end of this for stats.

2) We need her damage type to be EXPO only, but we still want her to have PLEA experience so that she does damage with Tempt.

3) We need her disgrace to be somewhere between 70 (8 EE) and 80 (4 EE). I'd recommend shooting for the lower end of this.

4) Important: we need her Obedience to stay BELOW 40%, or she loses most of her benefits because of the Tempted trait.

So, with this, we can come up with some sort of plan.

1) Earning the Grand Concert (if needed)

2) Raising Disgrace (probably)

3) Getting the correct damage type (1000% EXPO, then STOP training)

Okay, so how do we train? We can train for Corruption, for Expertise, or for Motivation.

To train for Corruption, the four % stats, you'll want to pile on trainings with Disgrace. If you're wanting to increase Obedience you'll always start with Drain Soul (check to make sure if you're training our Temptress here that this doesn't make it go to high). If you're wanting to increase Disgrace, you'll start with Grand Concert if she consents to it. Either way, pair the stat you want to raise with Disgrace, as Disgrace training makes actions not go up in cost. If Disgrace is the stat you're trying to raise, pair it with any of the others except Hostility (Hostility raises future training costs in the same session). Go from tier 4 trainings on down for the biggest results, just make sure they aren't too big.

To train for Expertise, the damage types, you'll want to pair Hostility and Deviance on the first two levels of training actions, then pick the action in the third tier that gives you the most experience in the type or types you want. If you're trying to make one of your current damage types disappear, make sure that you don't train that one as your third-tier action. Example, if you're trying to get our Temptress here to go from "100% PLEA/EXPO" to "1000% EXPO" you'll want to not use the Tentacle Show.

To train for Motivation, pair Deviancy and Disgrace on all three tiers, then pick whatever gives you the largest Motivation increase (without increasing corruption stats, unless you want those too).

Or, use a trainer. It's slow, but you'll always get exactly what you want, eventually.

 

[Shasou]

....I suppose it might be time to prioritize the multi-loop scenario system so that players can make "mini campaigns" where they can still enjoy the cross-loop game of corrupting the Chosen in order to turn them into useful Forsaken, but without the need to play more than 2 or 3 loops before reaching the desired interaction they had in mind.

....

How about adding in a feature in the main campaign that requires you to purchase it using influence? For example, an item that once purchased prompts you to choose a forsaken that you already have and it grants you to ability to start new campaigns with said forsaken. It can be an expensive item due to it's rather powerful ability, might even require you to fulfill conditions like "Selected Forsaken must have been in your service for at least 5 city captures." That way we can have a sense of achievement and earning that Forsaken for our next runs and the game can even detect if you already have a powerful enough forsaken to go against one of the special Chosen.

Just a suggestion, whatever you decide i'm just happy to be played a game like this one, it's one of the best ones out there in my humble-but-honest opinion!

 

[Cornuthaum]

Personally I have about 4 "roles" I keep in mind when I'm looking for potential forsaken to fill my roster. By doing this I can easily look at the chosen I encounter in a loop and figure out what I can do with them and I want I want to do with them.

Piercers - This role is a low-cost forsaken built to break the T2's on chosen quickly and easily. Often times I go for one damage type since they're meant to do one thing in the first place, but there is some merit to having a two-style forsaken. I try to have at least 4 piercers, one for each damage type. And sometimes few more with different damage types to cover my bases.

Punishers - This role as it's namesake are forsaken I keep solely for their punishers, I want their Disgrace to be low to fully utilize their abilities and their fighting style isn't as important as a piercer. I keep a solid assortment of these forsaken but mostly those that offsets the drawbacks of distortions or grants damage bonuses

Distorters- This role varies the most in that some of the forsaken in this role I train so they can help distort chosen faster and easier and some forsaken I train in this role simply to maximize the usage of their unique distortion traits/defiler. The main commonality is that the usage of the distortion defilers. Its good to have a wide variety of these forsaken in terms of EE cost since some chosen personalities are harder to crack with a distortion than others.

Generals- This role is something I thought of recently but forsaken built to handle the final battle in loops. while punishers and some of the other forsaken roles could accomplish this, I think the thought put into making a proper one is worth making a entire role for. It's good to have a variety of these similar to distorters since depending on the loop you're in or the distortions you're working with, it may not be viable to have all these forsaken at 100+ EE

This method is my way of organizing what I need to do to my forsaken and I highly recommend adopting something similar if you're having trouble figuring out how to make forsaken work for you

That has unironically been an enormous help for organising my brain, and for how to look at the Forsaken, thank you.

And also everyone else, tyvm. I am struggling to get my two braincells to work but y'all have been a huge help.

1) Earning the Grand Concert (if needed)

Please imagine your anime character of choice with empty eyes and a look of confusion bc that's me. Looking at the forsaken reference it's... some sort of high tier Training action? (That I have never seen on account of previous troubles.)

What does that do?

 

[Deleted member 2691156]

Please imagine your anime character of choice with empty eyes and a look of confusion bc that's me. Looking at the forsaken reference it's... some sort of high tier Training action? (That I have never seen on account of previous troubles.)

What does that do?

It adds a bunch of disgrace, teach Rampant and Tempted forsakens their defiler and teach other forsaken how to Broadcast their captive. If you do it on a Rampant/Tempted forsaken who already has their defiler it will replace it by the ability to broadcast

 

[namastesta]

Is it possible to capture all three chosen in the first city? I was able to get my first win of Nagano. I had all three with Hypno breaks and all T4 breaks. I maybe could try to get Parasitic T5 breaks on all 3, they were close.


My late game strategy has been:
use a suppressor+defiler combo to hit expo, pleasure, and hate all at once.
capture the first girl and Barrier until the second girl shows
cap the second girl, surround the first girl, target expo, then injur, then pleasure if i can
third girl shows up, use threaten & attack to stack a 4 surround and hit pleasure, injur, hate
surround the second girl, stack expo, inju


by that point I am in a position to keep stacking surrounds continuously on all three and position for a 14+ orgy

but the Orgys don't really help with the corruption? they stack serious damage, but they're not hitting Impregnation, Parasitic, or Drain.

 

[Cornuthaum]

Is it possible to capture all three chosen in the first city? I was able to get my first win of Nagano. I had all three with Hypno breaks and all T4 breaks. I maybe could try to get Parasitic T5 breaks on all 3, they were close.

Yes, it's reasonable to do; particularly if you avoid Rivalries so they don't murk each other in the final battle while you sandblast their Resolve if they aren't distorted

 

[SuperSkippy]

That has unironically been an enormous help for organising my brain, and for how to look at the Forsaken, thank you.

And also everyone else, tyvm. I am struggling to get my two braincells to work but y'all have been a huge help.


Please imagine your anime character of choice with empty eyes and a look of confusion bc that's me. Looking at the forsaken reference it's... some sort of high tier Training action? (That I have never seen on account of previous troubles.)

What does that do?

It's a tier 4 training action. It has the highest Disgrace number attached to it (100%, but that doesn't mean you have to be at 100% Disgrace to use it). Therefore, it's the best at raising the Disgrace stat for the Forsaken who need to cost less than they currently do.

Your Trainer on an Increase Disgrace plan makes it go up 1 per day. When you get able to use Grand Concert, you can easily raise Disgrace a bunch of points that day by just using Grand Concert and a bunch of other Disgrace training opportunities, so it's really convenient if her Disgrace is somewhere around 40-50 and you'd like it to be closer to 70-80. Without it, you're somewhat limited in what options you have to raise Disgrace without also raising Obedience.

The Tier 4 training actions are also how you give Forsaken their Punisher/Defiler effects, so if you do decide to build a Tempted EXPO-focused Forsaken, that's one way to get her the Tempt defiler (and definitely the easiest way).

 

[zargal]

Please imagine your anime character of choice with empty eyes and a look of confusion bc that's me. Looking at the forsaken reference it's... some sort of high tier Training action? (That I have never seen on account of previous troubles.)

It's a tier 4 training action. It has the highest Disgrace number attached to it (100%, but that doesn't mean you have to be at 100% Disgrace to use it). Therefore, it's the best at raising the Disgrace stat for the Forsaken who need to cost less than they currently do.

Just don't forget you need to have researched parasitism (40 EE) in the current loop. You'll probably have done this but don't plan on using it early in a loop.

Is it possible to capture all three chosen in the first city? I was able to get my first win of Nagano. I had all three with Hypno breaks and all T4 breaks. I maybe could try to get Parasitic T5 breaks on all 3, they were close.

Definitely, you should expect to grab all 3 unless you're deliberately letting them go. If they're enemies and you've got antipathy, they'll only have 20% resolve. I only use slime+ since 1 or 2 levels of pleasure will make them surrender quickly. If you're making them friends I'd have one or two distorted since some of those are insta-kills.

General ideas for getting to 1000%
-You're correct in saying orgies are not vital in this phase. You really want prolonged battles with many high end uses of each move. Orgies can help you get those high levels, but then you need to make sure the chosen have a lot of time to use those high levels of circumstance. Trauma has no impact on this other than letting you surround for longer.
-Remember that they won't use a move twice in a row. In practice, this means that if they only have one move to do (slaughter or exhibit) they'll do that then regen, thus limiting the percentage growth. Try to stop them doing this as much as possible.
-Slaughter benefits from other chosen being surrounded for a long time, and probably is the easiest to complete. It will only be used when the surround timer is 3+. Also it's best to only have one surround happening for this, otherwise it's a doubly effective move.
-Exhibition is annoying, you don't want them using a low level, regenerating x4. One idea is to let them use a level, capture them to prevent the regen, then they'll use it again once released. They can "overwrite" a much lower debuff but this is a bit unpredictable.
-Explode has a hard limit of 3 uses (barring forsaken) if you focus on the one chosen, and usually only 1 use if you spread the love around. You'll probably only get 90% each time, 120% if you're lucky but at least this one's very predictable.
-Striptease just requires a lot of surrounds, it'll be used every time a new one is started so cater your surrounds to that and time it so the one you want does the stripping.

Anyone able to do something like this for animalistics and undead? I find their move use a bit random.

And congratulations on your win! You'll find the 2nd loop much more fun, the first is probably the biggest slog.

 

[Notahouse]

Just out of Curiosity, and confusion, could anyone give me the "for dummies" guide to play or simply turn cheats on... this game looks amazing but for the life of I cant seem to get any mg's to even thier 1st core break.

 

[SuperSkippy]

Just don't forget you need to have researched parasitism (40 EE) in the current loop. You'll probably have done this but don't plan on using it early in a loop.


General ideas for getting to 1000%
-You're correct in saying orgies are not vital in this phase. You really want prolonged battles with many high end uses of each move. Orgies can help you get those high levels, but then you need to make sure the chosen have a lot of time to use those high levels of circumstance. Trauma has no impact on this other than letting you surround for longer.

If you can get Orgies on the Chosen before Extermination is complete, they're great as they stack up Circumstance damage (making each move raise the Punisher % more) and they add to later surround turns. Best thing you can do is get a short/medium Orgy done before Extermination finishes, but after Extermination is finished you should be surrounding one at a time to maximize the number of moves the Chosen do.

-Remember that they won't use a move twice in a row. In practice, this means that if they only have one move to do (slaughter or exhibit) they'll do that then regen, thus limiting the percentage growth. Try to stop them doing this as much as possible.
-Slaughter benefits from other chosen being surrounded for a long time, and probably is the easiest to complete. It will only be used when the surround timer is 3+. Also it's best to only have one surround happening for this, otherwise it's a doubly effective move.
-Exhibition is annoying, you don't want them using a low level, regenerating x4. One idea is to let them use a level, capture them to prevent the regen, then they'll use it again once released. They can "overwrite" a much lower debuff but this is a bit unpredictable.
-Explode has a hard limit of 3 uses (barring forsaken) if you focus on the one chosen, and usually only 1 use if you spread the love around. You'll probably only get 90% each time, 120% if you're lucky but at least this one's very predictable.

Your Explode is much more effective if it's concentrated on one Chosen. Instead of getting 90 + 90 + 90, you can get 90 + 150 + 180. I often find myself getting Explode to 1000% before I really focus on bringing the other stats up because it can be done with a cheap Commander, and can unlock endgame downtime actions. (Strategy: Capture 1 at the beginning with a Commander with INJU Punisher (no other Circumstance), 5 or more turns, 5 captures [or 3 if you haven't unlocked 5 yet]. When they Explode, Surround them and raise other Circumstances, starting with HATE. When they break the Surround, Capture them again, then 2 turns later, Capture them a third time.)

-Striptease just requires a lot of surrounds, it'll be used every time a new one is started so cater your surrounds to that and time it so the one you want does the stripping.

For an integrated strategy, I generally do the following:
1) Unlock all T3s by using a massive Orgy.
2) Get any Distortions I want set/activated/whatever.
3) Use the INJU Punisher method above to focus on one Chosen at a time until I've broken all the T4 CON I want. (normally, during this process, the T3s that I've earned enough damage for naturally unlock)
4) Use 5-capture max turns normal Commanders with Flight to get early Orgies set up with whatever Circumstance is convenient based on Distortions.
5) Once they are released from Orgy, Extermination will be complete. Capture one at a time to keep them using moves.

Anyone able to do something like this for animalistics and undead? I find their move use a bit random.

This info is valid for Campaign mode--I've not completed the Undead Clash challenge.

Undead:
Curse Lock: They will use this all the fucking time, as long as they have some HATE damage. Build up HATE and watch them go at it. Expect to not Research or buy Commanders for a day after you've worked on this.
Consume Vitality: They will use this if it increases their stacks of Surging Vitality and they have some PLEA damage. I find I can one-or two-shot this one (depending on my Achievements). Once they fire off a giant one of these, understand that you'll be leaving them alone for a few days/ a while. If you need multiple days on this, target them with a Forsaken that deals PLEA near the beginning of the fight (maybe set up a bit of EXPO on someone else first), let them Consume, , then do the rest of the fight while leaving them alone. Repeat the next day, and the next, for as many days as needed to break T4 INN (shouldn't be more than 3).
Seals: They will use this all the fucking time, as long as they have some INJU damage. Easy to plan around--two turns after they do Second Seal, use a Forsaken to do some INJU damage and they'll have to start over again. Doesn't take long to build.
Enervate: They will use this all the fucking time, even if they don't have EXPO damage. This one will probably pop off sometime while you're getting the other Chosen set up. Don't let this get much over its maximum or your Loop gets really tricky, even if this means capturing this Chosen even during times you can't damage it (from Surging Vitality).

Animalistic: (I have less experience here)
Wild Hunt: Seems like they use this whenever it's easier than Regenerating some Circ damage down. Deal some Hate damge, then do it again, as many times as you can.
Surrender to Instincts: Seems easy to break with a Forsaken that deals PLEA damage. Capture after they use it, then they'll probably use it again. I think it would work if you Capture/Release repeatedly with a Forsaken that deals this kind of damage, have not tested yet. The low increase on this one means it takes a while to break normally. [EDIT: Confirmed, it does work.]
Frenzy: I have a hard time figuring out when they use this move, honestly. I've had quite a few turns where based on my understanding of how they choose moves, they should be using this move, but then they instead Regenerate. Maybe you can get it easily by doing something like Surrender above with an INJU focused commander that can Release? This one was a real bitch to raise last time I broke it.
Mating Dance: Honestly, not too sure of this one. They won't use it while it's still active. I haven't had to worry about this one, generally--they use it often enough that this breaks in a reasonable amount of time.

 

[someguy42]

I've made a custom roster of three saviours, made sure each has a minor, significant, and core vilnerability, and each vulnerability is present on at least one saviour. When I start a new game I still always get the first one at random from the default characters, and only the other two from my roster. What am I doing wrong?

 

[Name36346]

I've made a custom roster of three saviours, made sure each has a minor, significant, and core vilnerability, and each vulnerability is present on at least one saviour. When I start a new game I still always get the first one at random from the default characters, and only the other two from my roster. What am I doing wrong?

Someone is incompatible with someone else, I guess

 

[someguy42]

Someone is incompatible with someone else, I guess

Yep, two confident characters. Thanks!

 

[SuperSkippy]

I thought it'd be fun to post some out-of-context numbers from my current run.

I think this Forsaken's a little bit on the strong side


Totally normal city, richer than fucking Dubai (finished on day 19)


Pull lever only in case of emergencies


A Good Kitty


energy raiders are useful

Anyway, still enjoying the game.
CSdev some questions/comments that I have, if you feel up to it:

1) What determines whether a particular Forsaken has the ability to Release? I didn't see this in the help files, and right now I'm not able to find the commonality between the Forsaken that can do this, but it's a really useful ability that I'd like to be able to plan for.

2) I see this information in the help file on Aversion Undead:
"Dissociative Identity" Forsaken Distortion trait becomes "Dissociative Identity (Shattered Soul)"
Can rewrite memories to gain other Distortion bonuses, but deal -20% damage in this state
How do you rewrite their memories? I'm not offhand seeing an option for it.

2) Error/Bug: There are quite a few training actions that are commonly mislabeled as either "This type of training does not require _____'s consent", when it actually does, or vice versa. Let me know if you need more detail to track this down.

3) The Forsaken Tempt defiler is mislabeled in the button tooltip as dealing PLEA and EXPO damage. In fact, it's just PLEA as mentioned in the Forsaken long description.

4) Either I'm misunderstanding this ability or it's incredibly weak. I understand this ability as "do billions of ANGST to all 3 Chosen each time this Forsaken dos a Parasitism T4 break". By the time I can inflict Parasitism, my Forsaken have crossed the thresholds into 100*Tera-angst or Peta-angst.

5) It's totally fine for some items, even starting items, to be better than others, or to be balanced around different modes of play. But, I think that Inferno Pepper and Tomorrow's Newspaper are far to weak to be considered worth playing in Campaign Mode when compared to items that give you tons of EE at the beginning of loops, when you need it most. Consider that an early T2 Core break as granted by Orgasm in a Can or similar can easily grant 20 EE on whatever day after all 3 Forsaken show up as a balancing point. Inferno Pepper gives you 49EE over a whole regular Loop 1 which doesn't at all compare to 20EE when your days are still in single digits. I'd suggest the following changes to make them somewhat more viable:

Inferno Pepper: grants 2*n Evil Energy whenever a Commander or Forsaken is summoned, where n is the current loop number.

Tomorrow's Newspaper: may summon a 5-turn 2-capture commander for a cost of 4 Evil Energy at any point. (even this may be too weak in comparison for players who spend the majority of their playtime in later loops, but it's good enough for Loop 1-3 at least)

I'm of the feeling that items should, in some way, like Forsaken, break the usual progression of the game. I feel like CS is modeled after idle games where this is a common mechanic--exponential growth leads to situations where what once was difficult becomes trivial, and a new progress bar is revealed--at least, that's the itch I scratch by playing it. Maybe you feel differently.

 

[Malgas]

Can somebody please help me understand the "x% of trauma required" thing?

Right now I'm getting a message like "Purity hates the criticism she's receiving...", which I think should mean she specifically needs more shame to advance? But the percentage was 30% with 537k shame, while increasing it to 1.95M is only 42%. There must be something I'm missing, because that's not how percentages work.

Also how do I break out of the "greater sins imminent" rut, where a champion that apparently fulfills all requirements for greater EE generation just refuses to actually do so?

 

[SuperSkippy]

Can somebody please help me understand the "x% of trauma required" thing?

Right now I'm getting a message like "Purity hates the criticism she's receiving...", which I think should mean she specifically needs more shame to advance? But the percentage was 30% with 537k shame, while increasing it to 1.95M is only 42%. There must be something I'm missing, because that's not how percentages work.

Also how do I break out of the "greater sins imminent" rut, where a champion that apparently fulfills all requirements for greater EE generation just refuses to actually do so?

I think that the trauma % counts across all 4 traumas, but I'm not 100% certain of that. I don't think there's a number specifically for each individual trauma, in my experience. I could be wrong, though.

The most common long-term cause of "Greater sins imminent" is that the girls are pressuring each other to do activities together. You can make this less of a factor by either (1) raising the trauma of the girl(s) doing activities with the Chosen that is ready to go further, so they both/all want to do the new activity, (2) making them less friendly towards each other, so they have less desire to cooperate on after-battle plans, or (3)break vulnerabilities on the friendly girl that's not ready for more sinful activities, and she may decide to go along with the more ambitious Chosen on some activities she wouldn't have enough trauma to do on her own.

 

[SuperSkippy]

Kalloi

Hey, can't guarantee this will be my only entry, but here's the first completed entry I've seen.

Made it into Loop 15, but I don't see how to beat the city I chose and I don't feel like going back to pick the other choice. I'd say overall i got lucky on Forsaken and somewhat unlucky on items.

The city that won:

(50% damage mitigation essentially means--no increase in circ damage from anything except INJU)


The MVP forsaken:

She's good all the way through a loop. At the beginning, she makes loooong surrounds so that all 3 Forsaken show up quickly (by the end they were showing up Day 1). In the midgame she stores almost all of my energy and gives most of it back to me. In the endgame, she breaks Parasitism and gets stronger for the next loop.

The items:



Items were certainly all helpful, but not the set that would have made this group shine. Balance's Pantsu was really good, it doubled my damage output in a lot of situations that I kept encountering in the run. Reign's Pantsu also quite strong, adding multiple Surround turns at the beginning of runs. The Schwerer Gusion at the beginning generates a first big EE push early and I prefer breaking INJU for quite a few reasons.

Other notable Forsaken:


Massive multiplier on HATE, plus the ability to start Orgy. She's good.

View attachment 2463845

Growing multipliers on both PLEA and INJU. In the end, though, that growth is linear.

How could I have gotten farther? There were a few items I was looking out for that never showed.

Flexibility
While Activated, gain -2 Evil Energy per day, but Chosen being affected by Defiler actions can still be switched mid-surround to other actions.
Broken Psychometer
Deploying one of the Forsaken will never expend more than 100 Evil Energy.
Silver Collar
Whenever the Chosen take circumstance damage, the amount dealt is increased by a flat value of 30 regardless of personality, corruption, or species.

It is also possible that creating more Chosen with both the "you were Hypnotized by Y, gain +40% PLEA damage" and "You gain X% PLEA damage per Hypnosis" with 1000% in that multiplier, that were Negotiated and Animal Chosen might have been enough to get through another loop or two, if I had done that for each Circumstance. At the end these were the Forsaken I was looking for, but I didn't find them often or early enough, and they require significant training to be maximized that I may not have had time to do.
Or I could have gone back and picked the other city, which was crazy but not as crazy.

Shizuoka
Damage Mitigation: 45% per level
Preparedness: Final Battle on Day 26
Luxuries: 596% Trauma resolution speed
Elites: 2 Undead, 1 Superior Chosen
5 Influence
New Item: Perpetual Motion Machine
The daily extermination requirement is increased by 150.

45% per level means multipliers would still work a little bit, but I don't know that it would have worked enough to get through by day 26.

Anyway, this was interesting, and maybe someone else out there has a better strategy or noticed something about how the game is put together that I missed.

 

[Malgas]

I think that the trauma % counts across all 4 traumas, but I'm not 100% certain of that. I don't think there's a number specifically for each individual trauma, in my experience. I could be wrong, though.

That was my first assumption, but I couldn't make those numbers line up either. And I did verify that focusing on shame in Purity's case increases the percentage *much* faster than raising other traumas by a similar amount. The process of raising multipliers is giving ~100k to all traumas, so in all my tests starting from that same 30% point the total increase across the board is ~2M but the meter winds up at like 32% if that's mostly in disgust, say.

 

[SuperSkippy]

Oh yeah, forgot to include my starting Chosen:

Name: Ninomiya Otome
Alias: Hopeful Prayer
Incantation: "Fear and malevolence, you shall reign no longer!"
Sex: Female
Species: Human
Chest access: into the cutout of her bodice
Crotch access: up her skirt
Underwear: yes
Footwear: loafers
Energy: gray
Weapon: mace
Morality 80: Core
Innocence 50: Significant
Confidence 20: Minor
Dignity 50: Significant
Valid Custom Partners:
None

Which started off as a Forsaken like this:

Ritual: Charming Breeder (+38.5% victim max Motivation)
Ritual: Adaptive Hypnotist (+0.077 own Expertise gain multiplier per Hypnosis)
Ritual: Timid Harvester (-30% victim Obedience)
Ritual: Hardworking Publicist (+770% victim trauma damage as Forsaken)
Expertise
HATE: 30.0k (x1.060 dmg)
PLEA: 20.0k (x1.000 dmg)
INJU: 30.0k (x1.060 dmg)
EXPO: 20.0k (x1.000 dmg)
Combat Style: Desperate (1000% INJU)
Lacking confidence in own abilities, acts with singleminded focus to disable the target. Useful early in the battle to increase future circumstance damage taken.

Training Plan: None
Remains idle when at full Stamina

Trait: Dissociative Identity
While consenting, training can only increase Disgrace. +50% HATE and INJU damage

First Impregnation: Demon Lord
First Drain: Demon Lord

Hostility: 46% (Pretending to be hateful toward humanity)
Deviancy: 16% (Pretending to fetishize aberrant actions)
Obedience: 66% (Pretending to be eager to obey)
Disgrace: 23% (Humiliated)

Stamina: 100.0%
Motivation: 100.0%
Cost: 20 Stamina, 18.8% Motivation, 203 EE
Combat Style: Desperate (1000% INJU)
Reputation Strength: 154%

She was needed mainly for the Breeder and Publicist positions, which allowed me to make the really strong Undead Demon Knight that the campaign depended on.